Opinion Are Richmond hitting the slope?

[theyellowsash]

Almost as good as the 'who cares it's a tainted flag anyway' comments right throughout your board last night.

It won't be a tainted flag if we don't win it

 

[CakeEater]

Given they hijacked the Ross Lyon gameplan, its no surprise they are.

Lucky they got 2 premierships out of it, will make the pain more bearable.

 

[damicky]

Almost as good as the 'who cares it's a tainted flag anyway' comments right throughout your board last night.

That crap annoys me too ... this flag will be just as meaningful as any other (maybe more)

 

[Spanish_Fly]

Richmond's team has always been a bunch of largely talentless, skillless, useless pricks who got a winning culture driven into them through extreme running, pressure and knocking the ball forward at all costs. That gameplan only worked because it had a few stars to act as the circuit breaker when things weren't going their way m- Dusty, Rance, Riewoldt etc.

Now theres no Rance, last night there was no Dusty and they are beginning to be exposed for what they are. The same bottom 8 team they've been for the last decade with a conditional hunger for the ball. They're still the same bums who can't kick a footy, can't take a mark. They're still the average Asbury's of the world. The conditional Caddy's. The can't-stand-up Castagnas. The bad-news Broad's. The worst-in-the-family Rioli.

They're done. Hope you enjoyed your time in the spot-light Tiget fans because it's over.

Haha funniest post of the year coming from a Carlton supporter, and yes mate I did very much enjoy our time in the spotlight.

 

[juss]

Lol history will not remember it.

The complete opposite actually. History will forget it and very quickly.

The premiership will go in the book and it will forever be in a teams overall tally.

I don't think people remember to exclude some of the dodgy flags of the 20'2,30's and 40's - Do they?


I think any reduction in game time is offset with the 17 game season being the fairest fixture of the last 30 years. You just have to look at Richmond's lead into the finals last year as the definition of inequality.....

History is only relevant to those who lived it.

No one gives a s**t about flags in bygone eras if you weren't around for them. They are numbers and stats on a page. This one will be as meaningless for those that weren't around as any other, or as meaningful as those who experienced it make it.

Time will tell how the individuals that experience it will value it. There is no answer yet.

 

[99cents]

I'd expect the AFL will pull some kind of crappy "wildcard" event this year - you only have to make top ten for finals, maybe even top 12.

 

[csharp]

Yep only 32 premierships in that team, pathetic.

Mark Blake won a Premiership.
Fletcher Roberts won a Premiership.
Matt Spangher won a Premiership.

 

[La Dispute]

Did anyone real see either premiership team as all-time great lineup?

The Tigers did well to capitalise on a good gameplan, but they're nothing more than a reasonable team largely carried by Martin, a few other A-graders and then a whole bunch of disciplined roleplayers. They also happen to play an exorbitant number of games at the MCG, which gives them a nice little advantage through any finals series they participate in.

I suspect they are pretty much done as genuine premiership threat.

 

[Sterge]

Mark Blake won a Premiership.
Fletcher Roberts won a Premiership.
Matt Spangher won a Premiership.

You know who didn't win a flag

Bob Murphy

Did anyone real see either premiership team as all-time great lineup?

The Tigers did well to capitalise on a good gameplan, but they're nothing more than a reasonable team largely carried by Martin, a few other A-graders and then a whole bunch of disciplined roleplayers. They also happen to play an exorbitant number of games at the MCG, which gives them a nice little advantage through any finals series they participate in.

I suspect they are pretty much done as genuine premiership threat.

sure we were never threepeat Brisbane levels but this myth of Dustin Martin and a bunch of role players

There are 2 brownlow medalists in the side
a 3 time coleman medalist
until this season one of the best defenders in modern footy (despite not playing in 2019)

Then blokes like Lynch, Grimes, Prestia, Edwards who are much more than 'disciplined roleplayers'

Yeah it's hard to stay up for many years but imo the main thing that has affected us is the shorter quarters, we can no longer grind teams down and blow them away with superior fitness in the last 5-10 minutes of a quarter. You could see this at the end of both games so far, it remains to be seen if the side is upto the challenge of making the changes required.

 

[La Dispute]

You know who didn't win a flag

Bob Murphy

Edgy

 

[McOrist]

Richmond aren't hitting the slope .....it's reserved for Melbourne supporters.

 

[La Dispute]

sure we were never threepeat Brisbane levels but this myth of Dustin Martin and a bunch of role players

There are 2 brownlow medalists in the side
a 3 time coleman medalist
until this season one of the best defenders in modern footy (despite not playing in 2019)

Then blokes like Lynch, Grimes, Prestia, Edwards who are much more than 'disciplined roleplayers'

Yeah it's hard to stay up for many years but imo the main thing that has affected us is the shorter quarters, we can no longer grind teams down and blow them away with superior fitness in the last 5-10 minutes of a quarter. You could see this at the end of both games so far, it remains to be seen if the side is upto the challenge of making the changes required.

