Current Abduction of 4yo Blowholes Shacks WA *Terence Kelly Convicted

[Kurve]

MEDIA
Current - The Bunker Part 2

 

[BFew]

In another post from January 1 he professed to have spoken with “my son 16 my eldest girls 17 year old, 19 year old and 21 year old plus my 11 year old” about the dangers of the online world.

Here's the post I screenshot direct from the accused FB page about 9pm on 3 November.

This is the post that received over 1000 comments from people discussing the case and the newly arrested accused, in the days after the accused's arrest, just before this FB account was pulled down.

Comments to this post included lots of screenshots of things people had found related to the accused on his various social media accounts........

 

[BFew]

One Bratz DeLuca post on October 18, two days after Cleo disappeared, said “feeling blessed”.

I already posted a screenshot of this worrying FB post in the Bunker thread yesterday here.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

He doesn’t seem unintelligent, but definitely living in a fantasy world.

 

[BFew]

police will allege, Mr Kelly crossed back out of that fantasy world and drove out to the Blowholes campground, 75km north of Carnarvon, to abduct Cleo.

That's premeditated as opposed to the opportunistic.

 

[Kurve]

That's premeditated as opposed to the opportunistic.

They must have done a switch in thinking on information they've gathered since the arrest?

 

[craffles]

craffles mate, in saying that I have no sympathy for a child snatcher I’m definitely not one of these stalking his FB and leaving disgusting comments, or wishing him to get bashed and assaulted in jail. No one even knows what he did and why yet. And even if he wants to collect dolls too thats not so strange, many people collect toys…I’m not jumping to conclusions and inventing theories that his collection has anything to do with pedophilia, I‘ll leave that crap for the police, psychologists and courts to work out.

I’m more interested in how he managed to get a 4 year old out of a tent so quietly and keep her for so long in the middle of a town that was madly looking for her…that's the part that interests me, the actual crime part of it is bizzare!
Now that’s she’s home safely of course

It's such a horrible crime I've tried really hard to avoid talking about it but it's not going away. Agreed with what you said

 

[Xtreme]

The other day I saw a boy who was quite young playing by a drain on his own. One car pulled up and a lady got out assuming she was checking on him. I did the same. Moments later his mum came around the corner. Still it pays to check and keep an eye out I mean in a non creepy way. I don’t really care if I’m perceived that way. As long as our littlest are safe.

Yesterday a child fell out of a pram, normally my first instinct would be to check on the person to make sure they're ok. But in recent years its more easier to play 'spectator' than hero of the day (regardless of 8 or 80 y/o). Lest you get accused of shady business. In this instance the child was lambasted by the mother and essentially said its your own fault for not sitting in it properly.

Witnessed a child stack it on her own feet a few months ago (reminded me of those ice skaters toppling over in Steven Bradbury's race in 2002), child starts bawling.... I'm 20m away and yet the parent gives me the side eye!!

 

[PetterdHoisted]

Did WAPOL interview this regular Blowholes camper soon after Cleo went missing?

Interesting that the property where Cleo was rescued from is reported to only be a one-bedder.

Forensic test results to provide info on who had been using the coloured pencils and pens, will be important in the wider investigation of what the accused was up to.

Cleo’s alleged kidnapper ‘often seen at campsite’

Accused child snatcher Terence Kelly was often seen driving around at the campsite where he was alleged to have abducted Cleo Smith, a regular camper says.

thewest.com.au

'Accused child snatcher Terence Kelly was previously seen driving around at the campsite where he was alleged to have abducted Cleo Smith, a local camper says.

The camper, who has strong ties to the area and often spends weekends at the Blowholes campsite, said he knew of Mr Kelly and had seen him several times at the site, about 70km north of Carnarvon, driving a four-wheel-drive.

But the man — who was at the campsite on Saturday — said he never saw Mr Kelly camp the night.'
....
Officers were seen examining a bedframe in the backyard of the home — with one of them also pictured holding a box of coloured pencils and pens.

The one-bedroom property, located just 1.5km from the local police station and 3km from Cleo’s family home, has been cordoned off for nearly four days while police painstakingly examine every item inside.

thanks, wow there it is, one of the big questions finally answered, another tick for the profile.

not a first timer at the camp, knew it well.

not seen at night, but imo was moving around at night on more than one occasion doing his petty thieving.

Until that fateful moment when he peeked into Cleo's tent.

 

[PetterdHoisted]

Collecting dolls does nothing to support a defence of insanity - mental impairment or diminished responsibility. In fact if what we've seen put forward as his doll collection, where there's a place for everything in a perfect arrangement, it won't help one bit.

I've been right over this and at this stage, I can't see where a defence might be raised. These weren't the actions of a man who didn't know what he was doing was wrong without the ability to plan and prepare.

