Roast A Reverse Buckley

[Baltimore Jack]

When we lose Bucks gets the bulk of the blame, so if we win today I assume Bucks will get the bulk of the kudos

 

[THATSGOLD]

Why are we building one of the most exciting and promising teams in the comp?

Because we have Moore and De Goey?

Is our youth any better than what the majority of other teams have in the cupboard

Fair point. Every side has good youth.

 

[ClaytonM]

Bucks be seen at Centerlink the next week

How you going to pull that off.

 

[Quicky]

These debates are so tiresome when they get this polarised.

 

[Schraderbrau]

Having read some of your posts from the past, I guess it's hard to take notice of anyone who has said "I hope we lose...." previously. No matter what opinions anyone has on topics based around Collingwood, I don't think I would ever hope for that.....

(a) direct me to posts where I seriously said 'I hope we lose', I have better things to do than go over my own posting history (or other peoples for that matter )

(b) i can think of better ways to spend Saturday nights than creating nonsense threads and trawling through peoples posting history.

 

[Schraderbrau]

Here's a question to the supporters.

Are your expectations of this team too high?
If it took bottoming out I.e bottom 4 to win a premiership would you do it?
Did you think we were finals bound this year when in fact we are still another year away?

These are some serious questions to answer because 'sack Buckley' is only a matter of perspective.

I can certainly see we're building one of the most exiting and promising teams in the Comp to rival GC GWS & WB , but whether Buckley is given the time to see it through will ultimately depend on your personal expectations. Media and centimet aside if you look at the list objectively - it's pretty damn good. Young and very exciting.

I was on this boat until the start of the season but the losses to Sydney and St Kilda are among the worst I've seen as a supporter - we shouldn't have even beaten Richmond. Now that Bucks has been in charge for several years it's fair to expect improvement but it appears from our form early on this season that we've taken several steps back. People are entitled to question whether he's the best person for the job on that basis without being called a bunch of backstabbers imo. Also one of the reasons why people are so frustrated is because they do think we have a good list that has seriously underachieved so far in 2016 (early days yet though)

 

[PieBeast]

Totally agree dude. I still think he deserves to finish out his contact. It's not even the last year and we are completely shredding him instead of supporting him.

He deserves nothing, despite being a Champion player and a decent bloke.

He has turned us into a laughing stock in a space of 2 years after taking over one of the best lists Collingwood had ever had.

And no amount of baseless and utterly laughable tripe like herpa derp I believe in Bucks, we're building the bestest list eva, we need to bottom out and apparently shouldn't judge Bucks' ability to coach on plummeting down the ladder every single year changes this fact.

ps. surprised OP's sermon didn't end with a standbybucks hashtag

 

[Schraderbrau]

I've backed bucks for years but I can't hide my rage anymore. Our club made a stupid decision which IMO cost us at least 1 flag with MM cracking it. And bucks simply has tunnel vision and can't pick a side

The decisions to replace MM with Buckley at the time was definitely correct imo. I doubt we would have won another premiership with MM in charge but the rebuild we undertook from 2012-16 gave us another crack at it. In light of performances this season, the question is whether there are better tactical coaches out there than Buckley who seems to have have got his tactics horribly wrong this season. We've been betting on having the last few good years of our key older players like Cloke, Pendlebury, Brown, Reid etc converge with the rise of our younger rebuild players. That doesn't give us that back a window to work in to win a premiership imo and we'd be negligent if we didn't have the best coach available to do the job.

 

[daicosdemis]

This pose is called a "Reverse Buckley", which is because the knives being put into Nathan recently have all entered his body from behind!

We can all have our opinions on our beloved Magpies and on our players, coaches, team & administration, but surely in the end we "support" all those that make up the club we love?

Maybe a number of us need to take the time to back our club, during the hard times, so we can enjoy the good times together as well.

Nathan Buckley has been my favourite footballer at Collingwood ever and I trust his ability to coach us to success. In the end I might be proven wrong and Nathan will become one of hundreds of champion players who become average coaches. But until then, he has my undivided and passionate support.

