Religion Ask a Christian - Continued in Part 2

[Chief]

Continued in Part Two:

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/ask-a-christian-part-2.1295001/unread

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

We don't need evidence. Faith.
And until you heroes can explain and prove how we came to be, God is the answer.
Your theories do not stack up.
Nothing comes from nothing.

No. Horseschitte.

Until we can prove how we came to be, “we don’t know” is the answer.

 

[Gbonl]

Are you saying that you think that the energy of life could pass on after death, or transfer to a different form, but not a person's individual identity (ie. consciousness and memory)?

I have no idea myself, but I was watching "Soul" (Pixar - brilliant show) the other day and there was a part where all dead people were on an escalator to a huge ball of white light and as they got closer they stopped chatting, lost their features, became a dot of energy and where absorbed into the light.

For some reason it completely freaked me out.

Now this is all from a Christian perspective, take it or leave it, but I don’t think you will get many other theories on this.

Don’t be freaked out, satan uses trauma to enter.

This illustrates the 2nd Heaven perfectly, as I have said most of the screenwriters draw their inspiration from here. They cannot access the 3rd Heaven what Jesus is talking about.

Of course they will portray ‘souls’ as dissolving into light. Satan was an arch angel that thought he could do a better job than God.
He is referred to as the angel of light, it can get confusing, but what the movie showed is the ceiling of the 2nd Heaven.

What does the Bible mean when it calls Satan an "angel of light"? - The Billy Graham Evangelistic Association of Canada

Billy Graham writes, "The Bible doesn't say Satan is an angel of light; it says he only masquerades as an angel of light."

www.billygraham.ca

Yes souls could dissolve back into light, it could be a metaphor for the lake of fire.

I wonder if Pixar will ever do a movie on the 3rd Heaven and God’s Kingdom the home of Jesus. Please let me know if there is one.

 

[Evolved1]

God provides those things, yet I don’t worship them. Was merely an example.

People worship, drugs, music, artists, sex, the occult, demons, movies, games, nature, animals, mind, sport stars, popes the list is endless. Some of these items have spiritual connections and once you worship them they can be very possessive.

I choose to worship God and his only son Jesus, take up my cross and die to the world. It’s not an easy path, but I have tried most things the world has to offer, never got into mega evil, but it never fully satisfied me like my walk with Christ.

Anything that separates you from God could be an idol. Only you know what you dream about, it could be crypto currencies. Anything you place above God could lead to a fall.

Being an atheist, I place everything above god.

The thing that separates me from god is his failure to provide any evidence for his existence.

What you define as 'worship' is merely part of being human. There's nothing wrong with finding pleasure in sports or music for example. The passage of 'taking up your cross and follow me' is one that churches use to manipulate people into giving them more money. Look at the way mega churches and the Catholic church have built up assets.

 

[Evolved1]

If all atheists actually picked up the Bible, but said to God before they start reading it- "ok God, I really need to know this is real. Please reveal yourself to me", you would have an entirely different appreciation. Reading it with the motive of looking for errors, inconsistencies, violence etc. will continue to frustrate you and you will miss the pearls.

It may surprise you to know that atheists don't talk to god.

 

[Evolved1]

No. Horseschitte.

Until we can prove how we came to be, “we don’t know” is the answer.

Science is the methodology we'll use to get there. Not faith.

 

[Boston tiger]

Where did this number come from? There is no evidence that the 'Massacre of the Innocents' was an actual historical event. Only Matthew mentions it. Philo and Josephus do not despite recording many of Herod's other misdeeds. The story is modelled on the older story of Pharaoh's attempt to kill the Israelite children in Exodus.

Misdeeds?

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Science is the methodology we'll use to get there. Not faith.

Quite agree. But given science has not provided all the answers, and that those who respect science over wishful thinking freely acknowledge that, I just find it alarming that a grown adult can leap to the conclusion that if we don’t know all the answers, that proves it must be god then.

