Academies

[Mr Meeseeks]

No one has made any noise that northern academy membership should take precedence over father son.

The AFL has been very clear that it is up to the kid which route he chooses to take.

Blakey chose academy over father son. Scott chose father son over academy.

Only one Northern academy is even close to producing a constant stream of draftable talent, and that is Gold Coast. Yet they might only have one draftable kid this year.

Otherwise, no Northern academy is even close to producing the same number of draftable kids each year, as the weakest Talent League club.

Oh no. Only one draftable kid this year? How will they manage?

Piss off with this victim bullshit. You guys get free access to the top talent in your state at a discount. All the time.

You moan that 'no Northern Academy is even close to producing the same number of draftable kids', the difference being that YOU GUYS STILL GET PRIORITY ACCESS TO THESE KIDS. THE VIC CLUBS DO NOT.

If the best talent in the country is from the talent league, any club can draft them. If the best talent in in the country is from a northern academy, you guys get them for a bag of chips.

This 'playing dumb' to the advantages does my *en head in. Just admit you are sitting on a golden goose because the AFL cant afford for the 4 northern clubs to do it the hard way like Hawthorn, Wc and North are right now.

Academies are great. The concessions are not.

Nothing is more infruriaiting than when supporters of northern clubs act as though they have some devine right to this advantage.

Piss off

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

We couldn’t.

Essendon bid on Keidean Coleman in the 30’s, that wiped out all our picks until pick 65.

Is this supposed to be a sacrifice?! You just admitted you got a talented kid in the 30s for a bunch of crap later picks, then spun it so that you are somehow the losers in this?

Incredible

 

[extractasam]

Is this supposed to be a sacrifice?! You just admitted you got a talented kid in the 30s for a bunch of crap later picks, then spun it so that you are somehow the losers in this?

Incredible

and it also was impossible for them to stockpile picks to match a bid at 65??

So GC can go stockpile and match 3 bids in the top 15 but Lions can’t match 2 picks outside the 30. Makes sense… sounds like they just had no interest in him

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Hodge has said multiple times on SEN and Fox Sports that it will be Cooper’s decision, if he’s good enough.

Imagine if a vic club had the ability to work on Levi Ashcroft throughout his teenage years, thus giving him the option to give the vic club first priority to get him. His choice and all that...

But they cant can they?

 

[Val Keating]

Hodge has said multiple times on SEN and Fox Sports that it will be Cooper’s decision, if he’s good enough.

That’s not the point. The point is that sons of footballers should not be allowed priority access. The whole point of the academies is supposed to grow the game and bring in young players that wouldn’t be playing Aussie rules.

After the Dogs got JUH the southern academies were basically neutered, even more than they previously were because the players had to be indigenous or come from a non football background, something that the northern academies don’t have, hence Gold Coast owning the draft last year.

Don’t you want an equal competition where every team has the same opportunities? What is the point of the southern teams being forced to have academies if they can’t draft them before pick 40 or whatever it is?

 

[briztoon]

Instead what we've got is a relatively unlimited talent pipeline of kids who really only want to play for the club that has been working with them for years - which is really good for the record. Well done. But on top of that these clubs are still free to go to the draft and where they can swing it, take the best young talent from other states too. Good example is Sydney taking Logan McDonald and then being able to match a bid for Braeden Campbell on the very next selection.

And I notice there doesn't seem to be so much of an issue with homesick Victorians leaving northern clubs in recent times. Perhaps homesickness was just a pretence for escaping the poor club cultures at the time (eg. Rockcliff as captain being a sociopathic bully, Suns building their initial list with those chasing cash).

what a load of hog wash.

Show me one single Northern academy that has benefited from an unlimited supply of academy kids.

Sydney has had 3 top 10 prospects in a decade, otherwise a smattering of later talent.

GWS has sfa high end academy kids, other than Tom Green. Again they have a limited number of later drafted talent. They’ve had other top draftees that never made it, or moved on. No pipeline there.

