Opinion 40% fit Paddy Ryder, better than a 100% fit Billy Frampton - non verbal Ken
- Thread starter RussellEbertHandball
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- Jul 8, 2015
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Not too bad of a game for 40%.
As for Billy coming in..sure, I'd like to see how he goes. But I haven't seen him play this year, so I'm not exactly sure where he's at.. I did hear Tim Ginever say (5aa after yesterday's game) that Billy holds himself back from being selected. Tim said he doesn't try hard enough and that his second efforts are non existent.
As for Billy coming in..sure, I'd like to see how he goes. But I haven't seen him play this year, so I'm not exactly sure where he's at.. I did hear Tim Ginever say (5aa after yesterday's game) that Billy holds himself back from being selected. Tim said he doesn't try hard enough and that his second efforts are non existent.
GremioPower
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Even if true, it is a fallacious reasoning. This decision needs to be weighted against the season as a whole; at the very least.
A simple example: NBA's Cavs best play was giving the ball to LeBron. But LeBron cannot have the ball 100% of the time; otherwise, giving him the ball no longer would be the best play. He would get quintuple-teamed and absolutely exhausted, both which would interfere on the quality of his play.
Hence, in order to preserve the odds of using LeBron successfully, the Cavs would need to risk letting the ball going into worse players. They would necessarily decrease their odds of success now so they could preserve their best odds later.
In brief, there are times when the best choice is to bet against the odds.
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Oh well. At least his Melbourne trip was worthwhile then...
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Definitely yes but in what role? I like Paddy as a forward as he can take a mark and is a reasonable kick. Our No 1 recruiting priority has to be an AFL ready ruckman to take some of the work load. West Coast do not appear to have any difficulty playing two ruckmen and there should be no problem in playing Ryder as a ruckman/forward . Then again the West Coast are not coached by far Ken Hinkley.
I am not sure where this leaves Billy Frampton because baring injury he isn't going to get much opportunity if he is no3 in the pecking order. 2018 was the year to give Billy a crack at it but as Hinkley chose not to we still do not know if the kid has what it takes or not.
I've watched Bill play all year his early form was average but he rebounded into a solidish block of form if Tim said that he's being hyper critical he tries & follows up when playing well.. towing a company line who knows I have great respect for Tim but the fact is we've picked players on worse form than Bill in the SANFL for years under Hinkley.
Daza, the decision to not play a proper ruckman to support Paddy cost us any chance of winning that game because of the snowball effect. Did you watch the last quarter, was entirely predictable that we would run out of gas. We have seen this before and we got the same outcome, just far worse.
PS. Everyone on this forum rates Ryder and would have been happy to see him resting in the forward line. He has skill unlike half our list atm. Diabolical development of players.
- Jul 8, 2015
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I'd prefer us to have a proper second ruck. Paddy and Frampton swapping between ruck and forward. Paddy is a lethal forward. Westy to do a very small amount of ruck, but to mainly sweep across back from play. Haven't watched the 4th yet.
Power Raid
We Exist To Win Premierships
If you're plan A is failing, why try something different?
Its a coaches to motivate players, now they can only do so much the player needs to want to and earn it.
But how would you feel if your Frampton, you get pulled from the SANFL GF last year to be ready this year when the only ruckman goes down they through structure out the window and Hinkley constantly says you're not good enough, when asked in the media "if you watched he SANFL you'd see guys that aren't ready", This is all whilst watching guys like Neade, S.Gray and Johnson gifted games when their form doesn't warrant it just like Young and AhChee in years gone bye.
That'd be pretty demoralising, why do this guys get gifted games when they aren't good enough and have other players that can take their spots ? But when our only ruckman goes down structure goes out the window. How about tap him on the back and say, Mate nows you're chance, the team needs you mate, lets see what you've got.
Back the kid in.
- Jul 8, 2015
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Yeah I'm not sure what conversations would be like between Kenny and Billy, but I'd imagine it would be encouragement. Ken hasn't actually said he's not good enough, just not ready for AFL.
