AFL overtaking NRL in QLD

[strand_victor]

AH Queensland, sunny one day and cyclonic the next.
Total misrepresentation. Should be WA or SA.

Should be Norwood they have the Supporter Base and the Ground.

 

[Macca180]

Should be Norwood they have the Supporter Base and the Ground.

That was a huge mistake, oversight and destroyed at the start.
Should of been Norwood and Port from the beginning. AND then a third composite team. In that order.

If they did it like that from the start, we would have 3 healthy SA teams right now.

Norwood and Port were powerhouses with huge support and an incredible rivalry. The introduction of the Camries diluted that in every sense.
Had to be dome from the start for it be great. Huge opportunity lost. Ship sailed now. DUMB.

 

[Cmarsh]

That was a huge mistake, oversight and destroyed at the start.
Should of been Norwood and Port from the beginning. AND then a third composite team. In that order.

If they did it like that from the start, we would have 3 healthy SA teams right now.

Norwood and Port were powerhouses with huge support and an incredible rivalry. The introduction of the Camries diluted that in every sense.
Had to be dome from the start for it be great. Huge opportunity lost. Ship sailed now. DUMB.

Dunno. Crows have a pretty big supporter base don't they? Surely bigger than a Norwood side would have been.

 

[The Educator]

Dunno. Crows have a pretty big supporter base don't they? Surely bigger than a Norwood side would have been.

Yep, much much bigger. And there is no way SA has the economic base for 3 teams

A third team would make SA lower than Victoria for GSP per club......



Port have had a tough time of it and were easily the biggest club historically in the SANFL and have a smaller footprint outside of SA than North do outside of Victoria.

 

[Macca180]

Dunno. Crows have a pretty big supporter base don't they? Surely bigger than a Norwood side would have been.

No yes for sure. But back in the day Norwood and Port had huge ones. Which would of only gotten bigger.

Yep, much much bigger. And there is no way SA has the economic base for 3 teams

A third team would make SA lower than Victoria for GSP per club......

yep that's my point exactly. Agree, 3 teams won't work now.

BUT if it was done Norwood and Port first and the Camries third (later) I believe it would of worked.
And the result would of been all 3 clubs thriving now in the AFL
It's long gone now- 3 teams in Adelaide won't work now. The order was ****ed up. Huge oversight.

Think only people that experienced the SANFL in the 80's understand how big those two clubs were-supporters, financially and the insane rivalry. Different level of rivalry compared with Camries and Port now, two established real clubs with a long history and entrenched rivalry.

Put them both in the AFL first with the composite invented club later and IMO SA has three thriving AFL clubs now.

Not happening now. Opportunity lost. Done. Shame.

 

[Rabman]

No yes for sure. But back in the day Norwood and Port had huge ones. Which would of only gotten bigger.



yep that's my point exactly. Agree, 3 teams won't work now.

BUT if it was done Norwood and Port first and the Camries third (later) I believe it would of worked.
And the result would of been all 3 clubs thriving now in the AFL
It's long gone now- 3 teams in Adelaide won't work now. The order was ****ed up. Huge oversight.

Think only people that experienced the SANFL in the 80's understand how big those two clubs were-supporters, financially and the insane rivalry. Different level of rivalry compared with Camries and Port now, two established real clubs with a long history and entrenched rivalry.

Put them both in the AFL first with the composite invented club later and IMO SA has three thriving AFL clubs now.

Not happening now. Opportunity lost. Done. Shame.

That's the fault on the SANFL clubs. They were more interested in stopping Port and ended up cutting their own nose off the spite their own face.

 

[Canberra Pear]

No yes for sure. But back in the day Norwood and Port had huge ones. Which would of only gotten bigger.



yep that's my point exactly. Agree, 3 teams won't work now.

BUT if it was done Norwood and Port first and the Camries third (later) I believe it would of worked.
And the result would of been all 3 clubs thriving now in the AFL
It's long gone now- 3 teams in Adelaide won't work now. The order was ****ed up. Huge oversight.

Think only people that experienced the SANFL in the 80's understand how big those two clubs were-supporters, financially and the insane rivalry. Different level of rivalry compared with Camries and Port now, two established real clubs with a long history and entrenched rivalry.

Put them both in the AFL first with the composite invented club later and IMO SA has three thriving AFL clubs now.

Not happening now. Opportunity lost. Done. Shame.

Agreed on this. Just like we wouldn't be putting a 10th team in Victoria if they weren't already historically there (or 8th and 9th for that matter).

Adelaide has also shrunk proportionately to the rest of Australia. Made up about 6.4% of Australia in 1990, now it makes up about 5.2%. And that was back when the AFL market was essentially just the southern states with two outposts.

The time for a third Adelaide team has passed.

 

[RedV3x]

A third team would make SA lower than Victoria for GSP per club

Forget GSP, Queensland has overtaken S.A. and N.S.W. in football participation.
i'm not sure about draft picks, but wouldn't be surprised at that result.