Brisbane, well we’ve averaged one kid every two years for the last decade, and only had two first round academy kids, and one of those was also father son, and he was drafted under the father son nomination.

Gold Coast have had two first round draftees before the last draft, and traded one of them away in a salary cap dump. They might be about to start seeing a pipeline of talent come through their academy, but they have done way more work than any other AFL club to spread afl in their zone.

Plus there are rules already in place that will limit how many kids Northern Academies will be able to take in the first round.

Finish top 4 and you can only match 1 first round bid.

Finish 5th to 8th, and a team can match two first round bids.

Finish outside the 8, and there’s no limit on matching.


Truth is no genuinely talented rugby league junior is going to switch to AFL, god knows both the Lions and Sydney have tried. But we can’t compete with the money that rugby league throws at the kids as juniors, or the money top end kids can earn straight out of colts.

In case you’re not aware, top rugby league juniors from the age of 14 & 15 receive yearly signing on bonuses and free medical when joining an NRL junior development squad, and can sign $500k+ contracts when they jump to seniors. None of this set draftee contracts the AFL have.

The Lions tried to lure Kalyn Ponga to AFL as a junior, but at 15 he signed a 4 year contract with North QLD, and at 17 re-signed a 4 year, $3.6 million deal with NQ.

AFL can’t compete with that.

 

[HedgeFund]

Imagine if a vic club had the ability to work on Levi Ashcroft throughout his teenage years, thus giving him the option to give the vic club first priority to get him. His choice and all that...

But they cant can they?

It’s a proven consistent fact that 50% of all kids drafted come from Victoria.

The incidence of players returning to their home state is far greater than those who were drafted within their home state choosing to move interstate / away from home after a few years.

The idea that the northern clubs are incentivised to develop local kids into long term players for their home state clubs makes sense to me.

It’s about having a strong competition throughout the country, not “dudding” Melbourne clubs on father / son selections.

 

[extractasam]

what a load of hog wash.

Show me one single Northern academy that has benefited from an unlimited supply of academy kids.

Sydney has had 3 top 10 prospects in a decade, otherwise a smattering of later talent.

GWS has sfa high end academy kids, other than Tom Green. Again they have a limited number of later drafted talent. They’ve had other top draftees that never made it, or moved on. No pipeline there.

Brisbane, well we’ve averaged one kid every two years for the last decade, and only had two first round academy kids, and one of those was also father son, and he was drafted under the father son nomination.

Gold Coast have had two first round draftees before the last draft, and traded one of them away in a salary cap dump. They might be about to start seeing a pipeline of talent come through their academy, but they have done way more work than any other AFL club to spread afl in their zone.

Plus there are rules already in place that will limit how many kids Northern Academies will be able to take in the first round.

Finish top 4 and you can only match 1 first round bid.

Finish 5th to 8th, and a team can match two first round bids.

Finish outside the 8, and there’s no limit on matching.


Truth is no genuinely talented rugby league junior is going to switch to AFL, god knows both the Lions and Sydney have tried. But we can’t compete with the money that rugby league throws at the kids as juniors, or the money top end kids can earn straight out of colts.

In case you’re not aware, top rugby league juniors from the age of 14 & 15 receive yearly signing on bonuses and free medical when joining an NRL junior development squad, and can sign $500k+ contracts when they jump to seniors. None of this set draftee contracts the AFL have.

The Lions tried to lure Kalyn Ponga to AFL as a junior, but at 15 he signed a 4 year contract with North QLD, and at 17 re-signed a 4 year, $3.6 million deal with NQ.

AFL can’t compete with that.

Have you seen the giants academy graduates?

They have consistently produced high level afl quality players for years now. Please google it

 

[cryptor]

what a load of hog wash.

Show me one single Northern academy that has benefited from an unlimited supply of academy kids.

Sydney has had 3 top 10 prospects in a decade, otherwise a smattering of later talent.

GWS has sfa high end academy kids, other than Tom Green. Again they have a limited number of later drafted talent. They’ve had other top draftees that never made it, or moved on. No pipeline there.

