Expansion 3rd Western Australian club

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Freomaniac

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The only possible options for a WA club would of been.....

-A perth club. At least they could draw talent from Perth, East perth and west Perth.

-Subiaco: Powerhouse of the WAFL in the last 10 years. They could play most of their home games at Subiaco oval.

-Peel/Mandurah. It could work just like Geelong. Yeah its 60-70 kms away from the Perth CBD but you can take the train there. Build the ground up to a 25,000-30,000 seat stadium and let them ply half their games there.
 

madmug

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Castle Coast is NewCastle/Central Coast. More than a Million people there - nearly twice as many as Tassie.... Plus add in NSW North Coast - you just know it makes sense.
Sorry, never heard the term.

Yes twice the population of Tassie & 4 times the population of Geelong, & probably 1/50th the interest as well. Perfect for the AFL then. :)

Having a ground to play on would help too. ;)
 

rfctiger74

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The only possible options for a WA club would of been.....

-A perth club. At least they could draw talent from Perth, East perth and west Perth.

-Subiaco: Powerhouse of the WAFL in the last 10 years. They could play most of their home games at Subiaco oval.

-Peel/Mandurah. It could work just like Geelong. Yeah its 60-70 kms away from the Perth CBD but you can take the train there. Build the ground up to a 25,000-30,000 seat stadium and let them ply half their games there.
Peel can join only if they take BT back
 

jmac91

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I would love to see a 3rd Perth team Within the next 10 Years and with the talks of the NT of maybe having a team of their own, a 3rd Perth team could be the one to even the competition out. The Places/ Teams that I can see working are Perth (drawing talent from the 3 Perth teams), Joondalup (massive grown in the population and could draw talent from Every Team but mainly West Perth), Subiaco-Claremont (Could have made their home at Subiaco Oval but now that their turning that into a school, they would need to find another option) Peel or South-West Regions (Population alone could make these teams a Geelong outside of Victoria).

For the Perth Teams I would play them out of The WACA Ground (Gives it something to do in Winter), an Upgraded Arena Joondalup (Mainly is Joondalup has the team), Perth Stadium (if the MCG can have 3 games a week so can the New Stadium) and Subiaco Oval (If They Didn't Turn It Into A SCHOOL!). Or just Build a new Ground. Using the old East Perth Power Station wouldn't hurt.
 

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Kwality

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I would love to see a 3rd Perth team Within the next 10 Years and with the talks of the NT of maybe having a team of their own, a 3rd Perth team could be the one to even the competition out. The Places/ Teams that I can see working are Perth (drawing talent from the 3 Perth teams), Joondalup (massive grown in the population and could draw talent from Every Team but mainly West Perth), Subiaco-Claremont (Could have made their home at Subiaco Oval but now that their turning that into a school, they would need to find another option) Peel or South-West Regions (Population alone could make these teams a Geelong outside of Victoria).

For the Perth Teams I would play them out of The WACA Ground (Gives it something to do in Winter), an Upgraded Arena Joondalup (Mainly is Joondalup has the team), Perth Stadium (if the MCG can have 3 games a week so can the New Stadium) and Subiaco Oval (If They Didn't Turn It Into A SCHOOL!). Or just Build a new Ground. Using the old East Perth Power Station wouldn't hurt.
How would WAFL footballers stack up against AFL players? Stop dreaming !
TODAY all AFL clubs have players on their list that arent going to make it & you want more ?
 

madmug

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I would think an AFL orientated city of 2million could develop enough players for 3 clubs. It is also part of a national draft. But given more local opportunity I'd think more kids will work their way to the top.
 

