5 Delisted

[LC40]

These statements are wrong on so many levels it inconceivable youu were sober when you posted them

Firstly have you seen Lee play live .......if not don't comment or better still don't regurgitate BF views also from people who haven't seen him play

Griffin .......done nothing in 5 years heh!! .......what crap

Sure he has to pull his finger out and make a determined effort to fight to play AFL ........but in the first half of 2008 he was excellent and kept Maric out of the side ......then to get injured

This year he was injured but no excuse he had a crap season ........but to generalize that he's done nothing is plain wrong

Can't say I saw a lot of Lee live but I'm not convinced yet that he was worth dropping given the trouble he did have with injuries. What I did see was a young kid who could take a grab with plenty of size. Big blokes take a bit longer to find their feet and he must have shown the club something to invest a draft pick with.
I'm hoping he gets another chance somewhere and can prove his worth because I don't believe he was ever in the position to shine this year.

Having said that I agree with your assessment of Jacky. Again on the limited times I saw him he looked good. Can take a mark overhead, has pace and was very balanced. Has the skills to be a good player,it will come down to opportunity and in a settled team like ours that might not eventuate.

 

[Mark Dreher]

The whole Goody will be better than pick 30 argument is ridiculous. You have to have far more foresight with your list management. Will Goody be better than pick 30 after Goody has retired ?

This year we are drafting with 2011 in mind, the truth is that Shirley would have had more impact in 2010 than all of our draftees combined in 2010, but you cant run your list like that. We are drafting this year to balance our list in 2011 after our veterans retire. We are looking further ahead with our list management than just the next season

When we are just coming into a premiership window and the draft is supposed to be Crap, why offload him for someone that is going to be dropped off the list within a couple of years and wont help us win the premiership but Goody can have good input over the next couple of years. I would say with the amount of kids on the list already our future is looking pretty bright . We still need some of these boys for the now.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

The whole Goody will be better than pick 30 argument is ridiculous. You have to have far more foresight with your list management. Will Goody be better than pick 30 after Goody has retired ?

This year we are drafting with 2011 in mind, the truth is that Shirley would have had more impact in 2010 than all of our draftees combined in 2010, but you cant run your list like that. We are drafting this year to balance our list in 2011 after our veterans retire. We are looking further ahead with our list management than just the next season

relapse, mate your time line is off the mark

we have already drafted to account for the retirements of Goodwin, Macca, Burton and Edwards

The club has been planning this transition for 3-5 years now and players like Vince, VB, Knights, D-Mac, Otten, Dangerfield and Walker have all been drafted and developed to minimise the impact of these retirements.

I would also debate strongly that this year we will be drafting with season 2012-13 in mind

there is enough evidence to suggest that for a very good draftee it is not until his 3rd season when you can expect them to be a regular player in the side, all clubs will agree its a 3 year time line when the club expects the player to start pushing for regular selection

On Shirley, the reason he has been delisted is that the club drafted Sloane for this role and believe that he can come in next year and play this role with the support of Dogga and VB

 

[Chacha]

Ezard would be fan-freakin-tastic. He's a great inside payer with exquisite outside skills.
Typical of Williams not to keep such a tough little unit like him.

 

[jo172]

With the delistings of Kite and Lee it's worth considering that under Rendell Adelaide may finally be better at drafting at the start of the draft than at the end of the draft?

Sad to see Shirley go, but was expected.

As for Gill and Gallman, I feel if the cards fell their way both could have had AFL careers, but for blokes with lower levels of talent they had way too many injuries to ever make a decent go at it.

Kite is a genuine disappointment. Can't remember too many blokes who managed to go backwards at the rate Kite did, was speculated as a first 22 player at the start of the year due to the promise he showed with the Legs in 08. One has to wonder how much that hit by Hargraves hurt his career ala Pickett on Begley? Hope he can make it.

Lee, meh.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

When we are just coming into a premiership window and the draft is supposed to be Crap, why offload him for someone that is going to be dropped off the list within a couple of years and wont help us win the premiership but Goody can have good input over the next couple of years. I would say with the amount of kids on the list already our future is looking pretty bright . We still need some of these boys for the now.

agree list management is that, not just stock piling youth

list management is all about balancing the future with current season needs

the club understand the talent in this years draft and the readiness of our young players to play a role in 2010 more than all of us and there decisions have been based on these assessments

to be fair on the club they have got it spot on with Hart, Torney and Bode's delistment and the development approach with Otten, Tippett, D-Mac and Danger

so I have full confidence that they have made the right delisting and trading decisions and they will make the right drafting decisions.

most importantly I am extremely confident the club will generally make the right decisions come selections in 2010

 

[cmndstab]

......He means well and the board is better for having him ........outrageous statements and all

To be fair, Kite's 08 season was actually fairly impressive - making himself a fairly regular member of the Norwood's senior side after being touted as a player picked a "year early". Pity it turned around so quickly

 

[relapse]

relapse, mate your time line is off the mark

we have already drafted to account for the retirements of Goodwin, Macca, Burton and Edwards

The club has been planning this transition for 3-5 years now and players like Vince, VB, Knights, D-Mac, Otten, Dangerfield and Walker have all been drafted and developed to minimise the impact of these retirements.

