Opinion Acceptance.

[archereleven]

If we don't win a final, Scott should be gone.

Couldnt agree more. Injuries or not i dont give a ****, get it done Bradley.

 

[Mr Reliable]

.......... To address your question though, Mr Reliable, on how to fix our mistakes, unfortunately there isn't really much we, the supporters can do, other than be vocal that we think we can do better, and ensure the club knows that, and also by not simply digging the heals and looking for escape goats or so called easy fixes (sack scott he's shit, drop half the team). It's up to the club to fix the problems, and I suppose that any optimism I have comes from the fact that I believe the club, coaches, and players WANT to fix the problems, that many of the problems are fairly easy to identify (if hard to successfully address), and the fact that in theory, some of the issues we cant control should (and hopefully will) start to resolve themselves. Our draw does open up a bit more (even if we have butchered a lot of it so far), we should start getting players back from injury in the next few weeks (granted, we've been saying that for 3 months ) and every week we play, the club learns more about what they are and aren't doing right.

I'll conclude by saying while I am optimistic, I'm by no means certain we will fix our issues in season. I'm also not certain we will fix them in the off season (In Walsh We Trust). But that said the only things that ARE certain in life are death, taxes (unless you're really rich in Australia it seems) and Essendope* being scummy.

Your optimism can balance my pessimism, Devington. I think the head coach and players delude themselves with their ill-founded positivity when what is needed is a strong dose of REALITY.

They delude many posters on here with it too, out of blind faith. They deluded me until, oh I don't know the Collingwood loss, or was it our start against the Suns? Losing is one thing. Playing important games without the necessary intensity is another thing.

Today I've watched bits and pieces of Melbourne losing, Port losing and Carlton losing. Their supporters would be devestated but at least their boys had a fair dinkum crack. We just lose lamely and then spin some bull shit story about how we outscored the opposition for 2 quarters.

Someone down there needs to grow a pair and challenge the coach to change tack and make the players more accountable.

And I should have added that there's no such thing as an easy draw or a draw that opens up for us.

 

[Devington]

Your optimism can balance my pessimism, Devington. I think the head coach and players delude themselves with their ill-founded positivity when what is needed is a strong dose of REALITY.

They delude many posters on here with it too, out of blind faith. They deluded me until, oh I don't know the Collingwood loss, or was it our start against the Suns? Losing is one thing. Playing important games without the necessary intensity is another thing.

Today I've watched bits and pieces of Melbourne losing, Port losing and Carlton losing. Their supporters would be devestated but at least their boys had a fair dinkum crack. We just lose lamely and then spin some bull shit story about how we outscored the opposition for 2 quarters.

Someone down there needs to grow a pair and challenge the coach to change tack and make the players more accountable.

And I should have added that there's no such thing as an easy draw or a draw that opens up for us.

I've never completely bought into the idea that the coach and players think too highly of themselves/their ability. It's a sticking point though. While the coach and players can come out and publicly slam themselves after a loss, and label it "embarrassing" or "not good enough" the issue is that... it happens again! and then.... again! I subscribe to the dual theories that A: they don't respect the opposition enough, and B: as a group they've yet to find the magic button that makes them do the job. The joke is that there is no magic button. The magic button is simply trying your guts out, and sticking to your role. But when they consistently aren't able to get out of first or second gear, and also don't appear to change their approach to the games (although, this is one of those things where they really could be, but it's all behind the scene) then what are we supposed to think?

I don't have blind faith in the club, and I agree with a lot of the things that some of our supporters say regarding selection, effort, coaching and the like, but I try to make an effort to take a bigger than normal step back. There would be oh so many things that we wouldn't be aware of that goes on behind closed doors, and for all we know the club is trying their guts out behind closed doors to sort out the issues, in fact, surely they would have to be.

One thing I want to ask as a general question of everyone though, is in regards to Brad's pressers. I see a decent number of supporters potting him for this and that, when personally I don't get much of it, with a few exceptions. I don't know as that I've ever seen him particularity try and spin the truth (other than perhaps whatever shizen happened with him Boomer and Rockliffe last night), or cherry pick positives and hold them up as something they're not. He often gets asked the standard questions (what went right, what went wrong, what could you have done better etc etc), and then just answers them in a fairly truthful manner. sometimes not bluntly enough, other times too bluntly, but he does answer their questions. There's only ever been 2 bees to get stuck in my bonnet with his pressers, I sometimes (rightly or wrongly) disagree with him when he differentiates between the quality of our workrate v application. And several times he's made vague threats to cut/drop players (without naming them) and then rarely does (granted availability/form of replacements come into it, but then he shouldn't say that in the first place then). That said he more recently and more often has been mentioning (almost worryingly)n our "core" group of players.
TL;DR: What do you guys think of his pressers in general? is he too biased/evasive/something or is it more an issue that we're just tired of hearing the same reasoning, because the same things keep happening every few weeks. I fall into the latter camp for the most part, but I don't find it that much of an issue, as I usually see him as being fairly forthright and honest.

