Alastair Clarkson - The Age 12.11.05

RustyHawk

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Thread starter #1
Alastair Clarkson is interviewed in Saturday's Age 12.11.05

Titled Patience Game by Stephen Rielly.
"A C is laying the foundation for success but will he see it come to fruition asks Stephen Rielly."

see: http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2005/11/11/1131578232987.html

Main points
Clarkson has likely committed himself to another losing season by upending the Hawks nest with a committment to the future rather than the present.

Reestablishing the Hawks via the draft.

Along with appointment of Chris Pelchen who has been given the brief to produce a top 4 list by 2008

He, Clarkson, will have to argue for an extension of his job beyond 2006 with a possible win loss record (if Hawks win 8 in 2006) of 13 out of 44. Further, Clarkson was appointed under outgoing President Dicker and faces new President Kennett, a man known to be "restless & eager".

Quote direct from the article:
"He and Pelchen have been to the board with some of what they discovered from an analysis of the competition over the past 30 years.

"We put a presentation to them that was based on the history of premiership teams, the profiles of successful teams," Clarkson said.

"We looked at every side and asked how many players, A grade players, do you need to win a premiership? . . .no one has won a premiership in that time without at least 12 A grade players.

"A 30-year sample doesn't lie . . .We judged and looked at our list and it was with that in mind that we explained to the board that we're nowhere near 12.In this age, the pure draft age we're about to enter where every player in the competition apart, I think, from Robert Harvey, has been drafted, it's pretty obvious where you go to get that 12."

===============================================

Interesting stuff. 12 A grade players minimium to win a premiership?
 

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#2
Depends on how you define A-grade players... there are solid gold career A graders and then there are guys who peak suddenly around GF time, but are just as big a part of the equation.

For example, Sydney won a premiership off the back of guys like Lewis Roberts-Thompson and Amon Buchanan - I don't know if I'd necessarily call either of them A grade players.

What took Sydney to a Premiership instead of, say, St Kilda, can't be drafted.

PS if anyone figures out what it is, please tell me.
 

RustyHawk

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RickMylox said:
What took Sydney to a Premiership instead of, say, St Kilda, can't be drafted.

PS if anyone figures out what it is, please tell me.
To me its the unknown variables that change from week to week & quarter to quarter during a game.

IFFS = Injury, Form, Fitness & Suspension.

St Kilda limped into the finals series with many of their "A" grade players either injured or still not 100% fit.

The Strategic & Tactical decision making of the coaching staff. What did Rodney Eade & Terry Wallace do with Western Bulldogs & Richmond respectively that was different to Peter Rhode & Danny Frawley? Both teams in 2005 added a high draft pick midfield running rookie to their starting line ups but I hardly think that was the secret ingredient that got both teams ticking.
 

RustyHawk

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In fact the Age on Sunday the 13th November 2005 continued their good coverage of Hawthorn. Gotta feeling they like us :)

2 articles by Samantha Lane.

The first concerned John Barker

Hawthorn forward John Barker's quest to play on in 2006 is progressing smoothly, with the 30-year-old continuing his conditioning program before the final decision on his career is made next month.

While key forward Nick Holland was released at season's end, the Hawks have invested considerable time in Barker, who has played only 24 games in the past three years.

It is understood Barker completed one of his best sequences of training days last week, but until his body is put under serious tests his playing future is uncertain.

He was Hawthorn's leading goalkicker when the club last reached the finals, in 2001, and was equal third in the club's best and fairest that year. Since then, Barker has battled osteitis pubis and various soft-tissue injuries.

"At the moment I think he's on track, but the real test is in the next four or five weeks. He's been doing a real preparation block of training so that we can then really test him out in December," Hawthorn's head of fitness Andrew Russell said.

"Structurally his body is in good shape right now - his ankles, his knees, his hips, his shoulders, all his joints are in good shape. So the challenge is for his body to be able to do high intensity sessions and be able to recover without having a soft-tissue breakdown."

Barker, who is out of contract, committed to on-going training, some under Russell's guidance, while his teammates were on holidays.

Barker is determined to play on, provided his body allows, and would have wholehearted support from his peers.

"When you have no direction or anything across centre half-forward, it's pretty hard to get deep into your forward line. So he's that important to us," said Ben Dixon, who acted as general of the Hawks' young forward line this year.

