Expansion 3rd Western Australian club

telsor

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Possibly, but these people either like footy or they don't, which means I'm assuming they support the Eagles or Dockers.
I don't see anyone in WA being newly attracted to the game because now there's a team based just North of Perth.
I'm sure all the WA fans who are so happy to kill off Vic clubs 'for the good of the game' would gladly accept WCE being closed down and split in two (or three)....It'd be for the good of the game after all.
 

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Kwality

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Nobody seems willing or able to answer this question.

If Vic football was in such a bad state, why were WCE & the bears so eager to pay that money?

I mean, given the speed it all happened, you'd think they figured they were getting a really good deal or something and that the VFL was something worth paying to join.
So IF the VFL were in a good place why did they sell the farm, love your logic.

Truth is the game nationally was sick.
 

telsor

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So IF the VFL were in a good place why did they sell the farm, love your logic.

Truth is the game nationally was sick.
Agreed, but there was money in it, and people could see that it would mostly be in the VFL.

Claims that WA 'saved' Vic football are farcical...At best they saw the turnaround coming and jumped onboard (and in doing so gave it a helping hand). That turnaround has helped football in all states. (the VFL/AFL does pay millions into every state after all).
 

Kwality

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I'm sure all the WA fans who are so happy to kill off Vic clubs 'for the good of the game' would gladly accept WCE being closed down and split in two (or three)....It'd be for the good of the game after all.
Agreed, but there was money in it, and people could see that it would mostly be in the VFL.

Claims that WA 'saved' Vic football are farcical...At best they saw the turnaround coming and jumped onboard (and in doing so gave it a helping hand). That turnaround has helped football in all states. (the VFL/AFL does pay millions into every state after all).
I'm saying the national comp saved footy at a time when State comps were ALL in trouble, the national comp not the VFL, not the WAFC, not the SANFL .... that comp going forward has problems, growing pains & the 2020s are not the 90s.
 

greatwhiteshark

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Agreed, but there was money in it, and people could see that it would mostly be in the VFL.

Claims that WA 'saved' Vic football are farcical...At best they saw the turnaround coming and jumped onboard (and in doing so gave it a helping hand). That turnaround has helped football in all states. (the VFL/AFL does pay millions into every state after all).
The Eagles and the Bears licence fees probably kept a couple of clubs from folding at best.
The VFL was the only comp that could go national but to this day I am still dirty why WA ran so quickly to join, they should of held out with SA and forced some say in how it was going to be. The then VFL threat of relocating a club to Perth or Adelaide was laughable as no one would of followed them.
Footy was in trouble everywhere, the VFL was where the money was but they didn’t actually have the money. The WAFL was broke as was the SANFL and players were leaving to get a slice of that non existent money in the VFL.
I still don’t think we went down the right path but we do have sort of a national comp and there is huge money in the game now Australia wide.
 

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So IF the VFL were in a good place why did they sell the farm, love your logic.

Truth is the game nationally was sick.
To be fair, Clubs were trying to join the VFL before it even announced they were selling licenses, and even then, they werent just freely available - Queensland only got one because the SANFL declined. Enquiries from the SANFL (in 81), Canberra, Gold Coast, Tasmania and even overseas were knocked back or ignored.

The Eagles and the Bears licence fees probably kept a couple of clubs from folding at best.
The VFL was the only comp that could go national but to this day I am still dirty why WA ran so quickly to join, they should of held out with SA and forced some say in how it was going to be. The then VFL threat of relocating a club to Perth or Adelaide was laughable as no one would of followed them.
Footy was in trouble everywhere, the VFL was where the money was but they didn’t actually have the money. The WAFL was broke as was the SANFL and players were leaving to get a slice of that non existent money in the VFL.

I still don’t think we went down the right path but we do have sort of a national comp and there is huge money in the game now Australia wide.
The WAFL couldnt hold out - and the threat of a VFL license being awarded to a WA or a club relocation was considered very real by the WAFL. Clubs had already tried to join the VFL (notably east perth in 81). Remember it was Port Adelaide trying to join the VFL that forced the SANFLs hand as well. The VFL from the moment it announced expansion indicated it was taking all of its teams with it to the national comp, after the announcement they never wavered, even in the face of SA and WA opposition.

