Religion Ask a Christian - Part 2

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Rosscoe

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Jesus is not demanding that you literally hate your family. He is using hyperbole to illustrate the steep cost of following him. Any prospective follower must be glad to give up everything, to love him unreservedly—to sell all in order to have him as your highest treasure (Matt. 13:44–46). Our affections for Christ must be of such an intensity and quality that, by comparison, all other loves seem like hate.

This is the first of three sobering warnings in Luke 14:26-33 against making a hasty decision to follow Jesus. A genuine disciple must:
  1. Love Jesus even more than your earthly family (v. 26).
  2. Take up your cross and follow him (v. 27).
  3. Be willing to lay down everything—even your life—and go hard after him (v. 33).
A wise builder won’t construct a tower unless he’s first made certain he has enough materials to complete it. A wise king won’t go to war unless he knows his army possesses enough firepower to have a fighting chance at repelling the enemy.

We all have questions about those words in the OT. You react to them with more fervour than I do. Does not mean they are not questionable. We all question these words.

Yes Vdubs, we must take up our cross and put god first. If your family are a pack of thieves; you must put god first and stop stealing, even if it means losing your family because of it.
 

Vdubs

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So you cannot love your family first and then God or at worst, both equally? that's Odd, cause God is asking me to love him ahead of the people who brought me to this world. You can do both, a creator who created the world will not demand 'love me first and then....', that's something that my ex jealous GF did. Jesus really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

This is the worst excuse i have heard mate. Did you read the verse just before that? if not let me help:

“Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.

35 For I have come to set a man against his father,

and a daughter against her mother,

and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law;

36 and one’s foes will be members of one’s own household.


AND Don't forget

Whoever is not with me [Jesus] is against me"

Matthew 12:30 = Luke 11:23, Bible (NIV)

You don't see what he is trying to do here? why does it have me to 'pick me orelse....'? Yeah you can't say it's OT now either. That verse sounds like Hitler or Stalin, honestly.

Just a loving poetry right? If you can't love your mother who carried you in her womb for 9 months and the creator of the universe throws a tantrum over it like he did quite often in the OT and then your deity have issues. Are you seriously telling me this is a 'follow me first orelse your not worthy" scenario? this is just ******* . Just ****** morality.

And hate really means hate. In greek it's already translates to hate. Could 'God' have not used a better word here? considering he is god?





See above. It's like a jealous ex- relationship, no thanks, terrible teaching.




That's odd, considering God is defined as loving , kind and tolerant, i see no evidence of that.
Well, it does appear you are at least a believer in God. You are clearly appalled at his methodologies in the OT, and plenty in the NT it seems.
So you either believe in God and reject Him- which sounds risky to me- do you really want to mess with an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent God?
Or you outright refuse to believe God is real, in which case, why the aggro about meaningless words in a meaningless book which has no relevance to you?
 

Total Power

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Well, it does appear you are at least a believer in God. You are clearly appalled at his methodologies in the OT, and plenty in the NT it seems.
So you either believe in God and reject Him- which sounds risky to me- do you really want to mess with an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent God?
Or you outright refuse to believe God is real, in which case, why the aggro about meaningless words in a meaningless book which has no relevance to you?

I thought we discussed this plenty of times already, i have stated clearly i am not an atheist and i don't 'believe' in anything which evidence, specially when it involves outrageous claims and above all i don't preach. I PM'ed you stuff (only cause you asked for it), maybe you haven't read it , maybe you should, but that is irrelevant here. Muslims believe in God, but not your God, same with Hindus. You still don't get the cigar.

On one hand you claim, God is kind, merciful, loving and tolerant..and then defend those atrocities saying these are God's ways. Makes me question what do you mean by love, kindness and tolerance? calling people of other faith ****** ? sending anyone who doesn't agree with me to hell? saying If you are not with me you are against me? Btw, Stalin said, if you are not with me, you are against me. You get my drift.

I see you are going to go any extent to defend your premise that God is loving kind and tolerant despite little or no evidence and i quoted the NT there. I am still waiting for your answer, in what light can you justify, rape, murder and genocide?
 

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Vdubs

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I thought we discussed this plenty of times already, i have stated clearly i am not an atheist and i don't 'believe' in anything I PM'ed you stuff, maybe you haven't read it , maybe you should, but that is irrelevant here. Muslims believe in God, but not your God, same with Hindus. You still don't get the cigar.

On one hand you claim, God is kind, merciful, loving and tolerant..and then defend those atrocities saying these are God's ways. Makes me question what do you mean by love, kindness and tolerance? calling people of other faith ****** ? sending anyone who doesn't agree with me to hell? saying If you are not with me you are against me? Btw, Stalin said, if you are not with me, you are against me. You get my drift.

I see you are going to go any extent to defend your premise that God is loving kind and tolerant despite little or no evidence and i quoted the NT there. I am still waiting for your answer, in what light can you justify, rape, murder and genocide?
These are all your words.
I have already said we ALL share your questions.
But rather than ride the waves with God, you want to challenge. i see that as a no-win for you.
 

Total Power

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These are all your words.
I have already said we ALL share your questions.
But rather than ride the waves with God, you want to challenge. i see that as a no-win for you.

You keep saying read OT in the light of NT. So i am asking you under what light would you agree a 'kind, loving, tolerant' God, commanded rape? or admit your premise is wrong?

