Are we ruthless enough?

[Mad_Hatter]

Starting a new thread while the autopsy thread is locked, been discussing this with a mate (whose not a Cats fan) about our want to be the nice guys, and be humble, and if that manifests by not being ruthless enough.
We always strive to be nice, to be the good guys, never rub it in opposition players when we take advantage of mistakes, never rub victories in opposition players, especially when we win finals/Grand Finals.
Now lets look at the Lions, all game, every time one of our players made a mistake that led to a mark/score half a dozen or more lions were running to that player to hit him and get into him about stuffing up, every tackle was over board and deliberate, even when the game was essentially over lions players were giving it to Cats even if they didn't make mistakes. COS has a poor fumble late in the game, game is OVER before that, results in a lions goal and a few players run 10m away from the celebration to go give him shit and a hit for it.
I look to the decision to allow the after the goal songs, that does nothing for us, our songs suck and our fans don't care/get involved, whereas the lions songs are great, the crowd get insanely hyped and behind them and the players feed on that. Why the **** would we say yes to having them, if that was a decision we could make? It's a Grand Final. Why say yes to a situation that could only advantage the opposition?!? Shoe on the other foot I have no doubt the Lions organisation would have said no way, yet it seems to want to be perceived as "nice" we allow other teams advantages that we can't afford to allow.
Now obviously this is a little short sighted, the most ruthless I've seen a team play would be the Cats in the 2022 Grand Final, absolute brutal display. But there was zero of that yesterday, perhaps we were just off, perhaps it just wasn't our day, but I want to see the club be ruthless on and off the field.
Hawks 13-15 were arseholes. Tigers 18-20 likewise. Lions currently.
I think it's time to pull out a bit of the arseh*le ourselves and become more ruthless, more unforgiving and start to hunt teams instead of playing nice.

 

[Warhorse]

No. We are not ruthless enough

Lack any real enforcer on our team. Even Atkins is Mr nice guy

 

[allrighty]

Hmmm. I'll have to think about this.

And I have. Frankly I am sick to death of the BS that modern sport dishes up of in your face bravado - I will cite frikken Ginnivan as an example - when a team is on top. The frikken tongue sticking out shits me to tears.

I prefer steely silence to BS bravado any day. Just give them stare and get on with it. And we do that as well as any team.

As for laughing along with the oppo players, yes that needs to go. For example Danger was having a nice chat with opponent (not sure who) just before the GF bounce and I thought WTF? Give them nothing, and so it went. A total ignore goes a LONG way believe me.

So I agree they need a reset (but no power stance please) but leave the arseholey stuff to the others - we can win without it.

 

[fpm84]

Did the club agree to the after goal songs? Would be very disappointing if that’s the case - it seemed like a terrible idea during the week and everyone knows the Brisbane players feed off the energy their crowd brings during the songs. I assumed it was another bad decision by the AFL with no club input.

 

[Cataholic]

No, we're not.

We don't have anyone that will throw their weight around.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Did the club agree to the after goal songs? Would be very disappointing if that’s the case - it seemed like a terrible idea during the week and everyone knows the Brisbane players feed off the energy their crowd brings during the songs. I assumed it was another bad decision by the AFL with no club input.

Don't quote me as fact yet, I've heard nothing official that the AFL asked both clubs, perhaps the AFL just decided to do it and told the clubs or something else, but that's what I was told prior to the game, so I'll run with it.

 

[Commando]

Absolutely not. Hard truth

Many won't want to hear this but a team like Hawthorn with an unsociable mentality probably find a way to get it done yesterday

 

[Cat Pummins]

I'm reminded of the NZ cricket team - perennial nice-guys, always thereabouts, but rarely do they get the chocolates.

I remember Scarlett, Chapman, Mooney, and even Stevie J had a mean streak. We do need some more of it.

 

[ekel92]

A few of our talls aren't ruthless enough. Which doesnt help when they play positions that require them to impose their will.