And yes Mr Reliable, I agree that someone should challenge Brad to change tact with the players, if he doesn't just do it himself, because as far as I'm concerned It's becoming a bigger ongoing issue. I think this is where Walsh might play a big role, because he strikes me as a guy who takes down names and notes then comes off the long run when its the right time (as he's only just come back into the fold at the end of last year, I think we may have to wait 'til end of season before he has a sufficient grasp on everything AND the ability/time/resources to address any faults. And after that hopefully he can start "intervening" on a more regular basis).

 

[ozzyoslo]

As Ben Brown was struggling to have an impact in the second quarter, and as Brisbane had already activated the sub, it occurred to me that Ben Jacobs on at half time would be a good move. Now if only we had a recent experience where a half time sub activation of a midfield player for a tall forward working stupendously well to turn around a deficit by three quarter time.

The lad did ok in his 1st game but we know that Brisbane are devoid of talls and there was a huge chance of rain.......we need to pick sides that match up well against our opponents and the taking the weather conditions into consideration........we never do this. Its embarrassing.

 

[mockingbeat]

Hawthorn and Freo Played in the grand final last year. Both are well adapted to their gameplan. Both have been consistent for a large period of time. They both have, and have for some time, better off field resources than us. While we may want to hold ourselves to their standards, we aren't there yet.

Should the clubs standards be higher than what they seem to be? Yes.
Is our club the quality of Freo or Hawthorn? No.
For a team that isn't the quality of the top 4 teams of the comp, is it understandable that key injuries detrimentally affect us more? Yes.
Is it a shit situation? Yes.

Of course we are not the quality of a top 4 side. But this group has been together 5 years now, they SHOULD be well adapted to a gameplan. Regardless of that, we should not be losing to a team that a week prior had kicked 1 point to half time. They are missing just as many of their best 22 as we are.

 

[Heaps of fun]

Great OP tazaa.

I have been one that has remained positive over the past few seasons, but after the lack of effort I witnessed last night my positivity has waned significantly. It was a lazy performance by all involved, players and coaches. Our club needs to realize what their supporters and members want from them.

We don't expect top 4 finishes every year.

We don't expect premierships every few years.

We don't expect to win every game.

What we do expect, and what we crave, is a team that will put in the required effort each week. A team that will come out onto the ground each week and give 100% for 2 hours. Just like Arch, Stevo, Shimma and so many others have that are lucky enough to represent the North Melbourne Football Club.

I have faith that when this team does give 100% we have the ability to beat anyone. If we give 100% we will have regular top 4 finishes, we will put ourselves in the position of premiership contenders, we will win a lot more than we lose. At the moment we are so far away from being that team. We can do it sometimes and we look good. We were lucky to have put in 75% last night and it showed.

As for the coach, I believe that Brad Scott is a good player manager. He has built a solid team, he has created a culture where we can retain and attract players, he has put together a good game plan. What he struggles with is his match day coaching. Why aren't changes made when teams get on a roll? When was the last time we saw a player positional change when things aren't going our way?

I have never said it before as I have always been positive about this group, but something needs to change. This last season and a half have been all tease and not much substance. Unless something dramatic changes we are never going to make it.

 

[B4Bear]

Hawks could be a serious wake-up call for all involved.

And the Lions wasn't?

 

[scottywiper]

And the Lions wasn't?

But we nearly won, and we had chances in the last quarter? :rolleyes thingy

 

[Only Forwards]

I want to see that.

Commitment
Effort
Desire
Pride

 

[Twinkletoes]

I want to see that.

Commitment
Effort
Desire
Pride

Alternatively, I'd like to see:

Committment
Unity
Nouse
Teamwork

 

[Only Forwards]

Alternatively, I'd like to see:

Committment
Unity
Nouse
Teamwork

Can't we have it all?

We used to.

We have players who have talent coming out of their ears. They are under representing the side and the jumper.

My personal view on the top 4 this year is that it's weak, half of them walking wounded, some untested in big finals. We had real tangible opportunity this year and its been pissed away to stupid losses to lesser sides.

I've had someone this morning ask me

What does North stand for?

I don't even know how to articulate the answer to that question. I love this club, we stand for 4 fifths of f*** all at the moment.

There are people on this board saying making finals and winning one is a step forward. its rejection of the chances we've pissed away.

