Ashes Replacement for Michael Hussey

[Harmichael]

DWTA, not because Wade is great, but because Haddin was absolutely dreadful last summer. Wade's keeping is quite ragged to the spinners, but at least he doesn't miss straightforward chances off the pacers (remember that miss off Pattinson's bowling when Gambhir was batting?).

If he improves his keeping to the spinners, Wade would probably be Test-class.

That's looking like a very big "if" at this stage. Guess in a way it's lucky for him we currently don't have a class spinner creating a lot of chances.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

DWTA, not because Wade is great, but because Haddin was absolutely dreadful last summer. Wade's keeping is quite ragged to the spinners, but at least he doesn't miss straightforward chances off the pacers (remember that miss off Pattinson's bowling when Gambhir was batting?).

If he improves his keeping to the spinners, Wade would probably be Test-class.

He also seems slow with his footwork to his left on the quicker bowlers, particularly with starting to move to the leg side with right-handers facing.

 

[Harmichael]

He also seems slow with his footwork to his left on the quicker bowlers, particularly with starting to move to the leg side with right-handers facing.

Yep. Sad fact of the matter is our test team currently has a bloke who is about the fifth or sixth best keeper in the country behind the stumps and at least three of the others are at least as good a batsman while the others at the very least don't negate the runs they score with the runs they concede and the straightforward chances they miss.

 

[Phone]

He also seems slow with his footwork to his left on the quicker bowlers, particularly with starting to move to the leg side with right-handers facing.

Which obviously leads to having to dive for catches others can take moving on their feet. This isn't so bad when fully fit and fully in form. But Haddin, who was much the same, showed last year that when out of form and playing with injury, it can be a liability. So I guess you just gotta hope injury stays away from Wade

 

[Phone]

Yep. Sad fact of the matter is our test team currently has a bloke who is about the fifth or sixth best keeper in the country behind the stumps and at least three of the others are at least as good a batsman while the others at the very least don't negate the runs they score with the runs they concede and the straightforward chances they miss.

nah that's not true.

 

[bird_man]

Wa

Yep. Sad fact of the matter is our test team currently has a bloke who is about the fifth or sixth best keeper in the country behind the stumps and at least three of the others are at least as good a batsman while the others at the very least don't negate the runs they score with the runs they concede and the straightforward chances they miss.

Wade's batting is a mile in front of any other keeper and he is only 25. I'd have him in the side for his batting alone.

 

[TJ1996]

1. Warner
2. Cowan
3. Hughes
4. Clarke
5. Khawaja
6. Watson
7. Wade
8. Johnson
9. Siddle
10. Starc
11. Lyon/Zampa/Boyce

 

[Super Hans]

Not confident with Johnson playing at 6 this game, even if it's just a trail.

1. Warner
2. Cowan
3. Hughes
4. Khawaja/Doolan
5. Clarke
6. Watson
7. Wade
8. Johnson/Starc
9. Siddle
10. Pattinson
11. Lyon

That's the team I'd be taking over there.

 

[Harmichael]

nah that's not true.

Yes it is and that's not even including Haddin -who I don't want back, but is currently the only batsmen to have scored more than one century in the Shield this season. Paine when in form if anything is a superior batsman to Wade as is Ludeman whilst Neville & and even Wade's Victorian understudy -who is also a better keeper- Hanscomb are just as competant with the bat, (and no I'm not just talking Kentucky Fried Cricket). Hartley's not as good but is the best actual keeper and Triffit clearly has considerable batting potential.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Yes it is and that's not even including Haddin -who I don't want back, but is currently the only batsmen to have scored more than one century in the Shield this season. Paine when in form if anything is a superior batsman to Wade as is Ludeman whilst Neville & and even Wade's Victorian understudy -who is also a better keeper- Hanscomb are just as competant with the bat, (and no I'm not just talking Kentucky Fried Cricket). Hartley's not as good but is the best actual keeper and Triffit clearly has considerable batting potential.

