Adding Depth - Trade Possibilities

[Axcellence]

Just want to get the discussion on who we might trade off (?)

I am thinking:-

- R Clarke
- J Gwilt
- Sweeney (unlikely)
- Raymond
- Brooks
- Blake (unlikely)
- Ferguson
- McQualter

If we are serious about getting quality, we may have to sacrifise better known players.

 

[sauce_head]

Just want to get the discussion on who we might trade off (?)

I am thinking:-

- R Clarke
- J Gwilt
- Sweeney (unlikely)
- Raymond
- Brooks
- Blake (unlikely)
- Ferguson
- McQualter

If we are serious about getting quality, we may have to sacrifise better known players.

Fair enough. Probably not Brooks though in case he develops late. Who would take him anyway?

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

With respect, no club is going to be interested in those players. Most would not even be picked up for free in the PSD.

Players who other clubs want are where that club has a deficiency (eg ruckmen) and have an excess of players to trade (eg half back flankers).

The Saints need a ruckman such as Meesen or Maric from the crows or DeLuca from the power - and that will cost a second round draft pick beacuse I can't see any players that the saints would be prepared to release that those clubs want

 

[Kildonan]

Brooks is already a better full forward than most clubs have.
I don't understand why he hasn't been played - he must be a real dill at training or something because that is three coaching regimes now (if you count Port) who decided against playing him. All three head coaches know what they're on about - so it must be him.

I have long held the hope that he would turn out to be a valuable player - a replacement for Fraser Gehrig, when he retires, but maybe it is time to face reality.

The way I go about trying to determine who / what to target as a recruiter is to put on paper our best squad, then look at who / what positions we have players developing towards.

Then I work out what our deficiencies are.

We need to replace Max Hudghton - he is the general in our defence - when he is missing our defence is severely compromised. If and when he retires we need to be able to put together a solid defensive unit. We have never really got over the premature retirement of Penny, but Sam Fisher has been a godsend.

We also need to replace Fraser Gehrig - whether he retires or not in 2008, we need a ready made full forward to come in and take over from him when he does retire. Watts and Brooks were my thoughts, Kosi might also be a show.

We will probably again target a big-bodied ruckman. This is a frustration for me because the temptation then is to play like Sydney - i.e. knock it out of bounds any time you can't win the ball decisively, because your ruck will win it for you. This stop / start style of play is boring and frustrating for opponents and fans and I want no part of it.

More later...

 

[Axcellence]

I agree, most of these players except perhaps Watts, Brooks & R Clarke would not be a huge currency.

I was just thinking if we package them with a 2nd round pick, one or the other club might take the bite?

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

I agree, most of these players except perhaps Watts, Brooks & R Clarke would not be a huge currency.

I was just thinking if we package them with a 2nd round pick, one or the other club might take the bite?

more is better...????

Thats the worst bunch of players you can ever package up and want a trade for....


Together worth zilch!

 

[__Ron_]

It really dissapoints me how people rubbish Blake. At least he gives 110% unlike others who i could name. I hope he plays his days out in a saints jumper. Everyone else on that list should retire. We don't need to axe them, if those guys are honest with themselves, then they'll move on and get a real job instead of clogging up our list with their mediocrity.

 

[Fryman]

It really dissapoints me how people rubbish Blake. At least he gives 110% unlike others who i could name. I hope he plays his days out in a saints jumper. Everyone else on that list should retire. We don't need to axe them, if those guys are honest with themselves, then they'll move on and get a real job instead of clogging up our list with their mediocrity.

That's fine, lets fill our list with blokes who can't play but have a crack. Sure we'll be terrible but at least we can say they have a go.

That's the thing with Blake, the argument goes he can't kick, has poor decision making, too small to be a ruckman and has no real position on the ground. Then his defenders say "at least he has a go" - without addressing the glaring deficiencies in his game.

Anyway, I think we should look at trading Jason Gram. You have to give up quality to get quality. His stock is at it's highest and we could set ourselves with some good players for him. We have a lot of guys who can play as a rebounding back flanker and I don't think he would be as big a loss as many would think. Maybe throw his name out there and see who bites.

