Confirmed Adelaide, Fremantle & Melbourne trade mutiple picks

liz

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If by some strange circumstance you’d completely traded out your 2019 draft hand and the picks remaining for 2020 weren’t enough to cover the deficit then it would carry over to 2021 I guess. They definitely wouldn’t let it go free.
My understanding is that a club wouldn't be allowed to match a bid in that situation. I believe there is a maximum deficit a club can rack up, equal to the points value of the rounds 1-4 picks that the premier will get, adjusted for any future picks already traded out or in.
 

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FineWines11

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And Ballard a SA boy good friend with Luko. You won't even get Rozee if Fremantle don't swap pick with Port last year. What goes around come around.
What does this have to do with GC bending over to Freo for Weller? We gave up heaven and earth to get Rozee, Im glad we did, but it was a f**king lot man.
 

sherrif

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Not that messy

Fremantle gave 10 and 22
Received 8 and 49

Melbourne gave 8
Received 10 and 28

Adelaide gave 28 and 49
Received pick 22

futures swapped also but for this draft that is the trades

Wins all around I think
What if the three teams could do a double on the wins all round with Carlton also involved
If Adelaide is into Fisher McCasey as much as rumoured then what if Freo trade their future first to Carlton for pick 9. Giving us 7.8.9.
Freo then trade the Melbourne future second to Melbourne for pick 28
Adelaide then trade pick 6 to Melbourne for pick 10, the future Melbourne second .
Melbourne go to the draft and bid on Green is a surprise. If GWS match the bid they get Green and bank point so that would make sense with pick 4.
Melbourne then get Jackson pick 4.
Sydney then probably will take an inside mid so Melbourne can get the other player they rate in the top 3 in Young. If Sydney select Young then the Melbourne back-up plan would be good anyway as either Sanders or Serong could play as small forwards early in their career and fill a short term need, but then move midfield in a couple of years.

Adelaide can then guarantee themselves McCasey (provided melbourne guarantee they wont select him not sure if this is tampering) at pick ten and load up with points for the 2020 draft even more in a draft where points will have great value in moving up the draft. Great position to be in with GWS !st and Bullddogs second pick already picked up and still getting a player they rate highly this year. Pick 4 turns into a player they rate in the top 6 by reports and the GWS 1st and Melbourne second. Would be an amazng result.
Freo go ASh, Stephens, Roberton and Henry bid match. No caryover point needed to be paid for next draft in Henry bid as well with a bid requirement that wouldnt be earlier than 11 and perhaps a few later.
Carlton get a first round pick for 2020 which in my view would be a great call as it wold allow then to trade in an experienced player as they already have a heap of young talent next trade period. Could prime them for a top 6 finish in 2021.
Easy. Everyone wins.
 
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slowedawg

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What if the three teams could do a double on the wins all round with Carlton also involved
If Adelaide is into Fisher McCasey as much as rumoured then what if Freo trade their future first to Carlton for pick 9. Giving us 7.8.9.
Freo then trade the Melbourne future second to Melbourne for pick 28
Adelaide then trade pick 6 to Melbourne for pick 10, the future Melbourne second .
Melbourne go to the draft and bid on Green is a surprise. If GWS match the bid they get Green and bank point so that would make sense with pick 4.
Melbourne then get Jackson pick 4.
Sydney then probably will take an inside mid so Melbourne can get the other player they rate in the top 3 in Young. If Sydney select Young then the Melbourne back-up plan would be good anyway as either Sanders or Serong could play as small forwards early in their career and fill a short term need, but then move midfield in a couple of years.

Adelaide can then guarantee themselves McCasey (provided melbourne guarantee they wont select him not sure if this is tampering) at pick ten and load up with points for the 2020 draft even more in a draft where points will have great value in moving up the draft. Great position to be in with GWS pick already picked and still getting a player they rate highly this year.
Freo go ASh, Stephens, Roberton and Henry bid match. No carier over point needed to be paid for next draft in Henry bid as well.
Carlton get a first round pick for 2020 which in my view would be a great call as it wold allow then to trade in an experienced player as they already have a heap of young talent next trade period. Could prime them for a top 6 finish in 2021.
Easy. Everyone wins.
Firstly, yes, that is tampering regarding Melb/McAsey.

