Australian Touring Squad for India

[Docker82]

Well actually he does; his test stats lower his batting average to what it is in FC cricket. Plus he's a far better player than Wells; who in reality has had half a good season and Voges is cooked so Mitch gets a game ahead of him too. As for the opening issue; Klinger and Marsh are both openers. WA's best XI has Mitch batting 7 behind Whiteman and ahead of Agar.

Nah he averages 29 in first class cricket with the bat. I'd take Wells ahead of M.Marsh batting wise although he's certainly the one you'd axe. If the best you can do is put M.Marsh at seven in WA's best lineup he isn't getting a game for WA if it wasn't for his bowling. Sure the reality is his bowling exists but it's quite clear to me that if you aren't a top six batsman in the shield how exactly do we expect you to be in test cricket.

I don't think we should include Wade in the test team as a number six either. Isn't nearly good enough...

 

[Bradesmaen]

Well actually he does; his test stats lower his batting average to what it is in FC cricket. Plus he's a far better player than Wells; who in reality has had half a good season and Voges is cooked so Mitch gets a game ahead of him too. As for the opening issue; Klinger and Marsh are both openers. WA's best XI has Mitch batting 7 behind Whiteman and ahead of Agar.

He actually averages 24.9 for WA. His test average is 23. He averages 42 for Aus A and 62 for the "Australians" when they play nothing matches on flat roads.

 

[Damon_3388]

Biggest problem with our team is that we lack a batsman who can bowl a bit of useful stuff. Michael Clarke, Mark Waugh, Darren Lehmann types. Glenn Maxwell, Mitch Marsh, Ashton Agar etc aren't in this category, they just aren't good enough batsmen. I would have been thinking more Trav Head but he isn't over there. Steve Smith has to step up and bowl.

Steve Smith - Must bowl some overs ahla Michael Clarke, if he can contribute with the ball then we get to take an extra batsman in which is a must. Gun bat who can play spin and hugely important. His more conservative and defensive nature as captain might give him an edge over previous more attacking captains.

David Warner - Simply must go for it early while the ball is new and the quicks are on, expecting to see spin opening the bowling at some stage to counteract his approach. Top line batsman very important to the team.

Ashton Agar - Useful with the bat and useful with the ball but not a huge impact in both areas. As with all spinners would get more assistance there than here. Probably too similar player to O'Keefe.

Jackson Bird - Pro is that he is super accurate and can bowl good variations and cutters which are important over there. He's one of the more likely quicks to have success in India. Con is that it's going to be tough for any quicks.

Peter Handscomb - Old fashioned back foot player which I think is important. The ability to be on the right foot to the spinners in India is the key to batting over there, far less margin for error over there than there is here with the extra turn. Lacking experience may be a factor so must play whole series. Great fielder.

Josh Hazlewood - Pro is his accuracy and persistence will be important for him. His form is excellent. Con is that he is a bit too reliant on the seam. Making the ball seam off the wicket and swing isn't really a factor in India. He will need to have good quality cutters and changers of pace to keep the batsmen guessing. Are his cutters better than Birds?

Usman Khawaja - One of our better batsmen, was dropped very quickly after a failed match in Sri Lanka. Needs to play if he is to get better. Surely he can figure it out.

Nathan Lyon - Pro is that he is our premier spinner and has been a great player. Con is that he is too reliant on bounce being more an overspin bowler and he wont get bounce. He doesn't have any variations. He doesn't have a great record on the sub continent like he does on harder, bouncier wickets. I am tipping that he will be our worst performed spinner.

Mitchell Marsh - Good bat when the ball isn't moving, bad luck for him as it always will be moving. Bowling might be somewhat useful but with Bird and/or Hazelwood in the team we simply must Mitchell Swepson - Simply must play. No brainer. A young leg spinner who has proven he can be accurate, turns it and has what the other finger spinners don't really have, variation. Has the ability to make things happen. Australia threw it's long held anti-youth policy away this summer and it reaped huge rewards. It's time we stuck to our guns and backed in young and inexperienced cricketers. Potentially could be our most damaging spinner.