Brisbane, well we’ve averaged one kid every two years for the last decade, and only had two first round academy kids, and one of those was also father son, and he was drafted under the father son nomination.

Gold Coast have had two first round draftees before the last draft, and traded one of them away in a salary cap dump. They might be about to start seeing a pipeline of talent come through their academy, but they have done way more work than any other AFL club to spread afl in their zone.

Plus there are rules already in place that will limit how many kids Northern Academies will be able to take in the first round.

Finish top 4 and you can only match 1 first round bid.

Finish 5th to 8th, and a team can match two first round bids.

Finish outside the 8, and there’s no limit on matching.


Truth is no genuinely talented rugby league junior is going to switch to AFL, god knows both the Lions and Sydney have tried. But we can’t compete with the money that rugby league throws at the kids as juniors, or the money top end kids can earn straight out of colts.

In case you’re not aware, top rugby league juniors from the age of 14 & 15 receive yearly signing on bonuses and free medical when joining an NRL junior development squad, and can sign $500k+ contracts when they jump to seniors. None of this set draftee contracts the AFL have.

The Lions tried to lure Kalyn Ponga to AFL as a junior, but at 15 he signed a 4 year contract with North QLD, and at 17 re-signed a 4 year, $3.6 million deal with NQ.

AFL can’t compete with that.

I said "relatively unlimited talent pipeline". Not that there was an unlimited supply of academy kids.

By this I mean the northern academies can effectively take in almost any kid within their state and there is clearly very little in the way of obstacles to get in kids from footballing backgrounds from other states. There will always be new kids to go through these academies and the northern clubs are really only limited by their ability to identify and develop the most talented ones. Something that has steadily been improving as the academy programs mature and see greater investment. Half of last years U16 All Australian team was northern academies prospects. PROFILED | 2023 AFL U16 All Australian Team
But again - I think this is good for AFL football and I also think the clubs who develop them should be given priority access to them.

What I don't want is to see father/son prospects being absorbed into this system. Which is what this thread is about.

I definitely don't think the current bidding system is fair or right as it is still riddled with loop holes that all clubs are utilising to varying degrees whether it's academy or father/son bidding. This isn't an academy issue, it's a draft issue and off topic.

 

[briztoon]

No one would need to make noise for that. The academy itself does the heavy lifting of indoctrinating the sons. And I don't mean that in an insidious way. Everything I hear about the northern academy programs is about how well run they are. Why wouldn't anyone in such a program not want to "graduate" to join the club that runs it?

Yeah, you haven't really read much on all the academies then. Widely spoken about up here that Brisbane's academy was really in name only, and didn't offer anything different than the juniors were getting from their QAFL clubs. A lot of accusations that it was a fund raising tool, as families have to pay for their kids to be in the academy. Things are different now, since a restructure after covid.

The issue ties back to my point in my other post about how the academies were sold to the competition as a way to bring in kids who wouldn't otherwise make it to the AFL (because they wouldn't be developed or would choose other codes) and simultaneously provide northern clubs with homegrown talent that will want to stick around. But now we know they can effectively be used as vehicles to cut in on other clubs potential father son's.

lol, a lot of retired AFL players move North. Both for work in the industry, or for the lifestyle.

The AFL chose to put the academies in the hands of the Northern clubs, rather than funding a Talent League type competition up here.

Then made rules that if any kid wanted to play in the U16 and U18 Championships, that they had to be in an academy.

The AFL literally force any kid who wants to play at the highest level up here to be in an academy.

Families can choose not to put a kid in the academies, but he's going to have a damn sight tougher time getting recognised and possibly drafted out of the QAFL.

Another AFL rule is that kids have to reside in an academy zone for 5 years, for that academy to have priority access to them.

The academies probably don't have to do any work to influence a kid whether he wants to stay home or not. Be he father son or not.

Again, blame the AFL for making the rules.

And for the record, I don't think Brisbane had any intention of this Cooper Hodge scenario happening when they offered a deal to Luke Hodge. But the fact is that there is nothing in place to prevent similar scenarios from happening by design in the future.

