Hot Topic Adrian Dodoro

(Log in to remove this ad.)

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
15,614
19,190
AFL Club
Essendon
And a 180cm McLean isn’t a midget getting loose ball gets? The way we played on Saturday night would’ve made anyone look good.

If your point is that we need another contested mid, then sure, I’ll agree with that. But the hyperbole is not needed, and undermines your point.

McLean plays with an intensity that maybe Smith gets to.

Reckon Yoda_ will back me on this.

It shouldn't come as a surprise that a specialist extractor is better at extracting than outside mids and converted flankers who are not strong and/or aggressive.

In any event it's a strawman to make reference to McLean's size. Nowhere have I said that small players cant win genuine contested ball. On balance they're less likely to be good. It's also about our players who suck when the inside contest is a physical one.
 
Last edited:

Bunk Moreland

Hall of Famer
Sep 22, 2011
30,956
59,759
Your girlfriend's dreams
AFL Club
Essendon
My largest gripe with our list management has been that we hold on to players for far too long.

Long and McNiece should have been delisted last year. Jackson Merrett and Morgan were offered too many contracts too.

If we don't think that we can draft someone who has more potential going forward it is damning IMO.
In general I agree but I think McNiece doesn’t really impact list numbers as he’s a Cat B.
 

eth-dog

Premium Gold
Jan 11, 2007
75,738
34,864
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
Yeah unless you had 3 players definitely going to be better than McNiece for the Cat B list last year it really is irrelevant. Plus Morgan only stayed on the list for 2 years.
 

MattyB3150

Senior List
May 19, 2014
179
124
AFL Club
Essendon
I feel like he has always focused on drafting players in areas that are easier to gap fill. How many mid sized defenders do we need? Our midfield has always lacked inside bulls. Jobe is the only good inside mid that we have had on our list since our glory days? I assume laverde langford begley were/are supposed to turn into those? I like our list and think its the best we have had in a long time but this is a position that hasn't been prioritised over the years... lets not think about Parker again :(
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

yaco55

Hall of Famer
Jul 25, 2007
35,722
12,165
hong kong
AFL Club
Essendon
Just out of curiosity, does a midfielder who struggles with injury play VFL in a role other than as a midfielder?

Worsfold has had no intention of playing Laverde as a midfielder.
It seems like you have a perfect structure for a footy team, but fail to match the characteristics of suitable players to fit that structure.Laverde lacks agility in confined spaces, struggles beneath his knees and has limited vision in congested situations - This is why he will never be an effective midfielder
 

The Donners

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 26, 2007
12,778
656
Victoria
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Aston Villa
It seems like you have a perfect structure for a footy team, but fail to match the characteristics of suitable players to fit that structure.Laverde lacks agility in confined spaces, struggles beneath his knees and has limited vision in congested situations - This is why he will never be an effective midfielder
Sounds exactly like Langford.
 

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
15,614
19,190
AFL Club
Essendon
It seems like you have a perfect structure for a footy team, but fail to match the characteristics of suitable players to fit that structure.Laverde lacks agility in confined spaces, struggles beneath his knees and has limited vision in congested situations - This is why he will never be an effective midfielder

You've said every player on an AFL list struggles below his knees at one point or another.
 

Seagrave_Holmes

Premiership Player
Jun 8, 2014
3,554
5,139
Rand McNally
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Australian Test Ball Tampering Team
My largest gripe with our list management has been that we hold on to players for far too long.

Long and McNiece should have been delisted last year. Jackson Merrett and Morgan were offered too many contracts too.

If we don't think that we can draft someone who has more potential going forward it is damning IMO.
Agree. Drafting and recruiting talent from other clubs has been fine but some of the contract extensions have been baffling.
 

JayJ20

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 28, 2016
9,858
13,614
AFL Club
Essendon
It seems like you have a perfect structure for a footy team, but fail to match the characteristics of suitable players to fit that structure.Laverde lacks agility in confined spaces, struggles beneath his knees and has limited vision in congested situations - This is why he will never be an effective midfielder
How do you know what we haven’t tried?

You’re describing Langford as a midfielder yet he plays there most of the time.
 

