Coach Alastair Clarkson IV - HFC Racism Investigation Discussion

[the big lebowski]

Adds another dimension to the whole story.

It would seem unlikely to me that hawthorn isn’t letting him speak

 

[nj23]

It would seem unlikely to me that hawthorn isn’t letting him speak

How did Jackson end up getting the report in the first place?

 

[dus]

Case dismissed.

Your honour.

 

[Merlin007]

Hawthorn racism report: Author Phil Egan unlikely to be part of AFL’s independent investigation​

The author of the sensational Hawthorn report into past racism is unlikely to be part of AFL’s independent investigation.

Jon Ralph

January 31, 2023 - 7:45PM
News Corp Australia Sports Newsroom




The author of the sensational Hawthorn report into past racism at the club is unlikely to appear as part of the AFL’s independent investigation due to a non-disclosure agreement with the Hawks.

Former AFL footballer Phil Egan signed a non-disclosure agreement with Hawthorn as part of his authorship of the report, which saw him interviewing First Nations families who revealed a series of sensational allegations against Hawthorn staffers.

His adviser Peter Jess said on Tuesday Egan believes he has been silenced given the potential legal issues if he appears.

Hawthorn has made clear he cannot pass on any of the information from within those interviews given the families signed non-disclosure agreements as part of what was initially a welfare check into Indigenous families.

They have told Egan they are happy for him to appear at the inquiry to answer questions about the report’s formation and process of interviewing players and families.

Given the strict parameters of his potential appearance and potential for legal action he is unlikely to appear.

The AFL had hoped the investigation led by Bernard Quinn KC might be wrapped up by Christmas but it now seems likely to drag on well into the year.
Hawthorn’s legal advice is that it can not allow Egan to disclose information from interviews which were given with strict privacy accompanied by non-disclosure agreements.

Most of the families who made allegations are being interviewed by the independent panel, so their allegations will be passed on.
But the partner of one of the Hawthorn players at the heart of the allegations, Amy*, said in November she would not speak to the AFL about the investigation.

It was Amy* (not her real name) who alleges people at Hawthorn urged her partner to leave her and tell her to have an abortion.
Egan’s lawyers had asked the AFL to indemnify him against any potential charges —protecting him from any legal liability — but the league has declined.
Given the vast potential for legal action from both sides of the issue the league was never likely to be in a position to indemnify Egan.

But given some of the First Nations families involved have refused to speak to the investigators Egan’s testimony would have been critical.

AFL chief executive Gillon McLachlan has agreed to remain at the helm of the AFL until April to land the results of the inquiry but it is not clear when it will be completed.

McLachlan said on Tuesday he hoped it might be returned in the next month, saying “I think obviously time is important and hopefully we get something back in February” but that seems an optimistic prediction.

Gillon McLachlan hopes it will be returned in the next month. Picture: Martin Keep/AFL Photos/AFL Photos via Getty Images

Egan’s adviser Peter Jess told the Herald Sun on Tuesday it seemed unlikely Egan would be part of the league’s independent inquiry.

“As it stands Phil and his company Binmada have signed a non-disclosure agreement with Hawthorn not to talk about or discuss in any way, shape or form the contents of the report.

“It is still in place and for him to talk to the AFL he must be released from that. He has also asked if the AFL would indemnify him from any costs that flow from him talking about his report and the AFL have refused,” he said.

“It is clear the report will be fatally flawed without him. It requires the person who is the producer to be part of the report to be part of this. Not to do so makes it incomplete.”

​

Amy said the AFL lacked independence and in a statement said “the AFL does not have the appropriate appetite, expertise or strategy to effectively address the matters raised in the Hawthorn Cultural Safety Review”.

But a group of families who made allegations have committed to speaking to investigators after the league committed to further cultural reviews of AFL practices.

Peter Jess giving lectures to people about incomplete reports when parties involved can't participate - might have been good advice to give to his business partner Mr Egan before the latter named Clarkson and co as persons who had breached the human rights of Hawthorn players, without giving them the opportunity to comment

 

[Passmore]

Geez, this investigation is motoring along.

 

[czero]

There are plenty of questions that they can ask to hawthorn about his appointment though.

 

[shintemaster]

Geez, this investigation is motoring along.

Honestly the investigatory equivalent jam donut leaking down your chin and staining a shirt. Just a fizzle of mess.

 

[koshari]

Geez, this investigation is motoring along.

they have backed themselves into a corner basically, no one wants to be seen to acknowledge that some indigenous people have different challenges to dealing with moden day issues which quite clearly led to behavioral issues that the hawthorn admin at the time were attempting to address. and its not just a hawks, afl issue, look at the s**t show going down at alice springs atm.

