A thread on politics- have some balls and post

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Johnny Bananas said:
Labor perhaps. The Greens brought a wealth tax on billionaires to the last federal election.
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Sure, all good.

But a wealth tax on billionaires targets how many people?

If the high earners, I'm talking $400k+, paid a tax rate of 50% in the dollar - how much cash does this take out of the system?

Combine this with plowing those same dollars into public infrastructure in a way that isn't politically corrupt (and that's a separate argument) and society as a whole stands to benefit.
 
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I mean, I should point out at this point my preferred vision of Government....

Consider the myriad of individuals who progress, Monday-Sunday, in office work.

Pretend, for a moment, one of those people, on the train/bus/tram/pedestrian/cyclist etc.....was in fact an elected representative.

Instead of voting on parties, with platforms, we should rather engage with electorate relevant topics.

Elected representatives simply implement, even by voting expression only, the will - not according to party, but according to electorate.

And note I say "electorate" - not individual.

Because people need and want to know they are with others of like minds. And they are there, not to create an enclave of dissidents, but to represent ONE part of a GREATER WHOLE.

This gives collectives of people meaning and identity.

Let me paint this another way, using another extreme.

We all have mates who were in the military. Perhaps someone who reads this is or has served.

I have not.

But, one thing I do know, because I have friends who have served, is, more often than not, they give a * about military things.

In the dossier of things to do, for our mystical Government representative reading the paper next to you, military matters to be decided are scheduled for late at night, beyond the hours of her work.

That will be left to open forum debate, moderated as needed, and designed to achieve something like a consensus on "do we need more missiles" to "do we invest more heavily in submarines?"

Politics is a FUNCTION. In and of itself, it should yield no special reward.

OUTCOMES are what should be rewarded.
 

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3KZ is Football said:
Then I’ll drive my car through a fence and into a constituent’s house.
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Dont forget refusing to pay to have the fence fixed over a year after it happened. Plus still charging the state for your driving allowance while you have a suspended licence
 
Never thought I'd see the day when he said something worthwhile
 
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A defeated Morrison drags his sorry self into Question Time yesterday. Looks like he is really enjoying work at the minute. Clenched fist is a nice touch.
 

Book may reveal cabinet secrets, says PM's department​

In Senate estimates Labor is investigating the alleged leak of cabinet material to the authors of Plagued, the book by Simon Benson and Geoff Chambers.
The book reveals details from the National Security Committee of the Morrison government’s cabinet, including its approach to dealing with China, the decision-making process behind closing Australia’s borders in early 2020, and discussions around Australia’s defence posture.
The first assistant secretary of the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet (PMC), John Reid, said:
We’ve reviewed the book and what information is in it, to determine its accuracy or otherwise. We’ve referred that information to the attorney general’s department ... Our conclusions were it certainly appears to reveal information that was, until it was revealed, cabinet material, and would ordinarily have been protected under the principle of cabinet confidentiality.
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Reid said he was “not aware” if other agencies are investigating the matter, but explained it had been referred to the attorney general’s department because it administers the “relevant criminal provisions” relating to disclosure of protected information.
Reid said:
Any action taken in relation to this would be within their purview.
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Asked if PMC would cooperate with any criminal investigation, he said “absolutely”.
We’ll see, when AGD [attorney general’s department] and Australian federal police officials are up at estimates, whether a referral has been made.
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Last Updated: 13:02 Friday, 28 October 2022
2h ago

- The Guardian
 
Im sure all of the contentious content was contemporaneously discussed and there is nothing to see here because I trust them completely
 

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I confess to feeling a rising wave of dark uncertainty, that grows everyday. A wave of perceived reality that seems increasingly fantastic, yet happening nonetheless.

My Twitter feed is alot of politics and current political events from the fringes of mainstream reporting, by experienced, respected journos, ala Mary Kostakidis. I'm not going to suggest their angle is correct, but the volume of contrary reporting that is emanating from these sources is growing increasingly alarming. Let me be clear - these aren't tin hat nutcases, we are talking award-winning, experienced and reputable journos, who report the same thing but from a different angle, with quoted sources and fact-checked statements. Broadly speaking, they are against the US World Empire and see Australia as a willing pawn in the US hegemony.