 

[fpm84]

Absolutely not. Hard truth

Many won't want to hear this but a team like Hawthorn with an unsociable mentality probably find a way to get it done yesterday

Are they still unsociable? Haven’t seen any of it in their past two finals campaigns.

The Hodge-Mitchell-Lewis era, absolutely.

 

[Commando]

Are they still unsociable? Haven’t seen any of it in their past two finals campaigns.

The Hodge-Mitchell-Lewis era, absolutely.

Chol put Stewart out of commission
They still have a mean streak always have its instilled in them

Bit like we play a 'beautiful' game

 

[allrighty]

Was there any betting plunge pre game I wonder?

 

[Commando]

Was there any betting plunge pre game I wonder?

Think we drifted 1.50 to 1.60
Lions shortened 2.50 to 2.40

 

[The_Todd07]

Did the club agree to the after goal songs? Would be very disappointing if that’s the case - it seemed like a terrible idea during the week and everyone knows the Brisbane players feed off the energy their crowd brings during the songs. I assumed it was another bad decision by the AFL with no club input.

Whether we allowed the songs to be played or not, it would not have made any difference at all yesterday.

I could barely hear the songs of either side coming out of the speakers, I sure as hell could hear the Brisbane fans though. They would have sung just as loud even if there was nothing being played alongside them.

Their club has done an amazing job of implementing something that the fans have embraced and now will happen no matter what. Something I have zero faith that our club or supporter base could pull off

 

[Bartel]

I'm reminded of the NZ cricket team - perennial nice-guys, always thereabouts, but rarely do they get the chocolates.

I remember Scarlett, Chapman, Mooney, and even Stevie J had a mean streak. We do need some more of it.

This is a great call and could add Milburn/Hunt to that list with some others. The second half yesterday required some hard nose players to ignite some fire, but it never came.

 

[MisterMarcus]

Starting a new thread while the autopsy thread is locked, been discussing this with a mate (whose not a Cats fan) about our want to be the nice guys, and be humble, and if that manifests by not being ruthless enough.
We always strive to be nice, to be the good guys, never rub it in opposition players when we take advantage of mistakes, never rub victories in opposition players, especially when we win finals/Grand Finals.
Now lets look at the Lions, all game, every time one of our players made a mistake that led to a mark/score half a dozen or more lions were running to that player to hit him and get into him about stuffing up, every tackle was over board and deliberate, even when the game was essentially over lions players were giving it to Cats even if they didn't make mistakes. COS has a poor fumble late in the game, game is OVER before that, results in a lions goal and a few players run 10m away from the celebration to go give him shit and a hit for it.
I look to the decision to allow the after the goal songs, that does nothing for us, our songs suck and our fans don't care/get involved, whereas the lions songs are great, the crowd get insanely hyped and behind them and the players feed on that. Why the **** would we say yes to having them, if that was a decision we could make? It's a Grand Final. Why say yes to a situation that could only advantage the opposition?!? Shoe on the other foot I have no doubt the Lions organisation would have said no way, yet it seems to want to be perceived as "nice" we allow other teams advantages that we can't afford to allow.
Now obviously this is a little short sighted, the most ruthless I've seen a team play would be the Cats in the 2022 Grand Final, absolute brutal display. But there was zero of that yesterday, perhaps we were just off, perhaps it just wasn't our day, but I want to see the club be ruthless on and off the field.
Hawks 13-15 were arseholes. Tigers 18-20 likewise. Lions currently.
I think it's time to pull out a bit of the arseh*le ourselves and become more ruthless, more unforgiving and start to hunt teams instead of playing nice.

Gee don't let Richmond supporters see this, or they'll be off on another 20 page rant about Tom Stewart

 

[MisterMarcus]

I think one problem yesterday was though, our experienced guys (who we'd expect to be the ones to fly the flag) generally had poor games.

It's much harder to get up the opposition's nose when you yourself are struggling.

 

[catman2006]

No, Mullin was getting pushed by 4 lions' players not 1 Cats player to lend him a hand in 2nd Q.