The second article talks about Hawthorns new preseason training program, titled "Hawks Board Tech Train"

"I REMEMBER we went to the Cerberus army camp. That was my first pre-season," Hawthorn forward Ben Dixon recalled last week after completing the first month of his 12th campaign.

"We had this gruelling mud run, where you're seriously up to your waist in mud and trying to get through that and carry logs and all that sort of thing.
"I was built like a twig and I had a tent with Dermott (Brereton) and Darren Jarman and Simon Minton-Connell, those sort of blokes, so it was pretty intimidating to a 17-year-old kid.

"That would probably be a novelty camp now. I couldn't see it being your focus for a pre-season like they used to be . . . but back then it was probably a Monday to Friday thing where you'd come to training just to be flogged."

Devoting a summer to making the grade demands no less exertion now than it did in 1994, when Dixon was drafted. But certainly at Hawthorn - if not at every AFL side - groups of more sensitive new-age trainers are being bred.

The odd pre-dawn run up a mountain or attack of an obstacle course still seems to provide players with a sense of mateship, but Hawthorn's head fitness coach Andrew Russell says that nowadays nothing in a training program is done simply for the hell of it.

Russell began working with John Quinn at Essendon in 1998 and, in some summer sessions, oversaw players running with bricks raised above their heads until the point of exhaustion. Those who dropped the weights were considered "soft" or "pathetic".

Every AFL club had its version of training torture. But as sport science has evolved, so have attitudes to such extreme physical challenges.

"The players aren't perceived by the coaching group (now) as being soft just for saying 'I'm a bit tired, I'm a bit sore, I'm a bit flat'. In the past it was perceived as . . . a cross against their name," said Russell.

"I think the players back then tended to hide their injuries a little bit and tended to push through when they were sore.

"Some people would say that maybe we've gone soft on the athlete in that they report everything . . . but I think we have to aim to educate the athlete to the point where they are able to make the decision themselves.

"They should be able to tell me when they're sore and when it's dangerous soreness, and when they're sore and it's just a training adaptation.

"We'll still run the guys into the ground. We'll absolutely smash our players at certain stages, but then we'll let them recover . . . so that they can go again."

Dixon, now 28, has had to learn not to feel guilty in the times he's been unable to train fully. "I think the old mentality was if you're not training then you're dogging it, and that's a hard mentality to get out of," he said.
"It was like, 'If he's not training, he's weak as ********'. But that's not the case. It's (now considered that) he's being smart with his body, he's going to prolong his career."

Like Collingwood last year, Hawthorn began its 2006 pre-season campaign early. It required 75 per cent support from the player body (only two or three players opposed the movement), and gave fitness staff precious bonus days to work with. The way the training program was structured subsequently has allowed the group to take this week off.
Hawthorn's training focus is on what Russell terms "game conditioning". From the outset, the squad has combined skills and running work, rather than tackle the disciplines in separate sessions.

"We're doing quite a lot more skill work than when I was at Port Adelaide," said Russell, who followed Hawks coach Alastair Clarkson from Alberton to Glenferrie.

"But Port Adelaide were a very highly skilled side. So we could put a whole lot of conditioning work into them and really work on their condition and their fitness knowing that the natural skill level of the group was very high."

Hawthorn's squad is less advanced - in the club's last match this year there were nine first-year players. However, top 2004 draft picks Jarryd Roughead, Lance Franklin and Jordan Lewis defied the popular theory - that first-year players can only last so long in the seniors before requiring a spell in the reserves - by playing a combined total of 55 matches.
Over 22 weeks there is no substitute for a battle-hardened body though, and that had implications for Hawthorn, which finished 14th.

"There were certain stats that suggested that we needed to improve our skill execution in a fatigued state because we were quite good when we were fresh," Russell said. "That's for many reasons. The training age of the group is probably the No. 1 reason and the amount of young players we had playing."

But Russell says it's no more complicated managing Hawthorn's squad than the Port Adelaide list he helped prepare in its premiership year. When they are not doing group skills work, players are generally divided into groups according to their "training age" - a ranking determined by the number of pre-seasons the player has done.