I don't want to disrespectful but you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Haddin and Nevill are the only keepers in Australia who cases could be made for in regards to being as good a batsman as Wade. I've made my thought's on Paine as a batsman known in the thread for last night's big bash game and page six of this thread so there is no point in repeating them.

Ludeman has a few good games in the BBL and he's a star batsman? Please. He hits the ball cleanly and is a nice batsman to watch but he averages 23 at FC level. He is starting to show that he could improve that rapidly but until he starts making good runs in the Shield, he should be no where near this discussion.

Handscomb is simply not as a good a batsman as Wade (nor keeper for that matter). He struggles against express pace bowling and has only looked like a future Australian player when he has played South Australia. He has a solid technique and good temperament but is still only young and not even in Victoria's best Shield side when everyone is available.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

I don't want to disrespectful but you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Haddin and Nevill are the only keepers in Australia who cases could be made for in regards to being as good a batsman as Wade. I've made my thought's on Paine as a batsman known in the thread for last night's big bash game and page six of this thread so there is no point in repeating them.

Ludeman has a few good games in the BBL and he's a star batsman? Please. He hits the ball cleanly and is a nice batsman to watch but he averages 23 at FC level. He is starting to show that he could improve that rapidly but until he starts making good runs in the Shield, he should be no where near this discussion.

Handscomb is simply not as a good a batsman as Wade (nor keeper for that matter). He struggles against express pace bowling and has only looked like a future Australian player when he has played South Australia. He has a solid technique and good temperament but is still only young and not even in Victoria's best Shield side when everyone is available.

Triffitt probably deserves a mention as an up and comer (ahead of Ludeman and Handscombe IMO).

 

[Ducky Tie]

Triffitt probably deserves a mention as an up and comer (ahead of Ludeman and Handscombe IMO).

Yeah I agree that Triffitt > Handscomb and Ludeman. I just didn't mention him because he/she didn't claim that he was a better batsman than Wade.

 

[DaRick]

IMO the only realistic competitor for Wade at this stage is Chris Hartley. Hartley isn't as good a batsman and doesn't have as much scope for improvement as Wade, but he is a better keeper. Tim Paine's form has not been particularly impressive since returning from injury, Tom Triffitt needs to develop more, Peter Nevill currently does not have the gloves for NSW and Brad Haddin is Brad Haddin.

 

[Harmichael]

Yeah I agree that Triffitt > Handscomb and Ludeman. I just didn't mention him because he/she didn't claim that he was a better batsman than Wade.

Said Hanscomb was a better keeper - which he is - and just as competent a batsmen, but on reflection I'll concede maybe Wade is better with the bat at this stage.



(On a side note: In form, Paine is vastly superior to Wade in both areas and it's quite laughable to suggest otherwise.)



Bottom line - I stand by my original comment that all are superior keepers and Wade is just not a test standard wicketkeeper IMO - and that costs you on the scoreboard just as much as a keeper who doesn't contribute with the bat. In the modern game, unless you're a once in a generation freak like Gilchrist, if one skill is below par it not only tends to nullify the other but will eventually start to effect it as well.

 

[Marks Prosciutto]

I'm starting to wonder why we never made more of an effort to keep Phil Jaques around after his injuries, I realise It would be hard for him to come back from, but surely a test average of 47.47 warrants a second chance??

 

[Marks Prosciutto]

Forgive me as I have very little knowledge of most cricketers of that era, but was Gilchrist the best keeper of that generation? or just the best batsman?

I know I've heard a few people say that Healy was a superior keeper but Gilchrist was obviously a better batsman, just curious as to how guys like Wade Seccombe and Ryan Campbell compared to Gilly.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Said Hanscomb was a better keeper - which he is - and just as competent a batsmen, but on reflection I'll concede maybe Wade is better with the bat at this stage.



(On a side note: In form, Paine is vastly superior to Wade in both areas and it's quite laughable to suggest otherwise.

I'm not going to debate who is the better keeper out of Wade and Handscomb, we'll just go around in circles.

I never said Wade is a better gloveman than Paine.

It's laughable to suggest that a guy who averages 40 at FC level is a better batsman than the guy who averages 30? Ok.

