Player Watch #4 James Harmes - Contract Extended til 2024

Cannon82

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Exactly the sort of player that North would offer $600k+ to after they miss out on everyone they offered millions to again
If we drew a Venn diagram of people Norf would offer $600k to and all the players currently on an AFL list, there'd only be one circle, and Phil Hughes would poke it to second slip.
 

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TheDarkDwarf

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Harmes isn't a genuine star; he's a versatile and solid B grader that's around the 4th or 5th best-performed player on our list in recent years and is someone we should be locking away. I'm guessing the 5 year deal may have a bit to do with keeping him away from free agency temptation in that prime 26/27 age bracket where other clubs can still get a good 5 years out of them. Don't know how much he'd be getting for his 5 year deal, but $500 or $600k is probably reasonable.
550k a year I believe.
 

Topkent

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The argument is not whether other clubs would come knocking. It’s whether another club would be willing to entice a B grader like Harmes away with a big five year offer. That’s the only reason to tie him up until 2024, instead of doing the sensible list management thing and add two years to his existing 2020 contract.

It would never happen. I’ve had passing conversations with several mates with keen footy brains (who support other clubs) and all agreed this was a strange decision at best. At worst - totally irresponsible.

If James Harmes is a Demon ‘star’ then we may as well shut the gates on the joint now. Ludicrousness.
Except it's no sensible. Having his contract run out in his prime with FA open is moronic at best. His contract would go way north or we could lose him. This we his next contract will be a veteran offering. Its smart business from the club.
 

Cannon82

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550k a year I believe.
Curious where people hear these types of things on salary given they're supposed to be confidential. That's probably about fair for someone of his ability, although if you start comparing it to other players like Lever, Harmes would be filthy, or Tomlinson, again Harmes would be filthy. The guy is currently a top 5 ish player on performance - if he hasn't demanded a top 5 ish salary to go along with the track record, great.
 

Cobwebs

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The argument is not whether other clubs would come knocking. It’s whether another club would be willing to entice a B grader like Harmes away with a big five year offer. That’s the only reason to tie him up until 2024, instead of doing the sensible list management thing and add two years to his existing 2020 contract.

It would never happen. I’ve had passing conversations with several mates with keen footy brains (who support other clubs) and all agreed this was a strange decision at best. At worst - totally irresponsible.

If James Harmes is a Demon ‘star’ then we may as well shut the gates on the joint now. Ludicrousness.
Polec wasn't/isn't a star and he got an offer to good to refuse, Lyons isn't a star and he got a better offer to move, Hill the same to St Kilda. It happens often.
 

GatesOfHell

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Polec wasn't/isn't a star and he got an offer to good to refuse, Lyons isn't a star and he got a better offer to move, Hill the same to St Kilda. It happens often.
Hill is a star.

Holding North Melbourne up as a beacon of list management astuteness doesn’t strengthen your case.
 

Cobwebs

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Hill is a star.

Holding North Melbourne up as a beacon of list management astuteness doesn’t strengthen your case.
Sorry, does the offer have to come from a top 8 contender, you should have told me. How about Lyons and Brisbane then. And Hill worth 900K, you hold St Kilda in high esteem then.
 

Cannon82

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Sorry, does the offer have to come from a top 8 contender, you should have told me. How about Lyons and Brisbane then. And Hill worth 900K, you hold St Kilda in high esteem then.
Lyons was delisted by the Gold Coast. If we delist Harmes and he goes to another club... cue shocked Melbourne Pikachu face?
 

Cobwebs

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Lyons was delisted by the Gold Coast. If we delist Harmes and he goes to another club... cue shocked Melbourne Pikachu face?
Wasn't Lyons delisted after trade period when he got the offer from Brisbane, thus the delisting. Pretty sure that is how it worked.
 

Cannon82

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Wasn't Lyons delisted after trade period when he got the offer from Brisbane, thus the delisting. Pretty sure that is how it worked.
No, wasn't wanted by the Gold Coast. If he was, Brisbane would have had to trade for him or pick him up in the draft.
 

