Anti Swans finals bias

[bedford]

96 finals frees 35-44
05 53-70
06 51-63
12 40-51
14 just in front
16 59-82

Bored Sunday and pissed off with what we get , what a joke the last 3 weeks have been. These are Grand Final years

 

[ScrewInStuds]

Watching the Giants v Roos at the moment and holding the ball looks a completely different rule to how it was judged in our game on Friday. A NSW umpire academy is urgently needed to bolster the number of Swans fans in their ranks.

 

[Mister B]

96 finals frees 35-44
05 53-70
06 51-63
12 40-51
14 just in front
16 59-82

Bored Sunday and pissed off with what we get , what a joke the last 3 weeks have been. These are Grand Final years

It is and has been an absolute joke for many years but unfortunately the anti-swans narrative driven by the likes of that campaigner McGuire has lead to an apathy where this bullshit is celebrated rather than called out. If those same stats were reflected for one of the big Vic clubs, there would have been an inquiry and a complete change in fortunes after the second year it happened.

 

[Wolfgang West]

It is and has been an absolute joke for many years but unfortunately the anti-swans narrative driven by the likes of that campaigner McGuire has lead to an apathy where this bullshit is celebrated rather than called out. If those same stats were reflected for one of the big Vic clubs, there would have been an inquiry and a complete change in fortunes after the second year it happened.

All true but isn't it about time the club grew some balls and stood up for themselves ? Other clubs do. We are either too ****ing nice or s**t scared of what will happen if we do.

 

[Mister B]

All true but isn't it about time the club grew some balls and stood up for themselves ? Other clubs do. We are either too ****ing nice or sh*t scared of what will happen if we do.

Very much think it is the latter. Let's not forget Fitzpatrick's statement to Colless that we would be made to pay for taking Franklin. It's the same administration.

 

[The King!]

every sides fans thinks they are hard done by though

we are right though

i will never get over 2016, that was complete horse s**t

 

[Slingshot Footy]

Very much think it is the latter. Let's not forget Fitzpatrick's statement to Colless that we would be made to pay for taking Franklin. It's the same administration.

every sides fans thinks they are hard done by though

we are right though

i will never get over 2016, that was complete horse sh*t

To further rub salt in the wound, upon reciting career highlights during his resignation speech Fitzpatrick took credit for the Bulldogs premiership win and branded it as vindication for the measures taken towards equalisation.

When I think of Mike this is all that comes to mind ->

 

[wills2g]

That 2016 grand final umpiring investigation was an AFL investigation into the AFL... I'm sure they are definitely going to out something

 

[HPKS]

That 2016 grand final umpiring investigation was an AFL investigation into the AFL... I'm sure they are definitely going to out something

Every AFL “investigation” is investigated by themselves. Just let that sink in for a few minutes and then your realise why we end up with a terribly negotiated grand final contract, a FIXture, tanking that’s that’s not officially tanking, an attempt to coverup a systematic performance enhancing drug taking club offences and the newest cab on the rank it appears a salary cap scandal that will get swept under the carpet, Dane beams/Collingwood, It’s a bloody shame because a truly fair and equitable national competition would dwarf this pseudo national competition we have at the moment.

 

[BloodySwan]

Kennedy's 15m mark is already being talked about more than the '16 GF

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I think Razor’s effort on Friday was a consequence of Horse’s hinting at the 50s the previous week.

 

[HPKS]

Kennedy's 15m mark is already being talked about more than the '16 GF

It has been pointed out previously by another swans supporter, name escapes me atm, ‘16 is when critical umpiring mistakes became acceptable. If it was highlighted and not even given as an afterthought we probably wouldn’t be in the situation we are with such terrible officiating. It was the thin edge of the wedge that has been allowed to fester for way to long.

Like I said on Friday I haven’t watched a weekend of neutral games in over a month. Regular throwing & dropping of the ball. And as I’ve said inconsistent during games and over a weekend of games. I’ve got no problem with the odd mistake but it happens way way to much. Love our indigenous game but it’s becoming a lottery to watch. If that Mark to Kennedy is adjudicated as Fox’s was on friday it’s most likely not a win to West Coast. To me it’s 3 games now that have been decided by shoddy inconsistent umpiring this year.

Until as fans we turn away nothing will change. I’ll continue most likely watching Sydney & following the club till the day I die but I will not waist my time with neutral games until there is a change. I can never get that waisted time back. So I just catch up on highlights during the week now.

 

[HPKS]

I think Razor’s effort on Friday was a consequence of Horse’s hinting at the 50s the previous week.

And if that’s the case he shouldn’t be officiating any games. Unprofessional and downright childish. The big problem with Ray Chamberlain was BT highlighting him regularly during broadcasts. Gave him the name razor most likely not because he was the best umpire going around but razor was just a catchy nickname that could stick. Now all that’s happened is he actually thinks he’s a big part of the show getting put on.

