A thread on politics- have some balls and post

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jackess

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What will it take for the people who voted for Trump to turn on him? Aborting a baby he had with his mexican boyfriend?

Hopefully other countries have the guts to cut ties with the US but I think the same factors that led to Trump being elected exist in most western countries.

Would also be nice to separate ourselves culturally from the US and develop an identity for ourselves.
 
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A lot of this information has been known for some time though and is part of an ongoing investigation.
Yeah but they couldn't act on it while the report remained classified. Their hands were completely and utterly tied.

Now that it's out there it is a whole new ballgame.
 

jackess

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Yeah but they couldn't act on it while the report remained classified. Their hands were completely and utterly tied.

Now that it's out there it is a whole new ballgame.
I don't think they'll be forced to act however. The ones that needed an excuse might try but it would probably require public support and I'm not sure this will turn all the deluded Trump supporters.

Also, I'm not sure Pence is a better option but it might give them an excuse to ditch some of their crazier policies.

Hopefully it's a wake up call of how ****** up modern culture is.
 

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Chezzalenko Reborn

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Question.... Why would Trump deliberately hire the room HE KNOWS Obama and wife would use?

Wouldn't it would be a fair assumption that Russian intelligence would be looking at that very room when Obama was there?

Wouldn't it be fair and reasonable that if Trump knew the room he hired to do these alleged things would most likely be a chance that Russian intelligence would continue to monitor those who stay there? Especially as someone as high profiled as him?

Am I missing something?

To me it sounds very sus..... but I am hoping its the other thing and that Trump is just a moronic JACKASS!
 
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Buzzfeed has been very careful to say that it is unverified and difficult to substantiate. They wrote "The document was prepared for political opponents of Trump by a person who is understood to be a former British intelligence agent." But the New York times were prepared to confirm that it was written by the aforementioned former British Intelligence agent and that he is well credentialled and considered a reliable source, although they were unable to get any confirmation from their own investigations.

There is going to be plenty of plausible deniability until the official US intelligence agencies can confirm it, but they felt it was important enough to append the summary of the document on the end of the hacking briefing last week for both Trump and Obama.
 
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Buzzfeed has been very careful to say that it is unverified and difficult to substantiate. They wrote "The document was prepared for political opponents of Trump by a person who is understood to be a former British intelligence agent." But the New York times were prepared to confirm that it was written by the aforementioned former British Intelligence agent and that he is well credentialled and considered a reliable source, although they were unable to get any confirmation from their own investigations.

There is going to be plenty of plausible deniability until the official US intelligence agencies can confirm it, but they felt it was important enough to append the summary of the document on the end of the hacking briefing last week for both Trump and Obama.
Carl Bernstein (yes the Watergate guy) has also been working on the story for CNN and he is adamant that the source is the MI6 agent and is credible. He also seemed to suggest that John McCain had also received independent substantiation on the allegations as well. Thus compelling him to go to Comey.
 
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Question.... Why would Trump deliberately hire the room HE KNOWS Obama and wife would use?

Wouldn't it would be a fair assumption that Russian intelligence would be looking at that very room when Obama was there?

Wouldn't it be fair and reasonable that if Trump knew the room he hired to do these alleged things would most likely be a chance that Russian intelligence would continue to monitor those who stay there? Especially as someone as high profiled as him?

Am I missing something?

To me it sounds very sus..... but I am hoping its the other thing and that Trump is just a moronic JACKASS!
The Golden Shower stuff is the most sordid detail in the report but to be honest there is much more damming stuff in the report. It's being on Putin's puppet strings that is the serious issue... the Golden Shower is just one of many forms of leverage they appear to have on him.

The full report is a must read. Especially as news agencies hyperfocus on the Golden Shower stuff to the point of trivialising the broader issue.
 

jackess

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He tweeted that it's fake news. How can it be fake if it's based on a real report? If it's untrue he should question the report and not the media.
 
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He tweeted that it's fake news. How can it be fake if it's based on a real report? If it's untrue he should question the report and not the media.
Yeah, seems like he is deliberately latching onto (and misusing) the Fake News meme for the sake of obfuscation.

3 hours of Twitter silence followed by that... feels like they are shaken.
 

Viceregal

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If there was actual documented proof that Trump was a serial, years long pervert then it would have been used by either his Republican opponents, his media inquisition team or by Team Clinton. Considering how far back they dug and how desperate they were to derail him, and how little 'classified' mattered to them it seems wildly implausible that this information is accurate or anything but created. On top of that there was not one mention of it in how many thousands of Podesta emails when they show discussions of strategy on a range of sensitive (and embarrassing if made public) issues.

On top of that a report that claims to be from 17 agencies (but is only from 4) and which is authored by Obama appointees with, shall we say, prior colourful track records when it comes to the facts ... who refuse point blank to appear and show their evidence before the Intelligence committee (their bosses) ...

Too little, too late, improperly processed (there are standard processes for these things which these are just not following), blatantly political bat guano.

TLDR - not a fan
 

jackess

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If there was actual documented proof that Trump was a serial, years long pervert then it would have been used by either his Republican opponents, his media inquisition team or by Team Clinton. Considering how far back they dug and how desperate they were to derail him, and how little 'classified' mattered to them it seems wildly implausible that this information is accurate or anything but created. On top of that there was not one mention of it in how many thousands of Podesta emails when they show discussions of strategy on a range of sensitive (and embarrassing if made public) issues.