I would also debate strongly that this year we will be drafting with season 2012-13 in mind

there is enough evidence to suggest that for a very good draftee it is not until his 3rd season when you can expect them to be a regular player in the side, all clubs will agree its a 3 year time line when the club expects the player to start pushing for regular selection

On Shirley, the reason he has been delisted is that the club drafted Sloane for this role and believe that he can come in next year and play this role with the support of Dogga and VB

I agree with you and maybe I didnt clarify enough what I meant.

Knights, VB, Douglas, Maric, Dangerfield, Tippett, Vince, McKay and Otten were all getting reasonable game time in their second year on our list.

Our 2009 draft class will have some degree of influence over our 2011 side. Obviously I am not envisaging players playing all 22 games, but to a degree our 2009 draft class will be required during periods during the 2011 season to fulfill various roles.

So while you are right that it might take 3 years to become a regular in the 22, our 2009 draftees season though will definately be required at times in 2011 to stand up in games.

 

[relapse]

When we are just coming into a premiership window and the draft is supposed to be Crap, why offload him for someone that is going to be dropped off the list within a couple of years and wont help us win the premiership but Goody can have good input over the next couple of years. I would say with the amount of kids on the list already our future is looking pretty bright . We still need some of these boys for the now.

Our premiership window is going to depend on the growth of players like Davis, Walker, Sloane etc. I also think realistically our next chance for a flag will be 2012 and Goody will be going on 36 then.

 

[Elder van Berlo]

To be fair, Kite's 08 season was actually fairly impressive - making himself a fairly regular member of the Norwood's senior side after being touted as a player picked a "year early". Pity it turned around so quickly

It would be interesting to see this board's opinion of him if he had switched years, i.e. has his 08 year this year, and vice versa. Ultimately he didn't, and went backwards, and by all accounts his attitude wasn't up to scratch so not too fussed by his delisting. Obviously has potential though, and I look forward to seeing what he does from here.

There's been a lot of comment in this thread about Tom Lee's attitude to training and improving himself - I haven't heard anything about this all year. What went wrong? Was there anything specific?

 

[cmndstab]

The comments on Lee's attitude to training came out of David Noble's list assessment a short while back, here.


Specifically, he said:

Tom Lee
Tom struggled this year. He’s taken a bit longer than what we would’ve thought to understand the intensity and workload required at this level. He’s certainly got some talent, but he’s got a fair bit to learn and will need to put in a big pre-season.

 

[amer]

haha... not bad...

but seriously... if attitudes his problem, we obviously believe he has the talent... make him live with charlie walsh...

Look, take it or leave it but Jacky has a lot more ability than this board gives him credit for. He is made out to be this total dud but he's not, he has the tricks in the bag to make it, and I get the impression maybe there was a lingering niggle or two (ankle, knee, whatever it was, he couldn't get right) to go with the confidence/belief issues we have heard about.

If he makes the breakthrough mentally and finds the necessary confidence he will find a spot for himself in our starting line up. I hope he does because he's nippy around the packs and is pretty crafty which we could use for sure. Don't give up on him yet, we haven't signed him on a two year contract extension to repeat the Matthew Smith story, we've signed him because he IS good enough.

Also again on Lee, if it's an attitude and application problem you would think they might've tried to persist for another year. We're paying his salary either way so what would we have to lose? This together with the removal of Kite says to me that we have our eye on another tall smokey who we think has greater upside than either of these guys. Didn't someone on here say that they'd heard from an inside source about a couple of KPPs bursting into draft calculations from nowhere?

 

[Crow-mo]

its not the 5 that surprises me, on their own you could make an argument for each. I'd not have done it, but that doesn't matter.

what surprises me is where are we getting 5 replacements from?

 

[craig crowing]

its not the 5 that surprises me, on their own you could make an argument for each. I'd not have done it, but that doesn't matter.

what surprises me is where are we getting 5 replacements from?

Crow Mo think you had a fade out as you know we only have 4 picks due to Martins elevation.
Also I think that from some experts there is more in this draft than previously reported and as other posters have said I think there is 1 or 2 mature players they have their eye on. Remember of course that getting the good kids is going to get harder not easier over next few years.
Like many think Jacky was very lucky to get a contract and my reports are that not prepared to do all the hard things on and off the field and lucky at end to be in reserves. Fingers crossed Crows are right and change of coach at Eagles might help.
Once Edwardes and Macca decided to play on then Shirley was always going to be delisted.
Even with 5 delistings there are not too many spaces for kids to push into and that is reason I agree with 1 key point of Relapse and Crow Mo that didnt understand re- signing Burton thus holding up opportunities for Walker and even Mckernan , Davis and Sellar if pushed out of ruck by Moran. You have to get key future players regular time to get confidence and become the players you need to get to the top.
But I also have to admit that I think Burton is overated by the club and many posters and his type of personal agenda style dont win premierships.
Forgetting that issue think Crows did it well and look forward to the draft with huge interest

 

[King Elvis]

Well we should have moved Burton on, but what done is done and the club made the right decision by having 4 draft picks in the draft. I had previously posted that I thought the club should do this and got bagged by all and sundry and apparently I had NFI saying we would have four 4 draft picks

You're like a modern day Jesus Christ; such a martyr for us all.