Look, the AFL can choose to change the rules for eligibility or priority access any time they want. The fact that they haven't probably speaks to there being greater complexities to the issue than I can come up with.

At the end of the day, the AFL has left the decision up to the kid.

 

[briztoon]

Oh no. Only one draftable kid this year? How will they manage?

Piss off with this victim bullshit. You guys get free access to the top talent in your state at a discount. All the time.

You moan that 'no Northern Academy is even close to producing the same number of draftable kids', the difference being that YOU GUYS STILL GET PRIORITY ACCESS TO THESE KIDS. THE VIC CLUBS DO NOT.

If the best talent in the country is from the talent league, any club can draft them. If the best talent in in the country is from a northern academy, you guys get them for a bag of chips.

This 'playing dumb' to the advantages does my *en head in. Just admit you are sitting on a golden goose because the AFL cant afford for the 4 northern clubs to do it the hard way like Hawthorn, Wc and North are right now.

Academies are great. The concessions are not.

Nothing is more infruriaiting than when supporters of northern clubs act as though they have some devine right to this advantage.

Piss off

lol at some of your language. Who's portraying the victim now.

Hawks aren't doing anything the hard way. That's the cycle of being a good team, bad team, etc. The better you are, the longer it takes for you to rebuild.

No team can stay at the top forever, and climbing off the bottom is bloody hard. That's the nature of a competition with a salary cap, draft system.

As for North. They CHOSE to go a scorched earth rebuild. And then went cap in hand to the AFL for draft concessions and priority picks.

The AFL is not truely an equitable national competition, with 60% of the competition based in one state, an unequal draw, the grand final locked in to one states major ground for the next 50 years, etc.

The AFL recognises this, and puts in to place systems to balance out the inequities. Otherwise Gold Coast and GWS would be perpetual feeder clubs to Victoria.

And recently we've seen some of the best talent from Victoria tell recruiters they don't want to be drafted out of Victoria. That wasn't fair on West Coast or GWS in 2022 when Harry Sheezel and George Wardlaw said they would prefer to stay in Victoria. Same with Bailey Smith, Archie Perkins and Ben Hobbs in previous drafts.

Haven't seen the AFL stamp down on this.

I've said multiple times on the draft board that I'd like to see a truely fair draft. No Father Sons. No Priority picks. No compensation picks.

But I'd also like to see a truely fair competition where one state's teams don't inherently have advantages over teams from every other state.

It is infuriating when supporters of the old VFL teams believe they have a divine right to every advantage they receive. But it's even more infuriating when they have a whinge about non VFL teams receiving a benefit to counter balance these.

 

[cryptor]

Yeah, you haven't really read much on all the academies then. Widely spoken about up here that Brisbane's academy was really in name only, and didn't offer anything different than the juniors were getting from their QAFL clubs. A lot of accusations that it was a fund raising tool, as families have to pay for their kids to be in the academy. Things are different now, since a restructure after covid.

I've read that it is a good footy development program. And you're telling me it wasn't... but now it is. So I'm right, it's a good program.

lol, a lot of retired AFL players move North. Both for work in the industry, or for the lifestyle.

Yep, and as I said, I don't think Brisbane targeted Hodge with Cooper and academies in mind. But I do think father son eligible players shouldn't be eligible for academy priority selection. And the rules as they stand today allow it to happen whether it's by chance or design.

The AFL chose to put the academies in the hands of the Northern clubs, rather than funding a Talent League type competition up here.

Then made rules that if any kid wanted to play in the U16 and U18 Championships, that they had to be in an academy.

The AFL literally force any kid who wants to play at the highest level up here to be in an academy.

Families can choose not to put a kid in the academies, but he's going to have a damn sight tougher time getting recognised and possibly drafted out of the QAFL.

Another AFL rule is that kids have to reside in an academy zone for 5 years, for that academy to have priority access to them.

The academies probably don't have to do any work to influence a kid whether he wants to stay home or not. Be he father son or not.

Again, blame the AFL for making the rules.