 

[Gbonl]

Being an atheist, I place everything above god.

The thing that separates me from god is his failure to provide any evidence for his existence.

What you define as 'worship' is merely part of being human. There's nothing wrong with finding pleasure in sports or music for example. The passage of 'taking up your cross and follow me' is one that churches use to manipulate people into giving them more money. Look at the way mega churches and the Catholic church have built up assets.

That’s fair enough, appreciate your honesty.

You’re a seeker of truth and is truth subjective or ultimate?

It doesn’t matter what we believe it won’t change truth.

Whatever laws our reality are founded on they still apply and will until this reality ceases.

We need to know those laws if we want to live a productive and harmonious life.

What evidence would satisfy your enquiry to prove the existence of God?

What if we are an expression of an artist? Can you conclude anything about Picasso by looking at his art?

Lots of churches are full of idols, there is nothing stopping anyone from starting a church. Look at the NDIS attracts a lot of vultures.

The last church I went to, did deliverance prayer with some church elders and identified unclean spirits in them, the elders were given the opportunity to repent. They chose not to and the last conversation I had with them was that they plan to destroy me, because I can see the junk that is in them, but they don’t want to give up their prideful title of church elder.

Rod Owen former StKilda player featured in an ABC article, on how we was abused in the little league. Predators will always seek to prey on the vulnerable, whether that is church, school, sports, scouts

Many churches don’t do deliverance so these predators can go through the system with no screening in place. If you really hated God, would you get into the Church system to take it down?

This is where I hesitate to call myself a Christian (prefer follower of Christ) I have been to 1 church service in 2 years.

My view in taking up your cross, is that if it wasn’t for Jesus paying the price on the cross for us, that could have been me at judgement(I recently asked for Gods judgement on my life and He revealed 3 key point, but that is for another post)

So my cross is where my separation with God/sin is nailed and I carry it daily as a reminder of my past, but also how I have been set free because of Jesus. Everytime I sin, I repent and put it on my cross.

Dieing to the world. If I see a beautiful woman, I try not to look, is impossible really, but I aim to deny lusting for her out of respect for my wife, but also as Jesus said that is adultery.

This all probably sounds insane to an atheist, but that is my perspective using Christ as my reference point.

 

[Roylion]

Misdeeds?

Misdeeds. Like killing three of his own sons and one of his wives.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Nice one, how do you know the vase isn’t behind the counter

Show your work

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Did Jesus dance and was there music?

 

[Total Power]

What evidence would satisfy your enquiry to prove the existence of God?

A few...you can start with,

1. Why do you need a creator when the Law of TD states you don't need 'creation' to happen. Where do you see creation when we see miles and miles of lifeless rocks floating around? eventually we will all get sucked into a blackhole like millions of galaxies do, death and destruction and then creation is natural. TD states it goes on forever. Your mind is hardwire for a cause, simple because time exists and time only exists in our head. Time is an abstract concept, readup on M-theory. We dont actually need a creator, you are invoking one when there's none needed. Why invoke a creator in it when there's none needed? Cause Bible said so? pretty piss poor reason to begin with, consider none of the Gospels are original texts anyway, in short, we simply don't know Jesus if he existed, what he preached exactly. All dependent on the lunatic Paul who had a vision after he had a stroke on the way to Damascus, you know what they call that in medical terms right? what a reason to believe.

There plenty of signs of asteroids pummeling the earth throughout history and destroying many lifeforms. You realise 95% of all lifeforms already been extinct before humans arrived on earth? can't be creation unless the creator is a bad bad one.

2. Evolution is so random, for many years it killed millions and millions of infants (before C section) cause a womans vaginal canal is not big enough for a childs heath (but perfect for a chimp). Evolution puts so many species at a massive disadvantage, including humans. Junk DNA, Useless genes which serves no function, Darwins point, wisdom teeth, appendix etc etc, so many useless design on human body. Where are the signs of a creator here?

