Abortion

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chargers 09

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Was going to post this on the SRP board but I thought I'd get a more level and intelligent discussion on GD.

Anyone been through one? What toll did it put you through physical/mental?
Also keen to hear peoples general thoughts and musings on this topic.

Please keep it civil, no religious or moral arguments at all please as this is a sensitive topic for many.

Let's see how we go.


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Gough

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I had two flat mates in six months that had abortions. Both abortions were certainly for the best, but one of them was Irish Catholic so there was a religous angle that was an issue, and both said they would spend the rest of their lives wondering what if. I wouldn't wish what they went through on anyone.
 

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Doss

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I have a couple friends who've had them; one of them aged only 16 at the time. Both of them were unwanted pregnancies.

My mother has a friend who had one because the foetus had severe abnormalities and there was a decent chance it would be still born regardless. My mother had a baby girl in 1982 who only lived until seven days old, having been born with spina bifida. It was traumatic for her and, while she's not really a fan of abortion in general, had she known that my sister had that abnormality during the pregnancy, she probably would have had an abortion to save the trauma of losing a daughter at a week old. Somehow, it just hadn't been picked up; a very sad situation all round.

Ultimately it is the woman's call as she, and only she, has to put up with the physical travails of pregnancy. Having said that, I do understand that the father has a stake too.

I hope it's a situation I never have to be a part of, because while I am pro-choice, I also know from my friends and mother's friend that they went through some very rough times because of their abortions.
 

MrsEddieBetts

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For me it all depends on the circumstances. I've never had one. I would have considered it if I'd had a surprise pregnancy when I was younger, but now I'm late twenties and married it wouldn't be on my radar.

I believe in a woman's right to choose. I think men do have some input but unfortunately can't see a way it could ever be anything other than a woman's choice. I think medical abortions should be much more readily available so that they're the first choice before surgical abortions, to reduce trauma.
 

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Bomberboyokay

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Explainer: is abortion legal in Australia?

September 30, 2015 3.21pm AEST

Abortion is a safe medical procedure, yet half of Australian women may have difficulty accessing a termination because they live in states and territories that designate it a crime.

From the 19th century onward, abortion was regarded as a crime in Australia. Abortion law was included in criminal legislation and was based on the 1861 English Offences Against the Person Act.

Since then, some states and territories have reformed or decriminalised abortion, while others continue to restrict women’s access to abortion in a way entirely inappropriate for the 21st century.

Abortion laws in Australia are all state or territory laws. The Commonwealth is only responsible for the oversight of drugs for medical abortion through the Therapeutic Goods Administration.

Queensland

Queensland law remains little changed from the 1899 Criminal Code which contains the same wording as the 1861 English Act. Any person who carries out, or assists with, an abortion may be liable to criminal prosecution, including the woman herself.

Any defence hinges on the interpretation of the “surgical operations and medical treatment” defence in section 282 of the Code.

In the 1986 case R v Bayliss, which interprets sections 282 of the criminal code, Justice McGuire found that “in exceptional cases” an abortion would not be unlawful where it was carried out in good faith to avoid “serious danger to the mother’s life or her physical or mental health (not merely the normal dangers of pregnancy and childbirth) which the continuation of the pregnancy would entail”.

In 2009-10, a Cairns couple was charged under the Queensland legislation. Although they were acquitted after a jury trial, they were subject to 18 months of glaring negative publicity.

New South Wales

Abortion has been a criminal offence in NSW since 1900, under the state’s Crimes Act.

NSW case law has established that in certain circumstances, similar to those in Queensland, an abortion would not be unlawful. It also allows for broader considerations of economic and social factors to determine whether continuing the pregnancy poses a serious danger to the woman’s mental health.

Western Australia

Until 1998, the position in Western Australia under the Criminal Code Act 1902 was similar to current Queensland law: unlawful abortion was a criminal offence. Although, there was no case law in WA to determine when abortion was lawful.

Following legislative reform (but not complete decriminalisation) in 1998, abortion is now lawful up to 20 weeks if the woman gives her consent*, or, where she is unable to consent herself, she will suffer “serious danger to her physical or mental health or serious personal, family or social consequences if the abortion is not performed”.

After 20 weeks, abortions can only be performed if two medical practitioners from a statutory panel of six agree that the woman or her fetus has a “severe medical condition” that justifies the procedure.

In practice, the panel only accepts very severe fetal abnormalities, driving women towards abortion “tourism” in Victoria and elsewhere.

South Australia

Under the Criminal Law Consolidation Act 1935, and 1969 amendments, abortion is lawful in SA in certain circumstances prescribed by legislation. So, similarly to WA, there has not been complete decriminalisation.

Abortion must be carried out in a hospital or prescribed facility, which has limited availability of early medical abortion in the state.

The woman must have resided in SA for a minimum of two months for the abortion to be lawful unless the grounds are fetal abnormality or immediate threat to the life or health of the woman.

Under SA law, the woman herself can still be charged with procuring an “unlawful” abortion.

Northern Territory

Abortion remains in the NT Criminal Code but has been modified by the Medical Services Act 1974, which makes abortion lawful up to 14 weeks. Two medical practitioners must agree that there is a risk to the mother in continuing the pregnancy or there is substantial risk that the child would be born with a serious “handicap”.

Abortion is also lawful up to 23 weeks gestation where the medical practitioner is of the opinion that terminating the pregnancy is immediately necessary to prevent serious harm to the woman’s life, physical or mental health.