Carlton wouldn't trade out 9 for your future first as there's a few they fancy @ 9 and I imagine they don't think it's worth moving to your future first (they want serong), especially if there's some NGA/FS bids going on.

Melbourne won't take Freo's future second for 28 considering your future second is likely to be severely impacted by father-son and academy selections.

We can't trade a future second because we don't have a future first. So that Adelaide trade's out.

We won't bid on Green. We want Jackson it seems, which is why we haven't moved from 3.

Then everything from there is fantasy.

Realistically, at this point in time, I'd say Melbourne is done trading, and that Adelaide are going nowhere from 6 as they have two very valuable and interesting selections after this. No need to move as they've got scope in the draft to get what they want. Freo will probably say we're all done now unless they can find a way to ensure they don't go into deficit next year.
 

sherrif

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Firstly, yes, that is tampering regarding Melb/McAsey.

Carlton wouldn't trade out 9 for your future first as there's a few they fancy @ 9 and I imagine they don't think it's worth moving to your future first (they want serong), especially if there's some NGA/FS bids going on.

Melbourne won't take Freo's future second for 28 considering your future second is likely to be severely impacted by father-son and academy selections.

We can't trade a future second because we don't have a future first. So that Adelaide trade's out.

We won't bid on Green. We want Jackson it seems, which is why we haven't moved from 3.

Then everything from there is fantasy.

Realistically, at this point in time, I'd say Melbourne is done trading, and that Adelaide are going nowhere from 6 as they have two very valuable and interesting selections after this. No need to move as they've got scope in the draft to get what they want. Freo will probably say we're all done now unless they can find a way to ensure they don't go into deficit next year.
Melbourne benefit more than you are making out. Thats a deadset great deal for Melbouren overall and takes into account that freo put a first pick in to make the deal happen. You end up after the double trade getting pick 6 rather than 8 without adding anything extra to the deal. Even if you still went for Jackson. Its certain that two of Serong, Young, Ash or Sanders would still be available.Thats still a great option. Two amazing kicks or twp players who could start forward early in their careers and play mid later.

The second is for Adelaide to end up with so they can have three second rounders (they have two already) to match bids and gain a first rounder with two of them to a team requiring points like the Mcgovern trade last year. They could then use the remaining second as part of their bids and have three first rounders to use in the draft if the trade went through as well.The second would not be for Melbourne to use themselves

You would be wrong on the future second not ending up at Adelaide as well. You've already traded that exact pick in the Langdon trade so even if it went via Melbourne you could still do the trade. The afl wouldnt have let you do the North trade already of what you are saying was true. Teams can trade first and second rounders. You've already done it this offseason.

Id bet you anything all three teams would do that deal. Only sticking point would be Calton first for Freo first.
So actually everything I said could 100% happen.
 
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slowedawg

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Part of my deal was that there would be an implied agreement between the clubs of what would happen. Hence actually you would be talking more about pick 6 and pick 28 for pick 10 and a second rounder. Eg anyway actually Melbourne benefit more than you are making out. Thats a deadset great deal for Melbouren overall and takes into account that freo put a first pick in to make the deal happen. You end up after the double trade getting pick 6 rather than 8 without adding anything extra to the deal. Even if you still went for Jackson. Its certain that three of Serong, Young, Ash or Sanders would still be available.Thats still a great option. Two amazing kicks or twp players who could start forward early in their careers and play mid later.

Very shit anaylsis above to be honest as the second is for Adelaide to end up with so they can have three second rounders to match bids and gain a first rounder. Not for Melbourne to use. Yep Melbourne wouldnt think about the Green and Young double after saying they wanted both in the top 3.

You would be wrong on the future second ending up at Adelaide as well. You've already traded that exact pick in the Langdon trade so even if it went via Melbourne you could still do the trade.

Id bet you anything all three teams would do that deal. Only sticking point would be Calton first for Freo first.
So actually everything I said could 100% happen.
I'll laugh fairly hard at your assertion that it's shit analysis when you're actually breaking rules to attempt to get your trades done.

Melbourne can't trade out any future picks as we've traded out our future first. We don't even have our own future second anymore, fairly certain it's the Hawks one. You can't trade our future pick back to us, can you? I thought that stuff had been ruled out after the Sydney stuff last year.