There is nothing artistic about this, all it screams of is randomness, this is why death and disease is rife in nature.

3.An omnipotent creator creates * ups, destroys, * ups, nukes his whole creation again *s up, sends his son again, *s up and now people are waiting for rapture as if his first appearance as Jesus solved anything. It made matters worse. He must have known this would happen all along, being omniscient? right? so why create? or are you suggesting he didn't know any of this?
Then comes the curse. Creates and Adam even and them banishes them despite Eve had no capability of judging right from wrong. Imagine you have a child and your child does something you told him not to, would you curse him and then curse his grandkids and everyone born - there from, cause the child had no capability to reason? it's an absurd proportion to curse everyone cause 2 dinosaurs who didn't know what's right or wrong disobeyed god.

You are exactly following a Fuhrer, no difference between Hitler and God. Obey orelse suffer for eternity right after you die and come to me.

What a terrible slave mentality to follow a tyrant like that, i really feel for ya bro, it must be hard to lead your one and only life being a slave.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

That’s fair enough, appreciate your honesty.

You’re a seeker of truth and is truth subjective or ultimate?

It doesn’t matter what we believe it won’t change truth.

Whatever laws our reality are founded on they still apply and will until this reality ceases.

We need to know those laws if we want to live a productive and harmonious life.

What evidence would satisfy your enquiry to prove the existence of God?

What if we are an expression of an artist? Can you conclude anything about Picasso by looking at his art?

Lots of churches are full of idols, there is nothing stopping anyone from starting a church. Look at the NDIS attracts a lot of vultures.

The last church I went to, did deliverance prayer with some church elders and identified unclean spirits in them, the elders were given the opportunity to repent. They chose not to and the last conversation I had with them was that they plan to destroy me, because I can see the junk that is in them, but they don’t want to give up their prideful title of church elder.

Rod Owen former StKilda player featured in an ABC article, on how we was abused in the little league. Predators will always seek to prey on the vulnerable, whether that is church, school, sports, scouts

Many churches don’t do deliverance so these predators can go through the system with no screening in place. If you really hated God, would you get into the Church system to take it down?

This is where I hesitate to call myself a Christian (prefer follower of Christ) I have been to 1 church service in 2 years.

My view in taking up your cross, is that if it wasn’t for Jesus paying the price on the cross for us, that could have been me at judgement(I recently asked for Gods judgement on my life and He revealed 3 key point, but that is for another post)

So my cross is where my separation with God/sin is nailed and I carry it daily as a reminder of my past, but also how I have been set free because of Jesus. Everytime I sin, I repent and put it on my cross.

Dieing to the world. If I see a beautiful woman, I try not to look, is impossible really, but I aim to deny lusting for her out of respect for my wife, but also as Jesus said that is adultery.

This all probably sounds insane to an atheist, but that is my perspective using Christ as my reference point.

Optimistic Nihilism: A Psychologist's Personal Story & …

Through surprisingly good storytelling, David “Don’t Ca…

www.goodreads.com

 

[Boston tiger]

Quite agree. But given science has not provided all the answers, and that those who respect science over wishful thinking freely acknowledge that, I just find it alarming that a grown adult can leap to the conclusion that if we don’t know all the answers, that proves it must be god then.

It use to amaze that an adult like yourself could leap to that conclusion. But after extensive research into the world of neuroscience it now makes sense why someone like yourself could and does think that.

 

[Boston tiger]

Misdeeds. Like killing three of his own sons and one of his wives.

Exactly. I’ll think you will find that after doing your research on this paranoid psycho that killing infants in an obscure little village is the least of his “ misdeeds” and hence quite a plausible event. And probably more importantly in your case still insignificant enough to be one of the many events lost in history.