The fact that about 85 per cent of the list is in full training has Russell surmising that the Hawks "are in a very, very strong position right now".
Of the regular senior players, midfielder Sam Mitchell (shoulder), Rick Ladson (arm) and Nick Ries (ankle) are still on modified programs. Chance Bateman, Mark Williams, Tim Boyle and Robert Campbell have all resumed full training after recovering from various ailments.

The club's big-name "one-year-olds" Roughead, Franklin and Lewis are all progressing well. "All of our young guys came in with quite high skinfolds last year and they've all dropped off quite considerably," Russell said.
Naturally strong-bodied midfielder Lewis is the most obvious example. He has shed five kilograms of body fat since arriving at the club. Roughead has also dropped about the same amount but weighs 10 kilograms more than he did this time last year.

And if players' choice of casual dress is any indication of their confidence levels, then Franklin fans should be enthused. The teenager they call "Buddy" was getting around a sun-drenched Glenferrie Oval last Wednesday afternoon in a figure gripping singlet.

========
If the Age keeps this up, ill have to consider buying the real thing instead of just reading from the internet.
 
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#6
Yes Rusty, the Age certainly has given the Hawks a good early run in the dog days of summer, with only soccer, soccer, soccer and a bit cricket to fill the sports pages.

I particularly liked the fact that Andrew Russell talks about combining skills and fitness work - after all, it is footy they are playing, not athletics!! Having been lucky enough to have been in the Hawks rooms at the Gabba this year and listening to Andrew Russell in the warm up, he appears very impressive and an excellent recruit by Clarko.

Also the fact that most of the list is already in full training with only a couple of players on restricted duties bodes well for the start of the season

After all, the Hawks do have some games early that they should realistically be looking to have a good chance to win ie. Round 1 v the Freo Harveys in Tassie, Round 2 v the Pies @ the G, Round 4 v Caaarrllton @ TD, Round 5 v the Bummers @ the G in my view are all very winnable games.

Like any young side, who knows what a couple of early wins may do for their confidence.
 

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GoHawks!! said:
I particularly liked the fact that Andrew Russell talks about combining skills and fitness work - after all, it is footy they are playing, not athletics!! - Good point GoHawks - exactly why Stephen Greene is no longer on our list.

Having been lucky enough to have been in the Hawks rooms at the Gabba this year and listening to Andrew Russell in the warm up, he appears very impressive and an excellent recruit by Clarko.

Like any young side, who knows what a couple of early wins may do for their confidence.
A couple of early wins would take the pressure off A.C. as well.
 
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Exactly Rusty - I reckon any coach that comes in and makes the huge changes that the Board (and most Hawks supporters) endorsed, no demanded, deserves a bit of breathing space to see if he can actually coach a winning team on game day.

It is one thing to make all the off field changes and put all the structures in place, but winning on the field will allow AC to live or die at the Hawks.

We all know AC has coached well at senior level in SA so we can only hope at this stage that tactically, on game day, he can cut it.

The game plan for 2006 will be interesting indeed. I think Peter Everitt must ruck and go forward much more in 2006 (as I think was the plan for 2005 until Campbell busted up his knee in Round 1) to allow Willo, Miller, Dixon and the other talls to feed off him.

I would think we need 30+ goals from Everitt this year with crumbing goals from two of Miller, Williams, Dixon of about the same amount. Imagine the damage Willo could do if he did not have two or three backman hanging off him on every lead because Everitt is sitting in the goal square!!!
 

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GoHawks!! said:
I would think we need 30+ goals from Everitt this year with crumbing goals from two of Miller, Williams, Dixon of about the same amount. Imagine the damage Willo could do if he did not have two or three backman hanging off him on every lead because Everitt is sitting in the goal square!!!
Thats the problem. We need 2 Everitt's. 1 to ruck and 1 to play as a forward.

I'd rather see; until Ryder, Clark or Kennedy (who ever we take in the draft or hopefully all 3!!) comes along to play no1 ruck; Campbell sitting down in the forward line. He is a BIG unit, someone like that sheparding for Willo, Dixon or Miller will cause problems for any teams D.
 
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Hmmm, interesting option. It has been so long since Robbie played for us I cannot recall his ability to not only create a contest, but to take a contested mark.