I'd like to get Jackson/Young but I'm looking it from a realistic perspective of the clubs, not from a perspective of I want my club to win all trades.

Adelaide's list manager has said they want to increase their KPD/KPF stocks. If they move to 10, they might not be guaranteed McAsey. They won't want to move on their 22/23 picks as there's some quality there (eg Gould sliding) and you've said they load up on 2020 draft when, the position they're in, they actually have a few bites at some good talent to either address current needs or plan for the future.

Our list manager never, ever said they wanted Young & Green. They mentioned there is a range of players they're considering at that range, but never said they wanted both.

Clubs, obviously, at this point in time, would have a fair understanding of what the others will pick and know about that.

What you're suggesting looks like (based on me attempting to decipher your ideas)

Carl
Out- pick 9
in - freo future first

adelaide
in melb future 2nd (somehow from melbourne which isn't allowed to be done), pick 10
out 6

freo
in 9, 28
out - mel second, future first

mel
in - 6
out - 10, 28

And most of this banks on us bidding on Green. If Melbourne was keen to move down and believed Jackson would last, we'd have taken GWS's offer. We are highly unlikely to take a punt on Green based upon our decision to hold 3.

I get the idea behind it, Freo ends up with 789, Melbourne moves back up two picks from their original position but loses a second rounder, Adelaide get a second rounder and drop back to get a KP player who could be there, but it's not feasible based upon the rules, and to be honest, if I was a Blues fan, I'd say no. At pick 9, they're in this sweet spot where talent is available and they can basically pick whatever suits at that point in time. I'd love to get Young & Jackson, and your situation is relatively beneficial to most parties, but, in the current state of the rules, and also, based upon club chatter, it's not happening.
 

sherrif

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I'll laugh fairly hard at your assertion that it's shit analysis when you're actually breaking rules to attempt to get your trades done.

Melbourne can't trade out any future picks as we've traded out our future first. We don't even have our own future second anymore, fairly certain it's the Hawks one. You can't trade our future pick back to us, can you? I thought that stuff had been ruled out after the Sydney stuff last year.

I'd like to get Jackson/Young but I'm looking it from a realistic perspective of the clubs, not from a perspective of I want my club to win all trades.

Adelaide's list manager has said they want to increase their KPD/KPF stocks. If they move to 10, they might not be guaranteed McAsey. They won't want to move on their 22/23 picks as there's some quality there (eg Gould sliding) and you've said they load up on 2020 draft when, the position they're in, they actually have a few bites at some good talent to either address current needs or plan for the future.

Our list manager never, ever said they wanted Young & Green. They mentioned there is a range of players they're considering at that range, but never said they wanted both.

Clubs, obviously, at this point in time, would have a fair understanding of what the others will pick and know about that.

What you're suggesting looks like (based on me attempting to decipher your ideas)

Carl
Out- pick 9
in - freo future first

adelaide
in melb future 2nd (somehow from melbourne which isn't allowed to be done), pick 10
out 6

freo
in 9, 28
out - mel second, future first

mel
in - 6
out - 10, 28

And most of this banks on us bidding on Green. If Melbourne was keen to move down and believed Jackson would last, we'd have taken GWS's offer. We are highly unlikely to take a punt on Green based upon our decision to hold 3.

I get the idea behind it, Freo ends up with 789, Melbourne moves back up two picks from their original position but loses a second rounder, Adelaide get a second rounder and drop back to get a KP player who could be there, but it's not feasible based upon the rules, and to be honest, if I was a Blues fan, I'd say no. At pick 9, they're in this sweet spot where talent is available and they can basically pick whatever suits at that point in time. I'd love to get Young & Jackson, and your situation is relatively beneficial to most parties, but, in the current state of the rules, and also, based upon club chatter, it's not happening.
Try reading. We have your second from the Langdon trade. Thats the pick Im talking about. Its not hard and the second round former melbourne pick doesnt even have to go via Melbourne for the trade to work. The Dockers have their own 2nd rounder to use as well. So yes a second rounder could definitely be used to make the trade work.
One week ago they had pick 3 and 8. After the two trades you would now have 3 and 6. They havent given up a anything compared to a week ago for gain of two picks and thats the point. From the final trade they have gained 4 positions for a mid to latish second rounder (28) by the time pick is taken. Not two like you keep saying and thats way above market value for a pick likely to be 32 if you kept the pick.