 

[Cleavy]

Seccombe better keeper. Campbell below Gilly in both areas, but capable.

 

[Black Diamond]

I'm starting to wonder why we never made more of an effort to keep Phil Jaques around after his injuries, I realise It would be hard for him to come back from, but surely a test average of 47.47 warrants a second chance??

Jaques was injured pretty badly and Katich ended up replacing him partway through the 2008 West Indies tour. Katich did well and Hayden who had a few credits in the bank and held his spot until retiring/getting tapped against SA in 2008-09. Jaques was still in a bad way during the '08-9 Shield and didn't play much while Hughes was on fire, thus getting a cap against SA in 2009. Jaques then just slid down the pecking order and wasn't really able to get his body right (back injury IIRC).

 

[bird_man]

Yes it is and that's not even including Haddin -who I don't want back, but is currently the only batsmen to have scored more than one century in the Shield this season. Paine when in form if anything is a superior batsman to Wade as is Ludeman whilst Neville & and even Wade's Victorian understudy -who is also a better keeper- Hanscomb are just as competant with the bat, (and no I'm not just talking Kentucky Fried Cricket). Hartley's not as good but is the best actual keeper and Triffit clearly has considerable batting potential.

Either your taking the piss or you know very little about cricket. Paine in his whe career has one first class hundred at an average of 30 whilst Wade has 6? At an average of over 40. Paine also has a couple of years on Wade. Wade in my opinion is good enough to bat in our top 6.

 

[Black Diamond]

Either your taking the piss or you know very little about cricket. Paine in his whe career has one first class hundred at an average of 30 whilst Wade has 6? At an average of over 40. Paine also has a couple of years on Wade. Wade in my opinion is good enough to bat in our top 6.

Wade may be good enough to hold down six given our current structure, but I don't think he is actually in the top six in the country.

 

[carnthemlions]

.

IMO the only realistic competitor for Wade at this stage is Chris Hartley. Hartley isn't as good a batsman and doesn't have as much scope for improvement as Wade, but he is a better keeper. Tim Paine's form has not been particularly impressive since returning from injury, Tom Triffitt needs to develop more, Peter Nevill currently does not have the gloves for NSW and Brad Haddin is Brad Haddin.

I agree. Hartley might have a similar average to Paine, but he's made 7 hundreds in the shield (including one in the final).
Who are triffit and Nevill? Seriously, they shouldn't even be considered yet.
Wade may fail with the bat fairly often, but he can also play the first counter-attacking innings where haddin would've just thrown his wicket away.

 

[eth-dog]

Said Hanscomb was a better keeper - which he is - and just as competent a batsmen, but on reflection I'll concede maybe Wade is better with the bat at this stage.



(On a side note: In form, Paine is vastly superior to Wade in both areas and it's quite laughable to suggest otherwise.)



Bottom line - I stand by my original comment that all are superior keepers and Wade is just not a test standard wicketkeeper IMO - and that costs you on the scoreboard just as much as a keeper who doesn't contribute with the bat. In the modern game, unless you're a once in a generation freak like Gilchrist, if one skill is below par it not only tends to nullify the other but will eventually start to effect it as well.

Handscomb is no where near the keeper Wade is. He's only keeping because that's a way to guarantee selection when Wade's playing for Australia and Victoria have their best batsmen in (Rogers, Quiney, Maxwell, Hussey, White, McDonald). Wade is a far better bat than Handscomb as well, you must hate the lad if you think he's not as good as the comb.

Paine has a FC average of 31. Wade has a FC average of 40. Wade has 4 more centuries, 1 more 50, and is a vastly superior batsman to Paine. It's extremely laughable to suggest that Paine is a better batsman than Wade.

 

[Winter]

Drop Watson to #6.

Clarke to #4, Khawaja to #5.

 

[Ian Dargie]

Drop Watson to #6.

Clarke to #4, Khawaja to #5.

I reckon there's some chance we will consider playing four quicks at some point.

In that case, there may be a push to including a spinning all-rounder, Maxwell or Hussey, in our top 7.

Otherwise, I agree, with a lingering question mark over Cowan.