None of that is relevant to the topic. As I've said multiple times, I'm happy for the northern clubs to have their academies and priority access to draft them. It just needs to be balanced and not infringe on the father/son system.

Look, the AFL can choose to change the rules for eligibility or priority access any time they want. The fact that they haven't probably speaks to there being greater complexities to the issue than I can come up with.

At the end of the day, the AFL has left the decision up to the kid.

It's actually really simple. The AFL want to grow the game and make more money. They want to do that by taking more of the NSW and QLD market. So they'll be reluctant to change any rules that move the benefit needle away from the northern clubs.

 

[briztoon]

Is this supposed to be a sacrifice?! You just admitted you got a talented kid in the 30s for a bunch of crap later picks, then spun it so that you are somehow the losers in this?

Incredible

I didn't spin anything.

I said we were unable to draft lachie Johnson ourselves, as we didn't have the pick to.

Essendon bid on Keidean Coleman at pick 37, our next pick was pick 38. This was Dodoro being Dodoro. Johnson had just done his ACL so was never going to play in 2020. We had committed to drafting Johnson in the rookie draft. Essendon cut Johnson at the end of his first contract.

Because Johnson had just done his ACL, Essendon put him straight on their Long Term Injury list, giving them an extra rookie pick. It was essentially a thrown away pick by Essendon and a d!ck move by Dodoro.

Very few teams rated Coleman as talented, that's why every club past over him in his original draft year of 2018, and we brought him back as an over age academy kid in 2019. Then most clubs past over Coleman at least once, before he was bid on. He wasn't a highly rated kid that year either.

 

[Baz_hawk]

I'm interested to see how long the northern academies operate in the current form. The AFL should be looking at taking over control of these and expanding the programs to better serve the expanding markets. The clubs have done a great job with them after the initial setup by the AFL.

Currently any high-end talent from QLD and NSW in the pathway have the luxury of knowing they won't be leaving their state, whereas all other draftees from Vic, SA, WA, etc are expected to pack their bags if selected. So much is spoken about players wanting to stay in their own state (Curtin in the most recent draft for example) but for the northern state talent, this isn't a concern. Auskick participation in NSW and QLD has never been higher, so the potential talent pool is expanding year on year and at some point they will need to look at this and decide that this concession needs to end to level the playing field.

I don't think we have reached the point where the academies should be handed over, but I think we are closer to the end than the start and if the AFL is serious about growing the game they need to be investing in a strong program run independently of clubs. It's definitely been a thought within the four walls as we got these garbage NGAs that were quickly dialed back after JUH was captured via a loophole.

I think once GWS and GC have had 20 seasons under their belt, these academies will shift to AFL control and clubs will no longer have priority access. As it stands, the newest clubs don't have enough history to get F/S selections, so this is more of a balancing act.

 

[briztoon]

Have you seen the giants academy graduates?

They have consistently produced high level afl quality players for years now. Please google it

Show me these high level academy graduates.

There's Tom Green, then who? Harry Himmelberg.

Maybe you need to google where all these "high level" afl quality players are.

Maybe you could include Jacob Hopper at Richmond as a high level player, if you squint hard enough. Matthew Kennedy at Carlton is just a step above Hopper, maybe... debateable, I don't know. Which player do you rate higher?

 

[briztoon]

I said "relatively unlimited talent pipeline". Not that there was an unlimited supply of academy kids.

By this I mean the northern academies can effectively take in almost any kid within their state and there is clearly very little in the way of obstacles to get in kids from footballing backgrounds from other states. There will always be new kids to go through these academies and the northern clubs are really only limited by their ability to identify and develop the most talented ones. Something that has steadily been improving as the academy programs mature and see greater investment. Half of last years U16 All Australian team was northern academies prospects. PROFILED | 2023 AFL U16 All Australian Team
But again - I think this is good for AFL football and I also think the clubs who develop them should be given priority access to them.

That U16 team.

Each teams MVP had to be included in the U16 AA team. Even if that meant other, more deserving kids missed out.

