Multiplat AFL Evolution 2

[dwwaino]

Firstly, we don't make AFL games and don't see WW as our competition, our bar is being set by 2K and EA, and has been for years.

The key question, as an AFL and gaming community, is not where the game is at, but more where it should be - they've had ten years and four goes at it, you don't need a review from me, the game speaks for itself - in volumes.

What would you have done differently? Not as in individual features as I don't own Evolution 2 and the last AFL game I bought was your AFL Live. One of the biggest criticisms I've seen on this board in my time here has gone back to your Live game that the games are too one on one and not truly representative of an actual game of footy. Evolution 2 seems to be the closest to date (though to be fair, as you said they've had four goes at it). AFL is a hectic and fluid game. If I had a blind stab at the logic of a soccer game I could probably create roles (positions) and assign those roles to zones on a field with some behaviours, and rules wouldn't be hard to create by setting invisible colliders around the boundaries and set one on the final defender that checks attacking players positions every frame and/or pass for example. Authentic AFL AI seems like it would be nuts - either rigid and robotic (which every game has been) or full flown machine learning and teach it how to play (well beyond the capability of this cert IV programmer lol). What sort of magic is up your sleeve that you could have implemented on Live 2 if you had a go on it back then?

We've only had a few trolls discuss nothing but graphics, but while on the topic, how worthwhile is resourcing your own engine when Unreal and even now Unity with its HDRP are so powerful out of the box? This seems to be the approach that WW have taken. I don't pretend to know the resources at your or WW's disposal but i've just been noticing a trend of even larger developers overseas move back to third party engines. So I'm just curious of the benefits of continuing to develop your own when I would hazard a guess that a lot of the features and work flow would be somewhat similar. Unless it's more to do with royalties then that's completely understandable.

 

[BlackMamba]

Hot Tip for Competition/Career Mode, go to ‘Competition Settings’ and change ‘Team Lineup’ to ‘Replace Injured and Suspended.
Means your lineup isn’t entirely changed over between games... and injured players get replaced, but with an automatic replacement back in the side when they’re good again.

 

[Quivorir]

This type of bump is ridiculous when I can't even do it in a marking contest without being done.




I also reckon the ball hones in on the goal post far too often for general play shots at goal.

 

[Dez!]

Ruck contests are broken in Be a Pro, the AI is just so stupid.

 

[Biggy_Boy]

Anyone else really cringing at BigAnt commenting on this game. Seems really off. Not comparing the two at all, but jesus that is unprofessional and cringe worthy.

What has he said about it though?

 

[Monfries7]

He was literally tagged and asked for his opinion.

After they had already commented in the thread. If their ‘competition’ is 2k and FIFA then god knows why they’re in this thread commenting on this game.

 

[wcesam]

He was literally tagged and asked for his opinion.

Yes. This means he must issue an official statement, because he was tagged.

Also didn't really do much except try and insult the game without actually saying anything specific...

 

[BigAntStudios]

We've only had a few trolls discuss nothing but graphics, but while on the topic, how worthwhile is resourcing your own engine when Unreal and even now Unity with its HDRP are so powerful out of the box? This seems to be the approach that WW have taken. I don't pretend to know the resources at your or WW's disposal but i've just been noticing a trend of even larger developers overseas move back to third party engines. So I'm just curious of the benefits of continuing to develop your own when I would hazard a guess that a lot of the features and work flow would be somewhat similar. Unless it's more to do with royalties then that's completely understandable.

Happy to answer general dev questions, actually trying to stay away from commenting on the game, as said, it speaks for itself.

We're always looking at alternatives, never complacent about where our engine is at relative to out-of-the-box solutions. We've released games using Unity for mobile (try AO Tennis for free on iOS/Android). There is definitely a fluid movement to and from third party engines, and certainly there are strengths and weaknesses for both the big players, Unity and Unreal, but neither are particularly "sports friendly" and can be extremely expensive, taking away from the actual budget of the game itself. I am sure PUBG regret it every day that they used Unreal.