 

[Gbonl]

A few...you can start with,

1. Why do you need a creator when the Law of TD states you don't need 'creation' to happen. Where do you see creation when we see miles and miles of lifeless rocks floating around? eventually we will all get sucked into a blackhole like millions of galaxies do, death and destruction and then creation is natural. TD states it goes on forever. Your mind is hardwire for a cause, simple because time exists and time only exists in our head. Time is an abstract concept, readup on M-theory. We dont actually need a creator, you are invoking one when there's none needed. Why invoke a creator in it when there's none needed? Cause Bible said so? pretty piss poor reason to begin with, consider none of the Gospels are original texts anyway, in short, we simply don't know Jesus if he existed, what he preached exactly. All dependent on the lunatic Paul who had a vision after he had a stroke on the way to Damascus, you know what they call that in medical terms right? what a reason to believe.

There plenty of signs of asteroids pummeling the earth throughout history and destroying many lifeforms. You realise 95% of all lifeforms already been extinct before humans arrived on earth? can't be creation unless the creator is a bad bad one.

2. Evolution is so random, for many years it killed millions and millions of infants (before C section) cause a womans vaginal canal is not big enough for a childs heath (but perfect for a chimp). Evolution puts so many species at a massive disadvantage, including humans. Junk DNA, Useless genes which serves no function, Darwins point, wisdom teeth, appendix etc etc, so many useless design on human body. Where are the signs of a creator here?

There is nothing artistic about this, all it screams of is randomness, this is why death and disease is rife in nature.

3.An omnipotent creator creates fu** ups, destroys, fu** ups, nukes his whole creation again fu**s up, sends his son again, fu**s up and now people are waiting for rapture as if his first appearance as Jesus solved anything. It made matters worse. He must have known this would happen all along, being omniscient? right? so why create? or are you suggesting he didn't know any of this?
Then comes the curse. Creates and Adam even and them banishes them despite Eve had no capability of judging right from wrong. Imagine you have a child and your child does something you told him not to, would you curse him and then curse his grandkids and everyone born - there from, cause the child had no capability to reason? it's an absurd proportion to curse everyone cause 2 dinosaurs who didn't know what's right or wrong disobeyed god.

You are exactly following a Fuhrer, no difference between Hitler and God. Obey orelse suffer for eternity right after you die and come to me.

What a terrible slave mentality to follow a tyrant like that, i really feel for ya bro, it must be hard to lead your one and only life being a slave.

I have had similar thoughts and think it is something you need to process. It won’t matter what I answer, you are too clever for my answers. Jesus did say only the childlike will enter Heaven.

Show me one person that is not in bondage to the world, family career, work, drugs, lifestyle, at least I know what altar I am under and who I serve.

 

[Gbonl]

Optimistic Nihilism: A Psychologist's Personal Story & …

Through surprisingly good storytelling, David “Don’t Ca…

www.goodreads.com

Thanks, will look into it, but I don’t think it will make any difference as VDubs would say, I’m too far gone.

Look at a building - there were plans,
look at this Earth - there were plans

Earth might seem far from perfect, but I ask how would you create a world?

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

It use to amaze that an adult like yourself could leap to that conclusion. But after extensive research into the world of neuroscience it now makes sense why someone like yourself could and does think that.

Well by all means share your extensive research into the world of neuroscience with us.

Just so you know, my six year old daughter said "Daddy, I think I believe in Jesus." I said, "that's interesting darling, why do you say that?" She replied "Well, we don't know who made the world" (I didn't pull her up on the fact that there was no need to use a personal relative pronoun in this instance; "what" is more reflective of what we know at this point) "so it must have been Jesus".

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Thanks, will look into it, but I don’t think it will make any difference as VDubs would say, I’m too far gone.

Look at a building - there were plans,
look at this Earth - there were plans

Earth might seem far from perfect, but I ask how would you create a world?

You should definitely read it. Very entertaining and personable.

The author himself was most certainly "too far gone".

