Moved Thread #7: Jack Ziebell [Part I] © -

JZ Best Position

  • Inside Midfielder

    Votes: 89 41.8%

  • Forward Pocket

    Votes: 124 58.2%
  • Total voters
    213

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I really hate the fact that more and more opposition players just burn Jack off with their speed. Several times I've seen a player see that it's Jack in front of them and just run around him or if they see him chasing just compose themselves and keep running knowing Jack has no chance catching up... I do like him forward more but I also liked the game he played against Carlton, that was one of the rare games where it seemed he orchestrated a lot of our attack from around HB with some zone splitting passes or handballs. Not really sure about him as a midfielder anymore, I think the game has changed too much for him to be super effective.
 

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He's inability to keep up with the game, is poor. He needs to stand up and inform the coach that enough is enough put me in the forward line.
 
Like the idea of Zebs plying a bit forward. He carnt run a game out on the midfield. but Gee some of his kicks lately.
 
Still can't run out of sight in the dark. An indictment on our fitness staff and JZ that after 10 pre seasons, there's been zero improvement in leg speed and endurance. ZERO!!!!!
 
Very serious issue for the club - the captain, has 4.5 years to run on a large contract (say $3m to go) - and at 26 should be at the peak of his powers.

Yet he doesn't 'own' a position - one that he can dominate week in and week out like the good players do.

Brad still sees him as a midfielder first and foremost but its not clear whether that's because we have on one else or because he actually has belief that JZ can beat the best midfielders in the comp.

So we still have these discussions about the 'right' position for JZ 150 games into his career.

Not sure what the answer is here but its not a good position to be in for Jack, the Club or us.
 
I'll go against the grain and say that I still think he is a good midfielder. Not perfect, but dangerous at times and has impact on games and players in a way that has real value. I think we're still suffering from an imbalance in there and that if you took out 2 of Cunnington, Ziebell, Dumont the remaining player would look very good. We really need a player like Dumont that has that extra 15% running and speed. They're hard to find though as they become the elite players. It wasn't JZ's best game though and he (like his mates) has had a few mare's this year.
 
Snake_Baker said:
Jack continues to be played out of position because of our lack of midfield depth.
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That's the issue. We don't have any mids at the moment so it's not that easy to replace him. Swallow is depth, Mountford has played 1 game, Anderson is so far not suited to the role so we have JZ. He doesn't have the tank to be a modern day mid and when you partner him with Cunners and Dumont well we see what happens
 
Deadeyeroo said:
Lay off he's got plenty of good games under his belt this year. Cunnington on the other hand has been putrid.

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In the GC game? Yep. Every other game he has been superb or good.
 

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Arthur Cloke said:
Still can't run out of sight in the dark. An indictment on our fitness staff and JZ that after 10 pre seasons, there's been zero improvement in leg speed and endurance. ZERO!!!!!
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At least he has mastered the art of getting his kicks smothered. :stern look
 
Speed is king at the moment so he is struggling ..he and a few others should take note of what's happening with Swallow. This game can pass you by in a heart beat.


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shintemaster said:
I'll go against the grain and say that I still think he is a good midfielder. Not perfect, but dangerous at times and has impact on games and players in a way that has real value. I think we're still suffering from an imbalance in there and that if you took out 2 of Cunnington, Ziebell, Dumont the remaining player would look very good. We really need a player like Dumont that has that extra 15% running and speed. They're hard to find though as they become the elite players. It wasn't JZ's best game though and he (like his mates) has had a few mare's this year.
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I don't think we can afford to have Jack and Ben10 in together with Dumont as well. They're both very effective but we need more speed.

If we're able to get Kelly and Martin in one of them is superfluous to our needs and would be better off traded.

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blackshadow said:
I don't think we can afford to have Jack and Ben10 in together with Dumont as well. They're both very effective but we need more speed.

If we're able to get Kelly and Martin in one of them is superfluous to our needs and would be better off traded.

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Agreed , they are great at the stoppages but get done on the spread.


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blackshadow said:
I don't think we can afford to have Jack and Ben10 in together with Dumont as well. They're both very effective but we need more speed.

If we're able to get Kelly and Martin in one of them is superfluous to our needs and would be better off traded.

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I'm not saying I'd prefer it but if you were looking at one of the three from a club point of view Dumont would be the easiest to let go of... I think if we can restructure with JZ as a proper utility type then we can get away with Cunnington and Dumont as core mids along with some speed and flair.
 
shintemaster said:
We really need a player like Dumont that has that extra 15% running and speed.
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This is what Atley was, as a junior. It was his natural position until he was turned into a defender. I don't know if such a switch would work now since he has been pretty ordinary (and that's putting it kindly) for a while now, but I can't help but feel Ziebell onto the HFF, Atley into the middle and then a more traditional HBF/General type moving to the HBF would be much better for team balance.
 
As much as we need speed, and the North board has been obsessed about speed for a long time (for good reason), we got slaughtered in clearances and turnovers. That is when our 'lack of speed' gets exposed. I'm not sure that adding one or two more speedsters to the team will fix that. If your blokes have the ascendancy in the middle, it generally makes you look a bit quicker. If you have good decision makers and players with good skills, that also makes you look a bit quicker.

Ziebell does have a turn of pace, we've seen it many times when he comes bustling forward through the middle, and I was surprised a few times this year because I always considered him to be a very slow player. It's just when he's chasing that it for some reason becomes completely non-existent.
 
shintemaster said:
I'll go against the grain and say that I still think he is a good midfielder. Not perfect, but dangerous at times and has impact on games and players in a way that has real value. I think we're still suffering from an imbalance in there and that if you took out 2 of Cunnington, Ziebell, Dumont the remaining player would look very good. We really need a player like Dumont that has that extra 15% running and speed. They're hard to find though as they become the elite players. It wasn't JZ's best game though and he (like his mates) has had a few mare's this year.
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He is made to look a lot worse than he is as a midfielder because of a real lack of midfield balance and A-graders.

In a really good midfield he is probably the 4th or 5th guy in there. In ours he is the one going head to head with the likes of Dangerfield and Martin, which is never going to work.
 
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