 

[tombomb]

every sides fans thinks they are hard done by though

we are right though

i will never get over 2016, that was complete horse sh*t

Although there is actually one team that does get consistently shafted by the umpires.

Free kick differential over the past 15 years

Free kick West Coast.

www.zerohanger.com

Only comparable one to us is the other Sydney team.

 

[Syd]

"Finals Bias" as if it doesn't exist every round.
2016 below as a reference, 2 teams with more than 500 FA, only 1 with over 500 FF

Amazingly hard to find GFF stats anymore.

Team Totals For	FF	FA	DIFFERENTIAL
Western Bulldogs	530	418	112
North Melbourne	473	401	72
Collingwood	443	404	39
Essendon	406	372	34
Adelaide	441	408	33
West Coast	457	435	22
Hawthorn	462	447	15
Carlton	397	387	10
Fremantle	380	392	-12
Richmond	423	440	-17
Brisbane Lions	444	466	-22
St Kilda	370	394	-24
Melbourne	395	423	-28
Gold Coast	370	401	-31
Geelong	473	514	-41
Sydney	468	518	-50
Greater Western Sydney	434	488	-54
Port Adelaide	409	467	-58

 

[Crust]

Club should speak to the Umpires chief. It should not ask: "why are we constantly dudded?", but rather "we are concerned that we are giving away too many free kicks. Can you help us determine what we are doing wrong so that we can address it with the team?"
Hocking wants fewer stoppages, so raise it with him. "How can we stop giving away free kicks. Can you help us please? What are we doing wrong? What are the trends?". I'll bet Hocking has a thousand statistics regarding free kicks, so he can't refuse the request for help.
If served up properly, it will force Hocking/the umpires to look at the trends, and see the poor decisions/bias if any. There may even be a commonality amongst numerous free kicks, (FIIK what that is) so we can legitimately address it.

 

[HPKS]

Club should speak to the Umpires chief. It should not ask: "why are we constantly dudded?", but rather "we are concerned that we are giving away too many free kicks. Can you help us determine what we are doing wrong so that we can address it with the team?"
Hocking wants fewer stoppages, so raise it with him. "How can we stop giving away free kicks. Can you help us please? What are we doing wrong? What are the trends?". I'll bet Hocking has a thousand statistics regarding free kicks, so he can't refuse the request for help.
If served up properly, it will force Hocking/the umpires to look at the trends, and see the poor decisions/bias if any. There may even be a commonality amongst numerous free kicks, (FIIK what that is) so we can legitimately address it.

I’d bet the club would have already done what your suggesting. The club is one of the best run clubs so I’d be shocked if they haven’t already gone down the path of these questions. And most likely Hocking and his predecessor has analysed the statistics your talking about & made suggestions to the club and umpiring fraternity. And it’s probably the same for other clubs with a big free kick differential in the negative.

 

[The King!]

I’d bet the club would have already done what your suggesting. The club is one of the best run clubs so I’d be shocked if they haven’t already gone down the path of these questions. And most likely Hocking and his predecessor has analysed the statistics your talking about & made suggestions to the club and umpiring fraternity. And it’s probably the same for other clubs with a big free kick differential in the negative.

Are we sure we are one of the best run clubs?

 

[Crust]

I’d bet the club would have already done what your suggesting. The club is one of the best run clubs so I’d be shocked if they haven’t already gone down the path of these questions. And most likely Hocking and his predecessor has analysed the statistics your talking about & made suggestions to the club and umpiring fraternity. And it’s probably the same for other clubs with a big free kick differential in the negative.

Maybe we have but it is not working.

 

[HPKS]

Maybe we have but it is not working.

That I would fully agree with but just like the trade ban what could the club do? The AFL are a vindictive organisation

 

[HPKS]

Are we sure we are one of the best run clubs?

Off the field definitely yes. Compare our club off the field, in arguably a tougher market, to Brisbane. We have huge membership, a stable administration and have never looked like what Brisbane was at one stage. If you’d said beginning of the nineties I’d be in full agreement. And this is where complaints are made via your administration.

 

[SwansProudly]

Using https://afltables.com/afl/teams/allteams/gfgames.html for the last 25 years

The 4 grand finals Sydney have played in, the only time we won the free kick differential was in 1996 when we lost to North.

The biggest difference in free kicks (greater than 10) involved Sydney (we won 1, lost 1)
2016 Footscray 20, Sydney 8 (winner +12)
2012 Sydney 10, Hawthorn 21 (winner -11)

When a Victorian team plays a Victorian team (7 times) (Vic/Vic)
- the only time the premiers had more free kicks was 2010 Collingwood (the replay)

When a Victorian team beats interstate team (8 times) (Vic/IS)
- only once did the losing interstate team win more free kicks - 1996 North 8, Sydney 11.