Our artists would love to use Unreal or Unity, life is so much easier for them, but the coders, not so much. There is also the lack of control, if something goes wrong, we're a small developer making niche sports titles, our ability to get changes from the larger engine providers is suspect - imagine finding a game breaking bug, right before submission, and you can't get them to help in time, you would totally miss your date.

The most compelling thing is control, we are the only video games company in Australia that is a licensee, developer, publisher, distributor, and as we are fast learning outside of games, it is important to control the supply chain. It's only since we took this approach that we could make our dates.

All of that said, if I was starting today, or didn't have an Engine of my own, I would definitely go third party.

 

[wcesam]

What camera is everyone preferring? Can't decide which on suits the play the best.

 

[Dez!]

After they had already commented in the thread. If their ‘competition’ is 2k and FIFA then god knows why they’re in this thread commenting on this game.

Oh please answering questions that were asked, notice how until then there were no posts from him?

Yes. This means he must issue an official statement, because he was tagged.

Also didn't really do much except try and insult the game without actually saying anything specific...

Official statement? He answered a question.

He didn't insult the game, you interpreted it that way with your reactions.

 

[GoldbergsGold]

I feel like the only people comparing this one to AFL Live are the ones that overstate how good that game was. Absolutely no way in my mind that game is the benchmark for afl video games.

Wicked Witch admitted to trying to imitate Live 1 for Evolution 1, because it was the best AFL simulator for its day. It's no PES 2020, but for Big Ant's first try on footy, they made it more fluid than anything before or after it. The ball movement is more satisfying than all the other footy games, particularly the chain hand passing.

 

[Xtreme]

Ha. Just kicked to a player who I thought was making a lead. Turns out he was sprinting to the bench and had no intention of getting the ball and it goes right through him and his opponent and out for a throw in.

Just like Evolution 1, I've had a player "smother" the ball, only for it to deflect off the player just as powerful as a kick - airborn all the way over the boundary line. Again using an example, the passage of play happens around the 50m line, and it sails through the air all the way to the boundary. Pretty funny!

 

[GoldbergsGold]

Happy to answer general dev questions, actually trying to stay away from commenting on the game, as said, it speaks for itself.

We're always looking at alternatives, never complacent about where our engine is at relative to out-of-the-box solutions. We've released games using Unity for mobile (try AO Tennis for free on iOS/Android). There is definitely a fluid movement to and from third party engines, and certainly there are strengths and weaknesses for both the big players, Unity and Unreal, but neither are particularly "sports friendly" and can be extremely expensive, taking away from the actual budget of the game itself. I am sure PUBG regret it every day that they used Unreal.

Our artists would love to use Unreal or Unity, life is so much easier for them, but the coders, not so much. There is also the lack of control, if something goes wrong, we're a small developer making niche sports titles, our ability to get changes from the larger engine providers is suspect - imagine finding a game breaking bug, right before submission, and you can't get them to help in time, you would totally miss your date.

The most compelling thing is control, we are the only video games company in Australia that is a licensee, developer, publisher, distributor, and as we are fast learning outside of games, it is important to control the supply chain. It's only since we took this approach that we could make our dates.

All of that said, if I was starting today, or didn't have an Engine of my own, I would definitely go third party.

Maybe too personal, but what were Big Ant's plans for sequels? I recall an interview, you wanted 5 iterations that would focus on certain aspects. I really wanted to see a collision system, like in Lacrosse 18. Oh, and adjustable socks.

 

[NotAMagpieBogan]

Giving away frees for charging is becoming super frustrating, can’t use any body due to the risk of giving away a free half the time. That and giving away frees for throwing the ball, when you’ve kicked it 50 metres while being tackled.

 

[treefingers]

What camera is everyone preferring? Can't decide which on suits the play the best.

I'm using the side camera, mid range, zoom 30. It is a reasonable balance between being able to see the play & the ball at the same time.

 

[BigAntStudios]

Maybe too personal, but what were Big Ant's plans for sequels? I recall an interview, you wanted 5 iterations that would focus on certain aspects. I really wanted to see a collision system, like in Lacrosse 18. Oh, and adjustable socks.

