Rumour Are we going to lose Brett Ratten?

gringo2011

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Will give you the injury scenario and totally agree re Wingard
But just because you are rebuilding, it does not exclude you from picking up talent when you see it! Especially on the cheap the way they did!
Wingard and Scully cost them sweet F all!

Wingard was probably the worst one they have got. He's still a frustrating lazy ****. He's got more talent than most but he's always in first gear. I'm glad we didn't get him now.
 

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gringo2011

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So every time I discuss Richo I need to add a disclaimer that it ain’t all his fault?

Ffs I said Richo has lead the development of the club. Someone leading also has a team/others contributing.

This back & forth has wasted bandwidth. A nothing point you raised!

The funny thing is we all want him sacked anyway. Even Plugger probably wouldn't shed too many tears if he's gone next year. He's had more of a go than any coach I can remember at the Saints and he's getting stale. Even just as a reset we need to move on. Just have to make sure we get the appointment right and have a clear plan for making the list better.
 

Mikka84

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They have clarko. Players want to play under the best coach. We have richo. No one cares one way or another if they play under him. Same thing next year if we have ratten or Scott. No one will be coming for the coach
The members probably will.
 

plugger66

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The funny thing is we all want him sacked anyway. Even Plugger probably wouldn't shed too many tears if he's gone next year. He's had more of a go than any coach I can remember at the Saints and he's getting stale. Even just as a reset we need to move on. Just have to make sure we get the appointment right and have a clear plan for making the list better.
I don’t rate coaching as highly as others unless they are the best like clarko Lyon maybe Scott and Longmire. The next batch rely on good players. If he sacked we’ll bad luck. I didn’t even want him extended. Very vocal about that. I just don’t think a coach who has been in the system will magically help this group. I probably want Scott from the coaches who have coached but I doubt there is a star coach available who has coached previously. To get that we need to try an unknown. I doubt we have the balls for that.
 

mightymalaka

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Not a huge amount. Hardly big names. Now if it was Lenny or harvs that would get the members excited
I'll take that!
So long as the freckle is gone! He was always a bad appointment in my view. And how he has got through his career known as a good developer of
Kids has got me completely f*cked! Not to mention his plain boring demeanour and lack of motivational skills!
Oh and tactically he and Neeld can share a bunker in coaching heaven for eternity!
 

gringo2011

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I'll take that!
So long as the freckle is gone! He was always a bad appointment in my view. And how he has got through his career known as a good developer of
Kids has got me completely f*cked! Not to mention his plain boring demeanour and lack of motivational skills!
Oh and tactically he and Neeld can share a bunker in coaching heaven for eternity!

I think the club know his lists have been **** so they've held on to him out of sympathy.
 

mightymalaka

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I think the club know his lists have been **** so they've held on to him out of sympathy.
Love you Gringo but what would explain our prez at the time saying he was expecting top 4 just last year, when we finished bottom 4!
When we slaughtered Hawthorn and Richmond just a couple of years ago everyone was saying what an exciting young list we had!
The reality is we have way too many players that have just not come on since! So Richo being the main man has to wear that!
Obviously we now need an injection of some class to the list and on the surface right now it doesn't look the best, but whose fault is that?

Can't all be Trout man! Yeah sure he was pretty average but the fact remains we just simply do not get the best out of our players!
That's why i bang on about development so much. People point out that the players we have brought in from other clubs seem to do ok
Well to me that just reinforces that we can't develop our own well enough on a consistent basis barring a handful of exceptions!
 

plugger66

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Love you Gringo but what would explain our prez at the time saying he was expecting top 4 just last year, when we finished bottom 4!
When we slaughtered Hawthorn and Richmond just a couple of years ago everyone was saying what an exciting young list we had!
The reality is we have way too many players that have just not come on since! So Richo being the main man has to wear that!
Obviously we now need an injection of some class to the list and on the surface right now it doesn't look the best, but whose fault is that?

Can't all be Trout man! Yeah sure he was pretty average but the fact remains we just simply do not get the best out of our players!
That's why i bang on about development so much. People point out that the players we have brought in from other clubs seem to do ok
Well to me that just reinforces that we can't develop our own well enough on a consistent basis barring a handful of exceptions!
Just out of interest why can’t it be that some players aren’t good enough. How do you know it’s development because it seems most we get from other sides improve immensely. I can’t see how you can credit the previous clubs for that when you say part of our development problem is they don’t play enough. Well most we got didn’t play much at all.
 

gringo2011

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Love you Gringo but what would explain our prez at the time saying he was expecting top 4 just last year, when we finished bottom 4!
When we slaughtered Hawthorn and Richmond just a couple of years ago everyone was saying what an exciting young list we had!
The reality is we have way too many players that have just not come on since! So Richo being the main man has to wear that!
Obviously we now need an injection of some class to the list and on the surface right now it doesn't look the best, but whose fault is that?

Can't all be Trout man! Yeah sure he was pretty average but the fact remains we just simply do not get the best out of our players!
That's why i bang on about development so much. People point out that the players we have brought in from other clubs seem to do ok
Well to me that just reinforces that we can't develop our own well enough on a consistent basis barring a handful of exceptions!

Brisbane and Carlton both went after ready made talent thinking they were a few players short of playing competitive footy. Bad drafting and trades create a bad list. Both had to go back to basics and draft good talent. Both have turned the drafting around. It's not all Trout, some of it is the club desperate for quick fixes directing the strategy. The president took his eyes off the footy department and was buying their bluff that everything was going well or he was just an idiot.
 

