Adam Goodes

[Ron The Bear]

He went on national TV, said what you said, that she was ignorant, people need education, that she wasn't to blame for what she said and needed to be supported.

What should he have done?

If he had his time again, I hope he’d elect not to say “Racism has a face, it’s a 13yo girl” at a presser the morning after.

 

[Kappa]

Don't forget a week after the ape incident Eddie McGuire called him King Kong.

Mcguire never called him King Kong, you probably shouldn't be so ignorant when making accusations or you will look like a fool.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

He pointed out someone in the crowd who yelled a slur during a game. Should he have ascertained the age and intent of someone abusing him before pointing them out?

And he was so hurt by that 13 year old he couldn't take the field later in the game...

 

[RUNVS]

This is the most depressing thread I have read on bigfooty in a long time. It is genuinely upsetting to know that many of my fellow countrymen and women think like this.

 

[Hawk_francais]

1. Black people aren’t “slayed” in the US. Black people commit violent crime at a much higher rate than any other group in America, hence they are going to get shot at more. That being said, there are stats out there from the FBI over the years that have pointed out that more white people have been killed in police shootings over the years. Is there a movement for them? Nope. Should the take a knee debarckle have been about police brutality in general and police shootings? Very much so. There are many sources that debunk “black slaying” by police. Keep in mind that African Americans commit more violent crime, but only make up 21-24% of the population depending on the source you’re looking at.

2. The KKK has around 5000 members and they were never as massively prominent as you imply. Does America have racists? Sure, maybe. But is a large amount of America racist as you’re implying? No. You seriously sound like the group of people that called everyone who didn’t vote for Hillary sexist.

3. Didn’t “mainstream Australia” vote in a peblisite where over half the country said they were in favour of gay marriage despite the blockades the Liberal party put in front of them? Sounds like, based on that, that Australia isn’t against minorities. Are you just making stupid statements based off flat air or do know everyone that is part of this “mainstream Australia”?

4. You must be pretty knowledgeable and have Goodes feeding you information to know exactly what he’s went through since he was a kid. I’m not going to pretend that I know what he went through, but implying you know exactly what he went through is hilarious at best. What if he didn’t go through anything? What if he went through he over exaggerated? You don’t know that.

5. AFL fans do not represent Australia. Most of the points you have made here are generalised statements full of hot air. The AFL isn’t made up of 25 million people, not even close. You’re trying to paint the actions of many to a group that is made up of around 25 million people, and it’s down right ******ed that you think that their actions should be put on the rest of us as a result.

Stop making generalised statements without facts to back them up. You are what’s wrong with the world and it’s current political climate, as you make dangerous statements about things you don’t have a lot of knowledge about and treat them as fact. You’re welcome to your opinion, but you’re making statements and misrepresenting facts.

I’m going to brush over this quickly as this isn’t what this thread is about, but pretty much every group whether it’s male/female, gay/straight/trans or white/black/asian/aliens (that last one is a joke btw) has some kind of problem or “oppression” in the current political climate. Do some groups have more problems than others? Yes. Does that make their groups issues any less important? No. It’s up to all of us to identify the issues each group has internally and with other groups to make this shithole of a planet we live better for everyone on it. Whether you’re a white Australian who doesn’t like Goodes or you’re some other person.

Don’t be so quick to go on the offensive, as many others have done on this thread, because all you do is hurt the cause that you’re trying to stand up for\defend and become ammunition for another group.

1. Perhaps more white people were killed overall because there are more white people in general? Talk about meaningless stats.
2. A large part of USA is NOT rascist... am I reading this right? You mean the same USA where (let's leave history of segregation, greenwood etc, because you clearly have no actual idea) they have elected a guy whose number one campaign promise was to build a wall to keep out Mexicans?
3. If you want to get an idea of mainstream Australia have a go reading the Herald Sun, where you'll quickly see Australia's general attitude towards minorities, namely: "I don't mind them as long I don't have to encounter cultural differences, hear their languages, bake wedding cakes for them or feel any discomfort about my complicity in Australia's discrimination past or present".
4. I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[Craze]

Anyone over the age of 40 would probably remember how popular limited over cricket was in the mid-80's. In that era Australia were the easy beats, and the West Indies used to love coming down here and smashing us. The MCG crowd used to target only one of the West Indian players - Sir Viv Richards - for booing. The 'you are a w***er' chant was also reserved for Viv. Now I joined in as a youngster not because I was racist, but because Richards was their best player and because he had an arrogance about him that grated with Australian fans. For the same reason, Australian fans booed Sir Richard Hadlee mercilessly.

