Atley Vs Conca

[Black Diamond]

It's Champ data, not HUN

"The Hun" didn't have to list those names though, did it?

Delaney averaged 14.2 disposals, 3.2 marks, 2.4 tackles. That's not great.

And if a player is not best 22 for a team around the middle of the ladder that would suggest they are below average would it not?

And Jacobs may not have played for North but he did play for Port and he was quite poor for them.




As I said before this is solely statistically based and has nothing to do with potential. Houli is not elite and Conca is not a spud. Don't get so upset when someone says players on your list are below average. Many of them are.

I'm not upset by the stats. I just think it's misleading to name who the did for us.

 

[eth-dog]

"The Hun" didn't have to list those names though, did it?


I'm not upset by the stats. I just think it's misleading to name who the did for us.

It was basic reporting

 

[NUFC Tiger]

"The Hun" didn't have to list those names though, did it?

I'm not upset by the stats. I just think it's misleading to name who the did for us.

Yeah not sure either why they only selected those 3 categories - I believe there is meant to be a few more on the 'above average' side of it - bit puzzling why they would just name the 'Elites', 'Below average' and 'Poor' - maybe 'elite', 'average' and 'poor' would have been better if they wanted to be selective about it, having 2 'negative' categories just makes it seem like a critical article.

As Dimma said in his press conference yesterday, he was disappointed by the article as to be an AFL player, you need to be an elite player of the game (compared to amateur and semi pro players) and that the stats don't necessarily reflect a player's rating within a club and the value they bring to the team nor their age, experience and potential.

 

[NUFC Tiger]

Conca makes Ben Cunnington look quick, he also has poor disposal by hand and foot, and his awareness in traffic is pathetic for someone drafted as a "future gun mid". When in contrast to Atley who has genuine X-Factor, serious speed, breaks lines and already has a better kick then Conca which was considered his "Weak point". This poll is a joke.

Conca played mainly on the half back in 2011 and moved to the midfield in 2012. While his disposal efficiency wasn't great, playing as an inside mid - he was never going to have a high DE playing in this role. Some of the players who had more clangers per game than Conca include Thompson, Ablett, Swan, Redden and Mitch Robinson so looking purely at that stat isn't a great indicator.

While I also think he can improve in this area, he was drafted originally because his awareness, decision making and composure were his strong points - in the games where he hasn't played in the midfield, you can see this is the case. Also, not sure where you read/heard Conca's weak point was his kicking, while not elite, he does possess good all round kicking. He's not the fastest player going around but he isn't a slouch either (again, not sure where you are getting your information from).

He hasn't had a full pre season yet but is reportedly one of the big movers in our pre season. Many are expecting him to have a breakout year - while I don't think he will be on the same level as Cotchin, Deledio or Martin, he should prove a more than capable 4-5th choice mid who can regularly rack up the ball and escape a tag most weeks. Some consider him to be Tuck's long term replacement so time will tell.

I like Atley and don't want to start a shit fight thread but they are too different types of players (Atley definitely more of an outside player with his pace and line breaking ability as well as his x factor) and personally I would still have Conca over Atley but that's just my own opinion, I would be happy to have Atley as well as I think they will both be great players I'm sure.

 

[Mixed Results]

Atley finished 5th in the best and fairest in a top 8 side
Conca finished 15th in the best and fairest in a side that only finished 12th

Conca was behind Nahas and Jackson
Atley was ahead of Wells, Ziebell, Firrito, McMahon, Bastinac etc etc

Not sure what people see in Conca, from the 2010 draft alone I'd rather have Swallow, Bennell, Atley, Prestia, Heppell, Gaff, Wallis, Liberatore, Darling and Parker no question. Then there's Sipposs, Brodie Smith, Isaac Smith, Howe, Fasolo and McDonald who I'd probably take over Conca as well.. Then there is Lynch, Caddy, Day, Polec and Harper who have shown signs that they may become better players then Conca could ever imagine if they put it together..

When it's all said and done it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Conca isn't in the top 20 of this draft class

 

[Psicosis]

Conca played mainly on the half back in 2011 and moved to the midfield in 2012. While his disposal efficiency wasn't great, playing as an inside mid - he was never going to have a high DE playing in this role. Some of the players who had more clangers per game than Conca include Thompson, Ablett, Swan, Redden and Mitch Robinson so looking purely at that stat isn't a great indicator.