 

[King Corey]

"We love Wayne's intensity around the ball and willingness to run himself into the ground, we really do. But he's got a few things to work on to play the role we want him to play. We've asked him to go back to Werribee and play AFL footy at VFL level if that makes sense. He knows guys like Will Sierakowski and Brad McKenzie are ahead of him and just needs to keep working and I'm sure an opportunity will open up for him."

 

[Grogg]

TL;DR: What do you guys think of his pressers in general? is he too biased/evasive/something or is it more an issue that we're just tired of hearing the same reasoning, because the same things keep happening every few weeks. I fall into the latter camp for the most part, but I don't find it that much of an issue, as I usually see him as being fairly forthright and honest.

Short answer:

I genuinely think he believes he's being honest, open and forthright about where we are at and how far away we are from the good sides. I also think that he's deluding himself, refuses to admit his steadfast belief has been misplaced and cannot understand why there is such a massive gap in overall performance from week to week, quarter to quarter, from individual to individual.

The best thing for him and us as a club would be for either the chairman or chief of football to come in and give him a rocket and point out a few obvious truths that everybody else can see from the outside.

Sometimes a person can be just too close to a situation to see the obvious is staring them in the face. The players have lost respect for him and he doesn't demand it of them.

 

[Yianni]

Everybody's angry, but this is a really shit post. You're really hoping we get done next week?

I'm sure he only said that because he feels that a win against Hawthorn will paper over the yawning cracks and everyone will be happy families again.

I would take 8 more losses to end the season if it meant a flag next year. That doesn't mean I want the team to lose. It means that my faith in this club's ability to be honest with themselves has been absolutely shattered by this year and I feel like that's what it might take.

 

[Joshen]

Needed to be the first thing highlighted at the game review (or whatever they do). Would love for there to be a side by side comparison with how our players look at the end of games today.

 

[Heaps of fun]

Needed to be the first thing highlighted at the game review (or whatever they do). Would love for there to be a side by side comparison with how our players look at the end of games today.

The sad thing was that they didn't go hard enough when the game was there to win and then were running themselves ragged in the 4th but didn't find they had the required skills or smarts to pinch it. Just like the Geelong game. The lack of the effort required really hurt but the lack of class and nouse was the worrying subplot of the night for me.

 

[Only Forwards]

Needed to be the first thing highlighted at the game review (or whatever they do). Would love for there to be a side by side comparison with how our players look at the end of games today.

]

 

[RobZombie]

One thing I want to ask as a general question of everyone though, is in regards to Brad's pressers. I see a decent number of supporters potting him for this and that, when personally I don't get much of it, with a few exceptions. I don't know as that I've ever seen him particularity try and spin the truth (other than perhaps whatever shizen happened with him Boomer and Rockliffe last night), or cherry pick positives and hold them up as something they're not. He often gets asked the standard questions (what went right, what went wrong, what could you have done better etc etc), and then just answers them in a fairly truthful manner. sometimes not bluntly enough, other times too bluntly, but he does answer their questions. There's only ever been 2 bees to get stuck in my bonnet with his pressers, I sometimes (rightly or wrongly) disagree with him when he differentiates between the quality of our workrate v application. And several times he's made vague threats to cut/drop players (without naming them) and then rarely does (granted availability/form of replacements come into it, but then he shouldn't say that in the first place then). That said he more recently and more often has been mentioning (almost worryingly)n our "core" group of players.
TL;DR: What do you guys think of his pressers in general? is he too biased/evasive/something or is it more an issue that we're just tired of hearing the same reasoning, because the same things keep happening every few weeks. I fall into the latter camp for the most part, but I don't find it that much of an issue, as I usually see him as being fairly forthright and honest.

I'm pretty much exactly where you are on this, though not nearly as eloquently. I've mentioned before how much I get all about presser kremlinology. As often as not, It's pretty clear people wish he would come off the long run more after losses, because that's exactly how we're feeling at the ground or in front of the box. We want someone to give voice to our frustrations and make it clear the club feels the same as we do. Whereas, his primary aim is media 101, to get in and out without stuffing up, without giving the papers juicy quotes to pot the playing group or give fuel to fire up the other guys. I'm kind of gobsmacked that people assume he's the same inside the four walls.

While on the one hand it's fine that he and the coaching/backroom group in general are realistic about where the playing group is at, I can see where people might interpret that as acceptance (though I personally doubt it is).

Sure would be nice to see a couple of heads on spikes at the selection table this week though.

 

[Jimmy's Hot Dogs]

Alternatively, I'd like to see:

Committment
Unity
Nouse
Teamwork

You think if we had 22 like this we'd have a pack or a bunch?

 

[Twinkletoes]

You think if we had 22 like this we'd have a pack or a bunch?

If you just use the first letter of each word one thing I'm sure of is that we'd have "a crack".