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GatesOfHell

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Sorry, does the offer have to come from a top 8 contender, you should have told me. How about Lyons and Brisbane then. And Hill worth 900K, you hold St Kilda in high esteem then.
Look, I just got awarded a ‘Nice Content’ trophy by the site, so it’s all over.
 

Cobwebs

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No, wasn't wanted by the Gold Coast. If he was, Brisbane would have had to trade for him or pick him up in the draft.
Sorry to burst your bubble but he was delisted on the 31st October and picked up as a DFA on the 1st November. Wiki told me.
 

Cannon82

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Sorry to burst your bubble but he was delisted on the 31st October and picked up as a DFA on the 1st November. Wiki told me.
Burst my bubble? Wasn't I the one saying Gold Coast didn't want him and delisted him? How much sugar did you have on your cocoa pops this morning?
 

Cobwebs

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Burst my bubble? Wasn't I the one saying Gold Coast didn't want him and delisted him? How much sugar did you have on your cocoa pops this morning?
Burst my bubble? Wasn't I the one saying Gold Coast didn't want him and delisted him? How much sugar did you have on your cocoa pops this morning?
Sorry, it might be the coffee, I take 2 sugars on my 5th.
 

Demonkings

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Harmes isn’t a star, he is a gun though. He lacks a stand out attribute that all stars must have. Oliver and Gawn are both stars because they do things as well or better than just about anyone else in the league. Harmes does a lot of things (basically everything except ruckwork) well without doing anything to a standard of being best in the league. Does this make him a b grader? Absolutely not. He has had a far more consistent career to this point than Petracca, Brayshaw, Salem, even Viney. This is all while not having a niche position given to him, he plays almost a different role each week, I would say in the future if given the opportunity he has the potential to be a better half forward than Petracca, or a better half back than Salem. He is a ripper. I don’t know why any Melbourne supporter would want to talk him down or make out like his signing on for 5 years is bad news. Any other club in the league would gladly pinch a 26 year old Harmes from us. By that stage he is going to be a hell of a player.
 

Cannon82

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Harmes isn’t a star, he is a gun though. He lacks a stand out attribute that all stars must have. Oliver and Gawn are both stars because they do things as well or better than just about anyone else in the league. Harmes does a lot of things (basically everything except ruckwork) well without doing anything to a standard of being best in the league. Does this make him a b grader? Absolutely not. He has had a far more consistent career to this point than Petracca, Brayshaw, Salem, even Viney. This is all while not having a niche position given to him, he plays almost a different role each week, I would say in the future if given the opportunity he has the potential to be a better half forward than Petracca, or a better half back than Salem. He is a ripper. I don’t know why any Melbourne supporter would want to talk him down or make out like his signing on for 5 years is bad news. Any other club in the league would gladly pinch a 26 year old Harmes from us. By that stage he is going to be a hell of a player.
Harmes is a B Grader. That's no horrific put-down of the bloke. None of Petracca, Brayshaw, Viney or Salem are A Grade players. Gawn and Oliver are, and there are some others who could be if form and fitness allow it. We don't have a list full of high level talent. We didn't finish second last by accident this year.
 

Demonkings

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Harmes is a B Grader. That's no horrific put-down of the bloke. None of Petracca, Brayshaw, Viney or Salem are A Grade players. Gawn and Oliver are, and there are some others who could be if form and fitness allow it. We don't have a list full of high level talent. We didn't finish second last by accident this year.
A player that progresses from the rookie list to being a better performer than many first round picked peers is bound to be an a grader. He may not be now, but he is super consistent and will get better with more experience and confidence. He does everything well without doing anything outstanding. I wouldn’t be surprised if later in his career he gets a bit of overdue kudos, a bit like Corey Enright at Geelong, such players tend to go unnoticed for a long time until their consistency proves to be remarkable. A super consistent, reliable performer. He is a gun.
 