VDS66

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I thought this thread was about Ratten.

Same old, same old...
 

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mightymalaka

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Just out of interest why can’t it be that some players aren’t good enough. How do you know it’s development because it seems most we get from other sides improve immensely. I can’t see how you can credit the previous clubs for that when you say part of our development problem is they don’t play enough. Well most we got didn’t play much at all.
The ones we get from other clubs do well with us due to opportunity with us, after they were developed elsewhere!
Our players either get too comfortable too early or simply don't play at all! You have answered your own contrary defence!
 

gringo2011

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The ones we get from other clubs do well with us due to opportunity with us, after they were developed elsewhere!
Our players either get too comfortable too early or simply don't play at all! You have answered your own contrary defence!

I don't think we have that many guns from other clubs. Hickey and Longer certainly didn't bring us much, Bruce is a good honest soldier, Membrey probably the best of them, Brown okay. Forgot Steele too.

I think Marshall, Gresham and Battle are our most promising players with an upward trajectory and they were all developed in house. Billings and Lonie both form players this year and were internally developed.

I think mature talent plays straight away so it looks more promising earlier.
 

plugger66

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The ones we get from other clubs do well with us due to opportunity with us, after they were developed elsewhere!
Our players either get too comfortable too early or simply don't play at all! You have answered your own contrary defence!
But you have claimed part of the development problem is not being played. Now for other clubs that’s a good thing. Having it both ways. And there is no doubt they have improved nearly yearly. The old chestnut of contrary when you have nothing else. Good one
 

triggering bro

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I’ll again point to what Dal & Roo said last year.

Dal said there’s a big difference between the well run clubs & the others with regard to developing talent. He said young players had more chance of reaching their potential when recruited by teams like the Cats & Pies.

Roo said our players wouldn’t know what ruthless feedback was. The people on & off the field at our club are too passive & don’t give ruthless & honest feedback.

What I take out of that is the culture at our club under Richo’s watch has been a meek & passive cruise-fest. Need some strong campaigners to lead the direction of the club & that’s why I don’t mind the idea of Scott.
 

BrutThough

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I don't think we have that many guns from other clubs. Hickey and Longer certainly didn't bring us much, Bruce is a good honest soldier, Membrey probably the best of them, Brown okay. Forgot Steele too.

I think Marshall, Gresham and Battle are our most promising players with an upward trajectory and they were all developed in house. Billings and Lonie both form players this year and were internally developed.

I think mature talent plays straight away so it looks more promising earlier.
Roberton and Carlisle have been great pick ups from other clubs.
 

mightymalaka

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But you have claimed part of the development problem is not being played. Now for other clubs that’s a good thing. Having it both ways. And there is no doubt they have improved nearly yearly. The old chestnut of contrary when you have nothing else. Good one
You do realise this pointless conversation is going nowhere! You will never concede what i'm on about, and i sure as hell will never
Come around to defending a guy who you yourself thinks should be gone!

It's all taking away from my valuable Disco time! Least in there no one has the balls to say my songs are sh!t!
I'm off to do the boogaloo! Cheers! ;)
 

Mowman

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I’ll again point to what Dal & Roo said last year.

Dal said there’s a big difference between the well run clubs & the others with regard to developing talent. He said young players had more chance of reaching their potential when recruited by teams like the Cats & Pies.

Roo said our players wouldn’t know what ruthless feedback was. The people on & off the field at our club are too passive & don’t give ruthless & honest feedback.

What I take out of that is the culture at our club under Richo’s watch has been a meek & passive cruise-fest. Need some strong campaigners to lead the direction of the club & that’s why I don’t mind the idea of Scott.
I remember listing to Dal when he was talking about that, was very critical of Richo and club
 

triggering bro

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I remember listing to Dal when he was talking about that, was very critical of Richo and club
Yup.

On the subject of the club being meek & passive & I’ll add lack of mental toughness because when we’ve had big games to possibly play finals (North in 2016 & Melb in 2017 from memory) & then the Good Friday debacle we’ve literally shat the bed Melbourne Demons style! I hate to say it but over the past few years we’ve put together some absolutely piss weak efforts that are embarrassing.
 

plugger66

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I’ll again point to what Dal & Roo said last year.

Dal said there’s a big difference between the well run clubs & the others with regard to developing talent. He said young players had more chance of reaching their potential when recruited by teams like the Cats & Pies.

Roo said our players wouldn’t know what ruthless feedback was. The people on & off the field at our club are too passive & don’t give ruthless & honest feedback.

What I take out of that is the culture at our club under Richo’s watch has been a meek & passive cruise-fest. Need some strong campaigners to lead the direction of the club & that’s why I don’t mind the idea of Scott.

Yet they have both been positive this season.
 

gringo2011

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Roberton and Carlisle have been great pick ups from other clubs.

Carlisle was a bit different because it was a high profile trade for an already established gun. The others were semi developed so could say that they were improved but not fully realised in potential.

I think also buying talent from other clubs you get a window into them over the draft in that they have exposed form against AFL quality players.
 

gringo2011

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Yup.

On the subject of the club being meek & passive & I’ll add lack of mental toughness because when we’ve had big games to possibly play finals (North in 2016 & Melb in 2017 from memory) & then the Good Friday debacle we’ve literally shat the bed Melbourne Demons style! I hate to say it but over the past few years we’ve put together some absolutely piss weak efforts that are embarrassing.

Yeah the goal kicking looks mental too. Do all the hard work and kick yourself out of it.
 
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