Whether or not you believe the political angle isn't important. What IS important is over the past month, the rhetoric we get from mainstream coverage is preparing us for war. With the US having the right of "first launch" as per the NPD (non-Proliferation Declaration), they are entitled to unleash nukes to protect their interests at the expense of their enemies. When I say they are entitled to this action, I mean it is stated in the NPD and every foreign government is aware. In turn, this means is the US has, in their view, the moral and legal right to launch nuclear first strikes. We all know the ramifications once the first nuke, from anywhere, is in the air.

I don't much care for the governments and government apparatus of either Russia or China. And like everyone, I'm aware of the US position as being the leader of the World and its desire to maintain that status quo. Equally, if I had to choose to live under US/Russia/China systems, I'll happily side with the Yanks. That being said, I have no concrete evidence of either China or Russia wishing to fill the vacuum should the US empire crumble - I'm GUESSING the CCP would step in though, but exactly what shape that would take, I have no idea. Would they just set their dogs of war free and make everything Chinese communist? Is their brand of imperialism similar? Russia, afaik, simply wants the former states of the USSR, if not absorbed, then as independent yet cast-iron allies in all other ways. A few buffer states betwixt them and NATO is pretty much all they seem to want.

The thought of waking up to news headlines announcing the world is at nuclear war once seemed satisfyingly remote, but not anymore. Now, I don't know what to believe and as a citizen of this world, when we are talking about (very worst case scenario) global nuclear winter, that really disturbs me. I SHOULD be able to have faith in my goverment and our structures. But the more I read, the more uncertain I am.
 


FWIW - Peter Cronau is an ABC producer and investigative reporter and has won a Gold Walkley.

The source here, johnmenadue.com , is a public news and editorial site run by John Menadue, who's bio can be found here. But the relevant bits are thus:

"From 1960 to 1967 he was Private Secretary to Gough Whitlam, Leader of the Opposition. He then moved into the private sector for seven years as General Manager, News Limited, Sydney, publisher of ‘The Australian’.

John Menadue was head of the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet from 1974 to 1976 and closely involved in the dismissal events of November 11, 1975. He worked for Prime Ministers Gough Whitlam and Malcolm Fraser.

From 1977-1980 he was Australian Ambassador to Japan.

John returned to Australia in 1980 to take up the position of Head, Department of Immigration and Ethnic Affairs where he was active with Malcolm Fraser and Ian Macphee in the settlement of large numbers of Indo Chinese refugees in Australia.

He was appointed Head of the Department of Trade in December 1983."

Like I said - these people are no tin hat muppets posting rubbish. Whether you believe they are stooges acting in the interests of a foreign power is up to you to decide. But what's most important is they are presenting a logical, reasonable and rational assessment of the current world crises that is unfettered from the tyranny of Murdoch et al.
 
Sausages said:


FWIW - Peter Cronau is an ABC producer and investigative reporter and has won a Gold Walkley.

The source here, johnmenadue.com , is a public news and editorial site run by John Menadue, who's bio can be found here. But the relevant bits are thus:

"From 1960 to 1967 he was Private Secretary to Gough Whitlam, Leader of the Opposition. He then moved into the private sector for seven years as General Manager, News Limited, Sydney, publisher of ‘The Australian’.

John Menadue was head of the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet from 1974 to 1976 and closely involved in the dismissal events of November 11, 1975. He worked for Prime Ministers Gough Whitlam and Malcolm Fraser.

From 1977-1980 he was Australian Ambassador to Japan.

John returned to Australia in 1980 to take up the position of Head, Department of Immigration and Ethnic Affairs where he was active with Malcolm Fraser and Ian Macphee in the settlement of large numbers of Indo Chinese refugees in Australia.

He was appointed Head of the Department of Trade in December 1983."

Like I said - these people are no tin hat muppets posting rubbish. Whether you believe they are stooges acting in the interests of a foreign power is up to you to decide. But what's most important is they are presenting a logical, reasonable and rational assessment of the current world crises that is unfettered from the tyranny of Murdoch et al.
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At 87, I question how active Menadue is in running "his" site any more.

A brief look at the page, and it looks a little all over the shop in terms of politics. Largely Liberal bias, anti Labor, anti democrat, somewhat pro china though, certainly quite a few "don't poke the panda" type articles.