 

[Axcellence]

Jason Gram is too valuable to let go... I think Leigh Fisher would be the best we could let go off. Jason's good at one thing - delivering to the forward line from half back. Getting rid of him would be like robbing peter to get paul (.... remem Grant Thomas?)

 

[Fryman]

Jason Gram is too valuable to let go... I think Leigh Fisher would be the best we could let go off. Jason's good at one thing - delivering to the forward line from half back. Getting rid of him would be like robbing peter to get paul (.... remem Grant Thomas?)

That's the thing though, how many clubs are going to want Leigh Fisher. More to the point how many are going to give up something decent for him. I would say none.

If we believe we have the team to win the premiership next year, then by all means trade away the peripheral players and hope to top up with fringe players. But, I think we need to make some serious changes to the list to get us up there again. What if Brisbane offered Charman for Gram, would that not be worth considering.

I think all teams are too timid when trading. There is a real oppurtunity for a club that has some talent on it's list to be ultra-agrressive during trade time and significantly re-shape their team. We have lost better players than Gram and came back stronger every time (Plugger, Hall, Everitt).

 

[Persevering Saint]

This is ultimately my point from other posts. Lyon has shown he can take ordinary players and make them pretty good: Milne, Fiora and Blake (Get off his case, he's had a good year...) are good examples. What needs to happen now is stability, particularly for the playing group. Remember in the Richmond game when Lenny was under the pump in the center clearance, and then out of the corner of his eye he just instinctively handpassed to Harves, who flew down and passed straight down a forward's throat? THAT's what I'm talking about. Lenny just KNEW Harvey was going to be there, because they've been playing with each other for years. Now, imagine if the whole TEAM was like that? That will only happen if we don't trade much - even our weaker players. There is no point breaking the playing group letting go players that nobody else wants anyway. I do not want another situation like we had at the end of last year with Wool Shwartz (sp?) being dumped.

 

[ShadowFax]

Brooks is already a better full forward than most clubs have.
I don't understand why he hasn't been played - he must be a real dill at training or something because that is three coaching regimes now (if you count Port) who decided against playing him. All three head coaches know what they're on about - so it must be him.

I dont understand why people say "I dont know why Watts isn't playing full-fwd" or "i dont understand why Brooks isn't playing full-fwd" or Kosi for that matter! The reason why is...Fraser Gehrig has been our full-fwd. You cant play 3 or 4 full-fwds?

At the same time...Brooks along with a number of other "fringe players" such as Sweeney, Gwilt, Ferguson, etc have been somewhat starved of oppurtunities. Over the last few years instead of blooding these guys here and there we've stucked with older, veteran type players (think Peckett, Powell, McGough, etc)...now we're paying the price because now the club has to make tough decisions on players whom have hardly been given a chance at senior level!

We need to replace Max Hudghton - he is the general in our defence - when he is missing our defence is severely compromised. If and when he retires we need to be able to put together a solid defensive unit. We have never really got over the premature retirement of Penny, but Sam Fisher has been a godsend.

Totally agree. Max prolly has AT THE VERY MOST 2 years left in him. Thats IF (a big IF) we can get his soft-tissue problems right. So we really do need to draft a key position backman. Maguire is at his best at CHB. Sam Fisher is at his best as the 3rd key backman/running-HB.

We will probably again target a big-bodied ruckman. This is a frustration for me because the temptation then is to play like Sydney - i.e. knock it out of bounds any time you can't win the ball decisively, because your ruck will win it for you. This stop / start style of play is boring and frustrating for opponents and fans and I want no part of it.

I disagree. I dun think having good ruckman dictates how you will play. Look at the top teams. Nearly all of them have formidable ruck combinations or a gun ruckman. Port - Brogan, Lade; WCE - Cox, Seaby; Sydney - Jolly, Everitt; Kangaroos - McIntosh, Hale; Geelong - Ottens (underated as a tap ruckman), Blake/King.