I'd prefer to have a second ruck though.. Especially when Ryder isn't that fit. I would have been happy for Billy to play yesterday and against the Western Bulldogs.
Hopefully going forward Billy gets his shot, and Paddy can play more in the forward line. Imagine Paddy next to Dixon, with Robbie and Chad.
- Jul 5, 2013
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Laughable Ken thinks some players aren't ready for AFL but will continually select players who aren't up to it at all.
Zac Clarke had 29 possessions and 4 goals in the WAFL yesterday.
I could name about 15 guys we could have cut from our list without losing anything.
I could name about 15 guys we could have cut from our list without losing anything.
Would love to see frampton go to another club next year and demolish it. The guy deserves his chance. No point staying on our list if he has no chance of playing with Ken around.
- Jul 20, 2002
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It's not new. When Dennis Taylor coached England he sometimes preferred the very average Michael Cole to the proven goalscorer Gary Lineker on the basis of "workrate". And that was in soccer, think about it. Someone who can score 10 goals in 20 games and little else would be dropped in Aussie Rules but they are gold in soccer.
RussellEbertHandball
Flick pass expert
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Add the stuff ups in 2014 and even in 2015 with Redden and you now might see why in the Ruck Strategy thread and other places I have written that if we dont get our list management of rucks correct by the end of the rookie draft in December this year, you can write off winning a flag in 2019. It will show we have learnt SFA from 2014, 2016 and 2018 and we have people as thick as pig s**t in charge, because they cant do what if scenarios and cant see unintended consequences.
If we dont have a squad of 3 blokes that are ready to ruck Rd 1 in 2019 because a couple might pick injuries in the preseason might mean we are down to 1 fit ruckman for Rd 1, we are ****** for 2019. Triple redundancy has to be in place in 2019 and has to be the driving philosophy.
Fos said get rid of the no hopers. Get rid of the no hoper thinking around rucky strategy of the last few years, or just leave if you can't!
- Dec 31, 2013
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I mentioned in the trade/FA period that I was concerned by our ruck stocks after getting rid of Lobbe and Jacko. Many people said it was nothing to worry about. We had Frampton sent in for surgery early so he'd be ready to go.
I think we did the right thing in getting rid of Lobbe but Jacko would have been good Ryder insurance this year. If we absolutely had to lose him then a mature age player should have been brought in, absolutely no questions asked.
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RussellEbertHandball
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Lobbe had to be moved on. His body said he wasn't going to play much AFL footy. If he was paid $200k not $500k then we probably would have kept him. Jacko could have done the back up job but he wasn't going to accept a $250k-$300k pay packet and play SANFL unless we had lots of injuries.
I wanted us to go for 23 year old Scott Jones from East Perth with a late pick or rookie pick, or someone like him as a minimal if we didnt go for an AFL delisted player. Have written about him many times. We weren't going to go for any rucks according to Parker but Sam Hayes fell to us and was too good to refuse. I was very happy we drafted him but it didnt solve our problem of having a mature back up. Scott Jones was drafted by Freo with pick 75, has played 5 games for Freo - didnt play yesterday in the shellacking at Geelong, so has showed enough to say he can play AFL. Billy hasn't, Hayes did an ACL, Ryder has picked up injuries, so we have been in the s**t in 2018.
Once we got Hayes I knew we wouldnt get anyone else which I was disappointed with, but at least Hayes looks good enough that he could be our main ruckmen for the 2020's. Doesn't solve our 2018 issues but at least we have a player who IMO is good enough to play AFL provide he recovers from his ACL in a normal fashion.
Ford Fairlane
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- Feb 21, 2002
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Gees thanks for reminding me of the decision that cost the Maggies and Summerton a premiership.
Forzaport
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I reckon Paddy will finally get some time off now.
It’s one out of the box but he’s been dominant all year, averaging 16 possessions, 37 hitouts and 1.5 goals per game.