One of your own Hawks supporters had a real crack at the selection process and team on the draft board. He then went and did his own team from the U16's champs. Wasn't nearly as many academy kids in his team. One of the QLD talent watchers had a real crack at how many Gold Coast kids were included in the AA team as well. However, the Suns academy crop next year is real strong. Even if they don't make finals, they won't be able to match bids on them all, plus they're getting real deap squad as it is. If they keep topping up with their academy kids, they're going to have to lose some good mature talent to fit them in.

What I don't want is to see father/son prospects being absorbed into this system. Which is what this thread is about.

Then lobby the AFL to change the rules.

I definitely don't think the current bidding system is fair or right as it is still riddled with loop holes that all clubs are utilising to varying degrees whether it's academy or father/son bidding. This isn't an academy issue, it's a draft issue and off topic.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Hodge may have been pa during to the crowd, but at a hawks sportsman's night, he said that he loves Brisbane but would probably be moving back to Victoria in a few years because "noone has seen a mother as protective as that of his sons"

Either Cooper is set for the hawks, or knocking back the lions

 

[cryptor]

Then lobby the AFL to change the rules.

Individual and even groups of supporters don't have the influence or authority to lobby the AFL directly to change rules, so that is a nothing comment.

If it matters to my club (and it should given the feeling among the supporters) then the administration will raise it to the AFL on our behalf.

In the meantime I'm free to state my thoughts on the matter on my own teams board.

 

[Back Pocket Rocket]

And in reply to the GWS part. Here is a list of their academy prospects over the years which are pretty much free hits with bids. They've done pretty well as they get these kids on top of their normal draft picks.

Josh Fahey

Canberra, ACT

Pick 42, 2021 National Draft – GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Tom Green

Canberra, ACT

Pick 10, 2019 National Draft – GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Nick Shipley

Campbelltown, NSW

Pick 64, 2017 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Lachlan Tiziani

Albury, NSW

Pick 54, 2016 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Jeremy Finlayson	Culcairn, NSW	Pick 85, 2014 National Draft - GIANTS Academy selection	GIANTS, Port Adelaide
Jacob Hopper	Leeton-Whitton, NSW	Pick 7, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Matthew Kennedy	Collingullie, NSW	Pick 13, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS, Carlton
Harry Himmelberg	Eastlake, ACT	Pick 16, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Matthew Flynn	Narrandera, NSW	Pick 41, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS

Jack Steele

Belconnen, ACT

Pick 24, 2014 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS, St Kilda

Zac Williams	Narrandera, NSW	Pick 55, 2013 Rookie Draft - GIANTS Academy selection	GIANTS, Carlton
Joe Redfern	Coolamon, NSW	Pick 51, 2013 Rookie Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Jake Barrett	Temora, NSW	Pick 97, 2013 National Darft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS, Brisbane Lions

 

[briztoon]

I've read that it is a good footy development program. And you're telling me it wasn't... but now it is. So I'm right, it's a good program.

We're only in to year 2 or 3 of the new program. No one is sure if it's a good program or not at this stage. I know the previous run program received a lot of criticism.

I do know that quite a few of the top prospects this year, have been doing a lot of work with their QAFL club coach (they come from the same club).

But our top talented kid moved to Vic on a scholarship as a 15 year old (here comes another can of worms)(a lot of the private schools in Vic have been throwing footy scholarships at our best academy kids, only one has taken up the offer so far).

Yep, and as I said, I don't think Brisbane targeted Hodge with Cooper and academies in mind. But I do think father son eligible players shouldn't be eligible for academy priority selection. And the rules as they stand today allow it to happen whether it's by chance or design.

All our best academy kids come from AFL background families. Andrews, Hipwood, Ben Keays, all come from Victorian families that moved north when they were kids, and AFL was the football code of choice in their family. Coleman also moved to Brisbane for a shot at an AFL career.

So is there a difference who their father is, if they come through the academy program?

None of that is relevant to the topic. As I've said multiple times, I'm happy for the northern clubs to have their academies and priority access to draft them. It just needs to be balanced and not infringe on the father/son system.