My point is that booing can be for reasons other than racism.

I regret booing Richards and Hadlee now as an adult, because they are two of my favourite past players. In fact that West Indian team of the mid-80's is my favourite cricket team from any era, including the great Australian teams of '48, and Steve Waugh's side that won 16 tests in a row.

 

[Craze]

1. Perhaps more white people were killed overall because there are more white people in general? Talk about meaningless stats.
2. A large part of USA is NOT rascist... am I reading this right? You mean the same USA where (let's leave history of segregation, greenwood etc, because you clearly have no actual idea) they have elected a guy whose number one campaign promise was to build a wall to keep out Mexicans?
3. If you want to get an idea of mainstream Australia have a go reading the Herald Sun, where you'll quickly see Australia's general attitude towards minorities, namely: "I don't mind them as long I don't have to encounter cultural differences, hear their languages, bake wedding cakes for them or feel any discomfort about my complicity in Australia's discrimination past or present".
4. I wholeheartedly agree.

How does wanting to prevent illegal immigration make someone racist?

 

[Craze]

'We simply cannot allow people to come into the United States undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country'.

Which right-wing extremist said that?

President Obama, 2005

 

[Chadwiko]

Which right-wing extremist said that?

President Obama, 2005

But... Obama wasn't President until January 2009?

 

[HairyO]

But... Obama wasn't President until January 2009?

Hes not President now either but its still his title.

Pretend it said Senator Obama instead. Now respond to the point.

 

[Kummerspeck]

If he had his time again, I hope he’d elect not to say “Racism has a face, it’s a 13yo girl” at a presser the morning after.

He didn't say that, though. That was the quote created by News Ltd. press when they removed a part of what he said without indicating they'd done so.

"Racism has a face and last night it was a 13 year old girl" is clearly making the point that racism isn't just the domain of rednecks or extremists. The edited quote gives a distinctly different impression.

 

[Kummerspeck]

How does wanting to prevent illegal immigration make someone racist?

How many rallies has Blair Cottrell and his ilk had against illegal immigrants from the US and UK, some of our biggest sources?

 

[Hawk_francais]

How does wanting to prevent illegal immigration make someone racist?

No, and if you're expecting somebody to explain to you that Donald Trump espouses racist views, and that supporting him is also necessarily racist then you can head over to wikipedia instead.

 

[Hawk_francais]

'We simply cannot allow people to come into the United States undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently and lawfully to become immigrants in this country'.

Which right-wing extremist said that?

President Obama, 2005

I also love your point here, it's just so wonderfully ambiguous... either:

a) Left-wing politicians are normally in favour of illegal immigration.
b) Obama is a right-wing extremist.
c) You don't know.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

People who make a big deal over the entire spear throwing saga are just pathetic imo. Pretending like they feel threatened by it so you can attack the man is just simply poor form. Obvious fake outrage, just sad

Nah. Consistency with the AFL has always been the problem. Some people have been allowed to do as they please, whilst others get pulled up for similar actions, and it appears the colour of their skin has a lot to do with it.

Many players have been fined for making gestures towards fans, a lot them have been sly little flips of the bird delivered with a cheeky smile, hardly threatening at all. Even Sheedy was fined for making a threatening gesture to a player, imagined what would have happened if he had of directed it at a spectator? Goodes on the other hand was all aggression, the look on his face, his body language was all about aggression, but it was all ok for him because it was a 'traditional' dance. Or was it?

Now, the 'traditional' dance he was performing was...well...let's just say that the guy who created it said it was meant to be a boomerang, not a spear. Hmmm, this is embarrassing. I guess some people might ask if it was a recent creation and not meant to be a spear then how 'traditional' was it at all? And if it wasn't really a 'traditional' dance then what was it? Some people might come to the conclusion that it wasn't really a 'traditional' dance at all but a threatening gesture to a group of opposition fans.

But hey, it's Goodes, he's allowed to do it because....

 

[StevoJenkins]

I don't see how a vegan protest at a steak shop is relevant. You say 'They booed him because of his use of AFL to advocate for social issues.' Can you imagine that happening in the NBA where their are a lot of black players.Afl players are disproportionately indigenous so it's the perfect place ro raise awareness of real issues.I agree with him that most Australian's are racist, you just have to look who people elect to parliament.

The reason I used that example (I think you're purposely ignoring my points now), is because I wanted to use an example of how time and place can be wrong and how that relates to Adam Goodes's at the same time period. It's why I also used the kids party analogy, as it best represents the situation at the time.