The memories, Sock-gate

The stuff we have currently implemented into Lacrosse, Cricket, Tennis; stadium creators, equipment/logo creators, user import of face scans (PlayFace), enhanced career mode with coaches, press interviews, etc. For footy specifically, we spent a lot of time with Bucks when he was assistant coach at Collingwood under Malthouse, he was amazingly generous with his time, indeed Collingwood were the best team we dealt with - they were awesome. The AI in Live was going to be the base to further implement specific gameplans for each team, and each team at each ground specifically based on the opponent and shape of the field.. e.g. the difference between the stupid off-centre sausage shape that is Kardinia v the round short SCG, v the expanse of G.

 

[MadMundy]

Hahahaha I just played that Killer Creed dude from YouTube in an online game, the guy who does nothing but trash the game, and beat him with a goal after the siren. He was ahead the whole game too

 

[Gee Dub]

Has anybody else found that all of the games in Career mode seem to finish really close? Like when it gets to the last quarter whoever is losing seems to come flying home (either Ai or myself). I've played 10 games and the margins have been 6 point loss, 2 point win, 7 point loss, 1 point win, 50 point win, 63 point win, 3 point win, 3 point win, draw, 1 point win.

 

[wcesam]

Just played first online game. Game seems better suited to online, the human error aspect makes it seem a bit more realistic. Things like possession footy, silly turnovers, spare man in defence, were really on show. Was good

 

[GoldbergsGold]

The memories, Sock-gate

The stuff we have currently implemented into Lacrosse, Cricket, Tennis; stadium creators, equipment/logo creators, user import of face scans (PlayFace), enhanced career mode with coaches, press interviews, etc. For footy specifically, we spent a lot of time with Bucks when he was assistant coach at Collingwood under Malthouse, he was amazingly generous with his time, indeed Collingwood were the best team we dealt with - they were awesome. The AI in Live was going to be the base to further implement specific gameplans for each team, and each team at each ground specifically based on the opponent and shape of the field.. e.g. the difference between the stupid off-centre sausage shape that is Kardinia v the round short SCG, v the expanse of G.

Wow, that would have been insanely amazing. I see some people say you should just make an unlicensed football game like with Don Bradman Cricket. Maybe just license one player, Gary Ablett perhaps, lol? But I guess financially, that'd be way too risky. The AFL should have just done away with the budget sheets and just financed one.

 

[Dark Sharks]

Has anybody else found that all of the games in Career mode seem to finish really close? Like when it gets to the last quarter whoever is losing seems to come flying home (either Ai or myself). I've played 10 games and the margins have been 6 point loss, 2 point win, 7 point loss, 1 point win, 50 point win, 63 point win, 3 point win, 3 point win, draw, 1 point win.

Its called auto balancing, and it's actually infuriating AF.

I get they don't want players just annihilating their opponents, but I cringed every time I got 5 points up with 3 minutes to go because you just knew what was coming..

God mode free kick/mark/infringement and resulting miracle shot from 60m out on the boundary which goes straight through despite them missing shots all game.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

Happy to answer general dev questions, actually trying to stay away from commenting on the game, as said, it speaks for itself.

The general reaction to this game is pretty positive. Lots of us think it’s got the best football feel if any game so far (packs, switching, the spare man chess match, marking, not just 1 in 1s).

I’m sure your company would have punched out a better version in 2020, but what specifically do you not rate about evo 2?

 

[Dark Sharks]

Just played first online game. Game seems better suited to online, the human error aspect makes it seem a bit more realistic. Things like possession footy, silly turnovers, spare man in defence, were really on show. Was good

The lag kills it.

Pretty much unplayable for me, which sucks because lag free it would be amazing.

 

[shev76]

There's so many glitches, bugs and random s**t happening in be a pro mode I feel like my PS4 now has cancer

Haha im playing for Eastern Ranges and have been picked in both Vic country and Vic Metro squads. Played 2 games on the same matchday as well

 

[Old M8]

Controls are frustrating.

Pressing Y to mark, tackle & dump kick is silly. It can be very difficult to tell who has the ball sometimes, so I’m trying to tackle and I dump kick. I try to mark, and I dump kick.

It’d fine if I could change control layouts, but you are forced to cop the default layout.