Adelaide Oval Review

Mattrox

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I'm amazed at the definitive statements on here about the finances of the SANFL and the AFL clubs over the stadium deal, when none of us know the figures.

The big stick in all this is the AFL, not the SANFL.
You need to start reading RussellEbertsHandball's thread. Read all the way through his opening posts ftom 2009.

He also has SANFL financials in some of hus recent posts. I know there is some bile and venom in the thread. But quite a lot of what he's posted backs up much of what has been stated here.

You are using the Essendon defence. "No one really knows, but its all good anyway!"
 

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marty36

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When a big 4 bank tells you to pack up your accounts and take your money elsewhere you pretty much know you are a financial basket case. Even knowing that the sale of land would net tens of millions, Westpac told the SANFL to **** off. Says a lot.

Absoukltely 100% correct, all banks (every Bank) do annual reviews on every client that has any large amount of debt and a large amount would probably be $100K. At which time they need to see that the current financials can service the clients debt levels, as Olsen said with the additional 16.25 million the Westpac saw that the debt level of the SANFL was too great for the SANFL to service and would have called in the debt. So the SANFL by supporting an AFL club has put themselves in a position which isnt envied. Yet no its all the SANFL's fault!
 

marty36

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You need to start reading RussellEbertsHandball's thread. Read all the way through his opening posts ftom 2009.

He also has SANFL financials in some of hus recent posts. I know there is some bile and venom in the thread. But quite a lot of what he's posted backs up much of what has been stated here.

You are using the Essendon defence. "No one really knows, but its all good anyway!"


MMM REH went and asked and they gave him the fianncials on the deal. Stuff the confidentiality agreemnt in place. REH financials are historical financials and even to his saying are too hard to get a difintive answer on because they will not breakdown expenses the notes are not provided.
 

Mattrox

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Absoukltely 100% correct, all banks (every Bank) do annual reviews on every client that has any large amount of debt and a large amount would probably be $100K. At which time they need to see that the current financials can service the clients debt levels, as Olsen said with the additional 16.25 million the Westpac saw that the debt level of the SANFL was too great for the SANFL to service and would have called in the debt. So the SANFL by supporting an AFL club has put themselves in a position which isnt envied. Yet no its all the SANFL's fault!
The SANFL got itself on the credit merry go round.

It was running an increasingly inefficient organisation that would gobble up every dollar it got. After 2007 when the Port crowds dropped it could not sustain ITS OWN spending. Port through the catering revenue was creating an income stream that the SANFL needed elsewhere. They couldn't afford their own competition and they couldn't afford for Power to die leaving only 11 games to generate the revenue the wanted.
 

aneale

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Absoukltely 100% correct, all banks (every Bank) do annual reviews on every client that has any large amount of debt and a large amount would probably be $100K. At which time they need to see that the current financials can service the clients debt levels, as Olsen said with the additional 16.25 million the Westpac saw that the debt level of the SANFL was too great for the SANFL to service and would have called in the debt. So the SANFL by supporting an AFL club has put themselves in a position which isnt envied. Yet no its all the SANFL's fault!
It's not, not their fault either. They have to put their hamds up as responsible for the plight they put the AFL clubs in, not to memtion the SANFL clubs, not to mention themselves. What they gave to Port is nowhere near their own level of debt.

The telling part of the Westpac issue is that they would have known that the SANFL were in the process of selling off west lakes and still didnt trust them enough to clear their debt and stay out of financial trouble obviously.
 

marty36

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It's not, not their fault either. They have to put their hamds up as responsible for the plight they put the AFL clubs in, not to memtion the SANFL clubs, not to mention themselves. What they gave to Port is nowhere near their own level of debt.

The telling part of the Westpac issue is that they would have known that the SANFL were in the process of selling off west lakes and still didnt trust them enough to clear their debt and stay out of financial trouble obviously.

Do you realise how much of an impact an additional 16.25 Million dollars would have on the ability to service your debts. I believe the 2013 fbalance sheet had debt of $39 million so almost 42% of the debt is related to this. Without this debt I think it is fair to say servicing the debt would not have been an issue, without even mentioning debt:equity ratio.
 
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Absoukltely 100% correct, all banks (every Bank) do annual reviews on every client that has any large amount of debt and a large amount would probably be $100K. At which time they need to see that the current financials can service the clients debt levels, as Olsen said with the additional 16.25 million the Westpac saw that the debt level of the SANFL was too great for the SANFL to service and would have called in the debt. So the SANFL by supporting an AFL club has put themselves in a position which isnt envied. Yet no its all the SANFL's fault!
I don't post much here, I prefer to lurk, but this has gone beyond ridiculous. See that bolded part? I am stupider for having read it. Explain the other $18M in debt, please.