SherbertLemon

Premiership Player
Apr 7, 2013
3,921
5,340
AFL Club
Essendon
The issue isn't that McGrath is a bad player, or that he won't have a long and productive AFL career, it is that he wasn't the best fit.

We weren't desperate for a speedy undersized small defender / midfielder when we drafted McGrath. We were desperate for a big bodied midfielder (Taranto) and a goal kicking midfielder with impeccable skills (McCluggage).

McGrath wasn't clearly the best talent available, that had been McCluggage all year, and he clearly wasn't the best fit. In that regard, it was an odd pick.
Great post.
I think this sums it up imo.
Quagmire will be a great player, but he’s not what we were desperately calling for at the time.

Is it the worst pick in the world? No, but our list manager once again failed (imo...) to address our most pertinent needs
 

Yoda_

Brownlow Medallist
May 6, 2007
25,269
11,711
South East Suburbs
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspurs, Melbourne Vixen
McLean plays with an intensity that maybe Smith gets to.

Reckon Yoda_ will back me on this.

It shouldn't come as a surprise that a specialist extractor is better at extracting than outside mids and converted flankers who are not strong and/or aggressive.

In any event it's a strawman to make reference to McLean's size. Nowhere have I said that small players cant win genuine contested ball. On balance they're less likely to be good. It's also about our players who suck when the inside contest is a physical one.
I what now?


Of course an extractor is better than a flanker. Having watched Dyl Clarke for 5 weeks at AFL level, he has fast become our best contested ball winner/clearance gatherer. His numbers may not reach those of a Shiel or Merrett but he gets the ball and gives it to blokes in better positions than himself. Something we severely lack.

Our go to is grab the ball and give it to a runner coming from behind us, these inside extractors can make a decision and hit a target himself such is the worth of a Pangerfield, Treloar or Bontempelli. We don't, andh ave not had one of these for years.
 

BrunoV

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2009
15,614
19,190
AFL Club
Essendon
I what now?


Of course an extractor is better than a flanker. Having watched Dyl Clarke for 5 weeks at AFL level, he has fast become our best contested ball winner/clearance gatherer. His numbers may not reach those of a Shiel or Merrett but he gets the ball and gives it to blokes in better positions than himself. Something we severely lack.

Our go to is grab the ball and give it to a runner coming from behind us, these inside extractors can make a decision and hit a target himself such is the worth of a Pangerfield, Treloar or Bontempelli. We don't, andh ave not had one of these for years.

I'm having an argument with Lore who thinks it's just hyperbole when I say that Dyl Clarke would be the only inside mid we have that would be in the top 6 or 7 options the Dogs have (the last of which l'd say is Toby McLean who I think is a genuinely good ball winner even if used sparingly).

Looks like you're already there anyway.
 

Yoda_

Brownlow Medallist
May 6, 2007
25,269
11,711
South East Suburbs
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Tottenham Hotspurs, Melbourne Vixen
I'm having an argument with Lore who thinks it's just hyperbole when I say that Dyl Clarke would be the only inside mid we have that would be in the top 6 or 7 options the Dogs have (the last of which l'd say is Toby McLean who I think is a genuinely good ball winner even if used sparingly).

Looks like you're already there anyway.
People get sucked into pure stats, ala the contested possession count when assessing an inside midfielder. How many of those contested possessions were effective?
 

Bunk Moreland

Hall of Famer
Sep 22, 2011
30,956
59,759
Your girlfriend's dreams
AFL Club
Essendon
I what now?


Of course an extractor is better than a flanker. Having watched Dyl Clarke for 5 weeks at AFL level, he has fast become our best contested ball winner/clearance gatherer. His numbers may not reach those of a Shiel or Merrett but he gets the ball and gives it to blokes in better positions than himself. Something we severely lack.

Our go to is grab the ball and give it to a runner coming from behind us, these inside extractors can make a decision and hit a target himself such is the worth of a Pangerfield, Treloar or Bontempelli. We don't, andh ave not had one of these for years.
Remember when Dangerfield was being played on the HFF full time and Crows fans were screaming for him to be put in the middle 😁

Fans know best!
 

Top Bottom