List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[phantom13]

There was 4 first rounders and 3 second rounders in that list.

Yes rucks can come from anywhere. But the argument was that there wasn’t 52 players who were better than Dodson and rucks often go significantly earlier than pick 53.

Dodson slid because he spooked clubs. Not because of his talent or current capability. Which was the point I was making to Joffa originally.

Which I’m thrilled about by the way. I’m just more cautious than most on here about when he will be ready.

But as a prospect? As good as any listed young ruck in the league.

Theres firsts and there firsts Stav. Pick 20 isnt pick 2 and nobody is calling a second "high".

Even if you wanna argue 4, two have a big asterisk next to them.

List managers know youre better off trading or FAing a ruck who can compete once youve got the other parts.

 

[phantom13]

Assuming Roma goes to say, Geelong. RoMa + a 3rd for their first, something like that.

That gives us a late 1st to play with.

We can keep it, hit the draft again. Maybe cross our fingers for Phillipou #2. Maybe grab

Other option is we trade it.

Does adding that pick to our first get us one of the Tigers/Bombers earlier picks? Would that pick get us Aleer is he nominated us? Do we maybe look to live trade it to a team that gets a bit silly ala North buying Richmond's picks?

If it was Roma out, Aleer in does that feel like enough? I'm not sure...

What are we missing, list wise?

Another talented KPF to pair with King would be great. Get Owens & Pou on ball more. Could Tauru shock the world as a high marking, pack busting, CHF option?

Wilkie not getting any younger and Doogs is a question mark. Our interest in Aleer probably means we're open to grabbing a KPD option that can slot in immediately.

And we say every year that you can never have enough mids.

I think I'd hold it until the draft. See if there's a crazy slide or a team gets frisky with future pick offers. Worst case grab Phillipou Junior (the kids can call him Pou Ju) and keep developing the kids.

I think if TDK comes and Roma goes that whole "were buying TDK and a draft pick" makes sense.

Whatever we can get for him within reason is better than paying him $800k a year to play twos.

 

[stavro#4]

Theres firsts and there firsts Stav. Pick 20 isnt pick 2 and nobody is calling a second "high".

Even if you wanna argue 4, two have a big asterisk next to them.

List managers know youre better off trading or FAing a ruck who can compete once youve got the other parts.

As I said, I’m running off the draft profile reports the day they were drafted. I’d be here all day working out who was what at AFL level.

Will Green at pick 16 is a high pick in a draft that was heavily influenced by top end academy picks. He was also the player we wanted and the swans grabbed him before we got the chance and took Wilson.

The point still remains a quality ruck will go in the first 2 rounds and there was a reason Dodson slid to us at 53. (This was the core discussion)

 

[The Punter]

Heath will be on an AFL list next year.

Winning yesterday would have improved the list.

 

[stavro#4]

 

[beside the seaside]

Heath will be on an AFL list next year.

Winning yesterday would have improved the list.

I'm all for winning but we won a bunch of games against good sides late last year and it didn't stop us going poorly this year.

Personally I think with the side we are putting out we are doing well to be competitive against good sides.

 

[mad-saint-guy]

If we want to live in the land of hypotheticals.
What if we don't get TDK? Roma's body continues to fail him, we continue to get smashed next year and our young talent ask to play elsewhere because they're sick of losing? Perpetual cycle of rebuilding.

I think Ro will have 2-3 elite years left in him as long as we manage him sensibly. He was rushed back off an interrupted pre season with a nasty injury caused by being overworked. And he hasn't had proper ruck support all year. It was nice having a big strong backup ruck who could hold their own when Marshall had a rest against Sydney.

If he gets a solid pre season in next year, there is no reason why it won't be his best year yet.

I think we are perfectly set up with ruck stocks for the future without bringing in TDK. If we don't recruit TDK, we'll have 30 year old Marshall in his prime, 23 year old Heath just entering physical maturity, 20 year old Dodson developing rapidly and 22 year old Keeler capable of pinch hitting.

Bring in TDK and Dodson won't have a chance at being number one ruck for another 7 years, so he'll probably be traded within a few years. We'll also trade Marshall either this year or next. Or, there's a real possibility that TDK is mediocre for us and we end up palming him off as a salary dump so we can play Dodson.