When an interstate team plays another interstate team (IS/IS)
- there have been only 3 grand finals (2004-2006) - Sydney and WCE played in 2 of them
- the winning differential was 1, -1, -4

When an interstate team beats a Victorian team (7 times) (IS/Vic)
- the losing Victorian team won more free kicks except once in 2001 (Brisbane 22 Essendon 19).

Note:
1. Geelong was considered a Victorian team
2. Only used free kick counts for the Collingwood St Kilda replay
3. The grand final year will link to the afltables for the match statistics

PS. I am number dyslexic (not fun doing Maths at Uni!)
PPS. When copying across from a spreadsheet - the merged cells in headings look weird
PPPS. I did not bother with doing % e.g. https://www.triplem.com.au/story/2016-grand-final-sets-free-kick-records-2181

Year

Winner

Loser

Winner

Victorian

Frees

Interstate

Frees

Victorian

Frees

Interstate

Frees

Vic/Vic

Vic/IS

IS/Vic

IS/IS

Winner

Loser

Diff

2020​

Richmond

11​

Geelong

16​

-5​

11​

16​

-5​

2019​

Richmond

20​

GWS

13​

7​

20​

13​

7​

2018​

WCE

13​

Collingwood

17​

-4​

13​

17​

-4​

2017​

Richmond

24​

Adelaide

19​

5​

24​

19​

5​

2016​

Footscray

20​

Sydney

8​

12​

20​

8​

12​

2015​

Hawthorn

14​

WCE

13​

1​

14​

13​

1​

2014​

Hawthorn

14​

Sydney

14​

0​

14​

14​

0​

2013​

Hawthorn

15​

Fremantle

14​

1​

15​

14​

1​

2012​

Sydney

10​

Hawthorn

21​

-11​

10​

21​

-11​

2011​

Geelong

18​

Collingwood

21​

-3​

18​

21​

-3​

2010​

Collingwood

16​

St Kilda

13​

(replay)

3​

16​

13​

3​

2009​

Geelong

19​

St Kilda

23​

-4​

19​

23​

-4​

2008​

Hawthorn

21​

Geelong

29​

-8​

21​

29​

-8​

2007​

Geelong

28​

Port Adelaide

25​

3​

28​

25​

3​

2006​

WCE

21​

Sydney

20​

1​

21​

20​

1​

2005​

Sydney

12​

WCE

13​

-1​

12​

13​

-1​

2004​

Port Adelaide

13​

Brisbane

17​

-4​

13​

17​

-4​

2003​

Brisbane

13​

Collingwood

18​

-5​

13​

18​

-5​

2002​

Brisbane

16​

Collingwood

24​

-8​

16​

24​

-8​

2001​

Brisbane

22​

Essendon

19​

3​

22​

19​

3​

2000​

Essendon

21​

Melbourne

21​

0​

21​

21​

0​

1999​

North

19​

Carlton

19​

0​

19​

19​

0​

1998​

Adelaide

16​

North

17​

-1​

16​

17​

-1​

1997​

Adelaide

15​

St Kilda

21​

-6​

15​

21​

-6​

1996​

North

8​

Sydney

11​

-3​

8​

11​

-3​

 

[bedford]

Off the field definitely yes. Compare our club off the field, in arguably a tougher market, to Brisbane. We have huge membership, a stable administration and have never looked like what Brisbane was at one stage. If you’d said beginning of the nineties I’d be in full agreement. And this is where complaints are made via your administration.

FFS we were a basket case before we left and early days in Sydney , much worse than Brisbane

 

[HPKS]

FFS we were a basket case before we left and early days in Sydney , much worse than Brisbane

Like I said compare it to Brisbane. We have an arguabley harder market and have huge membership, stable administration & never sank to what Brisbane have sunk to in the past, post three peat they required assistance via the AFL in administration. We have never done that since the dark days of the early nineties. Like I said we have a very good off field setup. Ffs

 

[kickthething]

Club should speak to the Umpires chief. It should not ask: "why are we constantly dudded?", but rather "we are concerned that we are giving away too many free kicks. Can you help us determine what we are doing wrong so that we can address it with the team?"
Hocking wants fewer stoppages, so raise it with him. "How can we stop giving away free kicks. Can you help us please? What are we doing wrong? What are the trends?". I'll bet Hocking has a thousand statistics regarding free kicks, so he can't refuse the request for help.
If served up properly, it will force Hocking/the umpires to look at the trends, and see the poor decisions/bias if any. There may even be a commonality amongst numerous free kicks, (FIIK what that is) so we can legitimately address it.

What will make a difference will be the betting agencies getting up in arms about the potential for matches to be fixed and umpiring to never be considered as a possible source. We turn a major blind eye to umpiring howlers that don't even out in games. Last Friday was as close as I have seen umpiring being hard to explain away in any other way and the difference in interpreting rules by the same umpire in the same game, particularly the oob decisions were enough to raise an eyebrow at the very least.

Wait for fr the bookies to be absolutely burnt and then you might get somewhere.