Sure i will get hailed down as a racist for this observation and quite frankly that is part of the problem. so the fear of being branded racist impedes the powers of be to take any real action. meanwhile 200 years down the track people are still entertaining the idea that its the colonists of 200 years ago that are responsible for todays problems, sheesh the brits were invaded by the vikings hundreds of years ago but they went on to create an empire that the sun never set upon.

i sometimes wonder what the local picture may have looked like if the old conquistadors rolled up in the 16th century judging how well that turned out to the mayans, aztecs, incas etc...?

 

[marklovesbeer]

they have backed themselves into a corner basically, no one wants to be seen to acknowledge that some indigenous people have different challenges to dealing with moden day issues which quite clearly led to behavioral issues that the hawthorn admin at the time were attempting to address. and its not just a hawks, afl issue, look at the s**t show going down at alice springs atm.

Sure i will get hailed down as a racist for this observation and quite frankly that is part of the problem. so the fear of being branded racist impedes the powers of be to take any real action. meanwhile 200 years down the track people are still entertaining the idea that its the colonists of 200 years ago that are responsible for todays problems, sheesh the brits were invaded by the vikings hundreds of years ago but they went on to create an empire that the sun never set upon.

i sometimes winder what the local picture may have looked like if the old conquistadors rolled up in the 16th century judging how well that turned out to the mayans, aztecs, incas etc...?

 

[koshari]

View attachment 1599068

where did you get that image of me from!

 

[SonofSamsquanch]

where did you get that image of me from!

It looks like the one taken when you had your first prostate examination.

 

[the big lebowski]

Cyril Rioli has his say in Hawthorn inquiry

Former Hawthorn superstar Cyril Rioli and his wife Shannyn have joined the contingent of First Nations players and partners who have made submissions to the AFL inquiry into alleged racism.

www.theage.com.au

No wonder it is taking so long. Interesting confirmation.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Cyril Rioli has his say in Hawthorn inquiry

Former Hawthorn superstar Cyril Rioli and his wife Shannyn have joined the contingent of First Nations players and partners who have made submissions to the AFL inquiry into alleged racism.

www.theage.com.au

No wonder it is taking so long. Interesting confirmation.

Looks like it might well blow up in Jeffrey's face.

In which case, justice will be served.

 

[gokangas]

I still have a bad feeling about the outcome of this inquiry. I think it will end up very messy.

 

[the big lebowski]

I still have a bad feeling about the outcome of this inquiry. I think it will end up very messy.

Explain

 

[Farthers]

Sources said a number of the confidential submissions from former players had been in defence of those officials, who are defending themselves against allegations from former players, including that a First Nations player was encouraged to have his pregnant partner terminate her pregnancy.

 

[koshari]

It looks like the one taken when you had your first prostate examination.

refreshing to look back at a time when i had more hair.

 

[zoomba23]

I still have a bad feeling about the outcome of this inquiry. I think it will end up very messy.

Disagree. The strength of the allegations has been diluted a little by various factors, and what the Hun posted yesterday about the league holds true. They look out for their own. Even if Clarko and co. behaved in the manner claimed, which is itself a question mired in different cultural perspectives and intentions, the league are professional rug sweepers. I can't see an outcome where a 4x premiership coach is banished from the game, or even dogged by this for the next few years

 

[gokangas]

Explain

I just can't see an outcome that both parties will be happy with. Just my opinion.

 

[the big lebowski]

I just can't see an outcome that both parties will be happy with. Just my opinion.

I can’t see how people that choose not to discuss their issues in an investigation, meaning their issues aren’t considered in an investigation, could be upset that the investigation didn’t find in their favour.

 

[gokangas]

It just gets messier.

Most damaging Hawthorn racism allegations might not be heard in AFL’s independent investigation​

It has emerged some of the most damaging racism allegations levelled at Hawthorn might not be heard by the league’s independent investigation.

Mark Robinson and Jon Ralph

2 min read
February 3, 2023 - 6:14PM

01:31
Darcy Moore voted in as captain by teammates

Hawthorn’s treatment of its First Nations families has been branded a “form of apartheid” as it emerged the most damaging allegations against Alastair Clarkson might not be heard by the league’s independent investigation.
Report author Phil Egan’s adviser Peter Jess on Friday said the alleged segregation of First Nations players from their partners could not be ignored despite what he says is a “strangulation by lawyers’’ of the process.
“We allowed a football club to participate in what looks like a form of sporting apartheid,’’ Jess said
“The definition of apartheid is you segregate people and strip them of their civil rights. That’s what (allegedly) happened.
“That’s what we need to focus on: What were the processes which failed our system and how can we prevent it from happening again?
“It’s shameful.
“Haven’t we got a right to be angry about the fact we are not addressing the core issue.’’
The AFL’s independent investigation into alleged mistreatment of First Nations families has received written submissions from former players and their partners, including four-time premiership star Cyril Rioli.