The TDK pursuit just doesn't make sense. It reeks of SOS trying to screw Carlton over at our own expense. Marshall is the perfect age to hand over the reigns in a few years to Dodson. It's one area of the list where we are in great shape already.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

I think Ro will have 2-3 elite years left in him as long as we manage him sensibly. He was rushed back off an interrupted pre season with a nasty injury caused by being overworked. And he hasn't had proper ruck support all year. It was nice having a big strong backup ruck who could hold their own when Marshall had a rest against Sydney.

If he gets a solid pre season in next year, there is no reason why it won't be his best year yet.

I think we are perfectly set up with ruck stocks for the future without bringing in TDK. If we don't recruit TDK, we'll have 30 year old Marshall in his prime, 23 year old Heath just entering physical maturity, 20 year old Dodson developing rapidly and 22 year old Keeler capable of pinch hitting.

Bring in TDK and Dodson won't have a chance at being number one ruck for another 7 years, so he'll probably be traded within a few years. We'll also trade Marshall either this year or next. Or, there's a real possibility that TDK is mediocre for us and we end up palming him off as a salary dump so we can play Dodson.

The TDK pursuit just doesn't make sense. It reeks of SOS trying to screw Carlton over at our own expense. Marshall is the perfect age to hand over the reigns in a few years to Dodson. It's one area of the list where we are in great shape already.

Yes it’s all a conspiracy. SOS operates as a lone wolf and nobody else is at all involved in decision making around the list and he won’t rest until he’s stripped Carlton for parts. Seriously.

 

[Joffaboy]

Hows the ****ing drive by i copped here.

Outrageous.

You love it champion

 

[Teflon]

As a positive will get to play under a good coach for the first time in his career

You just quote yourself ?
Nice

 

[_Maximus_12]

I think Ro will have 2-3 elite years left in him as long as we manage him sensibly. He was rushed back off an interrupted pre season with a nasty injury caused by being overworked. And he hasn't had proper ruck support all year. It was nice having a big strong backup ruck who could hold their own when Marshall had a rest against Sydney.

If he gets a solid pre season in next year, there is no reason why it won't be his best year yet.

I think we are perfectly set up with ruck stocks for the future without bringing in TDK. If we don't recruit TDK, we'll have 30 year old Marshall in his prime, 23 year old Heath just entering physical maturity, 20 year old Dodson developing rapidly and 22 year old Keeler capable of pinch hitting.

Bring in TDK and Dodson won't have a chance at being number one ruck for another 7 years, so he'll probably be traded within a few years. We'll also trade Marshall either this year or next. Or, there's a real possibility that TDK is mediocre for us and we end up palming him off as a salary dump so we can play Dodson.

The TDK pursuit just doesn't make sense. It reeks of SOS trying to screw Carlton over at our own expense. Marshall is the perfect age to hand over the reigns in a few years to Dodson. It's one area of the list where we are in great shape already.

and if Marshall is cooked? We go to Moose who can’t cover the ground or a 20 year Dodson who will be eaten alive.
Rowan has osteitis pubis and has for over 12 months. It’s not going to magically improve to the point he is elite

 

[phantom13]

Yes it’s all a conspiracy. SOS operates as a lone wolf and nobody else is at all involved in decision making around the list and he won’t rest until he’s stripped Carlton for parts. Seriously.

I gotta admit, i was onboard with it until the last para.

 

[_Maximus_12]

I gotta admit, i was onboard with it until the last para.

The earth is flat and Joe Biden is actually a robot

 

[stavro#4]

It’s a few months old. But I think still just as important.

 

[MordySaint]

Players on decent ($approx 500k+) salaries that will LIKELY come off the books or be significantly reduced over the next 3 seasons:
Steele
Marshall
Hill
Howard
Sinclair
Wood
Macrae
Cordy ($400k)

We have a hole in our list of players aged 23-29 (which is generally the bracket that takes up the most cap space). Our two most valuable in this bracket are King and Higgins who are both contracted till 2028 or later.

That is a massive redistribution of salary cap to a very young list IF we don't add more players in that are 23 years old or older.

Well you now have a raft of young players to start paying these sort of wages to or else they looking at other clubs.

Other clubs are now starting to sniff around as we are now developing our talent.

The whole TDK thing is strange as its a lot of money and its not our main need.

 

[Saint Shags]

So we could gain TDK
But then lose
Heath and Ro.

