Society/Culture Anti-Lockdown Protesters: Suddenly woke!

[Gough]

How to tell someone doesn't know anything about discrimination: equating racial and gender discrimination to people not getting a vaxx,

Cmon man, everyone knows Dan Andrews is the reincarnation of Vorwoerd.

 

[Gigantic]

The saddest part of it all is that some of these young blokes who are getting strung along by the right wing nutjobs will go back to their lives in a month from now either back earning a wage in the industry they turned on, or requesting unemployment benefits from a government they turned on.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

That earthquake was just Dan trying to stop our protest today, we’re not happy!

 

[Gough]

That earthquake was just Dan trying to stop our protest today, we’re not happy!

View attachment 1242809

It would require a self awareness not immediately evident in these people but I wonder whether it might occur them that in light of Vic's little shake this morning we have compulsory building codes designed to protect us from things like earthquakes. Vaccines do exactly the same.

 

[Cactus_]

sadly it is these types of comments that are the first steps to justify discrimination

have you every been the recipient of discrimination?

This is a straw man argument.

Rather than try to argue against what was written (the letter to the ed. pointing out that most people successfully had lots of vaccines and got lots of benefit from them so the big fuss over this vaccine doesn’t make much sense) you decide to propose a different idea that was never mentioned or alluded to in the original letter (that the letter to the ed. might lead to “discrimination”).

There is also a “thin end of the wedge” fallacy . . . basically saying that the ideas expressed could be negative and discriminatory if taken to extremes, even though the original writer doesn’t advocate those extremes. Many good ideas could be bad if they are taken to extremes. It doesn’t mean the original idea is bad.

Your final line “have you ever been discriminated against” implies that only people who’ve personally been discriminated against can have a fully informed opinion on the topic. This appeals emotionally to people who have experienced discrimination but it isn’t true. Someone who has previously been discriminated against can later go on to discriminate against others.

 

[Cactus_]

sadly it is these types of comments that are the first steps to justify discrimination

have you every been the recipient of discrimination?

Also here is a good article about the difference between “discrimination” and “making distinctions” and why different rules for unvaccinated people is not discrimination:

Here’s why ‘no jab, no entry’ is not discrimination

“No thongs, no singlets” is a common rule for pubs, while nightclubs refuse entry to those who are too intoxicated. Vaccine mandates would significantly reduce health risks.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Borisdog]

Stop the ride mister, I want to get off.

 

[Frank Bunn]

Also here is a good article about the difference between “discrimination” and “making distinctions” and why different rules for unvaccinated people is not discrimination:

Here’s why ‘no jab, no entry’ is not discrimination

“No thongs, no singlets” is a common rule for pubs, while nightclubs refuse entry to those who are too intoxicated. Vaccine mandates would significantly reduce health risks.

www.theage.com.au

It's a poor article.

He's only a few lines in when he relies on a Cherry Picking fallacy. He claims the protected attributes are "largely traits that we cannot change". This overlooks attributes such as - employment activity, marital status, parental status, physical features, political belief, pregnancy, religious belief. They are all attributes which are illegal to discrimination against but that we can change.

Then he goes on to say that vaccine mandates apply to all, so we are in the field of indirect discrimination ie the protected attributes that he just introduced are irrelevant. He's all over the place!

Then he asserts that a “no jab, no entry” policy is almost certainly reasonable, because vaccines have been proven to reduce death, hospitalisation, illness and transmission for COVID-19.

No one is arguing any more that the vaccines for Covid-19 prevent transmission. Vaccinated people can get infected and can even be super spreaders. The vaccinated should have reduced risk of death, hospitalisation and illness regardless of whether they are infected from a vaccinated or non-vaccinated person So the policies that discriminate against the non-vaccinated for Covid-19 are not reasonable.

He also omits a big category from his list of caveats. What about people who have had Covid-19 then recovered? They are likely to have much better immunity than a vaccinated person.

He does not get into the practicalities of how businesses are supposed to enforce these rules.

Restaurant worker : excuse me customer. Are you double vaxxed? Or do you have a disability or allergy that prevents you getting vaxxed? Or did you have Covid-19 then recovered?

Customer : that's none of your ******* business!

 

[Satan]

 

[Satan]

Teargas or Tear gas?