Here's some reading anyway, I think this is up to date but even if it's since been tweaked or not followed through on all recommendations, it probably won't make much difference. It provides a good understanding.

https://www.wa.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-04/LRC-Project-097-Final-Report-CH5.pdf

thanks for that doc Kurve, I am totally naive about these things, will be good to read.

I was thinking though, if I am the Defence, I want the perp on the stand saying:
'I was petty thieving in the tents, when I found a doll, which I took home and looked after for two weeks'

Could you really prove definitively that he wasn't thinking this? So much evidence of him living a bizarre fantasy life for a long time already.

 

[Kurve]

thanks for that doc Kurve, I am totally naive about these things, will be good to read.

I was thinking though, if I am the Defence, I want the perp on the stand saying:
'I was petty thieving in the tents, when I found a doll, which I took home and looked after for two weeks'

Could you really prove definitively that he wasn't thinking this? So much evidence of him living a bizarre fantasy life for a long time already.

Very seriously, I have no idea how this will play out but none of the 'experts' seem to know either! They're all lost for words. i was just thinking of all the really serious crimes that have gone before the courts before where the accused has tried to use an insanity or diminished responsibility defence, a lot of them have tried but i can only remember one that was successful.

 

[Wombot]

She was likely asleep and didn't wake.

A hand around the mouth would have been enough, especially to a groggy child who just wakes whilst being carried out of the tent. The noise aspect isn’t so unbelievable to me. They’re near the ocean as well. It’s not exactly complete silence. Taking the girl could definitely have been done without waking the parents. Either way, I’m sure he ran with the girl as fast as he could and witnesses heard the sound of the screeching tyres which indicates that he himself wasn’t sure that no one heard him. He was in a hurry.

I just don’t find the snatching from the tent to be mysterious. I reckon it’s something like 50/50 that the parents would have woken from that. And as it was, they didn’t.

But I find very unlikely the opinions that he lured her out or anything like that. That would be louder than snatching such a small child.

 

[PetterdHoisted]

Very seriously, I have no idea how this will play out but none of the 'experts' seem to know either! They're all lost for words. i was just thinking of all the really serious crimes that have gone before the courts before where the accused has tried to use an insanity or diminished responsibility defence, a lot of them have tried but i can only remember one that was successful.

yeah, I mean you wouldn't buy that he thinks a child is a doll 100%.

But you could believe that there is some blurring of the lines between dolls and children in his mind.

 

[BigPond101]

Witnessed a child stack it on her own feet a few months ago (reminded me of those ice skaters toppling over in Steven Bradbury's race in 2002), child starts bawling.... I'm 20m away and yet the parent gives me the side eye!!

Same here, this little girl stacked it on her bike just ahead of me on a walking path last weekend, she's laying on the ground screaming and im shuffling around scared shitless wondering what to do without looking some predator, thank god a woman I assume her mum came running past me and attended to her

 

[Kurve]

yeah, I mean you wouldn't buy that he thinks a child is a doll 100%.

But you could believe that there is some blurring of the lines between dolls and children in his mind.

He wasn't showing anybody his new doll or sitting her in the back seat of his car with his other dolls, he was hiding her. For 18 days. His actions seem to show an awareness and consciousness of guilt.

I should say though that if he has an intellectual disability or a diminished responsibility I would expect the courts to recognise that and take it into consideration.

 

[tenderwarrior]

Collecting dolls does nothing to support a defence of insanity - mental impairment or diminished responsibility. In fact if what we've seen put forward as his doll collection, where there's a place for everything in a perfect arrangement, it won't help one bit.

I've been right over this and at this stage, I can't see where a defence might be raised. These weren't the actions of a man who didn't know what he was doing was wrong without the ability to plan and prepare.

Here's some reading anyway, I think this is up to date but even if it's since been tweaked or not followed through on all recommendations, it probably won't make much difference. It provides a good understanding.

https://www.wa.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-04/LRC-Project-097-Final-Report-CH5.pdf

I havent read the file you attached, but why can't somebody be neat, tidy and forward-planning AND also potentially insane, mental impaired or have diminished responsibility? Are these things mutually exclusive?

 

[tenderwarrior]

I have just noticed that I no longer have access to the subreddit r/cleosmith. I am guessing it has been deactivated?

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

They must have done a switch in thinking on information they've gathered since the arrest?

Geez, you could just never predict anything like this. A bit like 9/11.

 

[jason_recliner]

thanks for that doc Kurve, I am totally naive about these things, will be good to read.

I was thinking though, if I am the Defence, I want the perp on the stand saying:
'I was petty thieving in the tents, when I found a doll, which I took home and looked after for two weeks'

Could you really prove definitively that he wasn't thinking this? So much evidence of him living a bizarre fantasy life for a long time already.

