Player Watch #22: Todd Goldstein - Re-signed until end 2022!

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The acurate one

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Cats certainly did offer 4 years which is just crazy on there part but good on Goldy for staying loyal.
In years gone by you had to give up picks and or players to get a ruck the calibre of Todd, in today's world it comes down to money/contract length and if Geelong have the room in their cap to support a four year deal. It all makes sense.

Gifting a guy cash or if you like a bonus in the form of an additional year on his deal that allows you to maintain players and picks is much better outcome for any club.

Not directed at you but there's too much emphasis put on player payments, all clubs have a cap and need to pay it, all clubs have players on their list getting money for not much. 22 take the field each week and that leaves about 16 plus contracted footballers getting money for either being injured or kicking the dew of the ground.

We did it with Waite and that paid handsomely. Wish we could find another Jarrod.
 

The Filth Wizard

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In years gone by you had to give up picks and or players to get a ruck the calibre of Todd, in today's world it comes down to money/contract length and if Geelong have the room in their cap to support a four year deal. It all makes sense.

Gifting a guy cash or if you like a bonus in the form of an additional year on his deal that allows you to maintain players and picks is much better outcome for any club.

Not directed at you but there's too much emphasis put on player payments, all clubs have a cap and need to pay it, all clubs have players on their list getting money for not much. 22 take the field each week and that leaves about 16 plus contracted footballers getting money for either being injured or kicking the dew of the ground.

We did it with Waite and that paid handsomely. Wish we could find another Jarrod.
If you could make this post more succinct we'll arrange to have it tattooed onto some posters foreheads.
 

the Ziebull

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In years gone by you had to give up picks and or players to get a ruck the calibre of Todd, in today's world it comes down to money/contract length and if Geelong have the room in their cap to support a four year deal. It all makes sense.

Gifting a guy cash or if you like a bonus in the form of an additional year on his deal that allows you to maintain players and picks is much better outcome for any club.

Not directed at you but there's too much emphasis put on player payments, all clubs have a cap and need to pay it, all clubs have players on their list getting money for not much. 22 take the field each week and that leaves about 16 plus contracted footballers getting money for either being injured or kicking the dew of the ground.

We did it with Waite and that paid handsomely. Wish we could find another Jarrod.
Would think we would be linked to free agents then using the above of keeping picks and players to bring players in but nothing yet
 

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The acurate one

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Would think we would be linked to free agents then using the above of keeping picks and players to bring players in but nothing yet
Yeah not sure if we are, as I don't get a lot in that space , more about 'business management'. FA's are for the now , you expect them to play day 1. That of course then allows you to bring through the young draftees in your preferred way ie VFL.

And back on Geelong, they're in a prelim- if we made a prelim and found a 31 yr old skilled quick outside mid that helped elevate us to our fifth flag in 95 ******* years, who'd begrudge him a six year deal?
 

LuvtheKangas

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Just bumping this for all those clearly having problems processing facts.

This gets raised periodically. It's completely unfair to Goldie IMHO as he has been a top 5 ruckman every year except one when he had his marriage breakdown - often top 3 ,2 or 1

Absolute servant of the club!

Even in his junior years he was a rising star and top rookie ruck etc

He plays 20+ games every year and is super resilient - very little risk in a 3 year deal.

If its all about 2 or 3 years, just sort it out!!!! FFS:)View attachment 730127View attachment 730128
 

Groin guru

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Just bumping this for all those clearly having problems processing facts.
Guess I'll requote my comment then because again - yearly averages from footywire do little to dispel the myth. You'd have a tough time arguing that Goldstein has been great since his last contract deal (his best year :$). Awfully coincidental that he played out of his skin in the final few games of 2019 (most specifically the Port one). I wonder why...

You can make excuses for him. That's fine. I want the best Goldstein every week.

In your opinion, but flashing up yearly averages from footywire does little to dispel the assertion.