The most damaging allegations against Hawthorn may not be heard by the league’s independent investigation. Picture: Quinn Rooney/Getty Images
But the Herald Sun can reveal Hawthorn’s cultural safety report into the claims between 2008 to 2016 will not be used by the four-person investigation led by KC Bernard Quinn.
Hawthorn made clear to participants of its review they would sign nondisclosure agreements.
It means the official report — which the Herald Sun revealed — will not be part of the review.
“The process is being strangled by lawyers,’’ Jess said. “This started out as a truth-telling exercise and now it’s mired by legal obscuration.
“The overriding guidance principle to eliminate racism from our sport is to listen to stories from the past and learn from them and make sure they are not repeated.’’
It is a significant development because the report included damning allegations by Amy (not her real name), who claimed Clarkson had told her partner she must terminate their child.
Amy* refused the request despite being forcibly separated from her partner and ultimately gave birth to the child, but after they reconnected she fell pregnant again the next year.
She terminated the unborn child because of her fears at the club’s negative reaction.
Amy* revealed in November she would not testify to the independent inquiry, with her lawyer stating she was “refusing to consent to the silencing tactics of the AFL”.
Because her story – and the report – cannot be tabled with investigators, it will make it harder to prove the most damning allegations.
It is understood neither Clarkson or Chris Fagan have yet to be interviewed by investigators.
Clarkson and Fagan have both denied any wrongdoing.
A report that was to be finished by December now looks likely to be tabled by March at the earliest.
Written submissions have been tabled by First Nations families into their treatment, with submissions by some players understood to be supportive of Fagan and Clarkson.
As part of that due process lawyers for the coaches are believed to have been able to access those submissions ahead of their potential interviews.

 

[travelli]

so the author of the report is not going to defend it.

Is that where we are at?

 

[Passmore]

It just gets messier.

Most damaging Hawthorn racism allegations might not be heard in AFL’s independent investigation​

It has emerged some of the most damaging racism allegations levelled at Hawthorn might not be heard by the league’s independent investigation.

Mark Robinson and Jon Ralph

2 min read
February 3, 2023 - 6:14PM

01:31
Darcy Moore voted in as captain by teammates

Hawthorn’s treatment of its First Nations families has been branded a “form of apartheid” as it emerged the most damaging allegations against Alastair Clarkson might not be heard by the league’s independent investigation.
Report author Phil Egan’s adviser Peter Jess on Friday said the alleged segregation of First Nations players from their partners could not be ignored despite what he says is a “strangulation by lawyers’’ of the process.
“We allowed a football club to participate in what looks like a form of sporting apartheid,’’ Jess said
“The definition of apartheid is you segregate people and strip them of their civil rights. That’s what (allegedly) happened.
“That’s what we need to focus on: What were the processes which failed our system and how can we prevent it from happening again?
“It’s shameful.
“Haven’t we got a right to be angry about the fact we are not addressing the core issue.’’
The AFL’s independent investigation into alleged mistreatment of First Nations families has received written submissions from former players and their partners, including four-time premiership star Cyril Rioli.

The most damaging allegations against Hawthorn may not be heard by the league’s independent investigation. Picture: Quinn Rooney/Getty Images
But the Herald Sun can reveal Hawthorn’s cultural safety report into the claims between 2008 to 2016 will not be used by the four-person investigation led by KC Bernard Quinn.
Hawthorn made clear to participants of its review they would sign nondisclosure agreements.
It means the official report — which the Herald Sun revealed — will not be part of the review.
“The process is being strangled by lawyers,’’ Jess said. “This started out as a truth-telling exercise and now it’s mired by legal obscuration.
“The overriding guidance principle to eliminate racism from our sport is to listen to stories from the past and learn from them and make sure they are not repeated.’’
It is a significant development because the report included damning allegations by Amy (not her real name), who claimed Clarkson had told her partner she must terminate their child.
Amy* refused the request despite being forcibly separated from her partner and ultimately gave birth to the child, but after they reconnected she fell pregnant again the next year.
She terminated the unborn child because of her fears at the club’s negative reaction.
Amy* revealed in November she would not testify to the independent inquiry, with her lawyer stating she was “refusing to consent to the silencing tactics of the AFL”.
Because her story – and the report – cannot be tabled with investigators, it will make it harder to prove the most damning allegations.
It is understood neither Clarkson or Chris Fagan have yet to be interviewed by investigators.
Clarkson and Fagan have both denied any wrongdoing.
A report that was to be finished by December now looks likely to be tabled by March at the earliest.
Written submissions have been tabled by First Nations families into their treatment, with submissions by some players understood to be supportive of Fagan and Clarkson.
As part of that due process lawyers for the coaches are believed to have been able to access those submissions ahead of their potential interviews.

We’re going around in circles.

 

[Emma12]

Unfortunately it appears the only way the truth can come out is if someone launches legal action against another party

 

[DocSholl]

Explain

He's gokangas