I don't have a problem with this in reality. But the AFL's stance is it's the kids choice, at this stage.

It's actually really simple. The AFL want to grow the game and make more money. They want to do that by taking more of the NSW and QLD market. So they'll be reluctant to change any rules that move the benefit needle away from the northern clubs.

 

[briztoon]

And in reply to the GWS part. Here is a list of their academy prospects over the years which are pretty much free hits with bids. They've done pretty well as they get these kids on top of their normal draft picks.

Josh Fahey

Canberra, ACT

Pick 42, 2021 National Draft – GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Tom Green

Canberra, ACT

Pick 10, 2019 National Draft – GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Nick Shipley

Campbelltown, NSW

Pick 64, 2017 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Lachlan Tiziani

Albury, NSW

Pick 54, 2016 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS

Jeremy Finlayson	Culcairn, NSW	Pick 85, 2014 National Draft - GIANTS Academy selection	GIANTS, Port Adelaide
Jacob Hopper	Leeton-Whitton, NSW	Pick 7, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Matthew Kennedy	Collingullie, NSW	Pick 13, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS, Carlton
Harry Himmelberg	Eastlake, ACT	Pick 16, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Matthew Flynn	Narrandera, NSW	Pick 41, 2015 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS

Jack Steele

Belconnen, ACT

Pick 24, 2014 National Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection

GIANTS, St Kilda

Zac Williams	Narrandera, NSW	Pick 55, 2013 Rookie Draft - GIANTS Academy selection	GIANTS, Carlton
Joe Redfern	Coolamon, NSW	Pick 51, 2013 Rookie Draft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS
Jake Barrett	Temora, NSW	Pick 97, 2013 National Darft - GIANTS Academy Selection	GIANTS, Brisbane Lions

It's a veritable who's who of the star players and AA's of the competition.

They're not free hits on top of their normal draft picks. That's not how the bid matching system works, so that assertion is a straight out fallacy.

 

[hfc70]

Coopers choice at the end of the day. Wouldn’t be begging for him to choose Hawks, you’d want the kid desperate to play for the club his father is a legend of. When the time comes, we will be in GFs regularly.

 

[Back Pocket Rocket]

It's a veritable who's who of the star players and AA's of the competition.

They're not free hits on top of their normal draft picks. That's not how the bid matching system works, so that assertion is a straight out fallacy.

Good one. Every club always gets a pick in front of a bid to choose someone else 1st or does what Gold Coast did this year and trade their 1st pick for a premium

 

[H00t]

Show me these high level academy graduates.

There's Tom Green, then who? Harry Himmelberg.

Maybe you need to google where all these "high level" afl quality players are.

Maybe you could include Jacob Hopper at Richmond as a high level player, if you squint hard enough. Matthew Kennedy at Carlton is just a step above Hopper, maybe... debateable, I don't know. Which player do you rate higher?

Just going with the players Giants have picked up not including the ones they’ve overlooked there is

Steele, Z. Williams, Finlayson, Hopper, Kennedy, Himmelberg, Flynn, Setterfield, Perryman, Cumming and Green all since 2013.

Plus numerous other academy players that didn’t quite make the cut.

That’s an incredible leg up on the competition. They had so many good players they couldn’t fit them all in. Plus they had their regular draft picks as well.

Non-academy clubs would be lucky to get a haul similar to that over 50 years from f/s.

 

[extractasam]

Show me these high level academy graduates.

There's Tom Green, then who? Harry Himmelberg.

Maybe you need to google where all these "high level" afl quality players are.

Maybe you could include Jacob Hopper at Richmond as a high level player, if you squint hard enough. Matthew Kennedy at Carlton is just a step above Hopper, maybe... debateable, I don't know. Which player do you rate higher?

Jack Steele? Harry Himmelberg has come up as one of the comps better swingmen in recent times. Tom Greene is the best by far.

You literally said, “no pipeline there”. There is almost 10 blokes off the top of my head that are best 22 on afl lists currently. Is that not good enough of a pipeline without even hitting the draft in any other way???