Are you still in Thailand?

I don't know what what it's like in the centre of the peninsula, but on the Vietnam side of the peninsula, there's constant bullying by China. Both militarily and economically.

Take the USA presence out of the South China Sea and the Straight of Japan, and I can almost guarantee that all of us in the Indo Pacific would end up as vasal states of China.
 
briztoon said:
At 87, I question how active Menadue is in running "his" site any more.

A brief look at the page, and it looks a little all over the shop in terms of politics. Largely Liberal bias, anti Labor, anti democrat, somewhat pro china though, certainly quite a few "don't poke the panda" type articles.

Are you still in Thailand?

I don't know what what it's like in the centre of the peninsula, but on the Vietnam side of the peninsula, there's constant bullying by China. Both militarily and economically.

Take the USA presence out of the South China Sea and the Straight of Japan, and I can almost guarantee that all of us in the Indo Pacific would end up as vasal states of China.
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Yeah - I realise there's still alot of "stuff" that needs to be filtered but at least the authors have credentials that bear some relevance. Like everything else, they have an agenda. But the information, insofar as the facts go, is useful, at least for me. Menadue still authors articles though.

Yeah, still here in NE Thailand - and Vietnam's issues with China, as you likely are aware, run historically deep. The current Vietnamese Communist Party leader and head of the country has a shared history with Xi Jinping, as they knew each other when they were youths and have maintained contact for many years. They share similar Communist Party ideals and beliefs. Unless there's a change in government in Vietnam, the historical antipathy between the 2 countries is irrelevant - Vietnam is firmly in the pocket of the CCP as it stands.

Thailand historically employs what is jokingly called "bamboo diplomacy" - the Thai government, as often as not appointed by the military after they topple someone they didn't like, has often been seen to be helping both sides in major conflicts....WW2 and the Vietnam War are two prime examples of this. In any regional conflict, I'd expect them to do similar. The average Thai who reads the newspapers doesn't see much of the same things we see - it just isn't being reported with the same gravity. Officially, I'd suggest Thailand will be "neutral" in any conflict that occurs between China and the West, but will undoubtedly attempt to not majorly piss off either China or the US, just as they did during Vietnam. Whether that can be achieved is another thing entirely.

In the main, Asian nations simply wish to do their own thing. The colonialism of the past is remembered, especially by Thailand who are the only SE Asian nation to have NEVER been absorbed by a colonial or foreign power. As a bloc, and as modern, independent states, they respect the differences of neighbours and ask for same. If China were to look at every nation between them and Australia and think "one day, this will all be part of China", then every nation south of Taiwan will rebel against that. And the CCP would know this. However, if their brand of world domination is more ideological than territorial, most SE Asian nations will probably accept China being China, so long as CCP tanks don't roll over the border. If Thais can be free to be Thai, in Thailand, then they really couldn't give a toss who is the major economic/military power in the world - the only issue would be if they feared losing their national identity within a CCP global hegemony.

Everyone here in the north east identifies as "Isan" or "Thai-Isan" - usually the former though. A different cultural group to southern Thais, they are considered second class citizens by the elites of Bangkok. But you look around....everyone drives a car (usually a late model 4WD ute or sedan), and a motorbike and they are cheap to buy. Everyone has a mobile phone and wireless 5G internet. There's no homeless here, there's no beggars, there's no feeling of compromised safety when you walk around at night and I hardly ever see a police officer. Some folks live in little more than tin-roofed shacks, but they don't mind and nor do their neighbours. There's no official telling them their property doesn't meet some building standard, or a real estate agent complaining that their house is bringing down property prices in the street. If that's someone's reality and it isn't yours, you leave them alone and don't judge the situation. People care about what's IMPORTANT here - and they live their lives accordingly. An interesting insight into this is when I first arrived here at my partner's house. Its a typical Thai home, 2 storey, built of steel and concrete. But the curtains for the windows are very very old and faded. I offered to buy the home new curtains, to make it look nice....and was met with virtual blank stares. The idea that I'd blow cash on something that served NO useful purpose (the curtains still blocked out the sun, let's face it...they just looked ratty) was an anathema to the family. The same curtains have hung here for over two decades and they were still blocking the sun....so why replace them? It wasn't earning money, it didn't provide food....so, not really important.