If we do "turn this ship around" in 2016, all those Buckley "Bullies" need to make sure they don't become pretend "Buckley Disciples", because it's easy for all to see who you are.

In Buckley I Trust. View attachment 236384View attachment 236384

So whoever dares question Bucks performance is a backstabber ? Some radical thinking right there.
Oh and thanks for clearing up that we are entitled to an opinion, here I was fearing I'm going to get stoned to death for having one.

 

[Schraderbrau]

When we lose Bucks gets the bulk of the blame, so if we win today I assume Bucks will get the bulk of the kudos

It's like a seesaw between the 'I told you so threads' and the 'bucks is terrible threads' and its been like that for a while now. This is an 'i told you so' thread which was made in the wrong week which is why it's been hijacked by 'bucks is terrible' posters.

If we get beat today then I'm predicting this thread to explode.

 

[FreddoFrog65]

(a) direct me to posts where I seriously said 'I hope we lose', I have better things to do than go over my own posting history (or other peoples for that matter )

(b) i can think of better ways to spend Saturday nights than creating nonsense threads and trawling through peoples posting history.

Enjoy your Sunday....I'll be at the 'G supporting my team....what will you be doing?

 

[Schraderbrau]

Enjoy your Sunday....I'll be at the 'G supporting my Nafan....what will you be doing?

fixed your post

 

[Baltimore Jack]

It's like a seesaw between the 'I told you so threads' and the 'bucks is terrible threads' and its been like that for a while now. This is an 'i told you so' thread which was made in the wrong week which is why it's been hijacked by 'bucks is terrible' posters.

If we get beat today then I'm predicting this thread to explode.

But it must be a fair analogy though
It can't be all one way (when we lose) and none the other way (when we win)
I get it that objectivity and fairness have no place on this board of late, but some people might still like to highlight the general stupidity of many

 

[Kirby]

I think this board really needed another Buckley thread.

 

[FreddoFrog65]

So whoever dares question Bucks performance is a backstabber ? Some radical thinking right there.
Oh and thanks for clearing up that we are entitled to an opinion, here I was fearing I'm going to get stoned to death for having one.

Where does it say "whoever"....just those that don't give any valid reasons why. By the way, I wouldn't waste a good stone on you.

fixed your post

I guess you won't be there then....

 

[Schraderbrau]

Where does it say "whoever"....just those that don't give any valid reasons why. By the way, I would waste a good stone on you.


I guess you won't be there then....

You've lowered your flags. I'm not getting into a pissing contest over who goes to games/ supports the coach/ or whatever else you think makes you a superior supporter to everyone else on this board. If you think that then that's a matter for you imo.

 

[FreddoFrog65]

I can now tick one item off the Bucket List...Starting a Post on Big Footy....

Have to say it's a bit like playing a game of darts......that's if you want to be the board!

One thing I do know, is that each and every person who has posted on this topic does truly support the Pies, otherwise why would you bother typing out a response.

Good luck to our boys today....and I hope everyone of you enjoy your day....even you Schraderbrau...Lol!

 

[FreddoFrog65]

fixed your post

Impressed how you did this.....being an old Bugger, I am not that IT savvy.....and I do like "Nafan".....Go Pies! By the way, thanks for the healthy banter, it's been amusing.

 

[Bad Horse]

Here's a question to the supporters.

Are your expectations of this team too high?
If it took bottoming out I.e bottom 4 to win a premiership would you do it?
Did you think we were finals bound this year when in fact we are still another year away?

These are some serious questions to answer because 'sack Buckley' is only a matter of perspective.

I can certainly see we're building one of the most exiting and promising teams in the Comp to rival GC GWS & WB , but whether Buckley is given the time to see it through will ultimately depend on your personal expectations. Media and centimet aside if you look at the list objectively - it's pretty damn good. Young and very exciting.

I think part of the problem is in here somewhere.

We were told, or at least intimated, that we have already done the rebuild. The club's message was that the years of downward trend we needed to have had already happened, the swapping of players for picks included, so we would have the right age profile and skill profile to compete by a mix of getting top end talent from higher draft picks, then bringing in ready made talent when we were ready to challenge. We were told we loaded up on talent in the draft, and had our pain, and the loss of established players like Shaw, Dawes, etc were to a purpose.

