Toast Adam Simpson

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dajesmac said:
Personally I find the “aiming for the chest” bit wholly unconvincing.
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So you are questioning Gaffs character? Just have a look at the way he plays the game and his clean record and I think you will find it difficult to support your point of view.
Glad your not the coach. Well done Simmo for coming down to console and support your player. Note "player" not the incident.
No one condones the injury that Brayshaw received but I for one fully accept that Gaffy did not intend to make forceful contact with the chin.
The attack on Gaffs character from feral opposition supporters is way over the top and should not be reinforced on our own board.
 
JackDoff said:
So you are questioning Gaffs character? Just have a look at the way he plays the game and his clean record and I think you will find it difficult to support your point of view.
Glad your not the coach. Well done Simmo for coming down to console and support your player. Note "player" not the incident.
No one condones the injury that Brayshaw received but I for one fully accept that Gaffy did not intend to make forceful contact with the chin.
The attack on Gaffs character from feral opposition supporters is way over the top and should not be reinforced on our own board.
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I don't think "not buying the chest hit argument" and "loving Gaff" are mutually exclusive. Can't we just accept the fact that he's historically been a very clean player who just, for whatever reason, snapped and threw a cheap shot?

dajesmac not digging the defence doesn't mean he's reinforcing hysteria as far as I can see.
 
I am 100% convinced Gaff didn’t try to punch him in the mouth but that’s not the topic of the thread.

I like the way Simpson speaks/cares about the players. It’s intensified over the years.

Not convinced he’s an outstanding strategic coach but he’s a good egg
 

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bombard said:
I don't think "not buying the chest hit argument" and "loving Gaff" are mutually exclusive. Can't we just accept the fact that he's historically been a very clean player who just, for whatever reason, snapped and threw a cheap shot?

dajesmac not digging the defence doesn't mean he's reinforcing hysteria as far as I can see.
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Deliberately clocking Brayshaw on the jaw when he has dropped about 12 inches from when Gaff threw the punch to when it landed requires prescience from Gaff. You can't throw a round arm swing with that force and alter the trajectory by that degree in that timeframe, let alone allowing for reaction time to Brayshaw's motion.
 
JackDoff said:
So you are questioning Gaffs character? Just have a look at the way he plays the game and his clean record and I think you will find it difficult to support your point of view.
Glad your not the coach. Well done Simmo for coming down to console and support your player. Note "player" not the incident.
No one condones the injury that Brayshaw received but I for one fully accept that Gaffy did not intend to make forceful contact with the chin.
The attack on Gaffs character from feral opposition supporters is way over the top and should not be reinforced on our own board.
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I definitely think Gaff's character has to be questioned based on this incident. A previously good record doesn't make someone immune to this kind of criticism. I love Gaffy and will continue to love him when he's back but if you believe he meant to do what he did - which I and many others do - then you cannot say his character cannot be questioned.

I liken the feeling to having a cousin you are fond of do something like this. You can condemn the act, believe he made a monumental * up but still love and support them. In a strange way that's how I feel toward players at my footy club.

As for Simpson, on the whole I think he did the right thing by supporting Gaff. It was his phrasing I questioned. I think he should have said something along the lines of "He feels horrible and this is wildly out of character for him" and left it there. Saying his character is unquestionable is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.
 
FKASC said:
I am 100% convinced Gaff didn’t try to punch him in the mouth but that’s not the topic of the thread.

I like the way Simpson speaks/cares about the players. It’s intensified over the years.

Not convinced he’s an outstanding strategic coach but he’s a good egg
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Strategy is just one component of coaching and if he gets us to the big dance or even better if we win, he will be hailed the GOAT. Given what we've been up against and where we shouldve finished.

I for one will be renting a popcorn machine and tuning into Walls comments on repeat.
 
dajesmac said:
I definitely think Gaff's character has to be questioned based on this incident. A previously good record doesn't make someone immune to this kind of criticism. I love Gaffy and will continue to love him when he's back but if you believe he meant to do what he did - which I and many others do - then you cannot say his character cannot be questioned.

I liken the feeling to having a cousin you are fond of do something like this. You can condemn the act, believe he made a monumental **** up but still love and support them. In a strange way that's how I feel toward players at my footy club.

As for Simpson, on the whole I think he did the right thing by supporting Gaff. It was his phrasing I questioned. I think he should have said something along the lines of "He feels horrible and this is wildly out of character for him" and left it there. Saying his character is unquestionable is a bit ridiculous in my opinion.
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I'm a bit confused by this line of thinking - so you're saying a player, who has never even been reported once in 171 games and 8 years of elite level Aussie rules, would just suddenly decide to hit an 18 year old in the face, with enough force to break their jaw, just because he's tagging him? What?