SANFL had a prime asset for 20 years, and another for 15 years, leeched out of them both and never got their own house in order. If the SANFL could get its own spending under control, it wouldn't have a problem - but after 20 years of not saving for a rainy day and not imposing limits on the clubs to make its own competition self-sustainable, they're crying it's about the death of grassroots footy. Utter, utter, utter, utter bullshit.
 

marty36

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I don't post much here, I prefer to lurk, but this has gone beyond ridiculous. See that bolded part? I am stupider for having read it. Explain the other $18M in debt, please.

SANFL had a prime asset for 20 years, and another for 15 years, leeched out of them both and never got their own house in order. If the SANFL could get its own spending under control, it wouldn't have a problem - but after 20 years of not saving for a rainy day and not imposing limits on the clubs to make its own competition self-sustainable, they're crying it's about the death of grassroots footy. Utter, utter, utter, utter bullshit.
Good to see you step up to the plate then, instead of being afraid to comment, me I couldnt give a shit, if I believe that I want the SANFL to run SA footy I will say it.

The SANFL arent in a terrible position financially based on say the 2013 financials because that is the facts we have

1 They have a 39 Million debt (16.25 Million or 42% of it resulting in the power bail out)
2 They are guaranteed to receive $18 million on the licences that they bought and paid for
3 have an Asset worth $71 Million which they have sold
4 Will retain and assett of the stadium and some land that would have to be worth $20 Million at worst but will conceded Im guessing

So efefctively they are worth in excess of $60 million dollars, so are the SANFL poor at managing their finances?
 

Mattrox

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Good to see you step up to the plate then, instead of being afraid to comment, me I couldnt give a shit, if I believe that I want the SANFL to run SA footy I will say it.

The SANFL arent in a terrible position financially based on say the 2013 financials because that is the facts we have

1 They have a 39 Million debt (16.25 Million or 42% of it resulting in the power bail out)
2 They are guaranteed to receive $18 million on the licences that they bought and paid for
3 have an Asset worth $71 Million which they have sold
4 Will retain and assett of the stadium and some land that would have to be worth $20 Million at worst but will conceded Im guessing

So efefctively they are worth in excess of $60 million dollars, so are the SANFL poor at managing their finances?
You are leaving out the $18m SANFL club debt.
 
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Good to see you step up to the plate then, instead of being afraid to comment, me I couldnt give a shit, if I believe that I want the SANFL to run SA footy I will say it.

The SANFL arent in a terrible position financially based on say the 2013 financials because that is the facts we have

1 They have a 39 Million debt (16.25 Million or 42% of it resulting in the power bail out)
2 They are guaranteed to receive $18 million on the licences that they bought and paid for
3 have an Asset worth $71 Million which they have sold
4 Will retain and assett of the stadium and some land that would have to be worth $20 Million at worst but will conceded Im guessing

So efefctively they are worth in excess of $60 million dollars, so are the SANFL poor at managing their finances?
Ha ha ha. Are you the local knob?

Yes, they're in a great financial position. Except their bank told them to go away, and half the clubs that make up their competition are practically destitute.
 

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Cleric

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The SANFL got itself on the credit merry go round.

It was running an increasingly inefficient organisation that would gobble up every dollar it got. After 2007 when the Port crowds dropped it could not sustain ITS OWN spending. Port through the catering revenue was creating an income stream that the SANFL needed elsewhere. They couldn't afford their own competition and they couldn't afford for Power to die leaving only 11 games to generate the revenue the wanted.
So you are saying that the SANFL gave PAP 16 million dollars to keep them afloat so they could get a few hundred thousand a year from catering? Can we start been serious here? A few people on here are starting to sound like ignorant Poort supporters.
 

Mattrox

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So you are saying that the SANFL gave PAP 16 million dollars to keep them afloat so they could get a few hundred thousand a year from catering? Can we start been serious here? A few people on here are starting to sound like ignorant Poort supporters.
They needed Port to return to drawing good crowds.... ie Win games. You can't win games by being coached by skype because you can't afford it and have players without elite habits..... out at Red square late midweek drinking "mineral water". This all changed after the cash injections, they could afford to pay a decent head coach, fitness guru, and a proper assistant coach system etc.

Whilst Port didn't make a profit this year they drew 42k average which drew, using the sma's numbers $4.6m in catering revenue. Assume a 50% split with SACA thats a $2.3m return this year on the $16m spent. Not bad, 14% return on investment already.
 

marty36

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Ha ha ha. Are you the local knob?

Yes, they're in a great financial position. Except their bank told them to go away, and half the clubs that make up their competition are practically destitute.

Sorry Lurk (as you called yourself) resorting to name calling after sitting on the fence for years! LOL

You do realise the SANFL run a competition and Govern Football in this state.

Who would you recommend run it if they werent there?
 

Amacca 23

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so when are the sanfl and their clubs going to be held accountable for living outside their means when they where getting huge dividends from afc from 1991 is it adelaide fault they did that as well lol
 
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Sorry Lurk (as you called yourself) resorting to name calling after sitting on the fence for years! LOL

You do realise the SANFL run a competition and Govern Football in this state.