 

[WeetBixKid]

Going to be interesting when the BLM and/or hippie crew start protesting against vaccine passports and the left/right quadrants of the libertarian political compass come together.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

Going to be interesting when the BLM and/or hippie crew start protesting against vaccine passports and the left/right quadrants of the libertarian political compass come together.

Lol. No.

Haha trashing the shrine. Not even antifa did that.

 

[WeetBixKid]

Lol. No.

Haha trashing the shrine. Not even antifa did that.

Lol what? Shrine has nothing to do with it and will be forgotten about by next week unless they keep going back.

BLM and (maybe) Antifa will frame vaccine passports as disproportionately impacting minorities (assuming they are somewhat independent and decentralized). Already happening in NYC. Hippies will latch onto my body my choice type rhetoric - already happening in Byron.

 

[darrenmorgan]

 

[Gough]

I'm a long way from being a shrine is sacred sort of guy but this lot aren't reading the room if they think this will go down well.

 

[kickazz]

Sigh,

There is no justification but just political decision making. There nations or regions in the world which have higher death rate than Melbourne, higher case overall than Melbourne, cases per captia than Melbourne, higher hospitalization rates per captia and hospitalization rates and so on yet are completely open. So lockdown is a mere choice.

You’re thinking is elementary and sadly childish, once we hit the target vaccination rates IT DOES NOT MEAN WE ARE OUT OF LOCKDOWN. The decision of being out of lockdown falls to Dan Andrews and the Chief Health Officer. We can hit 80% and he can choose to continue lockdown, or he can end it right now. We can hit 100% and he can continue, and we hit 100% rate with booster shots and he can continue it.

Your feeble mind doesn’t understand the continuation is solely human decision not some computer program algorithm.

I already posted articles showing medical establish already changing the post wanting 90% vaccination rates,

Human control based on human decisions, government are controlled and run by human, so all this is a choice NOT a mathematical equation,

Basic common sense and logical, staggering many supposed political pundits don’t understand this

A human decision that takes mathematical modelling as a major input.

 

[Marcel Proust]

I'm a long way from being a shrine is sacred sort of guy but this lot aren't reading the room if they think this will go down well.

I thought sacred applied to religious stuff. But apparently not

 

[kickazz]

Bunch of entitled simpletons, who frankly if it were not winning the "country of birth" lottery, wouldn't survive this world.

 

[Marcel Proust]

Bunch of entitled simpletons, who frankly if it were not winning the "country of birth" lottery, wouldn't survive this world.

Or They might do very well in the third world?


The black hoodie guy who went Jackie Chan might succeed

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

Lol what? Shrine has nothing to do with it and will be forgotten about by next week unless they keep going back.

BLM and (maybe) Antifa will frame vaccine passports as disproportionately impacting minorities (assuming they are somewhat independent and decentralized). Already happening in NYC. Hippies will latch onto my body my choice type rhetoric - already happening in Byron.

hahah. This right wing mob of hysterical men did all that junk in the shrine.

Yasmin Abdul Magied couldnt even tweet about the anzacs without every right wing racist hopping in, now....in the shrine??? haha. fair play, I suppose.

 

[Power Raid]

Also here is a good article about the difference between “discrimination” and “making distinctions” and why different rules for unvaccinated people is not discrimination:

Here’s why ‘no jab, no entry’ is not discrimination

“No thongs, no singlets” is a common rule for pubs, while nightclubs refuse entry to those who are too intoxicated. Vaccine mandates would significantly reduce health risks.

www.theage.com.au

if only the article identified the ACTUAL issue at hand being the UN freedom of movement and the UN freedom of gathering.

it is reasonable to breach these concept until everyone has had the "opportunity" to be vaccinated.


oh and discrimination is a broader concept than defined by the discrimination act.

 

[Power Raid]

This is a straw man argument.

Rather than try to argue against what was written (the letter to the ed. pointing out that most people successfully had lots of vaccines and got lots of benefit from them so the big fuss over this vaccine doesn’t make much sense) you decide to propose a different idea that was never mentioned or alluded to in the original letter (that the letter to the ed. might lead to “discrimination”).

There is also a “thin end of the wedge” fallacy . . . basically saying that the ideas expressed could be negative and discriminatory if taken to extremes, even though the original writer doesn’t advocate those extremes. Many good ideas could be bad if they are taken to extremes. It doesn’t mean the original idea is bad.