Contrast that attitude to the dominant one in Australia. Is our brand of government better than anyone else's, really? We don't have an enshrined right to Free Speech for example. Sure, I can hop onto a street corner and denounce the government, without fear of reprisal. But that's not sacrosanct. If a police officer tells me to move on, I am under no special freedom that allows me to ignore the officer's directive. We have no Bill of Rights in Australia, unlike the USA and almost every other western democratic nation. So, our "freedom of speech" is, at best, a tolerated privilege that can be removed at any time. Is Australia's history of freedom and prosperity unblemished? We all know the answer to that - but that truth isn't usually taught in primary or even secondary schools. Is that any different to the CCP not telling its citizens about Uighur "re-processing" camps? Sure, I can't stand outside the CCP HQ in Beijing and denounce the CCP leadership....but then I can't insult the Thai monarchy either. I can stand outside Parliament House in Canberra all day with a sign that lambasts our Government...but I'm not free to just live in a tin shack in metro/urban Australia - which one is more important to my sustainable life?
 
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Sausages said:
Yeah, still here in NE Thailand - and Vietnam's issues with China, as you likely are aware, run historically deep. The current Vietnamese Communist Party leader and head of the country has a shared history with Xi Jinping, as they knew each other when they were youths and have maintained contact for many years. They share similar Communist Party ideals and beliefs. Unless there's a change in government in Vietnam, the historical antipathy between the 2 countries is irrelevant - Vietnam is firmly in the pocket of the CCP as it stands.
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Not touching the rest, as it’s beyond my scope, but the current Vietnamese government has no close ties to China, or China’s leadership.

They are actively looking to the West, to ward off China’s growing ambitions.

I’ve no idea where you get the idea that Vietnam is in the pocket of China.

Vietnam suffers from the same types of Chinese economic punishments as Australia has recently, where Vietnamese exports are banned under false pretences.

Vietnam has been building stronger relationships with Australia and America, so our navies patrol their waters more regularly, to ward off ever growing Chinese incursions and aggression towards Vietnamese fishermen.

China firmly has it’s eyes set on a number of Island groups that currently belong to Vietnam, the Philippines and Indonesia.

China’s ambitions are 100% territorial. Anyone who believes otherwise is kidding themselves.
 
briztoon said:
Not touching the rest, as it’s beyond my scope, but the current Vietnamese government has no close ties to China, or China’s leadership.

They are actively looking to the West, to ward off China’s growing ambitions.

I’ve no idea where you get the idea that Vietnam is in the pocket of China.

Vietnam suffers from the same types of Chinese economic punishments as Australia has recently, where Vietnamese exports are banned under false pretences.

Vietnam has been building stronger relationships with Australia and America, so our navies patrol their waters more regularly, to ward off ever growing Chinese incursions and aggression towards Vietnamese fishermen.

China firmly has it’s eyes set on a number of Island groups that currently belong to Vietnam, the Philippines and Indonesia.

China’s ambitions are 100% territorial. Anyone who believes otherwise is kidding themselves.
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Vietnam's General Secretary was first to visit and congratulate Xi Jinping following his third term appointment. And his long years of friendship with Xi are well documented.

From the link:

"Trong expressed confidence that under the leadership of the CPC Central Committee with Comrade Xi Jinping at the core, China will definitely achieve the goals set at the 20th CPC National Congress and make a new contribution to the region and the world at large.


Trong said he fully agrees with Xi's important proposals on developing relations between the two parties and two countries. He said Vietnam attaches great importance to its ties with China and regards developing friendly cooperation with China as a top priority in its foreign policies.


Vietnam will advance the comprehensive strategic cooperative partnership with China based on the policy of long-term stability, forward-thinking, good neighborliness and comprehensive cooperation, and the spirit of being good neighbors, friends, comrades and partners, he said.


Trong said Vietnam firmly follows the one-China policy, opposes any form of "Taiwan independence" separatist activities, and will not develop any official relations with Taiwan.


He said Vietnam will not allow any country to establish a military base in Vietnam, or join any military alliance, or use force against any country, or work with one country to oppose another."