You can't pick and choose when you want to use some stats to suit your argument. Every AFL supporter in Australia knows Goldy has been a shadow of his former self since EOY 2015. 2019 was arguably his most consistent year since - a contract year. I've got no issue with that. People are motivated by different things. Maybe he pushed harder this year so he can earn a nice deal and provide for his children's future.

At the end of the day, he served up less than what his contract reflected. Not only did he let down his family but his teammates and supporters.
Your stance is even funnier when you've taken this viewpoint when it comes to stats...:drunk:
The fact that their career stats are even comparable is an indictment on Atley's lack of development.

It also shows that stats are misleading, because there is no way on this earth that anyone could reasonably consider that 4 out of every 5 Atley disposals are effective. You do realise how this stat works, don't you? Those times when he has the ball, surges forward 10 metres, stops, panics, turns around and handballs backwards to a player in worse position - we got a lot of those special moments this year and last - well, they're counted as effective.
 

LuvtheKangas

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Guess I'll requote my comment then because again - yearly averages from footywire do little to dispel the myth. You'd have a tough time arguing that Goldstein has been great since his last contract deal (his best year :$). Awfully coincidental that he played out of his skin in the final few games of 2019 (most specifically the Port one). I wonder why...

You can make excuses for him. That's fine. I want the best Goldstein every week.



Your stance is even funnier when you've taken this viewpoint when it comes to stats...:drunk:
LOL, you needed to find a two-year old post of mine to try to make your point. Pathetic.

Anyway, the point I was making on Atley was borne out then and holds now. He's a marginally above average footballer as his stats show. He was then and he is now. I was addressing the specific problem I have with DE%, which is a particular stat that many of us have a problem with.

On the other hand, Goldy's stats have indicated a high level of achievement in his role over a long period of time, NOT (can I emphasise this) just in pre-contract years.
 

Groin guru

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LOL, you needed to find a two-year old post of mine to try to make your point. Pathetic.

Anyway, the point I was making on Atley was borne out then and holds now. He's a marginally above average footballer as his stats show. He was then and he is now. I was addressing the specific problem I have with DE%, which is a particular stat that many of us have a problem with.

On the other hand, Goldy's stats have indicated a high level of achievement in his role over a long period of time, NOT (can I emphasise this) just in pre-contract years.
Don't blame me for your hypocrisy. The age of the post means little. What is telling is you're happy to break your own rules to make a point. All I did was type your name in search with 'stat' and bang here we are.

Big difference between going through the motions (which he did for some time) and some of the games he delivered in 2019. Sure there may be other variables but flashing up year averages means little and it certainly doesn't disprove the theory (as you keep suggesting). All it highlights are some will lie cheat and steal to protect a North player when 99.9% of AFL supporters know that he's been average since his last contract year. He wasn't thrust back into the limelight until the port game this year (besides his battle with mental health).
 

LuvtheKangas

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Don't blame me for your hypocrisy. The age of the post means little. What is telling is you're happy to break your own rules to make a point. All I did was type your name in search with 'stat' and bang here we are.

Big difference between going through the motions (which he did for some time) and some of the games he delivered in 2019. Sure there may be other variables but flashing up year averages means little and it certainly doesn't disprove the theory (as you keep suggesting). All it highlights are some will lie cheat and steal to protect a North player when 99.9% of AFL supporters know that he's been average since his last contract year. He wasn't thrust back into the limelight until the port game this year (besides his battle with mental health).
LOL. As usual, you deflect. The one "stat" post you found was about DE%, as I mentioned but you conveniently ignored.

The point that has been disproven is the suggestion that Goldy only performs well in the year ahead of EVERY contract, not just this one.
 

Quintero

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Don't blame me for your hypocrisy. The age of the post means little. What is telling is you're happy to break your own rules to make a point. All I did was type your name in search with 'stat' and bang here we are.