While I also think he can improve in this area, he was drafted originally because his awareness, decision making and composure were his strong points - in the games where he hasn't played in the midfield, you can see this is the case. Also, not sure where you read/heard Conca's weak point was his kicking, while not elite, he does possess good all round kicking. He's not the fastest player going around but he isn't a slouch either (again, not sure where you are getting your information from).

He hasn't had a full pre season yet but is reportedly one of the big movers in our pre season. Many are expecting him to have a breakout year - while I don't think he will be on the same level as Cotchin, Deledio or Martin, he should prove a more than capable 4-5th choice mid who can regularly rack up the ball and escape a tag most weeks. Some consider him to be Tuck's long term replacement so time will tell.

I like Atley and don't want to start a shit fight thread but they are too different types of players (Atley definitely more of an outside player with his pace and line breaking ability as well as his x factor) and personally I would still have Conca over Atley but that's just my own opinion, I would be happy to have Atley as well as I think they will both be great players I'm sure.

Listen pal, you can sugar coat your clubs mistake as much as you want but when it comes down to it, if Richmond could have the 2010 draft again they would snap up Atley in a heartbeat over Conca. That is a fact, whether or not you admit it.

Sure he will reach the level of a capable 5th mid (with pick 6 you'd hope so), but he is not on the level of a Shaun Atley, nor will he ever be. If you really rate them as equal in their respective rolls then you are extremely misguided and I suggest you watch Atley properly, stats aside he has the making of an outstanding footballer, whilst Conca is on the cusp of bland.

 

[eth-dog]

Both of you are really biased. Both are good players at this point in time and both have potential to be very good players.

If you wanted to redo the draft, right now it'd be (for me): Swallow, Bennell, Darling, Heppell, Gaff, Conca, Atley, I Smith, Jacobs, Smith.

Conca will only be a 4th midfielder due to the quality of Martin, Deledio and Cotchin, whereas Atley has only 2 guys of that quality in the midfield of the roos in Wells and Swallow

 

[The Bomb]

. Both are/will finish better than Dyson Heppell.

Just ashame the 18 coaches don't agree with you.

 

[Psicosis]

Both of you are really biased. Both are good players at this point in time and both have potential to be very good players.

If you wanted to redo the draft, right now it'd be (for me): Swallow, Bennell, Darling, Heppell, Gaff, Conca, Atley, I Smith, Jacobs, Smith.

Conca will only be a 4th midfielder due to the quality of Martin, Deledio and Cotchin, whereas Atley has only 2 guys of that quality in the midfield of the roos in Wells and Swallow

The fact you rate Isaac Smith in your top 8 legitimises your lack of clue. A genuine front runner that only strives when his side is on top and buckles under the pressure.

Feel free to compare Heppell and Atley, I have no problem with that comparison, but to this date Conca has done minimal to impress at AFL level, and does not deserve to be put on the same scale at those two.

 

[chrstphrwnstn]

Listen pal, you can sugar coat your clubs mistake as much as you want but when it comes down to it, if Richmond could have the 2010 draft again they would snap up Atley in a heartbeat over Conca. That is a fact, whether or not you admit it..

Nope. That is absolutely your own opinion.

 

[eth-dog]

The fact you rate Isaac Smith in your top 8 legitimises your lack of clue. A genuine front runner that only strives when his side is on top and buckles under the pressure.

Feel free to compare Heppell and Atley, I have no problem with that comparison, but to this date Conca has done minimal to impress at AFL level, and does not deserve to be put on the same scale at those two.

Right now he's produced better games than the majority of the draft, not surprising considering they've only played 2 fricken seasons. You could make a case for Alex Johnson, and I'll admit I forgot he was in that draft, but who else has outperformed him?

Heppell is far ahead of Atley and Conca, according to the coaches and statistics. I think I'll stick with their opinion thanks. Heppell going to get back-to-back young player of the year awards? (pretty sure he's still eligible, not sure though). Conca and Atley are very close together, you just can't see it

 

[Heisenberg_]

Listen pal, you can sugar coat your clubs mistake as much as you want but when it comes down to it, if Richmond could have the 2010 draft again they would snap up Atley in a heartbeat over Conca. That is a fact, whether or not you admit it.

That's not a fact, that's your opinion champion and a wrong one at that.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

That's not a fact, that's your opinion champion and a wrong one at that.

