Player Watch #25: Toby Nankervis

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Charlie Pannam

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He's 25. Yet to peak. Hope we keep him.

I believe the plan is to have longer quarters back next year so we'll likely go back to two rucks.
Yer bit harsh calling him old.

Not sure about not having peaked. Really hope I’m wrong but major groin surgery has probably resulted in him losing some of his mobility
 

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tora tora tora

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2020 Game lengths are looking like the death of the ruck. But if 2021 is back to 20 minute quarters then we don't want to be writing any of our rucks off. JR's kicking was a concern this week. Its bizarre, in the GF he was kicking from outside 50. If that persists then we need CJ/Chol as KPF.
 

blackcat

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Could easily see Nank traded at the end of the season. Out of contract at the end of the year, so could be offered up. This is from the HUN

TIGERS FLAG RUCKMAN MAY BE ON WAY OUT
Nathan Broad was close to signing a new multi-year contract at Richmond before the coronavirus pause, but has pledged his future to the Tigers.

He is one of the few uncontracted premiership players at Punt Rd, with the biggest watch on Toby Nankervis who might struggle for regular game time given most clubs will only play one ruckman this season.


Ruck/forward Callum Coleman-Jones is the youngster on the rise and is signed up despite GWS having a crack at him last trade period.

So despite two premierships in four years at the Tigers, Nankervis’s contract has plenty to play out.

He might have to find a first-ruck spot at a rival club.
This is Moneyball/Moreyball

see: Leon Davis All Australian could not get a trade back to a Perth team and Collingwood NOT prepared to go from 350k+ a bit to a new AA level contract ~500+/-

Marty Clarke back from Ireland, 220k plus50 potential bonuses

Moneyball, redistribute that 200-300 to Swan/Pendles when pay the talent their due

And LeonDavis NOT standing up in finals

How the <rucks> situation occurs, I don't know, and how you can realise those assets on the trade table when they still hold value, so like GWS they keep on rolling over their talent on the list for new EXTRA picks in the ND
see the Las Vegas expansion ice hockey team, and how they GAMED the expansion suite of options that NHL hq presented them with

Richmond in a novel situation they could have a gestalt strategem of GWS X Las Vegas NHL expansion franchise, NR over to you, u r the expert allthingsprosport I'll let u have it, take it away
RussellEbertHandball
 

Jozzy

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All this talk of moving on Nank is very premature, I personally believe we have to create the chance for CCJ to start playing senior football sooner than later but we’ll be back to the normal 20 minute quarters next year and there’s every chance we’ll go back to playing two ruckman then. Who’s to say we won’t end up still playing with two ruckman for chunks of this season.
 

tora tora tora

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I think any reports of nanks demise are grossly exaggerated, Thursday we saw no benefit from an extra runner yet nank could have provided an option deep forward for an out of sorts jack or chop out for lil ivy who I thought battled manfully v Grundy ensuring that he didn’t monster us
I think the one ruck selection worked. As did Houli & Higgins. Unfortunately, our other smalls weren't fantastic. I would not be selecting 2 rucks this week.
 

blackcat

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Could easily see Nank traded at the end of the season. Out of contract at the end of the year, so could be offered up. This is from the HUN

TIGERS FLAG RUCKMAN MAY BE ON WAY OUT
Nathan Broad was close to signing a new multi-year contract at Richmond before the coronavirus pause, but has pledged his future to the Tigers.

He is one of the few uncontracted premiership players at Punt Rd, with the biggest watch on Toby Nankervis who might struggle for regular game time given most clubs will only play one ruckman this season.


Ruck/forward Callum Coleman-Jones is the youngster on the rise and is signed up despite GWS having a crack at him last trade period.

So despite two premierships in four years at the Tigers, Nankervis’s contract has plenty to play out.

He might have to find a first-ruck spot at a rival club.
Burson Marsteller parlance, it would have been our Yale alumnus communications chief flying the kite, if Maley was indeed still chief fifteen years later, no doubt Nank's manager would have had preliminary discussions about the hypothetical next deal, but if I were manager I would be furious about this signal'ling by Richmond list management, screams #maslowshammer #toosmartforschool

Nank's manager ofcourse will not be able to trace the intentional leak from the comms team by instruction of list management team, with any perfect degree of certainty...
 

blackcat

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Bit harsh to call him old - he's only 25. That's just reaching peak for a big man.
The problem with Nank (at hitouts) is that he has short arms for a ruck. He's only 9cms shorter than Gawn, but Gawn can reach much higher. Grundy, Stanley, even Soldo, are built with a longer body and arms. Nank's a tank, and very good at the bullocking, around the ground, contesting - being a big body. But we don't win a lot of hitouts or centre clearances with Nank. Now, I'm not convinced that hitouts or clearances are that particularly valuable in today's game, and we've certainly worked out a way to manage the fact that we don't get hurt much - but that may change.

What I would love is if Soldo could take the ruck contests and then magically morph into Nank around the ground.
as you allude to, clearances are not Dimma's key metric.