I find it funny how you mention the NBA, you do know that guys get booed all the time there right? Regardless of skin colour, for various reasons ranging from how they appear in commercials to, yes, the social issues that campaign for. Unlike Australia however, most people understand the booing and don't call every who does so racist. At least those outside of the reactionary media don't.

Finally we have the shittiest comment you have made yet. Majority of Australia is not racist. Who is blatantly racist in parliament? Pauline Hanson? Someone who wore a burka to parliament and brought a fake grenade to highlight the issues police were having at the time with Muslim women? Someone who came to parliament and said racism can be directed towards white people and then got called racist? Outside of that, we have people of other races and minority backgrounds in various governmental capacities. If Australia was so racist, they wouldn't be there.

Also it's really stupid to use parliament as an indicator as to how racist Australia is due to people who just vote for literally anyone on the ballot paper because they don't give a *. It's a side effect of compulsory voting. One of these days we'll have a cartoon character in parliament because a whole bunch of people couldn't care less about who's up there.

1. Perhaps more white people were killed overall because there are more white people in general? Talk about meaningless stats.
2. A large part of USA is NOT rascist... am I reading this right? You mean the same USA where (let's leave history of segregation, greenwood etc, because you clearly have no actual idea) they have elected a guy whose number one campaign promise was to build a wall to keep out Mexicans?
3. If you want to get an idea of mainstream Australia have a go reading the Herald Sun, where you'll quickly see Australia's general attitude towards minorities, namely: "I don't mind them as long I don't have to encounter cultural differences, hear their languages, bake wedding cakes for them or feel any discomfort about my complicity in Australia's discrimination past or present".
4. I wholeheartedly agree.

1. Yes, that's part of the stats. Still doesn't change the fact that there are not police "slaying" black people, which is the point I was responding to. Talk about not reading...

Also those stats I mentioned are still relevant, as they reveal why black people are shot by police and why they make up majority of the prison population when they only make up around a fifth of the population. But sure, call the stats meaningless if you must. Given the other points you're bringing up further on, I don't have high hopes for you.

2. Segregation - fully abolished by the 1960's, almost 60 years ago. Greenwood (I'm assuming you're talking about the town or city where the racist graphiti was done on a mass scale), barely has 50,000 people. Not even 24,000 if you look at the other town. Some of the people who were caught making said graphiti said they did it for them memes.

Yes, I do have an idea of what I'm talking about, hence why I know that the KKK did not have a massive wide span of influence as the person I was replying to suggests, nor does the KKK have a great influence now as the person I was replying to tried to suggest as well. Read the post I was responding to, because most of the points you've brought up here you've addressed without reading what post I responded to.

But back to the main point on hand, trying to secure a country's borders does not equal racism. Not being a fan of people entering a country illegally is not racism. But here's the kicker right, you know Donald Trump isn't the first to come up with the idea of that wall right? Obama and the democratic party tried to get a fence/wall put up almost 8 years ago, before Trump even tried to go for president. But I just have no idea according to you, and America is just entirely racist because half the country had a choice between a guy who wanted to build a wall and a woman who wanted to go to war with Russia with nuclear missiles, so they decided to vote for the guy who wanted to build a wall because they didn't just want to vote for a woman because woman. Hillary was a terrible option, Trump was a terrible option but didn't want to do to war. All of America is not racist for voting for Trump. Additionally, it's worth mentioning that Hillary won the popular vote and a decent percentage of people still didn't vote. But America is still entirely racist for voting for Donald Trump and I still have "no actual idea" according to you.

3. Once again, much like what I said about the AFL, The Herald Sun does not represent Australia. I'm assuming you're talking about stuff in the paper like the Mark Knight depiction of Serena Williams? Stuff like that? Even though Mark Knight, without being American, couldn't have known that the image he produced was similar to racist cartoons from America in the mid-late 19th century. But once again I'm getting off point. One news paper, which only old people read these days regardless of whether it's digital or not, does not represent Australia. And if you think it does, you need to go and seek a medical professional, because that is insane.

I suggest you go and read the original post I was responding to, rather than reading my reply to them and then commenting/implying that I am racist, that I am using meaningless facts to be disingenuous, I have no idea about what I'm talking about and to prevent you from making mis-informed, moronic statements like a news paper that only old people read represents all of Australia/All of America is racist despite not really having another option (or not agreeing with the wall, not everyone who voted for Trump wanted the wall).

 

[SherbertLemon]

Western men are the most self loathing people on the planet.

 

[Ron The Bear]

He didn't say that, though. That was the quote created by News Ltd. press when they removed a part of what he said without indicating they'd done so.