I reckon the prosecution would ask why he didn't hand Cleo in when he saw the news of her missing.

 

[jason_recliner]

I havent read the file you attached, but why can't somebody be neat, tidy and forward-planning AND also potentially insane, mental impaired or have diminished responsibility? Are these things mutually exclusive?

I don't know the answer to this. But if somebody is capable of planning, what is their mental impairment?

 

[javaguice]

I don't know the answer to this. But if somebody is capable of planning, what is their mental impairment?

Obsessive compulsive?

 

[Collie_wobbles]

Here's some of the most interesting bits in this long article.

NoCookies | The Australian

www.theaustralian.com.au

'Cleo Smith accused Terence Kelly’s dangerous descent into world of make-believe
PAUL GARVEY SENIOR REPORTER
PAIGE TAYLOR INDIGENOUS AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT, WA BUREAU CHIEF

1:25PM NOVEMBER 6, 2021

In a dilapidated duplex in a rundown part of Carnarvon known locally as The Bronx, Terence Kelly – the man alleged to have abducted four-year-old Cleo Smith – built himself an elaborate online fantasy.

Mr Kelly, increasingly isolated in the years since the death of a woman locals considered his grandmother, appears to have crossed over into a virtual world of Bratz DeLuca: a name appropriated from one of his favourite make of dolls.

Alone in his housing commission home, with no close family of his own, Mr Kelly operated what appears to be several – and potentially dozens – of different Facebook and Instagram accounts for him and his imaginary children.

In at least one instance, he appeared to use photographs from the profile of a woman and her daughters and use them for the profiles of his fake family. He tagged many of the posts as being in Cronulla, a continent away from Carnarvon.

And he did so while sitting surrounded by an elaborate collection of dolls, stretching from wall to wall, and from floor to ceiling.

Last month, police will allege, Mr Kelly crossed back out of that fantasy world and drove out to the Blowholes campground, 75km north of Carnarvon, to abduct Cleo. There, it is alleged he opened a tent where she slept with her parents, picked up the sleeping girl, and took her back to his home.
....
Since his arrest, a trail left by Mr Kelly across social media has offered an unsettling insight into his life. His doll obsession and the fantasy family he constructed were documented primarily through Facebook pages under the names of Bratz DeLuca and Terence TezKelz.

Mr Kelly described himself in online profiles as half Australian and half Italian.

Through the DeLuca Facebook account – which has since been deactivated – Mr Kelly posted numerous updates to various doll forums. He also liked a series of different Facebook pages that have taken on different overtones in the wake of this week’s events.

Sources close to the investigation have confirmed that the Bratz DeLuca account belonged to him.

One Bratz DeLuca post on October 18, two days after Cleo disappeared, said “feeling blessed”.

The Bratz DeLuca profile also liked dozens of different pages about dolls, mermaids, Disney princesses and cosplay.

Through a web of fake social media accounts, Mr Kelly appeared to orchestrate conversations between himself and his imaginary “daughters”.

Often, the conversations involved his “children” telling their father how much they loved him.

In another post from January 1 he professed to have spoken with “my son 16 my eldest girls 17 year old, 19 year old and 21 year old plus my 11 year old” about the dangers of the online world.

“As a parent it’s (sic) give you goosebumps and very real knowing predatory people can strike behind the screen and keyboard, I also feel the need to protect my kids more and their friends too also other children around us we must look out for.”

While Mr Kelly isn’t the only man on earth with a doll collection, his apparent personification of the toys sits in contrast to other more conventional collectors.

In one social media foray, “DeLuca” posted photographs of him sitting in a vehicle with one of his dolls. “I love taking my dolls for drive abounds and doing their hair and taking selfies in public,” he wrote.

The picture of a loner with an obsession for dolls who is alleged to have abducted a child sounds like a trope of B-grade movie thrillers.

But criminal psychologists who have worked in the field for decades told The Weekend Australian they had rarely, if ever, seen a case such as this.

James Ogloff, a professor of behavioural science and director of the Centre for Forensic Behavioural Science at Swinburne University, has crossed paths with some of the country’s worst child abductors over his nearly 40-year career.

While he did not want to comment specifically on the allegations in the Kelly case, he said it was extremely atypical for someone alleged to be a child abductor to have an obsession with dolls.

“It goes without saying that it’s very unusual,” he said.

“As a psychologist, one of the things you start to wonder about – and it’s not just in this case – but people who have strange obsessions generally.

“But you also get people who collect things to fill gaps in life. We know, for example, that people who hoard often have underlying psychological issues.”

Similarly, the creation of fake online profiles could be a reflection of someone with a weakening grip on reality. “All of us have some sort of fantasy and we think about things, but we’re in touch with reality. We know what’s real and what’s not real. The question is whether you cross that line of irrationality,” he said.