Well, here is what we got for all that.

2012

Out Dawes and Wellingham for picks. Dawes has struggled, Wellingham is the sort of thing we need off half back but so be it.

But what did we get in that draft?

Selection 18 Brody Grundy - stalled, lots of issues probably exacerbated by no ruck coaching.Still early days but its beginning to look concerning.
Selection 19 Ben Kennedy - sent to Melbourne for a packet of peanuts. Totally screwed his development and let him walk for nothing just when we should have been seeing this pay off. nice one.
Selection 20 Tim Broomhead - Injury cursed and probably going to go the way of Kennedy in the next off season.
Selection 38 Jackson Ramsay - Injury cursed.

End result - not a lot so far, and may end up a complete waste.

2013

Out Heater in Adams. Lost the only real AA quality small defender we had, replaced by a limited inside mid with some grunt.
Out Daisy - in pick 10 ok, cashed out probably the right time.

Selections 6 - Scharenberg, injury cursed and may never achieve much
10 - Freeman Mismanaged injury and gone for nothing to St Kilda.

Traded our mid range pick for Jesse White. Well, that was a bust.

When we look back if we crash, these two off seasons will be where it happened IMHO. We needed to nail these, and it looks pretty bad so far.


2014

Out Heritier L in Varcoe - a big win

Out Beams in pick 5/Crisp/Greenwood - Pick 5 is nice, losing one of our few A grade players not so nice. And Crisp and Greenwood looks odd given Adams is a similar type. Too many of the same, and we are seeing that problem now in spades.

In Selection 5 Jordan De Goey - Looks a good type, but still a long way off elite. Has potential I think

Selection 9 Darcy Moore - Will be very good I think.


So, out of those three years when the "rebuild" was happening, we maybe got two potential A graders in De Goey and Moore, and a host of guys who through injury or poor development are likely to be busts. And lost Shaw and Beams, who were both and remain A grade talent.

And it is made worse by the players we have acquired, once again, IMHO. We have loaded up on grunt at precisely the time when the dominant model of successful clubs has become fast accurate ball movement and a reduced emphasis on contested ball.


Then comes 2015, and the message is, we are ripe for challenging now. So it makes sense to trade out picks, and future picks, in exchange for ready made talent because we are heading back up the ladder, we need to maximise our opportunity to make use of that upswing, and the future pick value will be lower because we will be higher on the ladder. So out goes a host of picks, including any chance of a good draft position at the end of 2016, in comes Treloar, Howe, Aish.

But, the trouble is, it hasnt worked. And we are continuing to slide, and playing like we did in the last games of 2015 when we were bottom 4 if not bottom 2. We mortgaged the future on the expectation we were challenging, now the bank is calling.

We resemble a company that went into big debt to acquire assets on the assumption the iron ore price would continue to rise, and now find we cant restructure as we misread the market. It could get brutal.

So, have we overestimated our position, or has the club? Because their behaviour in the offseason suggests they truly believed they were where they said they were, and its proven illusory so far. There is no fast way back from this.

 

[FreddoFrog65]

I think part of the problem is in here somewhere.

We were told, or at least intimated, that we have already done the rebuild. The club's message was that the years of downward trend we needed to have had already happened, the swapping of players for picks included, so we would have the right age profile and skill profile to compete by a mix of getting top end talent from higher draft picks, then bringing in ready made talent when we were ready to challenge. We were told we loaded up on talent in the draft, and had our pain, and the loss of established players like Shaw, Dawes, etc were to a purpose.

Well, here is what we got for all that.

2012

Out Dawes and Wellingham for picks. Dawes has struggled, Wellingham is the sort of thing we need off half back but so be it.

But what did we get in that draft?

Selection 18 Brody Grundy - stalled, lots of issues probably exacerbated by no ruck coaching.Still early days but its beginning to look concerning.
Selection 19 Ben Kennedy - sent to Melbourne for a packet of peanuts. Totally screwed his development and let him walk for nothing just when we should have been seeing this pay off. nice one.
Selection 20 Tim Broomhead - Injury cursed and probably going to go the way of Kennedy in the next off season.
Selection 38 Jackson Ramsay - Injury cursed.