Anyone else see the potential issue there?

 

[akaifu]

Just did the ladder predictor and I have us finishing 13th - so pick 7 after Allen compo and before bids

One more week of Champs but its looking like the top few could be:

1-4
CDT
Lindsay
Duursma
Sharp

The rest is hard to predict. 5-8 could be any of Grlj, Greeves, Marsh, NHH, Schubert, Rodriguez, Dovaston, Cumming

I think we're a huge chance for Greeves atm, especially if Essendon hold the two picks before us (inc. Melbourne's) - surely they take an outside mid and/or talls. Richmond surely won't take him after taking Smillie last year and Eagles would be reaching at 1 or 2

Whatever we do, we must not overtake Carlton given the TDK compo

 

[akaifu]

So we could gain TDK
But then lose
Heath and Ro.

Anyone else see the potential issue there?

Can't see Heath leaving if he continues to get games with us

And I don't think the club would get rid of Boyd, Heath, Marshall all in the same off-season

 

[mad-saint-guy]

Yes it’s all a conspiracy. SOS operates as a lone wolf and nobody else is at all involved in decision making around the list and he won’t rest until he’s stripped Carlton for parts. Seriously.

I don't think it's a conspiracy, I just think he's not very good at his job and has a weird fixation on recruiting players from his previous employer. He did it at Carlton, and he has been doing it at St Kilda.

 

[phantom13]

Just did the ladder predictor and I have us finishing 13th - so pick 7 after Allen compo and before bids

One more week of Champs but its looking like the top few could be:

1-4
CDT
Lindsay
Duursma
Sharp

The rest is hard to predict. 5-8 could be any of Grlj, Greeves, Marsh, NHH, Schubert, Rodriguez, Dovaston, Cumming

I think we're a huge chance for Greeves atm, especially if Essendon hold the two picks before us (inc. Melbourne's) - surely they take an outside mid and/or talls. Richmond surely won't take him after taking Smillie last year and Eagles would be reaching at 1 or 2

Whatever we do, we must not overtake Carlton given the TDK compo

I just did the same essentially picking the favourites and have us 14th.

Carlton v Essendon, Us v Essendon and Carlton v Port seem the critical games in there.

 

[Saint Shags]

Can't see Heath leaving if he continues to get games with us

And I don't think the club would get rid of Boyd, Heath, Marshall all in the same off-season

 If is the big part. But if Melbourne are into him then the likelihood is that we get 1 Ruck in but lose 2.
Is Boyd even contracted for next year?

 

[phantom13]

 If is the big part. But if Melbourne are into him then the likelihood is that we get 1 Ruck in but lose 2.
Is Boyd even contracted for next year?

If we lost Roma and Heath then wed re contract Boyd im sure, hes not going anywhere, no one would be interested, hes Tom Campbell mkII

 

[Saint Shags]

If we lost Roma and Heath then wed re contract Boyd im sure, hes not going anywhere, no one would be interested, hes Tom Campbell mkII

I think my main concern is around depth. We're already light on yet would be losing even more.
And yeah I get Dodson. But this is his first year. Boyd, well we all saw what he can do.

 

[phantom13]

I think my main concern is around depth. We're already light on yet would be losing even more.
And yeah I get Dodson. But this is his first year. Boyd, well we all saw what he can do.

Fair point tbh. Having said that our depth would remain about the same as it is now.

Roma>Heath>Dodson>Boyd

TDK>Dodson>Boyd

Id assume we would either grab another state guy, get rid of Boyd and replace him with a state guy, or pray weve got Max right and Keeler can ruck.

Reality is very few teams have two first choice rucks, so the depth is about as good as you can hope for.

I recall most people saying Heath wasnt up to it and would never get a game so Dodson might get a baptism of fire.

 

[Joffaboy]

There was 4 first rounders and 3 second rounders in that list.

Yes rucks can come from anywhere. But the argument was that there wasn’t 52 players who were better than Dodson and rucks often go significantly earlier than pick 53.

Dodson slid because he spooked clubs. Not because of his talent or current capability. Which was the point I was making to Joffa originally.

Which I’m thrilled about by the way. I’m just more cautious than most on here about when he will be ready.

But as a prospect? As good as any listed young ruck in the league.

Are there 49 players better than Garcia?