Are Brisbane irrelvant in Queensland. A lions supporter says they are..

[fabulousphil]

I'd hazard we have a decent number of young athletes that would love to have the exposure and kudos that goes with being on the verge of a paid professional footy player. Again, the lack of queensland born players beating a path back to the Sunshine State whilst at their peak suggests to me evidence that if you want to be big in footy and maybe have a career afterwards....you really need to stay in melbourne whilst you are playing.

Beams is setting a great example, coming back to join his brother whilst at his peak. This is the sort of thing the club can take responsibility for, as a marketing tool...but mysteriously doesn't. So we have are own issues about PR that we aren't using effectively in my opinion.

But the bottom line is still that the more this expansion style approach is pursued, the more unbalanced and unwieldy the entire competition becomes...fixturing, revenue, drafts, concessions, financial assistance....they are all linked to the concept that the league must constantly tug this string after that string in pursuit of fairness and equal competition. And the league DOES need to do that - that's what it does.

So in my mind, this issue has less to do with how the Lions go from week to week and season to season and more about how the situation could best be remedied from here for GC and GWS, because at least one of those 2 will be a very fine footy side for a spell, but after that....

Surely it is swings and round abouts, the theory is, out of 2 teams you would expect one to be at least competitive, in WA ATM we have 2 very good teams or so it appears, one was expected, one was not, In NSW we have one very good team and one middle of the road, in SA we have one that was expected to be great but we find we have 2 middle of the road.

In QLD we have 2 pretty crap teams and have had so for a number of years, although this year GC was expected to be more than middle of the road.

If for EX the GC were going great guns, it would paper over the cracks to an extent that is the Lions, but they aren't and the cracks are wider than ever ATM, but it will swing around.

At community/grass roots level, the game does OK in SE QLD, the base is there for the game to take off again quickly on the back of Lions or GC suns success and it will come around again, the build to success is usually a slow process.

 

[fabulousphil]

People get carried away with u18 championships IMO. Someone good at 17yo isnt necessarily goint to be good against men at age 21.

Maybe a better thing for the game in Brisbane is if they, along with GC, could keep all the draft picks from Qld/NT?

(waiting for the noise)

I would agree, you can have many sleepers or players who mature later and it's quite hit and miss, but quite a few of the first draft picks are 17 year olds who are physically men and have played against men.

The players who drafters are speculating on are usually the later picks.

I think a zone pick for the northern academies is a good idea, but don't agree they should keep all.

 

[Our Game]

The Lions are far better supported in city of 2 million compared to the Melbourne Storm that struggle to get more than 15,000 to home games in a city of 4.5 million even after being a top team for nearly all of the time the have been in the NRL.

 

[fabulousphil]

The Lions are far better supported in city of 2 million compared to the Melbourne Storm that struggle to get more than 15,000 to home games in a city of 4.5 million even after being a top team for nearly all of the time the have been in the NRL.

I would agree, but i don't think it is even up for debate

 

[madmug]

I would agree, but i don't think it is even up for debate

Yes correct, but I think its a fair point. It probably shows that the Sydney 'set' are against Storm because they are from Melbourne, just like some anti Lions feelings both from Melbourne, because they are 'outsiders' & in Brisbane because its that 'Victorian game' syndrome. Footy supporters need to show some support for the Lions.

After all, Brisbane Lions are an Aussie Rules club in a generally hostile Thugby Loigue environment.

 

[telsor]

The Lions are far better supported in city of 2 million compared to the Melbourne Storm that struggle to get more than 15,000 to home games in a city of 4.5 million even after being a top team for nearly all of the time the have been in the NRL.

Storm average this year: 14354
NRL average this year...: 15250

Not really a massive difference....

 

[telsor]

Yes correct, but I think its a fair point. It probably shows that the Sydney 'set' are against Storm because they are from Melbourne, just like some anti Lions feelings both from Melbourne, because they are 'outsiders' & in Brisbane because its that 'Victorian game' syndrome. Footy supporters need to show some support for the Lions.

After all, Brisbane Lions are an Aussie Rules club in a generally hostile Thugby Loigue environment.

Yeah, Vics hate non-vic clubs due to some kind of syndrome...As opposed to how non Vics love and embrace Vic clubs with equanimity...

 

[Our Game]

Storm average this year: 14354
NRL average this year...: 15250

Not really a massive difference....

Maybe but 14 k in Melbourne is bad when its a one team town.Apart from the Broncos when they are winning the rest of the NRL clubs esp in Sydney struggle to get over 20,000 any time.The NRL mare light years away from achieving the 20K average they were hoping for by 2020.

 

[telsor]

Maybe but 14 k in Melbourne is bad when its a one team town.Apart from the Broncos when they are winning the rest of the NRL clubs esp in Sydney struggle to get over 20,000 any time.The NRL mare light years away from achieving the 20K average they were hoping for by 2020.

Yeah, but it means their support/finances are on a similar level to the other clubs in the comp, which is the relevant issue.