What was laughable was the SANFL holding out for its own conditions to be met - not one of them was - before the inevitable happened.
 

greatwhiteshark

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To be fair, Clubs were trying to join the VFL before it even announced they were selling licenses, and even then, they werent just freely available - Queensland only got one because the SANFL declined. Enquiries from the SANFL (in 81), Canberra, Gold Coast, Tasmania and even overseas were knocked back or ignored.



The WAFL couldnt hold out - and the threat of a VFL license being awarded to a WA or a club relocation was considered very real by the WAFL. Clubs had already tried to join the VFL (notably east perth in 81). Remember it was Port Adelaide trying to join the VFL that forced the SANFLs hand as well. The VFL from the moment it announced expansion indicated it was taking all of its teams with it to the national comp, after the announcement they never wavered, even in the face of SA and WA opposition.

What was laughable was the SANFL holding out for its own conditions to be met - not one of them was - before the inevitable happened.
Of course WA could of held out, that they thought Victoria might relocate a club was laughable at best. Collingwood could of relocated here and they would play in front of 5k every week.
 

frenchconnection

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So IF the VFL were in a good place why did they sell the farm, love your logic.

Truth is the game nationally was sick.
Also WA was sick of the VFL pinching our better players, so the sooner a WA side entered the VFL the better! We even got some of the WA players back - Glendinning and the like.
 

The_Wookie

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Of course WA could of held out, that they thought Victoria might relocate a club was laughable at best. Collingwood could of relocated here and they would play in front of 5k every week.
Its just a pity that a a few people in WA footy at the time disagreed with your hindsight assessment, after all they'd done it to South in Sydney already. As well as the guy who tried to buy the Saints and move them to Perth.
 

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jatz14

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Of course WA could of held out, that they thought Victoria might relocate a club was laughable at best. Collingwood could of relocated here and they would play in front of 5k every week.
A bigger danger was a WAFL club jumping ship, which was far from unrealistic.

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Rabman

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To be fair, Clubs were trying to join the VFL before it even announced they were selling licenses, and even then, they werent just freely available - Queensland only got one because the SANFL declined. Enquiries from the SANFL (in 81), Canberra, Gold Coast, Tasmania and even overseas were knocked back or ignored.



The WAFL couldnt hold out - and the threat of a VFL license being awarded to a WA or a club relocation was considered very real by the WAFL. Clubs had already tried to join the VFL (notably east perth in 81). Remember it was Port Adelaide trying to join the VFL that forced the SANFLs hand as well. The VFL from the moment it announced expansion indicated it was taking all of its teams with it to the national comp, after the announcement they never wavered, even in the face of SA and WA opposition.

What was laughable was the SANFL holding out for its own conditions to be met - not one of them was - before the inevitable happened.
Would have been interesting how the Los Angeles Crocs would have gone. Particularly in terms of stadium, transport and growing Australian Football.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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A bigger danger was a WAFL club jumping ship, which was far from unrealistic.

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The schism in SA football caused by Port trying to jump ship to get the initial licence have had to be bred out.

I'm not sure if the WAFL had an equivalent of Port in terms of it's dominance of the league, but you wouldn't wish it on anyone.
 

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Not only but also, the VFL shunted South Melbourne off to Sydney in 1982, opening the door on a national comp.

Elliott & Seddon had made the noises of a SA club.
 

Kwality

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The schism in SA football caused by Port trying to jump ship to get the initial licence have had to be bred out.

I'm not sure if the WAFL had an equivalent of Port in terms of it's dominance of the league, but you wouldn't wish it on anyone.
Not really, in the 50s & 60s the Freo clubs were the teams we (Subi) wanted to beat, but 3 peats were common, East Perth in the 50s (they had Polly), Swans in the early 60s under Haydn Bunton Jnr, Perth did it too with Barry Cable & Bob Page ( not to mention Ray Mills whose grandson is Callum a product of the Swans Academy), Subi won in 1973 breaking a 49 year sequence (had to throw that in .... ).
 
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telsor

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Its not long enough ago to start this level of revisionism.
TV rights gloabally were becoming a much bigger factor, and the lions share was always going to go to the biggest and highest quality league, which was the VFL, by a long way. (VFL was already getting broadcast in WA & SA, while their leagues were barely hear of in the Vic media market).