But as one of the Goodreads reviews says, he's not trying to convert anyone. That is one of the cornerstones of nihilism. There's nothing to "convert" anyone to. Just a realisation that one has, and then one gets on with one's life entirely free of self-confected concerns about a non-existent afterlife.

If people want to see plans where no plans exist, they will see plans. One of the most important things to grasp about evolution is we're talking about really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really long periods of time.

 

[Roylion]

Exactly. I’ll think you will find that after doing your research on this paranoid psycho that killing infants in an obscure little village is the least of his “ misdeeds” and hence quite a plausible event. And probably more importantly in your case still insignificant enough to be one of the many events lost in history.

I'm quite aware of Herod. In fact I find the whole Herodian family fascinating.

Never said it wasn't plausible. I just questioned how the 2,000 number was arrived at and pointed out that there was little supporting evidence for such an event. Only one Gospel mentions it and the story has parallels with an earlier story. That then leads on to the purpose of the Gospel of Matthew but we've done all that.

 

[Vdubs]

It may surprise you to know that atheists don't talk to god.

Until they face a calamity or disaster in their lives. Hitting rock bottom is often the catalyst to seeking God. Nothing to lose.Everything to gain.

 

[Gbonl]

You should definitely read it. Very entertaining and personable.

The author himself was most certainly "too far gone".

But as one of the Goodreads reviews says, he's not trying to convert anyone. That is one of the cornerstones of nihilism. There's nothing to "convert" anyone to. Just a realisation that one has, and then one gets on with one's life entirely free of self-confected concerns about a non-existent afterlife.

If people want to see plans where no plans exist, they will see plans. One of the most important things to grasp about evolution is we're talking about really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really long periods of time.

Thanks I will look into it, don’t think I would get the book, have a backlog of books trying to read, but is there an online summary?

I think back 10 years, I can’t even fathom 500 years so is a really, as you say really long time, say 4,000,000,000 years possible to comprehend, yes you can look at rocks, land masses to prove points, study volcanoes and the like, but it is almost verging on faith when you make out it is simply time that brings us this beautiful world.

If we simply apply time to our lives, we get old and die. How come the Earth/nature sustains itself?

How can you not see the designer in all this, each seed produces a particular plant. Fern spores are almost invisible, float around but grow in the right conditions and a new fern appears.

It seems a godless religion is trying to replace a God religion.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Thanks I will look into it, don’t think I would get the book, have a backlog of books trying to read, but is there an online summary?

I think back 10 years, I can’t even fathom 500 years so is a really, as you say really long time, say 4,000,000,000 years possible to comprehend, yes you can look at rocks, land masses to prove points, study volcanoes and the like, but it is almost verging on faith when you make out it is simply time that brings us this beautiful world.

If we simply apply time to our lives, we get old and die. How come the Earth/nature sustains itself?

How can you not see the designer in all this, each seed produces a particular plant. Fern spores are almost invisible, float around but grow in the right conditions and a new fern appears.

It seems a godless religion is trying to replace a God religion.

Why did your God design and create pedophiles and rapists?

 

[Vdubs]

Why did your God design and create pedophiles and rapists?

Sin.
Free will, with or without knowledge of God, people will choose to love whatever tickles them if they allow their carnal desires to dominate, and do not adhere to God's commandments .

 

[Gbonl]

Why did your God design and create pedophiles and rapists?

The posts in this thread just keeps getting better and most of you believe in evolution. The passage of time does not = better

Do you really want to know? Like really want to know, as I don’t believe you can handle the truth. Your name gives away your identity.

As previously stated trauma is used by Satan to enter the body, it is often ritualistic and made an as offering to the god they serve.

It is often done in the Church to disgrace Jesus and all he stands for and to further satans kingdom.

There is no Earthly power stopping satanists from starting a Christian church and practicing their deeds.

Child sacrifice is still practiced in many cultures today. The blood of the innocent/child is what feeds them and what they use as an offering to satan.