Your final line “have you ever been discriminated against” implies that only people who’ve personally been discriminated against can have a fully informed opinion on the topic. This appeals emotionally to people who have experienced discrimination but it isn’t true. Someone who has previously been discriminated against can later go on to discriminate against others.

lol

what was written suggested that anyone who was anti-vax was lower than a kindergarten child

there is no point debating the issue other than call out attitudes like this don't help

 

[CM86]

Going to be interesting when the BLM and/or hippie crew start protesting against vaccine passports and the left/right quadrants of the libertarian political compass come together.

This is already happening.
If it isn't interesting now, why do you think it will become interesting?

Would you say you care more about the action of protesting, or the cause behind them?

 

[CM86]

People pretending to be "pro vax", while supporting anti-vaccine positions and making anti-vaccine arguments, can be more dangerous and influential than outright anti-vaxxers.
They are hard to spot, and hard to call out.
Crypto-anti-vaxxers.

lol

what was written suggested that anyone who was anti-vax was lower than a kindergarten child

there is no point debating the issue other than call out attitudes like this don't help

That is a ridiculously bad faith response.

Why not engage?


------------------------
I think that you are a 'bad faith interlocutor'. And this is my reasoning.



You don't seem to hold consistent positions.

Union anti-vax vs general anti-vax.

In one post, when you have the position that the anti-vax protestors are CFMEU, you call them "gutless" and state that they were and still are a "criminal organisation" and that they "support criminals".

Unions like the CFMEU
in the 80s as they were a criminal organisation and nothing has changed.
has always been associated with organised crime
these gutless members
the CFMEU ........... they support criminals
FTR I am pro vax but also pro choice on vax, so I shares the CFMEU's concerns.

In another post when the union link is removed, you complain that a joke is discriminating, damaging and not conducive of reasonable discussion.

what was written suggested that anyone who was anti-vax was lower than a kindergarten child

there is no point debating the issue other than call out attitudes like this don't help

The joke.
I have to confess to being a one-time anti-vaxxer. I was adamantly opposed to the vaccines against measles, mumps, pertussis, diphtheria, tetanus and polio that I was mandated by the state to take. But I later realized that it was actually a good thing. Kindergarten changes a person. N.Y.


That joke, in your 'opinion', is part of the first steps to justifying discrimination. But you yourself have called them gutless criminals.



----------------------------------

Discrimination.

have you every been the recipient of discrimination?

In response to Gough posting the joke, you ask if he has ever "been the recipient of discrimination?", when you're more than aware that he has.
He has been discriminated against for his sexual orientation, and recreational drug use.

Here is you, discriminating against him for his recreational drug use.

I note your on the bongs early Gough
For you that will be great tails of giant spliffs.
Anyway bong boy, try and concentrate, we are in a thread on vaccines.

are you on drugs again Gough
go back to your bongs and have a nice sleep

Gough get off the drugs.

The is the problem of smoking drugs all the time.

Are you on the bongs again?
do you have the munchies?

go back to your bongs Gough

wait for the dope to wear off, if it ever does

have another bong and go back to bed

Get off the bongs and clear your head before it is too late.

are you on drugs?
Get off the bongs before it is too late!

are you on drugs again Gough?
Get off the bongs boy

are you on drugs?

just pull another bong

get off the bongs Gough
Put down the bongs and see the world for its beauty rather than the hatred you carry. Oh and stop blowing smoke in peoples faces, they may be beautiful people despite what your drug induced reality has you believe.

Definitely get help
bong smoking dead shits.

More bad faith posting.

I say the following with care and sorrow, rather than anything negative; but I fear the drugs have gotten the better of you. I hope you can turn things around.

And I'm being uncharitable, but I don't think you would have made this post, if not for Gough's sexual orientation.

anything to do with wanting to get men into spandex?

I'm not actually interested in your response. Because I don't believe you'll respond in good faith.
I don't believe that you are "pro vax".

 

[The Passenger]

I can't imagine i'll be dripping with sympathy to our tradie friends after years of being called unpatriotic, disrespectful and whatnot for attending anti-war, anti-police-violence protests and other events such pro gay marriage walks etc,.