How exactly does one go from "play the ball 100% of the time" to "* this first year player who's tagging me, I'm gonna break his jaw"? I just don't see the logical connection. Surely it's more rational to assume it was a grave mistake?
 
CM9000 said:
I'm a bit confused by this line of thinking - so you're saying a player, who has never even been reported once in 171 games and 8 years of elite level Aussie rules, would just suddenly decide to hit an 18 year old in the face, with enough force to break their jaw, just because he's tagging him? What?

How exactly does one go from "play the ball 100% of the time" to "**** this first year player who's tagging me, I'm gonna break his jaw"? I just don't see the logical connection. Surely it's more rational to assume it was a grave mistake?
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How I get that it's confusing. But it's certainly possible that he just lost his temper. Looking at the footage, I can't accept the explanation he was going for the chest. To my eye, that's ridiculous. He doesn't even get close to his chest and the action is completely roundhouse.

I doubt it went as far as "I intend to break his jaw" but he was going for a smack in the face. As for exactly why he lost his temper, that's something we will never find out. I reckon accepting the chest explanation is exhibiting a bit of blind faith, because supporters don't want to accept that he just snapped. Good people are capable of doing stupid s**t.
 
dajesmac said:
How I get that it's confusing. But it's certainly possible that he just lost his temper. Looking at the footage, I can't accept the explanation he was going for the chest. To my eye, that's ridiculous. He doesn't even get close to his chest and the action is completely roundhouse.

I doubt it went as far as "I intend to break his jaw" but he was going for a smack in the face. As for exactly why he lost his temper, that's something we will never find out. I reckon accepting the chest explanation is exhibiting a bit of blind faith, because supporters don't want to accept that he just snapped. Good people are capable of doing stupid s**t.
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It’s not just blindly accepting it because we are supporters as many of the football community (who aren’t West Coast) supporters along with Andrew Brayshaw’s father accept it too.

And I just refuse to believe that Gaff is the kind of person to swing forcefully at a players jaw, then lie about it at a Tribunal. There is not one single shred of evidence to suggest he would.
 
dajesmac said:
How I get that it's confusing. But it's certainly possible that he just lost his temper. Looking at the footage, I can't accept the explanation he was going for the chest. To my eye, that's ridiculous. He doesn't even get close to his chest and the action is completely roundhouse.

I doubt it went as far as "I intend to break his jaw" but he was going for a smack in the face. As for exactly why he lost his temper, that's something we will never find out. I reckon accepting the chest explanation is exhibiting a bit of blind faith, because supporters don't want to accept that he just snapped. Good people are capable of doing stupid s**t.
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Why would he use enough force to break his jaw then? I can only assume that the amount of power needed to literally fracture someone's jaw and teeth would be quite excessive. Either he intentionally wanted to knock him out, or it was an accidental. Given Gaff's history and character, surely it's better to assume the latter rather then the former?
 
squashface said:
It’s not just blindly accepting it because we are supporters as many of the football community (who aren’t West Coast) supporters along with Andrew Brayshaw’s father accept it too.

And I just refuse to believe that Gaff is the kind of person to swing forcefully at a players jaw, then lie about it at a Tribunal. There is not one single shred of evidence to suggest he would.
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Sure. Other than the footage which shows no evidence that it was an accident. And there's plenty of motive to lie about it at the tribunal, namely rehabilitating his image.

CM9000 said:
Why would he use enough force to break his jaw then? I can only assume that the amount of power needed to literally fracture someone's jaw and teeth would be quite excessive. Either he intentionally wanted to knock him out, or it was an accidental. Given Gaff's history and character, surely it's better to assume the latter rather then the former?
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It's not exactly a rational decision exactly how much force you're able to put into a swing when you lose your temper like that. It's also more about where you hit someone than the actual force that decides the degree of damage. But in any case it's fair to say Gaff has a fair degree of strength being a professional athlete and probably didn't realise exactly how much damage he was capable of inflicting.
 

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dajesmac said:
Sure. Other than the footage which shows no evidence that it was an accident. And there's plenty of motive to lie about it at the tribunal, namely rehabilitating his image.



It's not exactly a rational decision exactly how much force you're able to put into a swing when you lose your temper like that. It's also more about where you hit someone than the actual force that decides the degree of damage. But in any case it's fair to say Gaff has a fair degree of strength being a professional athlete and probably didn't realise exactly how much damage he was capable of inflicting.
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You wouldn't say Gaff is exactly heavy set, but I digress. It just doesn't make any sense for Gaff to intentionally knock someone out when he's never even attempted it once. He's had the opportunity to lose his temper in 8 years and 171 games of AFL football, in numerous derbies and situations, and yet this is the event that set him off? A derby in which he's being tagged, when we're 50 something points up?