Kwality

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Its not a Perth problem, it could handle a 3rd team on many measures, BUT there is no getting away from it, there are too many teams in Melbourne & some of those clubs cant make ends meet & their supporters believe these clubs are actually trning a profit.
One team in needs one out & Tas should get first dibs.
 

gopies1981

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18 teams is too much anyway. We should really revert back to 16. Anyway that ain’t going to happen. What needs to happen is get rid of the Gold Coast and GWS those clubs are never going to be successful and make it on their own. Move Gold Coast to make them the Joondalup Jaguars and then move gws to Tasmania and call them the Tasmania turtles 👍
 

gopies1981

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Its not a Perth problem, it could handle a 3rd team on many measures, BUT there is no getting away from it, there are too many teams in Melbourne & some of those clubs cant make ends meet & their supporters believe these clubs are actually trning a profit.
One team in needs one out & Tas should get first dibs.
We no Victorian club will leave. The afl learnt their lesson for what they did to Fitzroy. They should of merged with Noth and we would not be worrying about north surviving. The Victorian clubs that were in big trouble financially atm are North Melbourne (they struggling to draw 20,000 when winning) and st.kilda even tho when they are winning they do have a pretty decent latent support base in the southern suburbs of Melbourne. They just to to start winning like Melbourne are now doing
 

telsor

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Its not a Perth problem, it could handle a 3rd team on many measures, BUT there is no getting away from it, there are too many teams in Melbourne & some of those clubs cant make ends meet & their supporters believe these clubs are actually trning a profit.
One team in needs one out & Tas should get first dibs.
If the AFL stopped bankrolling Vic clubs while continuing to fund GWS/GC, there would be a riot.

It'd also be interesting the see what the finances of Vic clubs would be like if the AFL took it's hand out of their pocket. (or at the very least was more transparent about it so we knew how much AFL 'handouts' were really just paying them back for money and other benefits the league took off them in the first place).

Let the Vic clubs compete fairly (e.g. stadium deals that aren't aimed at paying off the AFL ahead of the clubs) for a decent length of time (10 years?) and if they can't manage after that, then their removal is certainly a prospect worth looking at. (nb. if ths were to apply, then it should be applied to all clubs in established areas equally...So Port would be close to the chopping block too).

As for a Tas team...It'd have to prove that it would be significantly more financially viable than the clubs you were removing, which is highly unlikely. It's a bit hard to justify axing a club for being poor, and then bringing in a new, poorer, club after all (especially when it's in an area where there is less growth).
 

_M_16_

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I reckon the league will expand to twenty teams eventually. Both SA and WA, both footballing states and with plenty of talent will both get a third team. They have the support, finances and grounds to manage this. As for Tasmania, I think they will continue to miss out for awhile. But a Tasmanian team is inevitable, however I feel it will be at the expense of a Victorian team in a crowded market. Hopefully no new teams for awhile, the league was s**t the first few years of the new expansion teams due to the dilution of talent in the AFL draft. The past three seasons have been quite even at the top end and the gap between the best and the worst hasn't been as big. There isn't enough talent out there to support further expansion for at least another decade.
 

Arwib

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I would think an AFL orientated city of 2million could develop enough players for 3 clubs. It is also part of a national draft. But given more local opportunity I'd think more kids will work their way to the top.
Both South Australia and Western Australia already produce more players per available list spot than Victoria does.

Last year it was about 100 SA players and about 116 WA players in the league, or about 50 players per club in that state, 15% and 13% of the league for 11% of the league's clubs. By comparison, Victoria had about 426 players, 54% of the league for 56% of clubs, or about 43 players per team in that state.

(Note that these include some of my own State of Origin style reclassification from "official" sources eg Phil Davis is counted as ACT, Tom Hawkins as NSW, and Charlie Cameron as Qld.)

The Victorian draftees also have a slightly lower success rate in terms of games played, which suggests their talent pool is over-fished compared to WA and SA for the reasons that should be fairly obvious. The issue preventing the WA and SA clubs from having more local players is mostly talent distribution rather than talent availability. After all, if neither club has a draft pick and a need for you, then you don't get to stay home, and then getting back home later is tricky due to only two clubs being there. With 10 clubs in Victoria, locals are far more likely to match up to a local club.

So yeah, local talent availability would not be the issue for expansion in those two states, and having a third team would improve the chances of players from those states matching up to a local club in the draft.
 