Fair enough, I wasn't aware of that and retract the comment.

 

[Socrates2]

The reason I used that example (I think you're purposely ignoring my points now), is because I wanted to use an example of how time and place can be wrong and how that relates to Adam Goodes's at the same time period. It's why I also used the kids party analogy, as it best represents the situation at the time.

I find it funny how you mention the NBA, you do know that guys get booed all the time there right? Regardless of skin colour, for various reasons ranging from how they appear in commercials to, yes, the social issues that campaign for. Unlike Australia however, most people understand the booing and don't call every who does so racist. At least those outside of the reactionary media don't.

Finally we have the shittiest comment you have made yet. Majority of Australia is not racist. Who is blatantly racist in parliament? Pauline Hanson? Someone who wore a burka to parliament and brought a fake grenade to highlight the issues police were having at the time with Muslim women? Someone who came to parliament and said racism can be directed towards white people and then got called racist? Outside of that, we have people of other races and minority backgrounds in various governmental capacities. If Australia was so racist, they wouldn't be there.

Also it's really stupid to use parliament as an indicator as to how racist Australia is due to people who just vote for literally anyone on the ballot paper because they don't give a ****. It's a side effect of compulsory voting. One of these days we'll have a cartoon character in parliament because a whole bunch of people couldn't care less about who's up there.



1. Yes, that's part of the stats. Still doesn't change the fact that there are not police "slaying" black people, which is the point I was responding to. Talk about not reading...

Also those stats I mentioned are still relevant, as they reveal why black people are shot by police and why they make up majority of the prison population when they only make up around a fifth of the population. But sure, call the stats meaningless if you must. Given the other points you're bringing up further on, I don't have high hopes for you.

2. Segregation - fully abolished by the 1960's, almost 60 years ago. Greenwood (I'm assuming you're talking about the town or city where the racist graphiti was done on a mass scale), barely has 50,000 people. Not even 24,000 if you look at the other town. Some of the people who were caught making said graphiti said they did it for them memes.

Yes, I do have an idea of what I'm talking about, hence why I know that the KKK did not have a massive wide span of influence as the person I was replying to suggests, nor does the KKK have a great influence now as the person I was replying to tried to suggest as well. Read the post I was responding to, because most of the points you've brought up here you've addressed without reading what post I responded to.

But back to the main point on hand, trying to secure a country's borders does not equal racism. Not being a fan of people entering a country illegally is not racism. But here's the kicker right, you know Donald Trump isn't the first to come up with the idea of that wall right? Obama and the democratic party tried to get a fence/wall put up almost 8 years ago, before Trump even tried to go for president. But I just have no idea according to you, and America is just entirely racist because half the country had a choice between a guy who wanted to build a wall and a woman who wanted to go to war with Russia with nuclear missiles, so they decided to vote for the guy who wanted to build a wall because they didn't just want to vote for a woman because woman. Hillary was a terrible option, Trump was a terrible option but didn't want to do to war. All of America is not racist for voting for Trump. Additionally, it's worth mentioning that Hillary won the popular vote and a decent percentage of people still didn't vote. But America is still entirely racist for voting for Donald Trump and I still have "no actual idea" according to you.

3. Once again, much like what I said about the AFL, The Herald Sun does not represent Australia. I'm assuming you're talking about stuff in the paper like the Mark Knight depiction of Serena Williams? Stuff like that? Even though Mark Knight, without being American, couldn't have known that the image he produced was similar to racist cartoons from America in the mid-late 19th century. But once again I'm getting off point. One news paper, which only old people read these days regardless of whether it's digital or not, does not represent Australia. And if you think it does, you need to go and seek a medical professional, because that is insane.

I suggest you go and read the original post I was responding to, rather than reading my reply to them and then commenting/implying that I am racist, that I am using meaningless facts to be disingenuous, I have no idea about what I'm talking about and to prevent you from making mis-informed, moronic statements like a news paper that only old people read represents all of Australia/All of America is racist despite not really having another option (or not agreeing with the wall, not everyone who voted for Trump wanted the wall).

Your all over the shop.No need to write an essay every time.Re who is racist in Parliament, all the conservative parties are chasing the racist vote, see African Gangs and Sco Mo, Mathew Guy, Tony Abbott .In fact Scomo is going to base his whole campaign on 'border security'.Racism is locking up asian people for 6 years in a dirt covered camp not allowing medical treatment in Nauru. Sonia Kreuger and all those conservative types have a track record. The Herald Sun gives convicted racist Andrew Bolt a free page to be racist everday. Wake up and stop getting your ideas from the Murdoch press, he didn't care about Australia he's just trying to make money for himself.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

Lots of peopke like their Aboriginal countryfolk servile, happy go lucky, apolitical. Get one who isn't, they become boisterous.