There is no challenge, you can't challenge a deity which doesn't exist. My challenge is the book you believe to be true, not a non existant deity.
 

Total Power

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Why should Jesus be accepted as the "Redeemer"? Just because he supposedly said he was?

Everything is taken on face value. God is kind but as long as you are 'with him'. If you dare to think for yourself by using your own brain, then you are against him. But kind loving and tolerant apparently. I am tired of asking the question and now i am starting to question if they know the meaning of love and tolerance at all. If they said God is a brutal *******, then we can start to agree.
 

Evolved1

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When god performs miraculous healings, he's a good god.
When god is raping and committing genocide, he's mysterious.

I suppose it's the same reasoning Muslims use when god is flying planes into buildings. He's mysterious and beyond questioning. Who are we to question his ways?
 

Total Power

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When god performs miraculous healings, he's a good god.
When god is raping and committing genocide, he's mysterious.

I suppose it's the same reasoning Muslims use when god is flying planes into buildings. He's mysterious and beyond questioning. Who are we to question his ways?

Indeed. Christians believe that all humans are God’s property, to do with as He pleases. That’s the textbook definition of chattel slavery. Thus slavery is literally at the heart of Christianity – no wonder the Bible has so little to say against it.
 

Rosscoe

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When god performs miraculous healings, he's a good god.
When god is raping and committing genocide, he's mysterious.

I suppose it's the same reasoning Muslims use when god is flying planes into buildings. He's mysterious and beyond questioning. Who are we to question his ways?

God performs as a rapper; now I have heard it all.
 

SBD Gonzalez

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Kidding, right?
When god performs miraculous healings, he's a good god.
When god is raping and committing genocide, he's mysterious.

I suppose it's the same reasoning Muslims use when god is flying planes into buildings. He's mysterious and beyond questioning. Who are we to question his ways?
Yep. Everyone thanks god when they win but no-one blames god for when they lose.

But this has been pointed out to religious believers over and over and yet still they keep believing.

It’s almost like they find the freedom from logic and accountability rather exhilarating.
 

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Rosscoe

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Do you think he was listening to Eminem while he impregnated Mary?
Even Marshall would have to admit, that there has only ever been one god emcee. Whose cadence of breath gave birth to styles, used by all rappers that came after him.
 

Vdubs

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You keep saying read OT in the light of NT. So i am asking you under what light would you agree a 'kind, loving, tolerant' God, commanded rape? or admit your premise is wrong?

There is no challenge, you can't challenge a deity which doesn't exist. My challenge is the book you believe to be true, not a non existant deity.
So you do not believe there is God
 

Vdubs

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I thought we discussed this plenty of times already, i have stated clearly i am not an atheist and i don't 'believe' in anything which evidence, specially when it involves outrageous claims and above all i don't preach. I PM'ed you stuff (only cause you asked for it), maybe you haven't read it , maybe you should, but that is irrelevant here. Muslims believe in God, but not your God, same with Hindus. You still don't get the cigar.

On one hand you claim, God is kind, merciful, loving and tolerant..and then defend those atrocities saying these are God's ways. Makes me question what do you mean by love, kindness and tolerance? calling people of other faith ****** ? sending anyone who doesn't agree with me to hell? saying If you are not with me you are against me? Btw, Stalin said, if you are not with me, you are against me. You get my drift.

I see you are going to go any extent to defend your premise that God is loving kind and tolerant despite little or no evidence and i quoted the NT there. I am still waiting for your answer, in what light can you justify, rape, murder and genocide?
I come from the premise that God is all powerful, knowing and present, and He can and does whatever is needed. Who am i to question? But we do question. Why do we lose friends and family at inexplicable times? And often in horrible circumstances?
Why are there suicide bombers?
We will never know but God I believe in, and try to respect Him at all times, even when most difficult to do so.
 

Total Power

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I come from the premise that God is all powerful, knowing and present, and He can and does whatever is needed. Who am i to question? But we do question. Why do we lose friends and family at inexplicable times? And often in horrible circumstances?
Why are there suicide bombers?
We will never know but God I believe in, and try to respect Him at all times, even when most difficult to do so.

So what exactly do you mean by love, kindness, tolerance and peace then? i am starting to question if you know the meaning of this. Do you believe this cause you BELIEVE that's what God is, or you going by the evidence in the Bible? If it's the latter, where's the evidence?

The suicide bombers 'think' they are carrying the duty of 'honour' by being a martyr. Such is the power of brainwashing. People die all the time cause that's the way of nature (cause there is no intervening God like you this there is), that is a very reasonable explanation that death and disease is rife in nature. Things rot, they kill each other all the time. God got nothing to do with this, never did.

The deity you are talking about doesn't deserve respect. He wants slavery, he despises anyone who can think for themselves, he despises anyone who dares to love his family first. He speaks for slavery, for homphobia, for hate speech against people who believe otherwise. In what world is that tolerant?

Jesus said, 'if you are not with me, you are against me', multiple times. A few others who said in history include Stalin, Mussolini, Pol Pot etc. You see what i am getting at?

You do not have to be for an against something. Live and let live. I am saying the teachings of your God are sh*t. And should not be worthy of respect is a secular society. Maybe you wish to move to an ultra religious rathole?
 

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