 

[relapse]

You're like a modern day Jesus Christ; such a martyr for us all.

Nah just a mortal man with an opinion.

 

[Tex200]

Here is what I know about James Ezard....23 yo hard nut delisted by Power who, instead of going home with his tail between his legs, stuck it out here in the SANFl with Westies and won a Magary Medal.

1. Magary Medal tells me he can play
2. Working back to that level after being delisted tells me he has got attitude.

Can someone with greater knowledge of the SANFL generally and this player in particular than I do, please give any more info as to why he would not be a good fit for us...especially at 61?

 

[relapse]

Here is what I know about James Ezard....23 yo hard nut delisted by Power who, instead of going home with his tail between his legs, stuck it out here in the SANFl with Westies and won a Magary Medal.

1. Magary Medal tells me he can play
2. Working back to that level after being delisted tells me he has got attitude.

Can someone with greater knowledge of the SANFL generally and this player in particular than I do, please give any more info as to why he would not be a good fit for us...especially at 61?

Lets not forget that Port didnt give him Josh Carr's number for nothing

 

[KUNG FU]

Whilst we will have a hard time getting a look in at the burgeoning first round talent in next year's draft, it is likely to run much deeper than this year. Whilst it looks as though there are probably 40 very "draft-able" players in 2009, 2010 is likely to have about 60. That is not to say that any pick after 40 or 60 in those respective years will be useless, moreso, that is how deep certain clubs drafting list will likely go. So another 4 ND picks next year is very likely. I would say this year, the club felt that they could get more from #61 than Lee or Kite could contribute. Its also highly likely they feel they have a few players that might have snuck under the radar or are attracting little or no attention from other clubs.

Why not Henderson, whats the story there?

Henderson is looking great, but we can give him another year on the rookie list. Whilst he has flourished as a medium leading forward, in the mould of Welsh/Burton, he is yet to fully bring the other aspects of his game up to SANFL level. When he did play seniors he found himself caught out. If he plays the majority of 2010 in the seniors (assuming he has reasonable opportunity playing for the Dogs) he will most certainly be upgraded. He had a very promising year, but he'll need to make similar progress this year to be considered for a senior spot.

 

[KUNG FU]

Here is what I know about James Ezard....23 yo hard nut delisted by Power who, instead of going home with his tail between his legs, stuck it out here in the SANFl with Westies and won a Magary Medal.

1. Magary Medal tells me he can play
2. Working back to that level after being delisted tells me he has got attitude.

Can someone with greater knowledge of the SANFL generally and this player in particular than I do, please give any more info as to why he would not be a good fit for us...especially at 61?

He could be worth a look for some clubs, but I think his spot is more than adequately covered by van Berlo/Vince/ST. Doesn't have a great frame, so strength is always going to be an issue for someone who plays his role in the AFL. If anything, I'd say Bryce Campbell minus the strength, but with a bit more flair and slightly better kick.

 

[twentydollarnote]

i dont know what was the point of delisting shirley if we're keeping our veterans on our list, we are in no mans land not quite challenging for a flag (and delisting shirley makes it harder next year) yet not completely rebuilding either by keeping the oldies.

 

[RoosterLad]

I don't think Shirley will be the difference in whether we win a flag or not somehow...

Besides we have Sloane - he will guide us.

 

[KUNG FU]

Shirley will be 30 in June. Can't see him getting any better. He already isn't in the best 22, whereas the others most certainly are.

 

[Crow-mo]

Crow Mo think you had a fade out as you know we only have 4 picks due to Martins elevation.

potato/pohtato.

Also I think that from some experts there is more in this draft than previously reported and as other posters have said I think there is 1 or 2 mature players they have their eye on. Remember of course that getting the good kids is going to get harder not easier over next few years.
Like many think Jacky was very lucky to get a contract and my reports are that not prepared to do all the hard things on and off the field and lucky at end to be in reserves. Fingers crossed Crows are right and change of coach at Eagles might help.
Once Edwardes and Macca decided to play on then Shirley was always going to be delisted.
Even with 5 delistings there are not too many spaces for kids to push into and that is reason I agree with 1 key point of Relapse and Crow Mo that didnt understand re- signing Burton thus holding up opportunities for Walker and even Mckernan , Davis and Sellar if pushed out of ruck by Moran. You have to get key future players regular time to get confidence and become the players you need to get to the top.
But I also have to admit that I think Burton is overated by the club and many posters and his type of personal agenda style dont win premierships.
Forgetting that issue think Crows did it well and look forward to the draft with huge interest

paragraphs are your friend.

and everydraft supposedly has hidden depths, even when they don't.

 

[Crow-mo]

Shirley will be 30 in June. Can't see him getting any better. He already isn't in the best 22, whereas the others most certainly are.

well he's been in our best 22 for years now, and played in every finals we've been in since 2002.