End result - not a lot so far, and may end up a complete waste.

2013

Out Heater in Adams. Lost the only real AA quality small defender we had, replaced by a limited inside mid with some grunt.
Out Daisy - in pick 10 ok, cashed out probably the right time.

Selections 6 - Scharenberg, injury cursed and may never achieve much
10 - Freeman Mismanaged injury and gone for nothing to St Kilda.

Traded our mid range pick for Jesse White. Well, that was a bust.

When we look back if we crash, these two off seasons will be where it happened IMHO. We needed to nail these, and it looks pretty bad so far.


2014

Out Heritier L in Varcoe - a big win

Out Beams in pick 5/Crisp/Greenwood - Pick 5 is nice, losing one of our few A grade players not so nice. And Crisp and Greenwood looks odd given Adams is a similar type. Too many of the same, and we are seeing that problem now in spades.

In Selection 5 Jordan De Goey - Looks a good type, but still a long way off elite. Has potential I think

Selection 9 Darcy Moore - Will be very good I think.


So, out of those three years when the "rebuild" was happening, we maybe got two potential A graders in De Goey and Moore, and a host of guys who through injury or poor development are likely to be busts. And lost Shaw and Beams, who were both and remain A grade talent.

And it is made worse by the players we have acquired, once again, IMHO. We have loaded up on grunt at precisely the time when the dominant model of successful clubs has become fast accurate ball movement and a reduced emphasis on contested ball.


Then comes 2015, and the message is, we are ripe for challenging now. So it makes sense to trade out picks, and future picks, in exchange for ready made talent because we are heading back up the ladder, we need to maximise our opportunity to make use of that upswing, and the future pick value will be lower because we will be higher on the ladder. So out goes a host of picks, including any chance of a good draft position at the end of 2016, in comes Treloar, Howe, Aish.

But, the trouble is, it hasnt worked. And we are continuing to slide, and playing like we did in the last games of 2015 when we were bottom 4 if not bottom 2. We mortgaged the future on the expectation we were challenging, now the bank is calling.

We resemble a company that went into big debt to acquire assets on the assumption the iron ore price would continue to rise, and now find we cant restructure as we misread the market. It could get brutal.

So, have we overestimated our position, or has the club? Because their behaviour in the offseason suggests they truly believed they were where they said they were, and its proven illusory so far. There is no fast way back from this.

Quality post.....good reading and very insightful......much better than the crap I've been coming up with lately. Bravo!

 

[PicaBoo]

He deserves nothing, despite being a Champion player and a decent bloke.

He has turned us into a laughing stock in a space of 2 years after taking over one of the best lists Collingwood had ever had.

And no amount of baseless and utterly laughable tripe like herpa derp I believe in Bucks, we're building the bestest list eva, we need to bottom out and apparently shouldn't judge Bucks' ability to coach on plummeting down the ladder every single year changes this fact.

ps. surprised OP's sermon didn't end with a standbybucks hashtag

Laughing stocks are Brisbane , Carlton, Essendon & Richmond .They are in a hole deeper then Bucks ever got us into.
Laughing stocks are supporters that melt as if the season has ended after 3 matches.
Laughing stocks are people like me knowing we are better and be told that everything has fallen to pieces.
Seriously. Even if you don't like Bucks, get a grip on yourself.
Peace and out.

 

[PieBeast]

Laughing stocks are Brisbane , Carlton, Essendon & Richmond .They are in a hole deeper then Bucks ever got us into.
Laughing stocks are supporters that melt as if the season has ended after 3 matches.
Laughing stocks are people like me knowing we are better and be told that everything has fallen to pieces.
Seriously. Even if you don't like Bucks, get a grip on yourself.
Peace and out.

I like Buckley, in fact love him but I hate what happened to us on his watch, while people who can't admit it and differentiate between the two just make me laugh.

So yeah, laughing stocks are the people with heads up their clackers.

Stick to your trolloar account matey, reality isn't your forte

 

[PicaBoo]

I like Buckley, in fact love him but I hate what happened to us on his watch, while people who can't admit it and differentiate between the two just make me laugh.