The idea that people realised more money was coming, and the VFL would be the big player in that is hardly 'revisionism'.
 

telsor

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The Eagles and the Bears licence fees probably kept a couple of clubs from folding at best.
The VFL was the only comp that could go national but to this day I am still dirty why WA ran so quickly to join, they should of held out with SA and forced some say in how it was going to be. The then VFL threat of relocating a club to Perth or Adelaide was laughable as no one would of followed them.
Footy was in trouble everywhere, the VFL was where the money was but they didn’t actually have the money. The WAFL was broke as was the SANFL and players were leaving to get a slice of that non existent money in the VFL.
I still don’t think we went down the right path but we do have sort of a national comp and there is huge money in the game now Australia wide.
As Wookie has mentioned, WA standing firm for a better deal just wasn't realistically going to happen. WAFL clubs were ready to jump ship, and in the end the club/license went to a private entity anyway (yes, it wasn't completely separate, and WAFC later bought it, but if WA tried to play hardball, it wouldn't have been a big change to be completely separate).

The only was WA (or SA, or where ever) could have 'stood firm' was if all the fans boycotted it, which seems highly unlikely to happen on a large enough scale.

Whatever scenario you look at, a weak link would have been found and broken all too quickly.
 

Kwality

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TV rights gloabally were becoming a much bigger factor, and the lions share was always going to go to the biggest and highest quality league, which was the VFL, by a long way. (VFL was already getting broadcast in WA & SA, while their leagues were barely hear of in the Vic media market).

The idea that people realised more money was coming, and the VFL would be the big player in that is hardly 'revisionism'.
What year was it the ABC had the rights?
 

Goggin Our Best

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What year was it the ABC had the rights?
It was 1987 - the VFL was in a very poor state

And believe it or not - up in Sydney have a guess who had the TV rights - or should i say - which broadcaster was prepared to show aussie rules in Sydney

And the answer is - SBS - they came to the party - and they use to show the match of the day live on a Saturday afternoon - and that was the only VFL shown in Sydney for the week

Barry Breen the StKilda hero in their one and only flag - he was in the Sydney SBS studio- and at half time and after the game he would give a bit of a summary
 

Kwality

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Gee, same year WCE & the Bears joined...
The 1987 Rights

The VFL were surprised when Seven offered no increase on the rights for 1987, staying firm on $3.3 million for the 1987 season (Football Limited pg 163) – Ross Oakley says 3.4 million (The Phoenix Rises pg 85). The league did not believe a 13% increase was enough, and the VFL decided to try other stations, but no interest was forthcoming from the Nine or Ten networks. After a couple of weeks, the league went back to Seven only to be told they had taken too long to consider the offer – evidently a two week deadline – and it was now being reduced to $3 million a season. (Football Limited pg 167).

http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4259

Theres more:
n January 28th, 1987, Seven Network (Melbourne) manager Ron Casey offered the VFL $2 million for the 1987 Victorian rights, but later withdrew them, signing instead a deal for $1.4 million, while still broadcasting the preseason competition. (The Phoenix Rises pg 95, Football Limited pg 176). However, Seven was soon sold to Fairfax, and on March 13, the league announced the Seven deal for 1987 had collapsed (The Phoenix Rises pg 96). The league then turned to the ABC which signed on for $1.6 million (Note that Football Limited says it was slightly less than 1.5 million)
 

jatz14

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The 1987 Rights

The VFL were surprised when Seven offered no increase on the rights for 1987, staying firm on $3.3 million for the 1987 season (Football Limited pg 163) – Ross Oakley says 3.4 million (The Phoenix Rises pg 85). The league did not believe a 13% increase was enough, and the VFL decided to try other stations, but no interest was forthcoming from the Nine or Ten networks. After a couple of weeks, the league went back to Seven only to be told they had taken too long to consider the offer – evidently a two week deadline – and it was now being reduced to $3 million a season. (Football Limited pg 167).

http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4259

Theres more:
n January 28th, 1987, Seven Network (Melbourne) manager Ron Casey offered the VFL $2 million for the 1987 Victorian rights, but later withdrew them, signing instead a deal for $1.4 million, while still broadcasting the preseason competition. (The Phoenix Rises pg 95, Football Limited pg 176). However, Seven was soon sold to Fairfax, and on March 13, the league announced the Seven deal for 1987 had collapsed (The Phoenix Rises pg 96). The league then turned to the ABC which signed on for $1.6 million (Note that Football Limited says it was slightly less than 1.5 million)
But, but West Coast.

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