Goodes a great player and a great man, fantastic role model in and outside his club. Not sure what he is doing these days, hope he is still vocal and politically engaged.

That's it. Basically the bigots saw him as an uppity fellow.

 

[StevoJenkins]

Your all over the shop.No need to write an essay every time.Re who is racist in Parliament, all the conservative parties are chasing the racist vote, see African Gangs and Sco Mo, Mathew Guy, Tony Abbott .In fact Scomo is going to base his whole campaign on 'border security'.Racism is locking up asian people for 6 years in a dirt covered camp not allowing medical treatment in Nauru. Sonia Kreuger and all those conservative types have a track record. The Herald Sun gives convicted racist Andrew Bolt a free page to be racist everday. Wake up and stop getting your ideas from the Murdoch press, he didn't care about Australia he's just trying to make money for himself.

Did you read the part of my first response where I said I don't consume mainstream media? I don't read The Herald Sun, I don't watch the TV news. I've literally told you how I get my news, but you've ignored that. Who's really all over the shop here?

The reason why I write these long posts is because the people I'm responding to (including you) make generalized statements that have nothing backing them up, or you cut and don't read large amounts of my posts anyway, which means I need to write a long post to inform you that you didn't read my post or I need to rehash what I've already said. When you bring up evidence or don't make generalized statements, this what a post looks like.

African gangs have been a problem, it's not something that's been made up. People have protested over this. I doubt Murdoch is willing to pay money to get the small protest that did happen happen. He's got Fox News propaganda to fund.

Tony Abbot wasn't racist, he just didn't like gay people, which is something else, but definitely something I criticize the Liberal party for.

Wanting to secure borders does not equal racism. There are plenty of people of various races that are let into the country legally through many different channels available to them. Over the history of Australia, we've let masses of other races and cultures into Australia.

If you still think that Australia is racist, why didn't we allow the white South Africans to migrate to Australia last year? Black South Africans in power over there have said they will take over the lands of whites forcefully if they need to, and they'll kill to get it done, yet we aren't letting those white South Africans into our country. If we really were racist, those white South Africans would be welcomed within a heartbeat.

If we are stopping most of the migration to Australia whether it's legal or illegal (because the white South Africans were identified as meeting the legal requirement for immigration), and we are sending the illegal migrants to Nauru, how is that racist? Is it a shitty thing to do? Sure. Is it racist? No. The example with white South Africans proves that.

I'm happy to support changes to Nauru, because it's a shithole. But it's not a part of any kind of racism. You do know there have been white people in Nauru right? People get sent to Nauru because Australia does not have the ability to send these people back to their home countries. I mean, we could send them back if we had the man power to do it all at once, but they'll probably die or get killed once they've returned. But once again, this is part of a different issue outside of racism. It's moreso to do with the problems of other countries that makes these illegal immigrants want to leave in the first place.

 

[NoobPie]

At no stage in his career was Goodes regarded as the best player in the league. When Ablett went down in 2014 Fyfe was the best until the end of 2015 when he had that leg fracture. Fully fit I'd still say Fyfe is the best player in the league (I'd personally take him over Dangerfield and Martin) but he has a habit getting suspended or getting injured. Goodes may end up more decorated and yes he was good for a long time, but i'd take peak Fyfe over Goodes every day of the week.

I'd debate that anyway but to the extent it's true I would say this says more about how we've arrived at a stage where the best player in the league is essentially the best conventional midfielder

Goodes won brownlows as a ruckmen and as a largely outside midfielder.

One of the most dominant players I've ever seen. Fyfe has had one year of dominance at this stage.

 

[Toump Ass]

One of the most dominant players I've ever seen.

This.

Over 370 games too, amazing career.

 

[arfadunger]

Goodes was a terrific footballer but played in a manner which opposition supporters loved to hate. Probably in the end the booing went over the top and it is a real shame that it clearly affected him so badly.

Everything I have read about Goodes from people who know him suggests that he is a very good man. Every time I have heard him speak suggests the same. While he does bring up issues that we sometimes feel uncomfortable with, it appears as though his intentions are always of reconciliation and inclusiveness. I hope that he is happy in his life.

 

[_Mike_]

If you want to discuss politics and racism, this isn’t the thread to use as a springboard for destroying one man’s legacy. Take it to the appropriate board.