Port have had a tough time of it and were easily the biggest club historically in the SANFL

Yes, Port easy to establish but to overcome existing rivalries.
Fremantle was a combination of WAFL clubs so has worked better.

and have a smaller footprint outside of SA than North do outside of Victoria.

Poor choice and probably not even relevent..
I'm sure North have a very good following outside of Victoria because of playing W.A. players. being a non-big4 premier and from moving all about.
Eagles had an interstate footprint because they were considered a state team and picked up W.A.expats.
Fremantle had nothing in the beginning.
Giants have a footprint in Perth - I don't know if anywhere else.

 

[paullions]

North Queensland cities push for their own new Olympic stadiums

Townsville and Cairns have made their pitch for new and improved venues for one of the most decentralised Olympic and Paralympic Games in history.

www.brisbanetimes.com.au

If Cairns get this it's the 20th team.

 

[Canberra Pear]

North Queensland cities push for their own new Olympic stadiums

Townsville and Cairns have made their pitch for new and improved venues for one of the most decentralised Olympic and Paralympic Games in history.

www.brisbanetimes.com.au

If Cairns get this it's the 20th team.

Hope the stadium gets up.

But the stadium is probably on the lower end of issues for a Cairns team.

Would be good for a few games a year though.

 

[RedV3x]

Hope the stadium gets up.
But the stadium is probably on the lower end of issues for a Cairns team.
Would be good for a few games a year though.

They haven't even decided on a decent stadium for Brisbane yet and now they want a taj Mahal for every tinpot poor excuse for a city.

 

[Aussie in exile]

They haven't even decided on a decent stadium for Brisbane yet and now they want a taj Mahal for every tinpot poor excuse for a city.

Also you have to ask the Questions about the climate up there. Playing games there in March or April would be a non starter.

 

[Walshawk]

North Queensland cities push for their own new Olympic stadiums

Townsville and Cairns have made their pitch for new and improved venues for one of the most decentralised Olympic and Paralympic Games in history.

www.brisbanetimes.com.au

If Cairns get this it's the 20th team.

1. There is little chance of the government funding these upgrades of a privately owned stadium.
2. Putting a team in a small, isolated, pro-NRL city would be utter madness.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

No yes for sure. But back in the day Norwood and Port had huge ones. Which would of only gotten bigger.



yep that's my point exactly. Agree, 3 teams won't work now.

BUT if it was done Norwood and Port first and the Camries third (later) I believe it would of worked.
And the result would of been all 3 clubs thriving now in the AFL
It's long gone now- 3 teams in Adelaide won't work now. The order was ****ed up. Huge oversight.

Think only people that experienced the SANFL in the 80's understand how big those two clubs were-supporters, financially and the insane rivalry. Different level of rivalry compared with Camries and Port now, two established real clubs with a long history and entrenched rivalry.

Put them both in the AFL first with the composite invented club later and IMO SA has three thriving AFL clubs now.

Not happening now. Opportunity lost. Done. Shame.

But characterising it in the past as an "opportunity" just seems like lacking the relevant understanding and context.

At no stage did all vested parties such as clubs, leagues etc. sit together at the table and said "what's the most effective and balanced way that we can eventually become a national competition, balancing out everyone's interests and creating the most prosperous and fair competition for the future".

No, the VFL was a body that represented its existing clubs and ultimately expanded but on the VFL's terms. The VFL cum AFL was using other stats to sure up its financial position and the path to it becoming the main national competiton which governed the sport nation wide was a process that begun and ended well before and after the SANFL teams.

 

[Macca180]

But characterising it in the past as an "opportunity" just seems like lacking the relevant understanding and context.

At no stage did all vested parties such as clubs, leagues etc. sit together at the table and said "what's the most effective and balanced way that we can eventually become a national competition, balancing out everyone's interests and creating the most prosperous and fair competition for the future".

No, the VFL was a body that represented its existing clubs and ultimately expanded but on the VFL's terms. The VFL cum AFL was using other stats to sure up its financial position and the path to it becoming the main national competiton which governed the sport nation wide was a process that begun and ended well before and after the SANFL teams.

Right. It's a lot more intricate and complex than it seems.

 

[Black Haze]

Does anyone think the new stadium in Brisbane could lead to AFL overtaking NRL and becoming the number one code in Queensland?

 

[Walshawk]

Does anyone think the new stadium in Brisbane could lead to AFL overtaking NRL and becoming the number one code in Queensland?

No. In terms of general interest in the community, evidenced by TV ratings, media space, etc, NRL is miles ahead. Rl is ingrained in Queensland the same way footy is in the AFL states.

 

[RedV3x]

Does anyone think the new stadium in Brisbane could lead to AFL overtaking NRL and becoming the number one code in Queensland?

Not by itself, but with continued good on-field performance by Queensland sides eventually it will happen.

 

[Aussie in exile]

Does anyone think the new stadium in Brisbane could lead to AFL overtaking NRL and becoming the number one code in Queensland?

The NRL will have 5 clubs in Queensland by 2032.
It would be a mammoth task to overtake them, and IF PNG goes belly up i would expect them to put a team in Cairns making 6 as climate wise it will have less affect on playing Rugby League there than ARF.