On top of that a report that claims to be from 17 agencies (but is only from 4) and which is authored by Obama appointees with, shall we say, prior colourful track records when it comes to the facts ... who refuse point blank to appear and show their evidence before the Intelligence committee (their bosses) ...

Too little, too late, improperly processed (there are standard processes for these things which these are just not following), blatantly political bat guano.

TLDR - not a fan
I think the proof would implicate a lot of other very important people. Like that guy who knew Trump and the Clintons who organised a paedo ring.
 

Viceregal

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I think the proof would implicate a lot of other very important people. Like that guy who knew Trump and the Clintons who organised a paedo ring.
That logic would say that what is being promoted as 'proof' is thus not proof at all... ie the 'current proof' has got nothing to do with Clinton et al and could have been easily run at any point prior to the election if was real.
 
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It's not an internal intelligence report so I am not sure what "processes" you are referring to.

And again, sexual perversion isn't the real revelation here. He survived "grab her by the pussy" after all. We all know he is a penis on legs.

The real revelation (if true) is the true depth of Russian involvement going back 5 years, both via blackmail and via direct coordination with Trump surrogates during the campaign itself.

As for "if it was true, the Republicans and Democrats etc" would have used it against him already." There would appear to be a timing issue. He was already the nominee before this report was commissioned (by both Democrats and anti-Trump Republicans).

So in regards to the Republicans not using it until now... once he was the nominee they had to grin and bear it until after the election otherwise they would have been bloodied and bruised in the down-ticket races. Now that that is done and dusted it appears McCain et al are now making their move.

As for "why haven't the Democrats tried to use it until now"... it's pretty clear they tried. Does Harry Reid ring any bells? He did the upmost to get Comey moving on it earlier... he couldn't just come out with it himself being classified information and all. For someone all about the "proper process" you should be applauding him.
 
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jackess

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That logic would say that what is being promoted as 'proof' is thus not proof at all... ie the 'current proof' has got nothing to do with Clinton et al and could have been easily run at any point prior to the election if was real.
It's not proof. It's intelligence. They don't actually have the videotapes of what Trump got up to at the Ritz Carlton.
 

Skoob

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It's not proof. It's intelligence. They don't actually have the videotapes of what Trump got up to at the Ritz Carlton.
No, and that's the point and what will get him through.
I'm in 2 minds on this. I'm not averse to some levels of conspiracy theory, and this really lends itself.
Viceregal , the so called "proof" if it exists, is in the hands of the Russians. They're not about to release anything, as the point is to have Trump in the Whitehouse with this stuff hanging over his head. It will be kept well and truly up his sleeve. The only hope is that some now know where to dig, but that will be a big task & take a while. It seems that there is good intelligence on what cards the Russians hold, but we can't actually see those cards.

On the other hand, I don't for one second put it past U.S. intelligence agencies to manufacture things. There are political players more influential than Trump who by now will be panicking at the prospect of this madman being President. To be honest, I don't mind some subterfuge in this instance if it is a means to the end of Trump.

Bottom line is, I don't care if any of it is true or not as long as the end result is the downfall of this lunatic.

To pick up on TBD's point, I actually find it most disturbing that most of the world seems concerned about paying prostitutes to piss on each other. I mean **** me, that is the least of our worries. If true, the ****** is in cahoots with the Russian lunatics and has just perverted the course of democracy (which of course he was already guilty of without their help). This is huge.
 

Viceregal

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No, and that's the point and what will get him through.
I'm in 2 minds on this. I'm not averse to some levels of conspiracy theory, and this really lends itself.
Viceregal , the so called "proof" if it exists, is in the hands of the Russians. They're not about to release anything, as the point is to have Trump in the Whitehouse with this stuff hanging over his head. It will be kept well and truly up his sleeve. The only hope is that some now know where to dig, but that will be a big task & take a while. It seems that there is good intelligence on what cards the Russians hold, but we can't actually see those cards.

On the other hand, I don't for one second put it past U.S. intelligence agencies to manufacture things. There are political players more influential than Trump who by now will be panicking at the prospect of this madman being President. To be honest, I don't mind some subterfuge in this instance if it is a means to the end of Trump.

Bottom line is, I don't care if any of it is true or not as long as the end result is the downfall of this lunatic.

To pick up on TBD's point, I actually find it most disturbing that most of the world seems concerned about paying prostitutes to piss on each other. I mean **** me, that is the least of our worries. If true, the goose is in cahoots with the Russian lunatics and has just perverted the course of democracy (which of course he was already guilty of without their help). This is huge.
Since I am not of the opinion that Trump is a lunatic and am definitely not a fan of globalism or the current outworkings of multiculturalism I tend to look at it from a slightly different perspective. I know how Clinton/MSM/Soros etc tried to pervert the course of democracy (which we will keep as shorthand for representative representation in a federal republic) but I would be interested in how you perceive that Trump did so ...

In terms of motivations for making things up / reducing Trump's legitimacy there are trillions of dollars at stake and a massive paradigm shift from Wall St to Main St that greatly benefit the current establishment and naturally they are going to fight with whatever tools are at hand to keep their powers and privileges.

I still suggest that refusing to show your intelligence to the intelligence oversight committee is a strong red flag to rogue activities - if you had a real case you would be rocking up ... refusing to allow scrutiny reeks of not being able to prove what you have claimed you can prove.
 
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