Big difference between going through the motions (which he did for some time) and some of the games he delivered in 2019. Sure there may be other variables but flashing up year averages means little and it certainly doesn't disprove the theory (as you keep suggesting). All it highlights are some will lie cheat and steal to protect a North player when 99.9% of AFL supporters know that he's been average since his last contract year. He wasn't thrust back into the limelight until the port game this year (besides his battle with mental health).
The one stat that bothers me that I feel should be highlighted is his 6 contested marks in rounds 1-15 of this year, which is an embarrassment. The fact that he's stormed back into form at the end of the year whilst clubs were into him, doesn't surprise me at all.

I was howled down for calling him a contract year player but I'm convinced there are plenty of players like him.

Atley and Wood spring to mind.
 

Groin guru

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The one stat that bothers me that I feel should be highlighted is his 6 contested marks in rounds 1-15 of this year, which is an embarrassment. The fact that he's stormed back into form at the end of the year whilst clubs were into him, doesn't surprise me at all.

I was howled down for calling him a contract year player but I'm convinced there are plenty of players like him.

Atley and Wood spring to mind.
I've got no issue. We are motivated by different things. He has a family and it's important to make hay while the sun is still shining. I just don't get the need for the "you don't like a North player = get him. He's a traitor!!!" agenda that's pushed so often in here. We know Goldstein has been average. He got better last year and bucked the trend slightly. This year if improved again. Money is a great motivator.

We all know Goldstein has the ferociousness of a puppy. He doesn't realise how big he is. Once I saw him get out marked in 1v1 against Steven Motlop down at Skilled. A legit 50/50 ball too.

But hey. I hopefully he bucks the trend and proves LtK right in his remaining years at North. A good Goldy is great for us all.
 

The Y Factor

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I've got no issue. We are motivated by different things. He has a family and it's important to make hay while the sun is still shining. I just don't get the need for the "you don't like a North player = get him. He's a traitor!!!" agenda that's pushed so often in here. We know Goldstein has been average. He got better last year and bucked the trend slightly. This year if improved again. Money is a great motivator.

We all know Goldstein has the ferociousness of a puppy. He doesn't realise how big he is. Once I saw him get out marked in 1v1 against Steven Motlop down at Skilled. A legit 50/50 ball too.

But hey. I hopefully he bucks the trend and proves LtK right in his remaining years at North. A good Goldy is great for us all.
Happy for people to like or dislike or have favourites etc however the statement "We know Goldstein has been average." is blatantly your opinion not the royal "we" and statistically incorrect.

The link below has Goldy's player ratings for the past 3 years where he has not dropped out of the top 45 players, top 5 by position, top 2 by club since 2016. Arguably 2014/15 were much better again.


He may not be your preferred style of player or meet your expectations and that's fine but the guy has been contributing at a well above average level every year he has pulled on a jumper.
 

Groin guru

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Happy for people to like or dislike or have favourites etc however the statement "We know Goldstein has been average." is blatantly your opinion not the royal "we" and statistically incorrect.

The link below has Goldy's player ratings for the past 3 years where he has not dropped out of the top 45 players, top 5 by position, top 2 by club since 2016. Arguably 2014/15 were much better again.


He may not be your preferred style of player or meet your expectations and that's fine but the guy has been contributing every year he has pulled on a jumper.
Champion data :drunk:

Club - means little. We barely have big possession getters. Cunnington averages around 25 and < a goal a game. Higgins ramped it up over the past 2 seasons. So goldstein with 30/40 hitouts a game is an easier way to accumulate points if you get it around 14/15 times.

Position - hardly a shining light. Gawn has been the standout by a long way. Grundy closing. Goldstein consistent but not a patch on either in recent years. Nakervis and Jacobs dropped off. McEvoy is consistent but basically a poorer Goldstein. Martin, Witts, and Ryder have their moments. Ruck is a tough position and part of the reason why Geelong was more than happy to throw 4 years in front of Goldstein.

League - this is where Champion Data excels. Goldstein, Gawn, and Grundy in the top 6. Hell even Shane Edwards is in the top 15 :drunk:

Stats are 1 component. The ability to critically evaluate is another. That's why modern-day statisticians are just the nerds that crunch the numbers. The true brains take it that next step further. Glad I could help you take that next step.
 

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