However requirements that early medical abortions must be performed in hospitals, and not clinics, limit the availability, as there are so few hospitals in the NT.

Tasmania

In Tasmania until 2013, under the Criminal Code Act 1924, the “unlawful termination” of a pregnancy was prohibited. The Reproductive Health (Access to Terminations) Act 2013 has essentially decriminalised abortion and moved it into the health regulations.

Abortion can be performed by a medical practitioner with the woman’s consent, up to 16 weeks' gestation.

After 16 weeks, it can be performed if two medical practitioners (one of whom must be an specialist gynaecologist) reasonably believe the continuation of the pregnancy would involve greater risk of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman than if the pregnancy were terminated.

The woman herself cannot be charged.

This Tasmanian legislation also includes restrictions on the harassment of women seeking abortion services by mandating exclusion zones around clinics, the only legislation so far to do so.

Victoria

The Victorian Abortion Law Reform Act 2008 decriminalised abortion by removing it from the 1958 Crimes Act and placing it in the health regulations.

A pregnant woman who requests an abortion is entitled to the procedure when the pregnancy does not exceed 24 weeks. After 24 weeks, abortion is available where a medical practitioner reasonably believes that the abortion is appropriate and has the agreement of a second practitioner.

Where a doctor conscientiously objects to abortion, he or she is obliged to make a referral to a provider who is known not to conscientiously object.

Australian Capital Territory

Abortion was decriminalised in 2002 with the introduction of the ACT Medical Practitioners (Maternal Health) Amendment Act. A woman seeking or receiving an abortion faces no legal sanction; nor does the service provider.

All Australian women should be able to access abortions, no matter where they live. Ideally, all states and territories would have consistent laws based on Victorian legislation, with the addition of Tasmania’s prohibition on the harassment of women as they enter abortion clinics.

* This article has been updated to better reflect the legal position in Western Australia, where the woman consents to abortion and the fetus is 20 weeks or less gestation.
https://theconversation.com/explainer-is-abortion-legal-in-australia-48321
 

BluesMan

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It's a bit of a grey area and the specific laws varies form state/territory to state/territory.

I forget the specifics because I'm not a woman but it's quite a problem.
I know ive done an assignment and speech on it (not willingly), just wanted to know what you ment by it. Not that grey imo (well in WA that is, I only studied that law)
 

Scotland

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I see abortion as a bit of a tree falling in the forest type scenario. If someone, somewhere has or doesn't have an abortion - what the fu** has it got to do with me?

If it's your own personal circumstances then you'd have to weigh up the pros and cons and make what could be a very difficult decision. I think I'd find it very uncomfortable and would stew over it even after the fact.

Everyone has their own moral compass but I personally think it's selfish to bring a child into the world that you know will have a severe disability and will be a burden on the health system for its entire life. I also think it's ridiculous to force someone to give birth to a child they do not want and/or are unable to take care of. I also think there's a big difference between an abortion at 6 or 8 weeks compared to an abortion at 25 weeks.

I also don't have a uterus so am unlikely to ever have an abortion, and I don't know the health risks involved. That being said, the people that do have MD after their name. Priests, ministers, pastors and any other unqualified pro-life zealots should STFU.
 

MrsEddieBetts

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I see abortion as a bit of a tree falling in the forest type scenario. If someone, somewhere has or doesn't have an abortion - what the **** has it got to do with me?

If it's your own personal circumstances then you'd have to weigh up the pros and cons and make what could be a very difficult decision. I think I'd find it very uncomfortable and would stew over it even after the fact.

Everyone has their own moral compass but I personally think it's selfish to bring a child into the world that you know will have a severe disability and will be a burden on the health system for its entire life. I also think it's ridiculous to force someone to give birth to a child they do not want and/or are unable to take care of. I also think there's a big difference between an abortion at 6 or 8 weeks compared to an abortion at 25 weeks.

I also don't have a uterus so am unlikely to ever have an abortion, and I don't know the health risks involved. That being said, the people that do have MD after their name. Priests, ministers, pastors and any other unqualified pro-life zealots should STFU.
Yes. Exactly. I dips me lid to you sir.
 

Morganashlee

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I had an abortion when I was 18. I was seeing a guy at the time who told me he would have no part in being around and would not support me. I was scared and alone and thought it was my only option at the time.

I’m now 30 without children and terrified of never having another chance. What if that was it for me? I guess time will tell. I still think about it all the time, how different my life would have been. I’d certainly never do it again.
 

Thegibbsgamble

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I’m now 30 without children and terrified of never having another chance. What if that was it for me? I guess time will tell. I still think about it all the time, how different my life would have been. I’d certainly never do it again.
You've got plenty of time. Life changes really quickly, you never know who you're going to meet tommorrow. Who will change your life.

Its pretty clear from what you've posted you've made the right decision. One has to be able to look after themselves before they can look after someone else. Child rearing is about teaching. At 18 you have so much to learn. I know a few teenage mother's, they lose out on a lot. So does the child.

My mother hates my sister for having an abortion. It would of been my mother's first grandchild. It was a dead end relationship and she had a career. He was abusive

Not good.
 

JG22

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My view has always been pro abortion, just seems common sense to me.
Not to be abused obviously but seems a great piece of medical practice.
 

Bostonian

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I'm pro-abortion.

So long as tax payers don't have to contribute a cent to it.

I don't understand why conservatives etc are so against it, the more abortions there are the less liberal/left leaning people are born.
 

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