So yeah, laughing stocks are the people with heads up their clackers.

Stick to your trolloar account matey, reality isn't your forte

Ouch that hurts.
But indeed I am not good in reality, especially getting upset by it when it sucks. But I do like looking positive at the future.
Maybe you are right and that is laughable. Silly of me, I should be spending my time complaining how since 2012 things have gone backwards.

 

[Piealamode]

I think part of the problem is in here somewhere.

We were told, or at least intimated, that we have already done the rebuild. The club's message was that the years of downward trend we needed to have had already happened, the swapping of players for picks included, so we would have the right age profile and skill profile to compete by a mix of getting top end talent from higher draft picks, then bringing in ready made talent when we were ready to challenge. We were told we loaded up on talent in the draft, and had our pain, and the loss of established players like Shaw, Dawes, etc were to a purpose.

Well, here is what we got for all that.

2012

Out Dawes and Wellingham for picks. Dawes has struggled, Wellingham is the sort of thing we need off half back but so be it.

But what did we get in that draft?

Selection 18 Brody Grundy - stalled, lots of issues probably exacerbated by no ruck coaching.Still early days but its beginning to look concerning.
Selection 19 Ben Kennedy - sent to Melbourne for a packet of peanuts. Totally screwed his development and let him walk for nothing just when we should have been seeing this pay off. nice one.
Selection 20 Tim Broomhead - Injury cursed and probably going to go the way of Kennedy in the next off season.
Selection 38 Jackson Ramsay - Injury cursed.

End result - not a lot so far, and may end up a complete waste.

2013

Out Heater in Adams. Lost the only real AA quality small defender we had, replaced by a limited inside mid with some grunt.
Out Daisy - in pick 10 ok, cashed out probably the right time.

Selections 6 - Scharenberg, injury cursed and may never achieve much
10 - Freeman Mismanaged injury and gone for nothing to St Kilda.

Traded our mid range pick for Jesse White. Well, that was a bust.

When we look back if we crash, these two off seasons will be where it happened IMHO. We needed to nail these, and it looks pretty bad so far.


2014

Out Heritier L in Varcoe - a big win

Out Beams in pick 5/Crisp/Greenwood - Pick 5 is nice, losing one of our few A grade players not so nice. And Crisp and Greenwood looks odd given Adams is a similar type. Too many of the same, and we are seeing that problem now in spades.

In Selection 5 Jordan De Goey - Looks a good type, but still a long way off elite. Has potential I think

Selection 9 Darcy Moore - Will be very good I think.


So, out of those three years when the "rebuild" was happening, we maybe got two potential A graders in De Goey and Moore, and a host of guys who through injury or poor development are likely to be busts. And lost Shaw and Beams, who were both and remain A grade talent.

And it is made worse by the players we have acquired, once again, IMHO. We have loaded up on grunt at precisely the time when the dominant model of successful clubs has become fast accurate ball movement and a reduced emphasis on contested ball.


Then comes 2015, and the message is, we are ripe for challenging now. So it makes sense to trade out picks, and future picks, in exchange for ready made talent because we are heading back up the ladder, we need to maximise our opportunity to make use of that upswing, and the future pick value will be lower because we will be higher on the ladder. So out goes a host of picks, including any chance of a good draft position at the end of 2016, in comes Treloar, Howe, Aish.

But, the trouble is, it hasnt worked. And we are continuing to slide, and playing like we did in the last games of 2015 when we were bottom 4 if not bottom 2. We mortgaged the future on the expectation we were challenging, now the bank is calling.

We resemble a company that went into big debt to acquire assets on the assumption the iron ore price would continue to rise, and now find we cant restructure as we misread the market. It could get brutal.

So, have we overestimated our position, or has the club? Because their behaviour in the offseason suggests they truly believed they were where they said they were, and its proven illusory so far. There is no fast way back from this.

No use wailing about Beams and Wellers when they are never on the park, I'd much rather De Goey if I could go back and do over.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Nathan or Naf or Nate?
Let's go with the modern day Nate to take us over the line.