Whether the Vietnamese people are prepared to stage a coup to change direction is unknown, but the clear message being sent was one of strong support for Xi's leadership of the CCP by Vietnam's ruling party.

I'm 40 mins drive from the first Thai-Lao Friendship bridge and have traveled across it. There's a decent chunk of highway required either side in addition to the bridge that is still being built and improved. I'm pretty sure it's connected to China's Belt and Road initiative. Vientiane, capital of Laos, opened a high speed rail connection to China in December last year, largely paid for by China, that is definately part of that policy. Vientiane is about 25 mins drive from this Friendship bridge.

You can go from Bangkok to southern China in less than a day.

So yes, I agree, there's evidence to suggest the CCP's claims are territorial as well as ideological. Why build s**t and not allow the option of it to be armoured brigades traversing?

But victory at what cost? Is our definition of freedom, or free society, so different that we are prepared to annihilate billions of lives in it's defence?

And does the CCP represent the will of the people in China? If it does, fine. But if it doesn't....if the option exists to destabilise with Western precision, another foreign government....shouldn't we be pursuing that course, rather than present ourselves as the spear point?

And then there's the whole BRICS angle, which is another hydra......the maps below outline the economic reality of major trading partner, worldwide.

FhIHNGnWQAEfPM2
 
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And a few edits on that post, post post :p
 
Sausages said:
Vietnam's General Secretary was first to visit and congratulate Xi Jinping following his third term appointment. And his long years of friendship with Xi are well documented.

From the link:

"Trong expressed confidence that under the leadership of the CPC Central Committee with Comrade Xi Jinping at the core, China will definitely achieve the goals set at the 20th CPC National Congress and make a new contribution to the region and the world at large.


Trong said he fully agrees with Xi's important proposals on developing relations between the two parties and two countries. He said Vietnam attaches great importance to its ties with China and regards developing friendly cooperation with China as a top priority in its foreign policies.


Vietnam will advance the comprehensive strategic cooperative partnership with China based on the policy of long-term stability, forward-thinking, good neighborliness and comprehensive cooperation, and the spirit of being good neighbors, friends, comrades and partners, he said.


Trong said Vietnam firmly follows the one-China policy, opposes any form of "Taiwan independence" separatist activities, and will not develop any official relations with Taiwan.


He said Vietnam will not allow any country to establish a military base in Vietnam, or join any military alliance, or use force against any country, or work with one country to oppose another."


Whether the Vietnamese people are prepared to stage a coup to change direction is unknown, but the clear message being sent was one of strong support for Xi's leadership of the CCP by Vietnam's ruling party.

I'm 40 mins drive from the first Thai-Lao Friendship bridge and have traveled across it. There's a decent chunk of highway required either side in addition to the bridge that is still being built and improved. I'm pretty sure it's connected to China's Belt and Road initiative. Vientiane, capital of Laos, opened a high speed rail connection to China in December last year, largely paid for by China, that is definately part of that policy. Vientiane is about 25 mins drive from this Friendship bridge.

You can go from Bangkok to southern China in less than a day.

So yes, I agree, there's evidence to suggest the CCP's claims are territorial as well as ideological. Why build s**t and not allow the option of it to be armoured brigades traversing?

But victory at what cost? Is our definition of freedom, or free society, so different that we are prepared to annihilate billions of lives in it's defence?

And does the CCP represent the will of the people in China? If it does, fine. But if it doesn't....if the option exists to destabilise with Western precision, another foreign government....shouldn't we be pursuing that course, rather than present ourselves as the spear point?

And then there's the whole BRICS angle, which is another hydra......
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Vietnam is trying to be like Switzerland. Take no sides, and hope everyone leaves it alone.

I'm sure if you googled Vietnam Australian relations, you'd find something similar. It's not hard to find articles of the Chinese navy challenging the Australian navy in the South China sea, when our navy was on its way to "visit" Vietnam.

There was a lot of sh!t going down in the SCS right before covid hit. I can't find the articles now, but I'm sure it was the then Malaysian defence minister who called Xi an idiot or something like that on national tv, after the Chinese air force conducted a fly by exercise through Malaysian air space.
 
Looks like Albo didnt utensil up the messaging meeting with Xi Jinping today, fair play
 
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