 

[Wojcinski]

We don't have an enforcer, Dangerfield seems well liked as a captain but he isn't ruthless like Selwood was on the field. It's something we miss when Stewart isn't playing and a big reason I was, and still am surprised Stewy wasn't made captain after Sel retired.

 

[iameviljez]

No, we're not.

We don't have anyone that will throw their weight around.

Nobody does. It’s not 1985. There are no “enforcers” any more.

 

[rapidfire7]

Beaten in 2008, Premiership in 2009.

Beaten in 2020, bounced back in 2022..

Beaten in 2025... ?

Will need to again be aggressive this offseason, but I really believe we have it in us to win another one in next 1-3 years.

GO CATS!

 

[Cataholic]

Nobody does. It’s not 1985. There are no “enforcers” any more.

No, it's not 1985, and I'm not looking for enforcers.

What I was trying to say is that imo we're not a fiercely physical side, Danger, Stewart and Atkins aside. We don't play particularly physical, hard footy, unsociable even, a la Hawthorn for example.

I don't think physicality would be in the first few descriptors when opposition teams review us.

in fact, right or wrong, there's been discussion over the journey about whether or not a number of our players short step from time to time.

It seems Smith has now been thrown into that conversation too.

 

[Warhorse]

I'm reminded of the NZ cricket team - perennial nice-guys, always thereabouts, but rarely do they get the chocolates.

I remember Scarlett, Chapman, Mooney, and even Stevie J had a mean streak. We do need some more of it.

Accurate unfortunately.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

It's not about having enforcers, but having a group of guys who back each other, look after each other and bully the opposition with our attack on the ball and the player with it.
When you see half a dozen lions go to one of our young players and push and shove him around while talking shit after they've made a mistake, or had a mark taken by their opponent (their fault or not), and NOT ONE Cats player go to defend them, then there's genuine concerns on our mental strength and ruthlessness to the contest. Cannot be allowed to be bullied by teams like we did yesterday, it will only result in failure.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

Starting a new thread while the autopsy thread is locked, been discussing this with a mate (whose not a Cats fan) about our want to be the nice guys, and be humble, and if that manifests by not being ruthless enough.
We always strive to be nice, to be the good guys, never rub it in opposition players when we take advantage of mistakes, never rub victories in opposition players, especially when we win finals/Grand Finals.
Now lets look at the Lions, all game, every time one of our players made a mistake that led to a mark/score half a dozen or more lions were running to that player to hit him and get into him about stuffing up, every tackle was over board and deliberate, even when the game was essentially over lions players were giving it to Cats even if they didn't make mistakes. COS has a poor fumble late in the game, game is OVER before that, results in a lions goal and a few players run 10m away from the celebration to go give him shit and a hit for it.
I look to the decision to allow the after the goal songs, that does nothing for us, our songs suck and our fans don't care/get involved, whereas the lions songs are great, the crowd get insanely hyped and behind them and the players feed on that. Why the **** would we say yes to having them, if that was a decision we could make? It's a Grand Final. Why say yes to a situation that could only advantage the opposition?!? Shoe on the other foot I have no doubt the Lions organisation would have said no way, yet it seems to want to be perceived as "nice" we allow other teams advantages that we can't afford to allow.
Now obviously this is a little short sighted, the most ruthless I've seen a team play would be the Cats in the 2022 Grand Final, absolute brutal display. But there was zero of that yesterday, perhaps we were just off, perhaps it just wasn't our day, but I want to see the club be ruthless on and off the field.
Hawks 13-15 were arseholes. Tigers 18-20 likewise. Lions currently.
I think it's time to pull out a bit of the arseh*le ourselves and become more ruthless, more unforgiving and start to hunt teams instead of playing nice.

Scores were level well into the third. You just lost to a better team who beat you 3 out of 4 games in 2025 as well as the prelim in 24 to become champs a week later. Geelong is still a champion team. You can't and won't win them all.