 

[JD Tomahawk]

Yes, which is why you keep failing to kick a goal, because that statement, to you = no issue and problem solved.
But, to me, it represents the exact issue....if we are STILL only viable if we are winning, after almost 30 years up here, that's not much of a footy club.

Sentiments like that are exactly the sort of dismissive conclusion the AFL come to and therein lies the problem.

So what exactly are you trying to get out of this thread? You want more help? Less help? Relocate to Tasmania?

 

[Papa G]

Yeah, Vics hate non-vic clubs due to some kind of syndrome...As opposed to how non Vics love and embrace Vic clubs with equanimity...

Downs I think.

 

[bombersfan4000]

I would agree, but i don't think it is even up for debate

same might go for the majority of the other NRL clubs as well! the Lions crowds and memberships are relatively poor by AFL standards but at the top end when compared to the NRL clubs

 

[stmookeyj]

People get carried away with u18 championships IMO. Someone good at 17yo isnt necessarily goint to be good against men at age 21.

Maybe a better thing for the game in Brisbane is if they, along with GC, could keep all the draft picks from Qld/NT?

(waiting for the noise)

Not when Eddie or Brayshaw cracks it when they see this as something worse than the so called "hand outs". Hence the ridiculously flawed bidding system.


And don't get me started on Auskick. Yes you can have great Auskick numbers but what the governing body needs to look at is YOUTH participation (Under 13-Under 18) and more importantly numbers of those who have Australian Rules as their ONLY sport or Only football choice given many are roped in by mates in return for them playing off the bench in the school's 2nd XIII or XV. Funny how we rarely hear that.....A lot of the standout Qld 16's and 18's reps are also plucked from other sports (alternate talents) as opposed to those who have been toiling through the grades. For example, Zac Smith (GC Suns) was plucked from the World Game, Tom Williams (Pick 6 in the draft many years ago) had a League background.

As for relevance, any time the Broncos win they are the only relevant team in SE Queensland of any code, apart from maybe the Firebirds given they cater towards the female audience more than any other team. The only reason the Roar get any coverage has to do with their ownership debacle, the Lions barely get a small spot on the news, ditto for the Reds and the Bulls/Heat, even the revival of the Bullets went unnoticed this week.

 

[FuManchu]

Having lived in Brisbane from 2003 thru to 2008, when they experienced notable success, the game has very little penetration of the public's sporting psyche up there.

Sure they like the Lions to beat those dastardly Victorians at their own game, but that's the extent of the support they have city wide. It's interesting to note that even the Broncos don't fill their own stadium in a one team town. Sport is big up there, but funnily enough it's all about participation as the climate lends itself to that. Attendance comes second.

If you scratch the veneer of AFL support up there, you will find very little beyond that very thin veneer.

 

[kaypee]

Having lived in Brisbane from 2003 thru to 2008, when they experienced notable success, the game has very little penetration of the public's sporting psyche up there.

Sure they like the Lions to beat those dastardly Victorians at their own game, but that's the extent of the support they have city wide. It's interesting to note that even the Broncos don't fill their own stadium in a one team town. Sport is big up there, but funnily enough it's all about participation as the climate lends itself to that. Attendance comes second.

If you scratch the veneer of AFL support up there, you will find very little beyond that very thin veneer.

I disagree with that. Having lived in Brisbane and Queensland on and off for thirty years, Aussie Rules is reasonably strong at the grass roots. sure Aussie rules players up there love watching league, but they jump on board the lions (and maybe in the future the Suns) when they're pumping. a problem is that while many Aussie rules fans up there would say the lions are their team, they are also happy enough to keep an eye on whatever team their parents barracked for whe the lions suck. I'm not sure apathy towards the lions means apathy towards the game.

 

[papabear]

Theres no link between participants and revenue. If there was, soccer and netball would have billions in the bank. Theres no real link between viewers and participation for that matter either, or Rugby League wouldn't need to merge with Touch to inflate its figures.

arguing with a rugby union fan you goto rugby league again.

lmao.

AFL creates auskick to inflate figures and get government handouts.

Touch football a game which already exists as a non contact version of rugby league, is counted by the nrl in its participation figures copying a strategy by the AFL to pick up govt hand outs.

... you are becoming predictable..

 

[The_Wookie]

Nice bump. brave of you too after you flat out made up crap on the Union board.

Hey there friend league troll. the takeover of Touch is a fact, and the reason for the takeover were specifically to extend Rugby leagues development reach.

Auskick has been around in some form since it started as Vickick in the 80s. it wasnt created for government handouts or inflationary figures or any other rubbish you want to trott out.

oh and these posts? This is what gets league trolls banned.

 

[papabear]

Lol I am not a league Troll, I stayed up and watched the umps carry west coast into the GF. Helping the numbers you value!@!

You are an anti league troll and I am quite happy to call you out on your distortions of the truth.

Just like my obvious distortion re auskicks creation, its only their to counter yours to hope that you will see how ridiculous statements like that are.

Auskick is to AFL what touch is to rugby league. To suggest that the NRL are negative in their purchase or inclusion of them in their numbers to increase their govt funding whilst the AFL / Auskick relationship is a positive one, is just garbage, they are on the same level.