One of Simon Taylor's problems this season was if the ball hit the deck, it changed from a Sherrin to a cake of soap. I know it was ST's first year in the AFL, and I actually thought he did pretty well overall, but a big man resting in the forward line in the modern game must still have a few tricks in his bag (like Matthew Primus (before the 15 knee injuries), Clark Keating, Jason Ball etc).

You are right Rusty - oh to have two Everitts!!! After the trade week, thankfully we still have one!! ;)
 

RustyHawk

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GoHawk wrote "One of Simon Taylor's problems this season was if the ball hit the deck, it changed from a Sherrin to a cake of soap. I know it was ST's first year in the AFL, and I actually thought he did pretty well overall, but a big man resting in the forward line in the modern game must still have a few tricks in his bag (like Matthew Primus (before the 15 knee injuries), Clark Keating, Jason Ball etc)."

Couldnt agree more :) Good first up effort.

From the original article:
"We looked at every side and asked how many players, A grade players, do you need to win a premiership? . . .no one has won a premiership in that time without at least 12 A grade players."

I looked at our 1988 Premiership side. A team that won the a Grand Final by the biggest winning margin.

1988 VFL premiership team:
B: 40 A. Collins 24 C. Langford 7 G. Ayres
H-B: 20 S. Maginness 2 C. Mew 17 M. Tuck
C: 9 R. DiPierdomenico 30 P. Schwab 6 T. Hall
H-F: 10 C. Wittman 23 D. Brereton 34 J. Kennedy
F: 39 P. Abbott 19 J. Dunstall 35 J. Morrissey
FOLL: 14 G. Dear 11 G. Buckenara 44 J. Platten
I'CHANGE: 29 R. Greene 18 D. Pritchard
EMERG: 32 D. Anderson 22 R. Loveridge 4 P. Russo

To me, the A grade players are: (in no particular order)
1. Langford 5. Dipierdomenico 9. G Dear
2. Ayers 6. T Hall 10. Buckenara
3. Mew 7. Brereton 11. Platten
4. Tuck 8. Dunstall 12. Greene

13 Pritchard

The rest where pretty handy as well such as Paul Abbott went on to kick 6 goals in the Grand Final.
 

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cs61

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#12
Yeah he meant 12 A grade players pretty losely. I don't think he means 12 players Hodge's and Crawf's standard. But more Batemans, Mitchells and Croads perhaps. We have a good core group developing IMO. At the moment its Hodge Mitchell Bateman Croad Brown Lewis Franklin Roughead who we are building around.

The main thing is you can't afford to have more than say 3 C grade players. I think Clarke, Sewell, Vandenburg, Ries, Dixon, is too many, I think they are all good enough to make a best 22, but collectively it doesn't work.

I think Tim Clark could become a vital part of our side, with Sewell, but I don't see a future for the other players unfortunately, despite the fact they do have attritrubutes that could be handy to some sides. It annoys me when I see people say we should let them all go, which shouldn't be the case, its just we have too many of that standard type player trying to play big roles when we only need a couple playing very specific tagging or defensive roles.

But you can't have 5/6 players doing that, unless they are of better standard (Sydney has lots of defensive skillful players).
 
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#13
It is good to see Tim Clarke getting off the "most kicked" list for Hawk supporters. He is finally getting a bit of credibility for his great efforts in 2005 in the posts on BF.

I still remember the way he got in the way of Dustin Fletcher in Round 20, took the big impact, got the free, and kicked the goal from 40 metres out. Sensational 100%er!!

The exciting thing about supporting the Hawks is the simple fact - because of the makeup of the list now (or following Nov 26 more accurately) they could improve in quantum leaps starting in 2006.

No longer do we have to endure Jonny Hay (who I thought was actually a good defensive fullback) and his "colourful" decision making, Nick Holland's sad but inevitable staging for free kicks simply because he could no longer physically compete at AFL level, Steven Greene's inability to hold his ground in a physical contest (he was great against Freo in Perth this year because Freo refuses to give a physical contest in most of their games and he was almost 20 metres clear on his own all day), Simon Beaumont's lack of leg speed because of his leg injuries, etc etc.

What we will get is a fresh and probably frenetic style of football from players we know little about. Didn't a lot of us think Willo, Sewelly, Clarke were underperforming duds until last year??

It is going to be fun I reckon!! Bring on 2006.
 