Please... there isn't a non Richmond fan in the world who would take Conca over Atley.

With so many elite players - how the hell did you finish 12th?

 

[eth-dog]

Please... there isn't a non Richmond fan in the world who would take Conca over Atley.

With so many elite players - how the hell did you finish 12th?

that's why the neutrals in this thread have gone 50/50 mate .

 

[Heisenberg_]

I wouldn't swap them.
Don't know why I'm even wasting my time with you to be honest, it's not possible to have an intelligent conversation with you if a North player is involved.
Very little would even contemplate the swap let alone a rurally go through with it.

 

[chrstphrwnstn]

Please... there isn't a non Richmond fan in the world who would take Conca over Atley.

Again, you're opinion; not fact.

I would take Conca ahead of Atley.

 

[eth-dog]

Again, you're opinion; not fact.

I would take Conca ahead of Atley.

He said non-Richmond fan mate... but I would too, as I said earlier in the thread

 

[chrstphrwnstn]

He said non-Richmond fan mate... but I would too, as I said earlier in the thread

Oops. Well still, what I said wasn't wrong.

 

[Groupie_]

Just ashame the 18 coaches don't agree with you.

They've all had 2 seasons. Calm down.

 

[eth-dog]

They've all had 2 seasons. Calm down.

He wasn't the one claiming Heppell was the worst of the three mate

 

[NUFC Tiger]

Listen pal, you can sugar coat your clubs mistake as much as you want but when it comes down to it, if Richmond could have the 2010 draft again they would snap up Atley in a heartbeat over Conca. That is a fact, whether or not you admit it.

Sure he will reach the level of a capable 5th mid (with pick 6 you'd hope so), but he is not on the level of a Shaun Atley, nor will he ever be. If you really rate them as equal in their respective rolls then you are extremely misguided and I suggest you watch Atley properly, stats aside he has the making of an outstanding footballer, whilst Conca is on the cusp of bland.

Could you show me evidence of this fact? If it's true, then there must be supporting proof otherwise you're just speculating here.


As eth-dog said, he would be 4,5, 6th choice midfielder on the basis of being behind some special talents in Cotchin, Deledio and Martin (who were all higher picks than Conca anyway) not necessarily because he was a failed pick. I’m not going to pot Atley as I think he is a very talented young player with a bright future but I find it hilarious that in your absolute wisdom can categorically state as a fact that Atley (after 2 seasons and an extra 4 games!) will be the superior player – you must be very good at assessing talent if that’s the case and should be doing this professionally.

The stats showed Conca is slightly ahead on career to date despite fewer games. That doesn't mean he will be the better player forever - no one can predict the future, not even you buddy. Atley may very well become a superstar (and good luck to him if he does) - the main issue I have is your ridiculous willingness to write off players after 2 seasons - premature much?

Think you might have taken one to many chair shots to the head dude.

 

[Mixed Results]

The stats showed Conca is slightly ahead on career to date despite fewer games. That doesn't mean he will be the better player forever - no one can predict the future, not even you buddy. Atley may very well become a superstar (and good luck to him if he does) - the main issue I have is your ridiculous willingness to write off players after 2 seasons - premature much?

Think you might have taken one to many chair shots to the head dude.

And actually watching games shows the complete opposite... This is why North supporters appear to overrate their list, as due to a lack of media coverage and the stigma that we are a boring team there aren't that many people who watch our games. I'd be interested if you were able to name 5 match ups that Atley had all season, having a clearly defined opponent makes it pretty easy to tell

He came 5th in our best and fairest for a reason

 

[PUNTROADHAMMER]

Please... there isn't a non Richmond fan in the world who would take Conca over Atley.

With so many elite players - how the hell did you finish 12th?

On last season alone, in hindsight, if I was given the choice between finishing 12th with a bullet, or the humiliation of getting absolutely disembowelled in the finals like North did, please... there isn't a non North fan in the world who would take the latter.

 

[eth-dog]

On last season alone, in hindsight, if I was given the choice between finishing 12th with a bullet, or the humiliation of getting absolutely disembowelled in the finals like North did, please... there isn't a non North fan in the world who would take the latter.

making finals>not making finals. That's all there is to it

 

[PUNTROADHAMMER]

making finals>not making finals. That's all there is to it

A Premiership is all there is to it.