To be honest I find a lot of your posts regarding viewership numbers and your opinions on them quite informative. But if you allow whatever it is you have against rugby league to twist and skew facts on to this board, a union board, a basketball board, a rugby league board, then I will quite happily point out where your skewed opinion has become unfair or incorrect as you would expect me to.

 

[The_Wookie]

You are dragging an issue you completely invented on another board onto here and comparing Auskick which is a junior development program with touch football which is no such thing. Auskick numbers may make the numbers look bigger but it was never their purpose, whereas the absorption of touch was publicly acknowledged to be a way to increase leagues participation numbers and boost the NRL brand.

Again, Auskick is a junior development program that was created by the VFL in the 80s. Touch football was not and had never been part of rugby league or its development until it was affiliated with the sole purpose of increasing league exposure. Theres a massive difference.

To be honest, I dont care if you find my posts informative or not. You are flat out wrong here, as you were on the other forum.

 

[papabear]

You are dragging an issue you completely invented on another board onto here and comparing Auskick which is a junior development program with touch football which is no such thing. Auskick numbers may make the numbers look bigger but it was never their purpose, whereas the absorption of touch was publicly acknowledged to be a way to increase leagues participation numbers and boost the NRL brand.

Again, Auskick is a junior development program that was created by the VFL in the 80s. Touch football was not and had never been part of rugby league or its development until it was affiliated with the sole purpose of increasing league exposure. Theres a massive difference.

To be honest, I dont care if you find my posts informative or not. You are flat out wrong here, as you were on the other forum.

Obviously that wasn't there purpose, I noted as much in my last post. However the result remains the same.

With the AFL achieving great leverage out of governments from them.

The NRL would be stupid not to implement a similar strategy.

Just because touch footy evolved and grew naturally (from rugby league) where as auskick was created by the AFL is really irrelevant when they are both in the end leveraged for the same result.

However, if I am wrong, and you are not suggesting that the NRL shouldnt have adopted said strategy, then why are we arguing?

 

[Colonial]

Obviously that wasn't there purpose, I noted as much in my last post. However the result remains the same.

With the AFL achieving great leverage out of governments from them.

The NRL would be stupid not to implement a similar strategy.

Just because touch footy evolved and grew naturally (from rugby league) where as auskick was created by the AFL is really irrelevant when they are both in the end leveraged for the same result.

However, if I am wrong, and you are not suggesting that the NRL shouldnt have adopted said strategy, then why are we arguing?

I dont see how you can say auskick and touch as the same. Touch was a completely different sport not affiliated with league until the nrl brought it under their umbrella.

Auskick would be more inline with the old mini and mod footy. Its just more successful.

 

[The_Wookie]

Obviously that wasn't there purpose, I noted as much in my last post. However the result remains the same.

With the AFL achieving great leverage out of governments from them.

The NRL would be stupid not to implement a similar strategy.

Just because touch footy evolved and grew naturally (from rugby league) where as auskick was created by the AFL is really irrelevant when they are both in the end leveraged for the same result.

However, if I am wrong, and you are not suggesting that the NRL shouldnt have adopted said strategy, then why are we arguing?

The NRLs strategy isnt similar. They literally absorbed another sport - and then used it to say hey look at the growth we've achieved. The AFL grew Auskick from 20,000 victorians in 1987 to what it is today.

 

[papabear]

Its more look at the participation we have achieved as opposed to growth.

mini and mod are the primary RL options for kids, ie four year olds play under those rules. Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought most fair dinkum kids would be playing actually afl from a young age, as well as auskick if they wanted too?

Similarly kids can play mini/mod depending on what age they are and touch separately.

Just because the NRL didn't own it during its ups and downs prior to purchasing it doesn't make the comparisons irrelevant. Rugby League and Rugby Union (to a lesser degree) would have had an impact on its growth as it is the primary non tackle version of them. It just managed on its own, whereas auskick was more of a masterplanned approach.

Soon enough they will probably pick up oztag and add a whole bunch more numbers to their participation figures, just like I imagine AFL could pick up their tag game (if they dont own it already).

 

[papabear]

and by similar strategy I mean high participation numbers to maximise govt revenue

and probably sponsorship / other revenue...

 

[Colonial]

Its more look at the participation we have achieved as opposed to growth.

mini and mod are the primary RL options for kids, ie four year olds play under those rules. Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought most fair dinkum kids would be playing actually afl from a young age, as well as auskick if they wanted too?

Similarly kids can play mini/mod depending on what age they are and touch separately.

Just because the NRL didn't own it during its ups and downs prior to purchasing it doesn't make the comparisons irrelevant. Rugby League and Rugby Union (to a lesser degree) would have had an impact on its growth as it is the primary non tackle version of them. It just managed on its own, whereas auskick was more of a masterplanned approach.

Soon enough they will probably pick up oztag and add a whole bunch more numbers to their participation figures, just like I imagine AFL could pick up their tag game (if they dont own it already).

So if the AFL bought Basketball it would be ok to include the figures?
May as well merge the figures for union and league as well.