Opinion 3 marking tall forwards and 2 rucks

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josh the gent

The Pieman
Sep 25, 2008
2,346
1,942
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
The biggest thing to take from last night’s lass to the Tiges was our structure.

For 6 weeks, we’ve had:

- 3 tall forwards who attack the ball in the air (Naughton, Bruce, English)
- 2 rucks (Martin, English)

Having Tim English obviously helps a bit with bench space/run - but i think the structure needs to remain even if English is not available.

Looking at last night:
- Our third “tall forward” was Schache. But he simply does not attack the ball in the air. Without the third tall, we don’t stretch good teams defensively in the air.
- We didn’t have a second ruck. That allowed Nank to take multiple rests throughout the game, and he dominated Martin who tires in the second half (obviously he’s past his peak). Also means we get no ruck ascendency when Martin is resting.

Solution?

If English misses this week, i’d rather see a forward line of Naughton, Bruce, and Ugle-Hagan - and a ruck division of Martin and Sweet.

The benefits of consistently winning or halving the ruck to our elite midfield, and ensuring they have 3 genuine marking options to kick to......... far outweighs the downside of less interchange running capacity.

We must have a consistent structure - with or without Tim English...
 

Virgin Dog

Norm Smith Medallist
Oct 29, 2017
7,716
15,316
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
The biggest thing to take from last night’s lass to the Tiges was our structure.

For 6 weeks, we’ve had:

- 3 tall forwards who attack the ball in the air (Naughton, Bruce, English)
- 2 rucks (Martin, English)

Having Tim English obviously helps a bit with bench space/run - but i think the structure needs to remain even if English is not available.

Looking at last night:
- Our third “tall forward” was Schache. But he simply does not attack the ball in the air. Without the third tall, we don’t stretch good teams defensively in the air.
- We didn’t have a second ruck. That allowed Nank to take multiple rests throughout the game, and he dominated Martin who tires in the second half (obviously he’s past his peak). Also means we get no ruck ascendency when Martin is resting.

Solution?

If English misses this week, i’d rather see a forward line of Naughton, Bruce, and Ugle-Hagan - and a ruck division of Martin and Sweet.

The benefits of consistently winning or halving the ruck to our elite midfield, and ensuring they have 3 genuine marking options to kick to......... far outweighs the downside of less interchange running capacity.

We must have a consistent structure - with or without Tim English...
You're double counting English. Running with Sweet and JUH in means one extra tall which significantly affects our structure.

Next time, I'd still rather run with Sweet in Schache's place since he barely offered a presence up forward anyway
 

LittleG

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 18, 2015
6,963
7,855
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
The biggest thing to take from last night’s lass to the Tiges was our structure.

For 6 weeks, we’ve had:

- 3 tall forwards who attack the ball in the air (Naughton, Bruce, English)
- 2 rucks (Martin, English)

Having Tim English obviously helps a bit with bench space/run - but i think the structure needs to remain even if English is not available.

Looking at last night:
- Our third “tall forward” was Schache. But he simply does not attack the ball in the air. Without the third tall, we don’t stretch good teams defensively in the air.
- We didn’t have a second ruck. That allowed Nank to take multiple rests throughout the game, and he dominated Martin who tires in the second half (obviously he’s past his peak). Also means we get no ruck ascendency when Martin is resting.

Solution?

If English misses this week, i’d rather see a forward line of Naughton, Bruce, and Ugle-Hagan - and a ruck division of Martin and Sweet.

The benefits of consistently winning or halving the ruck to our elite midfield, and ensuring they have 3 genuine marking options to kick to......... far outweighs the downside of less interchange running capacity.

We must have a consistent structure - with or without Tim English...
I posted in the offensive strategy thread that I am looking forward to us playing 4 tall forwards and 1 ruck. Obviously 1 forward needs to be the secondary ruck (English being the ideal player for this role). Quite a few agree with this concept.
 

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TommyD13

Club Legend
Jul 31, 2016
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Can only play one of Martin or Sweet. If English doesn't play only one of the forwards needs to also chop out ruck. Should have been Schache last night because of his tank, but Bruce can also suffice. A long-term solution is young Darcy coming through looks like maybe he could be also that English type.
 

josh the gent

The Pieman
Sep 25, 2008
2,346
1,942
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Can only play one of Martin or Sweet. If English doesn't play only one of the forwards needs to also chop out ruck. Should have been Schache last night because of his tank, but Bruce can also suffice. A long-term solution is young Darcy coming through looks like maybe he could be also that English type.
That’s my point, we don’t have a second English type - so when he’s out we either have to sacrifice the 2nd ruck (which is what we did vs Richmond, and tbh it’s what we’ve done for the last couple of years) - or we keep our structure but sacrifice run off the bench.

Schache or Bruce don’t suffice as the 2nd ruck.
 

Next Waiting

Premiership Player
Jan 19, 2014
4,207
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Bevo alluded to Timmy being a capable defensive proposition in his mid-week presser this week.

Down the track....last 3rd of the H&A season might reveal what's really in the pipeline for September (with few of the contenders getting an early look).

Up forward, Naughts, Bruce and JUH.

Down back, Keith and Gardiner

Ruck: 1 of Martin or Sweet

Floater, Timmy (forward, back or ruck) but you'd have 3 talls forward and 2 back plus a ruck at any one point. Forward they're all a little different and there's scope for horses for courses.

So how many small forwards do you need and what traits given at least 1 is likely to be a resting mid. So maybe 2 genuine small forwards and even then 1 might be hybrid(VDM/Hunter). And when Bont is the resting mid....options galore...as long as supply is ongoing.

Supply from source is surely number 1 priority. A genuinely competitive ruck at all times and pray for a speedy Dunks recovery. Those things come together and we're right there.
 

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