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RustyHawk said:
To me, the A grade players are: (in no particular order)
1. Langford 5. Dipierdomenico 9. G Dear
2. Ayers 6. T Hall 10. Buckenara
3. Mew 7. Brereton 11. Platten
4. Tuck 8. Dunstall 12. Greene
13 Pritchard
14. Collins; 15. Schwab; 16. Kennedy; 17. Greene; 18. Loveridge

All of whom played 200 games and / or made All-Australian teams and / or were in the best player lists in at least two Grand Finals.

I'm guessing an A-Grade player is one who can be expected to create a genuine contest with a top-line player from another club week in, week out, or win their battle with a cross section of opponents at least half the time.
 

Hawk Dork

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Mr.Likeable said:
I'm guessing an A-Grade player is one who can be expected to create a genuine contest with a top-line player from another club week in, week out, or win their battle with a cross section of opponents at least half the time.
I think more than half the time.
 
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#17
Alastair Clarkson is interviewed in Saturday's Age 12.11.05

"He and Pelchen have been to the board with some of what they discovered from an analysis of the competition over the past 30 years.

"We put a presentation to them that was based on the history of premiership teams, the profiles of successful teams," Clarkson said.

"We looked at every side and asked how many players, A grade players, do you need to win a premiership? . . .no one has won a premiership in that time without at least 12 A grade players.

"A 30-year sample doesn't lie . . .We judged and looked at our list and it was with that in mind that we explained to the board that we're nowhere near 12.In this age, the pure draft age we're about to enter where every player in the competition apart, I think, from Robert Harvey, has been drafted, it's pretty obvious where you go to get that 12."


===============================================

Interesting stuff. 12 A grade players minimium to win a premiership?
Here's the article from 'The AGE' on the 12/11/05 as posted by RustyHawk!.....Our current Dynasty has it's intellectual foundation right here!:thumbsu:

Reckon it's fair to say that we now have at least 12 A grader's in our team....The fact that Sewell could not get a gig in our Premiership side, lies testament to that!
 
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#19
How much does being a premiership player increase your grade.
Dunno, but no doubt it helps....Our current A graders I'd argue would be: Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Burgoyne, Roughead, Birchall, Gibson, Breust, Gunston, Smith, Hill, Rioli, That's the lazy dozen right there....I challenge anyone to argue the point with me on this!

B plus: McEvoy, Hale, Puopolo, Stratton, Frawley, Lake, Shiels..... B: Suckling, Whitex, Ceglar, Anderson.
 

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Dunno, but no doubt it helps....Our current A graders I'd argue would be: Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Burgoyne, Roughead, Birchall, Gibson, Breust, Gunston, Smith, Hill, Rioli, That's the lazy dozen right there....I challenge anyone to argue the point with me on this!

B plus: McEvoy, Hale, Puopolo, Stratton, Frawley, Lake, Shiels..... B: Suckling, Whitex, Ceglar, Anderson.
Rioli is overrated - it says so on the bay
 

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#22
Rioli is overrated - it says so on the bay
If I were on the bay, I'd ask them how many players could have created a goal from Tippet's handball in the grand final. And the overrating of Cyril doesn't extend to teams, only dumb-ass supporters. However, the bay is a place I don't visit anymore as we as Hawthorn fans don't have time to get involved in their b/s as we are too busy accumulating premierships.
 
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#24
A grade = 'elite'

I think Procrastinator has pretty much nailed the 12 elite players in our GF 22, although you could argue Smith is B+
Smith has become our number 1 player tagged by opposition clubs!....His speed & endurance combo are both unmatched & elite across the league, not to mention his goal kicking ability with his raking left-foot....This focus upon him by opposition clubs not only confirms his elite status, but has allowed the free reign of Brad Hill to go unchecked as a consequence!
 

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#25
Smith has become our number 1 player tagged by opposition clubs!....His speed & endurance combo are both unmatched & elite across the league, not to mention his goal kicking ability with his raking left-foot....This focus upon him by opposition clubs not only confirms his elite status, but has allowed the free reign of Brad Hill to go unchecked as a consequence!
Yes, but when he is tagged he gets completely shut out of a game, unlike the other A graders you listed.

Until Smith learns how to handle a tag he will not be A grade in my mind.
 
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