List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part IV

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 4

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
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[Sainter62]

That's very disappointing and fair enough. I can't believe he has been so petulant, it's not like he wouldn't be playing.

What have Geelong offered him, perhaps he is getting a few extra $$$ or other sweeteners on what we would have been paying?

Like Diehard Saint said, was front-loaded so he will be getting a pay boost with Cotton On

 

[Armoooo]

Wants to go because he will no longer be the No 1 ruckman. So much for playing and doing anything for the club that gave you a chance!

Go and have a look at some rucking stats Rowan and wake up to yourself. As a tap ruckman you are actually one of the worst in the comp.

I hope they hold him to his contract, given the manner he has carried on. What is it with the players today, their egos get ahead of themselves.

Great post, didn't realise how terrible he was. Let's just see if we can fleece Geelong for a future second and be glad to be rid of him.

 

[Armoooo]

Like Diehard Saint said, was front-loaded so he will be getting a pay boost with Cotton On

Yep, that's the calculated risk you take when you front end a contract.

Maybe that player will decide they want to go elsewhere for more money when it's their turn to take a haircut.

That's when you do another cost / benefit analysis and decide whether trading them or forcing them to their contract is better for you.

If we could get SDK, I think we trade him. If we can get two firsts we trade him.

Both of those are good results.

If Geelong make a 1st round pick as their best and final offer i think we bluff for as long as we can, maybe try and talk him i to opening up to playing for other clubs etc. But if that doesn't work, I think we ultimately end up taking the 1st.

If this time 12 months ago, we were offered TDK and a 1st for Marshall, we all would have jumped at it. You can't be as aggressive as we have been and win bigly on every hand.

 

[Goddardwetrust]

Would Ro still want out if we had back ended his contract?

 

[thekizzler]

I hope we're contending by '27

Win a final next year, contend the following.

I hope we are too.

But that's a pretty big leap, it's possible but unlikely.

I think a good scenario in 2026 that is more likely, is that we just miss finals or make them and lose one.

2027 - win a final or two.

2028 - contend with a team with finals experience and with the core players having another 40-odd games of experience behind them.

Remember the core of the team is still 24 and under, with a significant portion under 22. These guys 22 and under are going to hit their straps with 50 more games behind them.

The experienced players brought in this season are designed to have an early swing at a flag. I hope we can do that. I do think it's going to be tough and we would need a hell of a lot to go right for that to happen.

It's the best of both worlds. Have the best possible swing at snatching an early flag but have the blocks in place for the team to contend over a number of years once the core comes through.

 

[luca77]

If the new ruck rules really do favour the jumping ruckman, TDK/Keeler/Dodson might get us through the year. We only used Heath/Keeler/Boyd about once each anyway.

JSOS made it pretty clear he doesn't want to ruck anymore.

With Marshall in with TDK, it's potentially a position of strength for us. Without him, it's probably a vulnerable position on the teamsheet, with Keeler and Dodson as they are now.

I don't see any urgency at all to get Marshall to Geelong, other than using what they give us to secure someone else. If it's nothing, then drag it out til the end.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

To say that TDK is no better than Marshall is either to seriously under rate TDK, or to think that the Marshall of 2026 will be the same as the Marshall of 2023. I love Ro, but he is an honest battler type now, not a star of the competition.

What has TDK ever achieved? He has put together a few good patches of form. Never a great season. His biggest achievement to date is finishing 7th in Carlton's B&F.

I think if Ro didn't come into this season underdone off a fractured pelvis, he would have been a lot better. He still finished 6th in our B&F.

Ro is a better mark, a better kick and more effective forward. TDK has a better leap (which will hopefully be more of a factor with the rumoured rule change) and is quicker on the follow up at ground level. Both love a dump kick clearance.

 

[gubby88]

What has TDK ever achieved? He has put together a few good patches of form. Never a great season. His biggest achievement to date is finishing 7th in Carlton's B&F.

I think if Ro didn't come into this season underdone off a fractured pelvis, he would have been a lot better. He still finished 6th in our B&F.

Ro is a better mark, a better kick and more effective forward. TDK has a better leap (which will hopefully be more of a factor with the rumoured rule change) and is quicker on the follow up at ground level. Both love a dump kick clearance.

he's achieved the same as Ro....but is younger and has a far superior athletic profile

 

[Joffaboy]

Didn't Marshall ask to leave last year?

That would seem Geelong have been working on him for a while.

Maybe he sees the TDK thing more as an opportunity to get to Geelong rather than a reason

Never let facts get in the way of a bed wetting session.

 

[hotdish]

Marshall trade will be straight forward and will not involve any other players.

Geelong first rounder (pick 20-21 overall) plus Geelong's pick 38, with the saints trading back pick 47.

 

[Diehard Saint]

The guy has no juice. Very sweaty energy.

Wow. What a salty little man. Taking a swipe at the umps. Hope they make him pay next season.

(Not to be compared with Bassats comments about Viney as the entire room was stunned by that.)

 

[ScrappyDo]

This is the thing.