Cotchin won his Brownlow in 2012 and didn't play anywhere near that level across either 2017 or 2019. He's now slowing down and virtually a bit player himself. Rance fair enough, though overrated, Riewoldt was a very good player who is currently in complete free fall.

Lynch, Grimes, Prestia, Edwards are all good players - no question (I'd add Houli in here too, though soft, as we saw last night). After that there is a big drop off in quality. I'd say between 10-12 C-D graders who make the most of their limited talent or are fairly young - that's a huge amount for a supposedly dominant team. Someone like Soldo wouldn't make the best 22 in any other team in the AFL, to show you the unusual mechanics of the Richmond lineup.

The team has looked complacent in each of the games they have played so far, but that's not a bad thing at this point of an already compromised season. They can still correct whatever it is that's bringing about this current malaise.

 

[BarbieITFC]

Did anyone real see either premiership team as all-time great lineup?

The Tigers did well to capitalise on a good gameplan, but they're nothing more than a reasonable team largely carried by Martin, a few other A-graders and then a whole bunch of disciplined roleplayers. They also happen to play an exorbitant number of games at the MCG, which gives them a nice little advantage through any finals series they participate in.

I suspect they are pretty much done as genuine premiership threat.

I'm calling BS on this - sorry.

In a sport using salary caps, every premiership team has comprised stars and journeymen. Let's not let the fun in winding up gullible Tigers fans go too far into diminishing their achievement.

They have won two flags in three years, should have won three in three because they were by far the best team in 2018 as well.

What might be happening - and we have a body of evidence of two games - is that maybe other teams have worked out how to counter the Tigers' game plan. It happens. Maybe going into a fourth year of a high pressure game style is taking it's toll - just look at Freo's implosion midway through 2015 after 4.5 years of sustained high performance. Maybe the shorter quarters has impacted their ability to roll over teams. Maybe last year they were motivated to win it for Rance, but this year his retirement has shifted the weight of pressure on to other shoulders.

But trying to diminish their performance over three years is just lacking class and ingenuity - it's not liked they fluked one like the Doggies did in 16.

 

[La Dispute]

I'm calling BS on this - sorry.

In a sport using salary caps, every premiership team has comprised stars and journeymen. Let's not let the fun in winding up gullible Tigers fans go too far into diminishing their achievement.

They have won two flags in three years, should have won three in three because they were by far the best team in 2018 as well.

What might be happening - and we have a body of evidence of two games - is that maybe other teams have worked out how to counter the Tigers' game plan. It happens. Maybe going into a fourth year of a high pressure game style is taking it's toll - just look at Freo's implosion midway through 2015 after 4.5 years of sustained high performance. Maybe the shorter quarters has impacted their ability to roll over teams. Maybe last year they were motivated to win it for Rance, but this year his retirement has shifted the weight of pressure on to other shoulders.

But trying to diminish their performance over three years is just lacking class and ingenuity - it's not liked they fluked one like the Doggies did in 16.

You were really on a roll and sounding sincere until you said the Bulldogs fluked their flag - if that is the case then the Tigers have fluked two.

I have essentially said the same thing about Richmond since 2017. They have managed to make hay, using a good system with a few stars, but largely a heap of disciplined but not overly talented players. That's as impressive as winning with a squad composed of many stars, a number of ring ins who are happy to join on and play for less than their market value and then a few role players like Hawthorn.

Maybe they're struggling also without crowds?

I don't see why you have to take it upon yourself to launch a staunch defense of Richmond, who have had every advantage to win a flag and have managed to do so twice. We have had enough Richmond adulation over the past three years to last a lifetime - surely you don't believe everyone has to think the same way?

 

[Sterge]

Cotchin won his Brownlow in 2012 and didn't play anywhere near that level across either 2017 or 2019. He's now slowing down and virtually a bit player himself. Rance fair enough, though overrated, Riewoldt was a very good player who is currently in complete free fall.

Lynch, Grimes, Prestia, Edwards are all good players - no question (I'd add Houli in here too, though soft, as we saw last night). After that there is a big drop off in quality. I'd say between 10-12 C-D graders who make the most of their limited talent or are fairly young - that's a huge amount for a supposedly dominant team. Someone like Soldo wouldn't make the best 22 in any other team in the AFL, to show you the unusual mechanics of the Richmond lineup.

The team has looked complacent in each of the games they have played so far, but that's not a bad thing at this point of an already compromised season. They can still correct whatever it is that's bringing about this current malaise.

Jack has looked cooked i dont think the break helped him at all
Cotch is the one bloke you can rely on to try week in week out and despite not being at 2012 levels is still putting in the same as he did 17-19

The problem isn't those blokes in the last 2 games though it's the younger ones who have either regressed or never came on

Rioli has been utter garbage
Graham has stagnated
Stack looks to have bought his own hype a bit too much and squibbed a bunch of contests last night.