Cannon82

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A player that progresses from the rookie list to being a better performer than many first round picked peers is bound to be an a grader. He may not be now, but he is super consistent and will get better with more experience and confidence. He does everything well without doing anything outstanding. I wouldn’t be surprised if later in his career he gets a bit of overdue kudos, a bit like Corey Enright at Geelong, such players tend to go unnoticed for a long time until their consistency proves to be remarkable. A super consistent, reliable performer. He is a gun.
Where he was picked has little to do with his current performance. He's an above average player but not up there with the elite or exceptional players in the competition. He's not in remotely the same class as Enright at Geelong - Enright was a 6 time All Australian and won two B&Fs in Premiership years. Harmes is placing top 5 for a shit club and isn't in AA discussions.
 

Gysberts2Bate

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Where he was picked has little to do with his current performance. He's an above average player but not up there with the elite or exceptional players in the competition. He's not in remotely the same class as Enright at Geelong - Enright was a 6 time All Australian and won two B&Fs in Premiership years. Harmes is placing top 5 for a shit club and isn't in AA discussions.
Enright didn't make AA until his 9th season on the Cats list and his first six at the Cats were pretty similar to ours in the time that Harmes has been here, though, with Enright making similar contributions in that time. Harmes just completed his sixth season on the list. It's not a great comparison sure but not too late for him to become a much better player than he is.
 

Cannon82

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Enright didn't make AA until his 9th season on the Cats list and his first six at the Cats were pretty similar to ours in the time that Harmes has been here, though, with Enright making similar contributions in that time. Harmes just completed his sixth season on the list. It's not a great comparison sure but not too late for him to become a much better player than he is.
Ha, righto, so we have to wait for Harmes not to make the AA side 6 times and win zero B&Fs in Premiership years before we're allowed to say he's not as good as Enright? Please. Harmes is a good player, Enright was a great player. Come back to me when Harmes IS a great player.
 

Demonkings

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Where he was picked has little to do with his current performance. He's an above average player but not up there with the elite or exceptional players in the competition. He's not in remotely the same class as Enright at Geelong - Enright was a 6 time All Australian and won two B&Fs in Premiership years. Harmes is placing top 5 for a shit club and isn't in AA discussions.
It’s probably not a good analogy, but Enright was the first player I could think of who was good at everything without being exceptional at something, in the same way that Harmes is. It’s also way easier to be AA when you play in one of the best teams of all time. Enright also was played consistently in a position while Harmes hasn’t had that luxury so far in his career. I would say that Harmes is in our top 4 or 5 players while Enright would have been around top 6 or 7 in that Geelong team which goes to show how far away we are really. But if we’re ever going to be a good team let alone a great team then we need to keep our good players and Harmes is a good player now and he’s going to keep improving. Whether you call him an a grader or b grader a side issue.
 

Gysberts2Bate

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Ha, righto, so we have to wait for Harmes not to make the AA side 6 times and win zero B&Fs in Premiership years before we're allowed to say he's not as good as Enright? Please. Harmes is a good player, Enright was a great player. Come back to me when Harmes IS a great player.
I think it's possible to recognise that Enright was just a very solid and consistent player in his first several seasons with occasional bursts of form like Harmes 2018 and he didn't do anything exceptional to go to the next level, the team just improved around him and he continued to play the role he'd finessed like Harmes is in the process of now. A five year investment in Harmes isn't just an investment in him, it's an investment in his role in where they think the side will go. Can't win a B&F in a premiership year if your team doesn't win the flag, no matter how good you are. Just ask Scott West.
 

Cannon82

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Yeah, I think you guys seriously underrate Enright. I'll admit he's one of my favourite players outside of the Dees - if you think he was just a solid, unspectacular player, then that says more about your understanding of the game. Bloke could read the game as well anyone, pretty much always beat his opponent, was always calm and composed and a very good ball user. Nev Jetta is the closest on our list to Enright and Jetta at his best could only do a comparable job defensively without racking up the same number of possessions and rebound out of the back half.

You guys want to argue Harmes is an A Grader but then compare him to one of the best players of the modern era. Why don't you shoot a little lower? Harmes is definitely as good as Nic Fosdike was.
 

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