Here is the trade without the melbourne second going via melbourne.
Freo get
Pick 9 from Carlton
Carlton get future freo first.

Three way trade
Adelaide get pick 10 from Melbourne and future second from freo in the langdon trade that used to be Melbourne's. Yes if that deal was done they would be guaranteed McCasey. Sydney want mids or running backs. In every Dockers draft preview they have said they only want running players and they would only have to say to Adelaide this trade means you get the player you want at a cheaper price. Ditto Melburne could say the same thing.
Melbourne get pick 6. Thats the point with freo getting 7,8,9
Freo get pick 28 from Melbourne as part of the three way. Not a straight swap of second rounder for 28, but also because they can guarantee that Carlton cant take McCasey if freo have that pick and that makes 6 for 10 possible as Adelaide wouldnt do that swap without Mccasey being a certainty. THe trade could happen after the Sydney pick in live trading too. That way everyone knows what they would get. Freo would have to do the Carlton trade before the draft though.
 
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Crow till I die

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Wonder if adelaide have positioned themselves for a dip into the back end of the 1st round if a player they want is there at say pick 18 or 19 they have say pick 22 + bulldogs 2020 2nd. Most teams will be after points and might take a drop of 3-4 places this year to get some good 2020 points. Maybe gives adelaide some wriggle room on the night
 

raffrox

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Wonder if adelaide have positioned themselves for a dip into the back end of the 1st round if a player they want is there at say pick 18 or 19 they have say pick 22 + bulldogs 2020 2nd. Most teams will be after points and might take a drop of 3-4 places this year to get some good 2020 points. Maybe gives adelaide some wriggle room on the night
I've got the feeling that there will be more teams wanting to get back into the late first round this year then wanting points next year.
 

Crow till I die

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I've got the feeling that there will be more teams wanting to get back into the late first round this year then wanting points next year.
Maybe so. I am thinking that some teams also might take a slight drop of 3 to 4 places if the can still see good value in the drop and gain good 2020 points. A bit like the crows last year with GWS where we dropped 6 or 7 spots in the 2nd round by swapping 2nd's with them but gaining the extra 2019 2nd. Gws got the player they wanted and the crows got a player they wanted and now have pick 23 this year
 

sherrif

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Wonder if adelaide have positioned themselves for a dip into the back end of the 1st round if a player they want is there at say pick 18 or 19 they have say pick 22 + bulldogs 2020 2nd. Most teams will be after points and might take a drop of 3-4 places this year to get some good 2020 points. Maybe gives adelaide some wriggle room on the night
Bulldogs have the highest currently rated academy prospect for 2020 draft from memory and no second rounder in the same draft. Pick 21 and Adelaide future second for pick 13? Will be pick 15 and pick 24 with a second rounder by the time the pick happens or pixk 21 and 22 for 13, but then the bulldogs trade one of the pick for a future second and fourth from another team.
 

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old55

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My understanding is that a club wouldn't be allowed to match a bid in that situation. I believe there is a maximum deficit a club can rack up, equal to the points value of the rounds 1-4 picks that the premier will get, adjusted for any future picks already traded out or in.
Biggest deficit you can carry over is the points value of the last pick in the 1st round, pick 18 = 985 points.
 

master bate

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Wonder if adelaide have positioned themselves for a dip into the back end of the 1st round if a player they want is there at say pick 18 or 19 they have say pick 22 + bulldogs 2020 2nd. Most teams will be after points and might take a drop of 3-4 places this year to get some good 2020 points. Maybe gives adelaide some wriggle room on the night
Freo, Coll, Hawthorn have all done deals to free up their future first round pick and I think the competition for picks 15-20 on the night will be incredibly fierce bidding, with teams wanting to take a player they like their rather than run the risk of next years compromised draft.

22 and a future 2nd might get you up to 19 but I'd imagine someone like Hawthorn might offer up their future first plus something to get up to that pick as well.

The Crows seem to be playing the long game, they could trade out of 22 for future picks if that's the case.

I can certainly see Richmond trading back, they have such a well positioned list now without any great needs, moving back and securing a nice first rounder for next year could well be worth it.
 

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