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Isaac Cumming No 1

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18 teams is too much anyway. We should really revert back to 16. Anyway that ain’t going to happen. What needs to happen is get rid of the Gold Coast and GWS those clubs are never going to be successful and make it on their own. Move Gold Coast to make them the Joondalup Jaguars and then move gws to Tasmania and call them the Tasmania turtles 👍
You'd have to blind not see any reduction of clubs will be in Melbourne though.
 

madmug

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18 teams is too much anyway. We should really revert back to 16. Anyway that ain’t going to happen. What needs to happen is get rid of the Gold Coast and GWS those clubs are never going to be successful and make it on their own. Move Gold Coast to make them the Joondalup Jaguars and then move gws to Tasmania and call them the Tasmania turtles 👍
Tassie Turtles :) Reminds me of the old one about moving Collingwood to the Philippines. Call them the Manila folders. ;)

We won't revert to less than 18 clubs because the AFL is the VFL. They'll use the pot of money to expand into the northern states & milk the other footy states for the Victorian economy.

Victorian kids will continue to get a far better opportunity to play professional Australian rules per capita than WA, SA & Tas kids.
 

Kwality

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If the AFL stopped bankrolling Vic clubs while continuing to fund GWS/GC, there would be a riot.

It'd also be interesting the see what the finances of Vic clubs would be like if the AFL took it's hand out of their pocket. (or at the very least was more transparent about it so we knew how much AFL 'handouts' were really just paying them back for money and other benefits the league took off them in the first place).

Let the Vic clubs compete fairly (e.g. stadium deals that aren't aimed at paying off the AFL ahead of the clubs) for a decent length of time (10 years?) and if they can't manage after that, then their removal is certainly a prospect worth looking at. (nb. if ths were to apply, then it should be applied to all clubs in established areas equally...So Port would be close to the chopping block too).

As for a Tas team...It'd have to prove that it would be significantly more financially viable than the clubs you were removing, which is highly unlikely. It's a bit hard to justify axing a club for being poor, and then bringing in a new, poorer, club after all (especially when it's in an area where there is less growth).
Yep, given the AFLs back door deal to keep the grand final in Melbourne underlines its priorities on the game. Oakley size cohunas aren't in Gils makeup.

If we are to subsidise clubs one of them should be in Tas, a footy nursery will return a handsome dividend in talent IMHO. Certainly a better decision than looking for more $s out of WA.
 

Kwality

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Both South Australia and Western Australia already produce more players per available list spot than Victoria does.

Last year it was about 100 SA players and about 116 WA players in the league, or about 50 players per club in that state, 15% and 13% of the league for 11% of the league's clubs. By comparison, Victoria had about 426 players, 54% of the league for 56% of clubs, or about 43 players per team in that state.

(Note that these include some of my own State of Origin style reclassification from "official" sources eg Phil Davis is counted as ACT, Tom Hawkins as NSW, and Charlie Cameron as Qld.)

The Victorian draftees also have a slightly lower success rate in terms of games played, which suggests their talent pool is over-fished compared to WA and SA for the reasons that should be fairly obvious. The issue preventing the WA and SA clubs from having more local players is mostly talent distribution rather than talent availability. After all, if neither club has a draft pick and a need for you, then you don't get to stay home, and then getting back home later is tricky due to only two clubs being there. With 10 clubs in Victoria, locals are far more likely to match up to a local club.

So yeah, local talent availability would not be the issue for expansion in those two states, and having a third team would improve the chances of players from those states matching up to a local club in the draft.
:thumbsu: so true.

Got a reference on your claim for the draftees, I've been interested in failure rate more, & your stats may help my curiousity.
 

Arwib

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From, I think, the 2017 lists, Victorians had played an average of 62 games, Tasmanians 63, South Australians 66, and Western Australians 71. The other states and territories were all a fair bit lower (NSW 55, NT 50, Qld 49, ACT 44). That's pretty crude, but it sorta suggests there's a few more Victorian guys not getting many/any games, although there's a lot of complicating factors like the age of players etc. I haven't really dug into a more historical look or into failure rates by league of origin, I'm afraid.
 
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