Who would you recommend run it if they werent there?
Call me afraid, I call you a knob. I'm not a fence sitter, I just don't see the point in for instance arguing with people who I'm pretty sure have velcro sneakers. Based on your writings in this thread, I don't think I'm far away from the target on that one.

I had no idea the SANFL ran football in this state. When did this happen?

If they weren't there, I would suggest a new board of control for football in SA be created under the Associations Act of 1985, but this time with a clear mandate to make it sustainable. You know, like the current ones should have been doing all along *cough massive unsustainable salary cap to attract ex-AFL players so we can cling to being the 2nd best comp in the country when we should be worried about being sustainable cough*.
 

Cleric

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They needed Port to return to drawing good crowds.... ie Win games. You can't win games by being coached by skype because you can't afford it and have players without elite habits..... out at Red square late midweek drinking "mineral water". This all changed after the cash injections, they could afford to pay a decent head coach, fitness guru, and a proper assistant coach system etc.

Whilst Port didn't make a profit this year they drew 42k average which drew, using the sma's numbers $4.6m in catering revenue. Assume a 50% split with SACA thats a $2.3m return this year on the $16m spent. Not bad, 14% return on investment already.
Revenue does not = profit. You have to buy those pies, pay someone to cook them and sell them, stock loss that wasnt sold etc. Up to now we dont know the profit numbers.
Lets not go off half cocked with incorrect numbers, leave that for the PAPers.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/revenue.asp
 

Amacca 23

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Revenue does not = profit. You have to buy those pies, pay someone to cook them and sell them, stock loss that wasnt sold etc. Up to now we dont know the profit numbers.
Lets not go off half cocked with incorrect numbers, leave that for the PAPers.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/revenue.asp
ill ask you again cleric when are the sanfl clubs going to be held accountable and the sanfl over spending the cash they were getting from the afc on a yearly basis ?
 

Mattrox

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Revenue does not = profit. You have to buy those pies, pay someone to cook them and sell them, stock loss that wasnt sold etc. Up to now we dont know the profit numbers.
Lets not go off half cocked with incorrect numbers, leave that for the PAPers.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/revenue.asp
The SMA revenue is usually stated as Net.

Even with costs removed, they still make out like bandits because the clubs are paying for many of the costs which generate the revenue.

As I have stated all along, we will see in Feb how much the SANFL actually recieved.
 

marty36

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Call me afraid, I call you a knob. I'm not a fence sitter, I just don't see the point in for instance arguing with people who I'm pretty sure have velcro sneakers. Based on your writings in this thread, I don't think I'm far away from the target on that one.

I had no idea the SANFL ran football in this state. When did this happen?

If they weren't there, I would suggest a new board of control for football in SA be created under the Associations Act of 1985, but this time with a clear mandate to make it sustainable. You know, like the current ones should have been doing all along *cough massive unsustainable salary cap to attract ex-AFL players so we can cling to being the 2nd best comp in the country when we should be worried about being sustainable cough*.

I really couldnt care a less if you call me a knob or not, but some advise you will get in the shit on BF for that stuff, only hear to help by the way!

As for SA footy the SANFL is the governing body of SA footy and responsible for Umpiring, Tribunals, Game development, Brand Development, Junior Development, Zoning of leagues and admisinistration of football in South Australia.

So who will appoint this board of control and who will fund it?

If you didnt know the SANFL isnt just about the SANFL comp, if they left the above alone and ran there little SANFL comp with the assets they have built up I think it would go on for a 100 years! But its about Football in this state!

Me and My Velcro sneakers geez!
 

Cleric

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The SMA revenue is usually stated as Net.

Even with costs removed, they still make out like bandits because the clubs are paying for many of the costs which generate the revenue.

As I have stated all along, we will see in Feb how much the SANFL actually recieved.
Exactly. We don't know exactly what is going on until the AG releases his report. Then we can judge the SANFL. We had a 3-4 million dollar uplift from AAMI this year, and we would have made a profit if it were not for paying out Sando etc. Footy clubs arnt ran to make profits but they shouldn't be making losses either. Poort losses are their own fault as they have a history of spending more money than they have and just expect someone else to pick up the tab. Not my problem.
 

Mattrox

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Exactly. We don't know exactly what is going on until the AG releases his report. Then we can judge the SANFL. We had a 3-4 million dollar uplift from AAMI this year, and we would have made a profit if it were not for paying out Sando etc. Footy clubs arnt ran to make profits but they shouldn't be making losses either. Poort losses are their own fault as they have a history of spending more money than they have and just expect someone else to pick up the tab. Not my problem.
Are you disputing there are big revenue streams for the SANFL being generated by Port Power via the catering?

The SANFL whinges about the $16m they borrowed to bail out Port. Which was given in the form of grants (ie no strings). But they ignore the fact that had not done so there was no way to generate this income.
 
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