Remind me,
who did Dimma do his apprenticeship under? Ohhhh that's right, angry ant at Glenferrie, Hawthorn's Clarkson.

both hold more necessary, a defensive-set-up and being able to attack unhurried without messy clearance forward.
 

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blackcat

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2020 Game lengths are looking like the death of the ruck. But if 2021 is back to 20 minute quarters then we don't want to be writing any of our rucks off. JR's kicking was a concern this week. Its bizarre, in the GF he was kicking from outside 50. If that persists then we need CJ/Chol as KPF.
won't be back to 20. But depends how liberally umpires invoke <time-on>, so not a net 5 min per qtr loss.

The AFL want the reduction, but their biggest revenue to protect is tv rights contract, the time loss will not be pro rata reduction in the broadcast value, but it is a decent heuristic (rule-of-thumb) to use before McLachlan formally determines the elasticities

my intuition may be incorrect, because AFL boffins need to assess the trade-offs and triangulate

- rights value negotiation(change)
- new AFL fans in emerging culture and competition with other ~100 minute prosport consumers
 
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Rayzorwire

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I actually think Soldo might offer the best trade value.


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Soldo's worth way more on potential and steadily building a better record in the here and now, we'll keep him ahead of Nank if our hand gets forced.

We're yet to see Nank get back to the peak fitness and athleticism he needs to compete as an undersized first ruck and much as I dislike saying it, the groin surgery means he may never make it back to that level. He really didn't last year and this season hasn't boded well either so far.

We've seen Nank's best - performances he may really struggle to replicate in the future - and it often fell short of matching the top rucks, especially if he was carrying a niggle.

Soldo's a genuine giant with so much more upside and career length potential. He's got the height to carry niggles through games, we lose little if anything in hardness using him over Nank and his skills are pretty much on a par. Because of his raw size and late start he's got a great shot at playing into his 30's given a good run with injury.
 

Grrr

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Soldo's worth way more on potential and steadily building a better record in the here and now, we'll keep him ahead of Nank if our hand gets forced.

We're yet to see Nank get back to the peak fitness and athleticism he needs to compete as an undersized first ruck and much as I dislike saying it, the groin surgery means he may never make it back to that level. He really didn't last year and this season hasn't boded well either so far.

We've seen Nank's best - performances he may really struggle to replicate in the future - and it often fell short of matching the top rucks, especially if he was carrying a niggle.

Soldo's a genuine giant with so much more upside and career length potential. He's got the height to carry niggles through games, we lose little if anything in hardness using him over Nank and his skills are pretty much on a par. Because of his raw size and late start he's got a great shot at playing into his 30's given a good run with injury.
Another thing Soldo has going for him is he can actually jump at centre bounces. Was way higher than Grundy most of the night, although his tap work was very limp wristed. So nice to see a ruckman not do the Vickery.
 

Rayzorwire

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Another thing Soldo has going for him is he can actually jump at centre bounces. Was way higher than Grundy most of the night, although his tap work was very limp wristed. So nice to see a ruckman not do the Vickery.
Yeah, was so good to see, he was really getting over the top of him. If he's getting up significantly higher than Grundy you can imagine what the coaching staff are seeing at training when he and Nank go at it.

We've got a lot of work to do on our centre square setup and system. Not one of our mids has ever had a ruck who wins clean hitouts consistently enough to rove to them, we've always set up defensively so I see this new development as something that may take 2-3 seasons to really start taking advantage of. At times it really seemed like Soldo wasn't sure where he needed to be putting the ball and I'm sure there will be huge improvement as they all play together more.


Nank and Soldo will play together once Nank has his legs back after last years surgery, his contest work around the ground and marking down the line will have him back in imo
We carried a lot of smalls who got too little ball to give us any advantage going with just one ruck last week and it messes with the forward setup taking Lynch away, so I think what we saw both in our game and others over the weekend did Nank's chances no harm whatsoever. Can certainly make a good case for playing both on what we've seen so far, Nank would have had way more impact than plenty of smalls who got a game.
 

tiger_tough

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I thought Soldo got a fair amount of hitouts but they were pretty poor overall. Quite often direct to pies players and even Grundy. Plus the soft HOA Grundy got to Adams for the opening goal was weak.

Soldo played his role in doing a job quelling Grundys influence, but I'd like to see Nank come in for him this week. Ceglar is a better match up for Nank.
 

Marcel Proust

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the most important part of it all is tying CCJ up long term ...

Can't see why we can't use 2 rucks.
Think we only used 77 of our 90 rotations.
With shorter qtrs it actually makes it easier too manage our mids in particular.
cause they like having the extra run a Stack or Pickett gives instead of 2 bigs i assume
 

Tiger_Of_Old

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the most important part of it all is tying CCJ up long term ...



cause they like having the extra run a Stack or Pickett gives instead of 2 bigs i assume
If we're not going too use all our rotations then why go in one tall short?
My concern what if we lose an Astbury down back?
 

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