Both Marshall and Wilkie are unlikely to be a part of St Kilda's next flag team.

It is possible they could but pretty unlikely.

When you are getting offered more money elsewhere and arguably more chance of immediate success, it's got to be a significant consideration. Especially when you have been good servants to the club you are at.

Wilkie probably has 4 years left in him and the acquisition of KPDs will move him into a less physically demanding role.

 

[thekizzler]

If the new ruck rules really do favour the jumping ruckman, TDK/Keeler/Dodson might get us through the year. We only used Heath/Keeler/Boyd about once each anyway.

JSOS made it pretty clear he doesn't want to ruck anymore.

With Marshall in with TDK, it's potentially a position of strength for us. Without him, it's probably a vulnerable position on the teamsheet, with Keeler and Dodson as they are now.

I don't see any urgency at all to get Marshall to Geelong, other than using what they give us to secure someone else. If it's nothing, then drag it out til the end.

While it's true we would have elite ruck depth with TDK, Marshall, Dodson, Keeler, I don't think we really need to have it.

TDK, Dodson, Keeler is enough to get by. If there is ridiculous injuries, then Owens, Silvagni, Caminiti or Aleer can chop out - we do have plenty of tall defenders now.

Look at the current ruck divisions of the top four clubs:

Brisbane: Darcy Fort, Oscar McInerney, Henry Smith
Geelong: Rhys Stanley, Mark Blicavs, Sam De Koning, Mitch Edwards
Collingwood: Darcy Cameron, Mason Cox, Oscar Steene
Hawthorn: Lloyd Meek, Ned Reeves, Max Ramsden

Sure, maybe there is slightly more depth across these lines, but not by a huge amount.

Another bunch of games into Dodson and we could have a better no.1 and no.2 ruck pairing than all of the above by 2027-2028 as well.

 

[thekizzler]

Wilkie probably has 4 years left in him and the acquisition of KPDs will move him into a less physically demanding role.

Hopefully and fair enough.

It still puts him right on the edge of when the Saints would be targeting a flag.

Most players aren't first choice in their final season before retirement.

 

[Diehard Saint]

100%, the timing wasn't accidental. Has his nose out of joint and expressed it without saying it.

Make these arrogant sleepy-hollow gombeens pay a kings ransom for him - or no ****ing deal! Over to you Ross, SOS & Co... As for Marshall, well a contract's a contract. We're in charge here and I hope we stand our ground!

Pretty sure I remember Ross quoting Chris Scott, a coach he appears to really respect, saying something like -

“If you let your contracted players go you might as well hang out your shingle telling everyone you are not a serious club.”

I guess we’ll see if we are a serious club by what we do here.

If we let him go, it must be on our terms.

 

[Remboy]

Please god no

You're right. We should offer him two years.

 

[seasonedsainter]

Wow. What a salty little man. Taking a swipe at the umps. Hope they make him pay next season.

(Not to be compared with Bassats comments about Viney as the entire room was stunned by that.)

What did Bassat say?

 

[seasonedsainter]

He wanted out last year before TDK.

It’s a very easy argument to make to say it’s TDK.

If anything, TDK makes it allowable to let Marshall go. But it doesn’t explain why Rowan has wanted out for 2 trade periods now and it has nothing to do with money.

What does it have to do with?

 

[Remboy]

“TDK contract fallout”

Dear god.

He isn’t leaving because of money and he asked to go last year.

But circle it back to TDK mate.

I can't wait for the Marshall contract fallout at Geelong when all of their rucks realise they're stuck behind Marshall for the next three or four years and want out.

 

[Off Stump 89]

We have absolute leverage in the RoMa trade Based on Lyons words and Sos's precedent... I can't see a deal that gets done. Particularly if Ro's contract is as front ended as speculated, how would we be a better team without him in the squad, not with a mid 20's pushed back pick in this draft that's for sure. Ef giving geelong a leg up

 

[seasonedsainter]

Didn’t a Cats’ ITK suggest this as the likely outcome last week?

Haha if only.

 

[triggering bro]

Not sure what’s everyone’s issue with Row going he is 30 years old banged up and average ruck, good around the ground but tbh I think we get what we can while we can, if we get their first and some we take it and run

We are a mid table team need to make changes. Prefer to have a crack than stay mediocre. I like RTB mentality.

 

[Hysteria]

I have loved Ro as a player and he still has a few high quality years left in him.
However it is clear this list is being built to contend when the current crop of younger players (NAS, Windhager, King, Owens, Pou etc.) start to reach their prime years.
TDK fits this build. Marshall does not.
As much as i'd love to see him stay, if the club does see fit to trade him to the Cats i'm not going to be losing any sleep over it.

 

[stavro#4]

 

[seasonedsainter]

Marshall trade will be straight forward and will not involve any other players.

Geelong first rounder (pick 20-21 overall) plus Geelong's pick 38, with the saints trading back pick 47.

As far as deals go this would be really quite uninspiring. However, we got Dalrymple for a reason I guess......