People don't just lash out for no reason. There's gotta be a buildup or turmoil that sets off a reaction like that. It has been mentioned on here by @pantskyle that Gaff might be having trouble with his girlfriend, but that's literally the only inkling we have. Relationship trouble - I doubt that would completely cloud his judgement, given the sort of person he is.

There's no constistency in the assumption he hit Brayshaw on purpose. Any action from a person is as much dependant on their character as the situation, and in this case, history goes against your view.
 
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Bit off topic but i'd seriously look at getting Mark Brayshaw to the club. I know he's AFLCA president and all that but IMO he's the sort of bloke you need at a footy club. He seems to understand people well and would make a great player welfare manager, tho i don't think he would come for that role. With 2 of his sons in WA and being a sandgroper, he's probably be a good chance to move over as well.
 
dajesmac said:
Sure. Other than the footage which shows no evidence that it was an accident. And there's plenty of motive to lie about it at the tribunal, namely rehabilitating his image.

It's not exactly a rational decision exactly how much force you're able to put into a swing when you lose your temper like that. It's also more about where you hit someone than the actual force that decides the degree of damage. But in any case it's fair to say Gaff has a fair degree of strength being a professional athlete and probably didn't realise exactly how much damage he was capable of inflicting.
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I don't understand your reasoning as to why Gaff would have deliberately aimed at Brayshaw's face. You seem to be suggesting that because his fist connected with the jaw area, it guarantees a deliberate attempt to inflict maximum damage to the face, and this is a wholly unconvincing argument., because the only support it has is an entirely unfounded belief that Gaff 'just snapped'.

Rather, it's much more likely (taking into account other, similar incidents that don't end this way, and Gaff's outstanding record) that this was a tactical action to move Brayshaw out of Gaff's running space - one that went completely wrong due to Gaff's sloppy technique and Brayshaw shaping into the arm. There was an element of Gaff wanting to impose himself on the younger player, which had in effect turned a 'open pushing motion' into more of a 'love-tap side-jab'. To see two players almost in 'fisticuffs' is pretty common in footy games, iirc Gaff frequently uses his arms to contest with defending mids and get around them. Don't forget both players were likely tired, having run hard at the start of the 3rd quarter.

For the record, I was very appreciative of 6 weeks, as regardless of area of contact, the action was unacceptable. I feel he's only received 8 due to the media frenzy, which had decided the outcome before the tribunal could even convene.
 
FKASC said:
I am 100% convinced Gaff didn’t try to punch him in the mouth but that’s not the topic of the thread.

I like the way Simpson speaks/cares about the players. It’s intensified over the years.

Not convinced he’s an outstanding strategic coach but he’s a good egg
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I think hes a fantastic egg and i hope he stays for many more years yet and we get a few flags with him too! Love him :kissingheart:
 
dajesmac said:
How I get that it's confusing. But it's certainly possible that he just lost his temper. Looking at the footage, I can't accept the explanation he was going for the chest. To my eye, that's ridiculous. He doesn't even get close to his chest and the action is completely roundhouse.

I doubt it went as far as "I intend to break his jaw" but he was going for a smack in the face. As for exactly why he lost his temper, that's something we will never find out. I reckon accepting the chest explanation is exhibiting a bit of blind faith, because supporters don't want to accept that he just snapped. Good people are capable of doing stupid s**t.
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I'm reluctant to further this debate in the thread that's meant to be about Simmo (I luv me a bit of Simmo!), but it seems entirely obvious to me that he was going for the chest. My first instinct suggested that was probably the intention, but did make a point of really questioning that stance given the media backlash and I think the video really confirms that.

Gaff and Brayshaw are both around the same height. Gaff's arm never goes higher than 90 degrees. His fist remains below the level of his shoulders. That's exactly the action you'd take if you're punching towards someone's chest. When you watch the video, the instinct is to watch the connection and because the punch hits him square in the head, it seems that was where the punch was directed. But look at Brayshaw's legs in the instant before the hit and see how bent they are. He's dropped significantly lower in his action to improve balance as he braces for bumping into Gaff to impede his path.
 
Ahem.

After serving my week long suspension in one of the most tumultuous weeks of our club (I went over to the dockers board and gave them what for to fly the flag for our club and gaff) I would like to say a few words about Simpson.

I would like to say I was wrong about Simpson.

This guy loves our club. He bleeds blue and gold through and through, loves the players and leads by example and character.
From his defence of gaff to sticking it to basil he has not only defended us but put forward the best of our club. Yes he accepted gaff was wrong doing what he did even though we all accept it wasn't intentional.
But he stood up and took ownership and turned our club around from what would have been an intense and emotional week to getting the boys up for a great win against the odds.

Yes he has his flaws and all coaches do but I can't think of another coach I'd prefer right now to Simpson leading this club.

Kudos to Simmo and our glorious club and supporters.

Well done everyone flying the flag for our club and good luck for the flag this year.
 
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