If you want to keep being at the top you need to trade well which we did with guys like prestia caddy and lynch but you also need some of the younger guys to lift and that hasn't happened.

 

[captain cotch 9]

We have lost 1 game in a calendar year...
classic Big Fooooty

 

[Sterge]

You were really on a roll and sounding sincere until you said the Bulldogs fluked their flag - if that is the case then the Tigers have fluked two.

I have essentially said the same thing about Richmond since 2017. They have managed to make hay, using a good system with a few stars, but largely a heap of disciplined but not overly talented players. That's as impressive as winning with a squad composed of many stars, a number of ring ins who are happy to join on and play for less than their market value and then a few role players like Hawthorn.

Maybe they're struggling also without crowds?

I don't see why you have to take it upon yourself to launch a staunch defense of Richmond, who have had every advantage to win a flag and have managed to do so twice. We have had enough Richmond adulation over the past three years to last a lifetime - surely you don't believe everyone has to think the same way?

Fluked 2 flags, you're taking the piss now.

Shorter quarters have affected us more than anything else.

Its funny that the dustin martin and a bunch of well drilled hacks still gets a run there have been more than enough a and b graders in the team over the journey.

 

[La Dispute]

Fluked 2 flags, you're taking the piss now.

Shorter quarters have affected us more than anything else.

Its funny that the dustin martin and a bunch of well drilled hacks still gets a run there have been more than enough a and b graders in the team over the journey.

Did you see the post I was responding to?

I said IF the Bulldogs fluked their flag, THEN the Tigers fluked their two*

*No Damien Barrett

 

[BarbieITFC]

You were really on a roll and sounding sincere until you said the Bulldogs fluked their flag - if that is the case then the Tigers have fluked two.

I have essentially said the same thing about Richmond since 2017. They have managed to make hay, using a good system with a few stars, but largely a heap of disciplined but not overly talented players. That's as impressive as winning with a squad composed of many stars, a number of ring ins who are happy to join on and play for less than their market value and then a few role players like Hawthorn.

Maybe they're struggling also without crowds?

I don't see why you have to take it upon yourself to launch a staunch defense of Richmond, who have had every advantage to win a flag and have managed to do so twice. We have had enough Richmond adulation over the past three years to last a lifetime - surely you don't believe everyone has to think the same way?

I'm not doing a staunch defence of Richmond. I'm simply pointing out that finishing 3rd, 1st, 3rd on the ladder and winning two flags deserves some respect and you were - in my opinion - diminishing their achievement.

As for the Doggies, they have finished 6th, 7th, 10th, 13th, 7th over the last five years, winning the flag from 7th and with the single largest free kick differential across a season for the last 20 years. Nothing like Richmond's two flags. Did I take more pleasure as a neutral in the Doggies' flag than either of the Tigers' flags - absolutely - but to compare the two teams is just myopic.

 

[dean33]

Mark Blake won a Premiership.
Fletcher Roberts won a Premiership.
Matt Spangher won a Premiership.

1st loss in 12 months, you’re an idiot.

 

[La Dispute]

I'm not doing a staunch defence of Richmond. I'm simply pointing out that finishing 3rd, 1st, 3rd on the ladder and winning two flags deserves some respect and you were - in my opinion - diminishing their achievement.

As for the Doggies, they have finished 6th, 7th, 10th, 13th, 7th over the last five years, winning the flag from 7th and with the single largest free kick differential across a season for the last 20 years. Nothing like Richmond's two flags. Did I take more pleasure as a neutral in the Doggies' flag than either of the Tigers' flags - absolutely - but to compare the two teams is just myopic.

Surely you can see the explicit double standards in talking down the Bulldogs while also attempting to defend Richmond, pointing out arbitrary metrics like free kick differentials. There is clearly a reason why you don't think the Bulldogs flag is that impressive (the free kicks paid), and I've explained why I don't think either of the Tigers flags are that impressive; namely a lot of home games towards the back half of both season and then a majority of home finals, culminating in the ultimate home game and deciding match.

Personally I think watching the Bulldogs win an away elimination final, knock off the previous year's premiers, beat a rampage GWS away and then go on and beat the year's minor premier in the Grand Final is as far from a fluke as it gets.

Interesting crusade though.

 

[Xtreme]

Mark Blake won a Premiership.
Fletcher Roberts won a Premiership.
Matt Spangher won a Premiership.

Spangher is a god tyvm!

 

[Bigeasy]

I think Richmond have no other choice but to fold.

 

[csharp]

You know who didn't win a flag

Bob Murphy

You know who else didn't win a flag? Matthew Richardson.

In fact, how many finals did he even play in at all? Lmao, what a garbage career.

 

[Sterge]

You know who else didn't win a flag? Matthew Richardson.

In fact, how many finals did he even play in at all? Lmao, what a garbage career.

Richo played in more finals games than the dogs have flags in their history.

This is a fun game