Another criminal psychologist, who declined to be named, said they’d “not seen anything like it”.

Mr Kelly was known to be close to a woman locals considered his grandmother, Penny Walker. Her death about two years ago marked a change in his behaviour, according to some.

“He became more reclusive,” one person who used to see Mr Kelly in town regularly said.

But Mr Kelly did not stop going out altogether. Three or four times a year, he bought Disney princesses and other little girls’ toys at the local Toyworld. This did not raise eyebrows since Mr Kelly has lots of young relatives.

He was seen in the main street of Carnarvon during the 18 days Cleo was missing. On October 29 – five days before police raided his house and arrested him nearby in simultaneous operations – when Cleo may have been locked away in his house, Mr Kelly took his dying dog to the vet.

The revelations about his online persona have emerged in almost real time. Police have said Mr Kelly became a suspect only late on Tuesday, just hours before detectives burst through the door of his house.

Hordes of online sleuths have been scouring the internet for traces of Mr Kelly’s profile, finding details and accounts before they can be removed. His unusual doll collection and his strange social media presence have added a further bizarre twist to the shocking Cleo Smith story.
....
Mr Kelly, meanwhile, is facing numerous charges including one count of forcibly take a child under 16.
....
Additional reporting: Emily Kowal'

Thanks for this BFew I've been trying to get this article. Is it the whole article you have posted or is there more?

 

[Collie_wobbles]

Did WAPOL interview this regular Blowholes camper soon after Cleo went missing?

Interesting that the property where Cleo was rescued from is reported to only be a one-bedder.

Forensic test results to provide info on who had been using the coloured pencils and pens, will be important in the wider investigation of what the accused was up to.

Cleo’s alleged kidnapper ‘often seen at campsite’

Accused child snatcher Terence Kelly was often seen driving around at the campsite where he was alleged to have abducted Cleo Smith, a regular camper says.

thewest.com.au

'Accused child snatcher Terence Kelly was previously seen driving around at the campsite where he was alleged to have abducted Cleo Smith, a local camper says.

The camper, who has strong ties to the area and often spends weekends at the Blowholes campsite, said he knew of Mr Kelly and had seen him several times at the site, about 70km north of Carnarvon, driving a four-wheel-drive.

But the man — who was at the campsite on Saturday — said he never saw Mr Kelly camp the night.'
....
Officers were seen examining a bedframe in the backyard of the home — with one of them also pictured holding a box of coloured pencils and pens.

The one-bedroom property, located just 1.5km from the local police station and 3km from Cleo’s family home, has been cordoned off for nearly four days while police painstakingly examine every item inside.

But this article is saying 2 bedroom

The two-bedroom property, located just 1.5km from the local police station and 3km from Cleo’s family home, has been cordoned off for nearly four days while police painstakingly examine every item inside.

Cops to spend WEEKS scouring alleged Cleo abductor’s home

Police set up a forensic tent outside Cleo Smith’s alleged abductor’s Carnarvon home on Saturday morning, with the investigation at the site set to last several weeks.

www.google.com.au

His next door neighbour (duplex attached) was interviewed and he has a 4yr old daughter. So I'm thinking they are actually in fact 2 bedrooms, rather than 1.

 

[deanc]

Female relative and her daughter, 5yo iirc. Sorry, no link but I read that somewhere and can't remember where.

Edit: Two female relatives in their twenties is the story now and according to an Aunty.

I have not been as attentive as some on here, following every related report since the alleged perpetrator was charged - but what do we know/has been reported about these two female relatives - one assumes the police would of questioned them..?
Any chance one or both knew who uncle Terry was keeping in his house? Perhaps one or both had actually visited his new 'special friend'..?

 

[jason_recliner]

Obsessive compulsive?

OCD is a discorder but does it diminish culpability?

 

[Collie_wobbles]

I have not been as attentive as some on here, following every related report since the alleged perpetrator was charged - but what do we know/has been reported about these two female relatives - one assumes the police would of questioned them..?
Any chance one or both knew who uncle Terry was keeping in his house? Perhaps one or both had actually visited his new 'special friend'..?

There has been too many mixed reports on the 2 females that were in the car. We've had

* taking his aunty and her 6 yr old to get food

* Aunty and her 5yr old daughter

* The latest was in 7news last night, that the 2 females were in their 20's

While we are on the car I have been wondering what car it was he was driving. The dashcam footage is not very clear, but it looks more a sedan rather than the SUV that's parked in his carport.

If he was in the SUV when arrested wouldn't that car have been towed straight to the Police Station for forensics??

If it was the SUV he was arrested in then how did it get back to his house if they had arrested him?

Or does TK actually own 2 cars?