Now...all of those teams dont play a sydney style. Secondly, the ruck is now almost the most important area of a team now. This is because if you have good tap ruckmen then you have a far great to execute clearances. And if you can execute clean clearances from congestion then you can beat flooding.

 

[pol06]

drafting is the answer not trading. the problem is we havent drafted well / our players haven't come on over the previous few years whether it be due to playing veterans over them or not. We need to draft for 3 years in advance and hope we can get players like montagna coming on after a few seasons.

as for that list none have an trade value so we are better to keep them and give them a go.

and to those foolish people who continue to say 'blake gives 110%' and 'he has had a good year' that is all well and good, but the guy isnt a good enough footballer to take stkilda to the next level. as a matter of fact he is a terrible footballer, just because he gives his all doesnt mean shit. if your not good enough your not good enough and he is not! so stop defending a player that does not have the ability to play

 

[Dorval6]

Some talk on the Dogs board about Kosi.

What would it take to get him over?

 

[Fehring]

Some talk on the Dogs board about Kosi.

What would it take to get him over?

Your six best players, your first four draft picks and 200k in cash.

 

[Pedro the Lion]

What if Brisbane offered Charman for Gram, would that not be worth considering.

hehe

 

[ChrisFooty]

I will be really dissapointed if we traded away our first round pick. Looking at those players the original thread starter listed, none of those players are any good. None of those players are going to attract any interest. If they do, it will be for picks 50+

R.Clarke really the only one who might have some currency, but this is based purely on potential. Mcqualter might attract interest based on this also (was a pick 15 or something)

 

[Butane]

Your six best players, your first four draft picks and 200k in cash.

Power, Wight, Gia, Eagleton, M.West and Walsh. We won't have our first 3 picks due to trading them for Ryan Murphy, and Fevola. So we can give you the other 4. picks 40, 56, 72 and 88 and the 200K Smorgan can fork out of his suit pocket. Done deal

haha. Nahh Kosi will re-sign with the saints soon enough.

 

[goodie23]

Your six best players, your first four draft picks and 200k in cash.

And Scott West's first born son

 

[Half Back Pocket]

The saints will go for Alex Rance with pick 1. He'll develop into a gun FB. 1 year to develop and he'll be ready for senior footy.

2nd round pick (pick 27 approx.) and a player (Leigh Fisher or Raph Clarke) should be offered to Bris. for Charman.

we should then use our remaining picks on some young, fast midfielders.

No point trading nothing for nothing. We've probably got the best out of Gram, Fiora, Birss etc. But we've also failed with McGough, Clarke, Gardiner (so far), Brooks. You don't find too many really good players coming through a trade.

 

[goodie23]

No point trading nothing for nothing. We've probably got the best out of Gram, Fiora, Birss etc. But we've also failed with McGough, Clarke, Gardiner (so far), Brooks. You don't find too many really good players coming through a trade.

Clarke and McGough were both draft picks

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Clarke and McGough were both draft picks

true...but still taking a risk on average recycled players

 

[goodie23]

true...but still taking a risk on average recycled players

Agree with you on McGough, but Clarke was taken out of necessity. Ackland's desertion left us even shorter in the ruck department, and we needed a quick fix. He was worth the risk, and didn't cost us anything

 

[Punter!]

The saints will go for Alex Rance with pick 1. He'll develop into a gun FB. 1 year to develop and he'll be ready for senior footy.

2nd round pick (pick 27 approx.) and a player (Leigh Fisher or Raph Clarke) should be offered to Bris. for Charman.

we should then use our remaining picks on some young, fast midfielders.

No point trading nothing for nothing. We've probably got the best out of Gram, Fiora, Birss etc. But we've also failed with McGough, Clarke, Gardiner (so far), Brooks. You don't find too many really good players coming through a trade.

Do you honestly think brisbane would give charman up for a 2nd round pick and a modest player?!

If we want charman we'd have to give up our 1st round pick. Plain and simple. Brisbane arn't dumb enough to settle for anything less.

Why not trade our 2nd round pick for cameron wood? He's their 3rd choice ruckman and entering his 3rd or 4th season. 204cm.

 

[Bourky23]

i'm keen on cam wood