 

[Bjo187]

Does anyone think the new stadium in Brisbane could lead to AFL overtaking NRL and becoming the number one code in Queensland?

You'll get a few bites in here with this post, well played .

 

[The Educator]

No. In terms of general interest in the community, evidenced by TV ratings, media space, etc, NRL is miles ahead. Rl is ingrained in Queensland the same way footy is in the AFL states.

It clearly isn't to the same degree by every objective assessment of this.

 

[Black Haze]

No. In terms of general interest in the community, evidenced by TV ratings, media space, etc, NRL is miles ahead. Rl is ingrained in Queensland the same way footy is in the AFL states.

There was an article in the paper last year asking if the AFL will overtake the NRL in Queensland, from memory it was in the Courier Mail and the majority of readers answered with yes.

It was only a decade ago when people were saying Brisbane and Gold Coast should merge because Queensland can't support two teams, it's amazing how much things have changed even with Gold Coast still yet to qualify for a finals series.

Not by itself, but with continued good on-field performance by Queensland sides eventually it will happen.

If/when the AFL becomes the number one code in Queensland, do you think it'll go on to become the number one code in New South Wales? Rugby Union is going the way of the dodo so it'll likely see a snowball effect where we see Rugby League decline and eventually go the way of the dodo as well.

 

[Walshawk]

It clearly isn't to the same degree by every objective assessment of this.

Not sure what you are saying? That each objective assessment gives a different result?
Walk the streets, go into almost any pub on a weekend and it is clear how far in front NRL is. Tv ratings icon firm that.
Go do a survey of random Queenslanders. What percentage do you reckon would say they prefer rugby league?
I work for a Queensland based company, and from that any my travels there, it would still be 80/20 in favour of NRL overall across the whole state.
I reckon
Brisbane 80/20
GC 55/45
Townsville/Mackay/Rockhampton 90/10
Cairns 80/20
Port Douglas is about 50/50. Possibly even pro AFL. Full of Victorians.

 

[The Educator]

Not sure what you are saying? That each objective assessment gives a different result?
Walk the streets, go into almost any pub on a weekend and it is clear how far in front NRL is.

By objective, I mean referencing a quantitative measure.

"Walk through the streets" is very much a subjective assessment...

Tv ratings icon firm that.

TV ratings confirm that rugby league in Brisbane / QLD is not as dominant "the same way footy is in the AFL states"

Go do a survey of random Queenslanders. What percentage do you reckon would say they prefer rugby league?
I work for a Queensland based company, and from that any my travels there, it would still be 80/20 in favour of NRL overall across the whole state.
I reckon
Brisbane 80/20
GC 55/45
Townsville/Mackay/Rockhampton 90/10
Cairns 80/20
Port Douglas is about 50/50. Possibly even pro AFL. Full of Victorians.

Well, there has been surveys done. There was the results of one published in that Hunter Fujak code wars book (survey from 2017 so at the tale end of the Lions decade in the wilderness).

In Brisbane at least, the cultural dominance of rugby league is nowhere near that of Australian football in the AFL states....(note that Adelaide and Tasmania are very similar to Melbourne so just included Perth as where Aus football is least culturally dominant by this survey)



So Rugby league is not as popular in Brisbane than AF is in the traditional football states and Australian football is alot more popular in Brisbane than rugby league is in the AFL states.

14 % of people in brisbane say they like League and no other code and 6% say they like AF and no other code in Brisbane

In Perth and Melbourne only 1% like League and no other code compared to 28 and 34 % for AF respectively

Obviously we can look at participation, match attendance / membership......these will all point to the same conclusion

 

[The Educator]

There was an article in the paper last year asking if the AFL will overtake the NRL in Queensland, from memory it was in the Courier Mail and the majority of readers answered with yes.

It was only a decade ago when people were saying Brisbane and Gold Coast should merge because Queensland can't support two teams, it's amazing how much things have changed even with Gold Coast still yet to qualify for a finals series.

If/when the AFL becomes the number one code in Queensland, do you think it'll go on to become the number one code in New South Wales? Rugby Union is going the way of the dodo so it'll likely see a snowball effect where we see Rugby League decline and eventually go the way of the dodo as well.

Rugby League has definitely "rallied" in the last decade in NSW and QLD but there is definitely no guarantee it is sustainable..

...if the AF was to overtake rugby league in QLD (let alone NSW) rugby league decline would need to meet it part way I.e I can't see AF getting near the current popularity on the NRL in those states, but can see rugby league falling away sufficiently over the coming decades for AF growth the result in matching it at least in SEQ

IT could be within the decade that AF is more popular than Rugby league in inner (east, west, north) sydney and the gold coast for instance.

The problem is that there is less aggregated city media now....but, paradoxically, this given the appearance of increasing dominance in the short term as it is the older more culturally rusted on that still buy the local rags and watch commercial news.

Rugby league's problem is when this further dissipates as it doesn't have the critical mass of other traditionally dominant football codes in its heartland.