Matthew Wade - Pro is he is a good leader and determined but is his batting form good enough? Is he a good enough keeper? Up to the stumps a lot to some turning bowlers, it will be tough and his keeping up is always a worry for me.

Warner
Khawaja
S Marsh
Smith
Renshaw
Handscome
Wade
Starc
Lyon
Hazlewood
Swepson

Bird
O'Keefe
Maxwell

I'd go into the first test match batting heavy. I'd expect Smith to bowl a good few overs, his bowling has been accurate lately and he's likely to pick up wickets over there. First test, bowlers should be fresh and able to do a bit of extra work. I would be backing our batsmen to set a big score for them to bowl to, especially if we win the toss and bat first. Really try to make a lot of runs and win this first test and put them on the back foot early in the series and in the first innings. Then I would be looking to bring in an all-rounder as the players get tired. Probably Maxwell. Would also be looking to bring in Bird and O'Keefe for any bowler who doesn't perform in the first test, I'm tipping that will be Lyon and Starc. Might be tougher on the bowlers to not have a bowling all-rounder but it's tough to win over there and if you want to win you've got to be tough. You don't win by looking after players and babying them through, you grind it out and earn it.

I would also bat Khawaja and Warner as openers, try and get off to a fast start against the new ball and not expose Khawaja to too much spin, get him in early, he's a good opener, he's proved that. I'd put Renshaw at 5 as a bit of security in case of a batting collapse which we see from Australian sides a lot over there. He's just good at not going out! If he's developed a sweep, he could be useful against the slower bowlers/pitch.

We need to set big scores, give our bowlers plenty to bowl to and force pressure through long boring defensive bowling and bowling to tight fields. Can't blast teams out like we do here, ball just doesn't do enough.

What we need to learn are the differences between India and Australia.

Batting starts hard here and gets easier, batting in India starts easier and gets harder. So we need to start aggressive then become more measured, it's all in reverse over there, that's why I'd have a conservative opener in the lower middle order and blasters up the top.

Spinners get wickets from bounce/overspin in Australia and/or putting a lot of spin on the ball. Spinners get wicket from subtle variation and accuracy in India, not so much bounce and putting a lot of turn on it isn't that important over there.

The key to batting in India is being on the right foot. Australian batsmen are traditionally looking to get on the front foot and if they get it wrong the ball doesn't move enough to be a problem and they defend it. In India you need to be on the front foot playing it as a half volley or on the back foot playing it off the pitch. Get it wrong and it stays low, shoots through or spins too much and you're out. Footwork is far more important over there to surviving than it is here.

Beating India with that squad is a huge possibility, we just need to embrace the style of cricket and the conditions and be smart about it, forget what we know from playing cricket in Australia and select a lineup that is suitable to playing cricket there.

He actually averages 24.9 for WA. His test average is 23. He averages 42 for Aus A and 62 for the "Australians" when they play nothing matches on flat roads.

So given his ODI record too, Mitch Marsh is basically the right-arm version of James Faulkner.

If we're not willing to play Faulkner in the Test side because of his batting, why are we willing to play Marsh?

 

[eth-dog]

So given his ODI record too, Mitch Marsh is basically the right-arm version of James Faulkner.

If we're not willing to play Faulkner in the Test side because of his batting, why are we willing to play Marsh?

Except better in that arena

 

[to1994]

Finch is another worth considering based on his average in the last 36 months.

 

[red+black]

What food are they selling at the ground out of interest?

Pizzas, samosas, various rice dishes, popcorn, ice cream. Bottled water is free, small Pepsi is $1, but there was no alcohol yesterday because it was an Election Day.

 

[red+black]

Apparently yesterday was the coolest day we're getting (34°) with the temperature expected to be 36° for the remaining days. Thankfully we are under cover in the grandstand (the only grandstand).

 

[The_Reaper]

I'm certainly not a Wade hater like a lot, I just didn't think there was a heap of other options and Nevill certainly didn't grab his chance.

But, Nevill has the most ton's in the shield now this season and is averaging mid 70's.

Patterson whilst not having the highest average in the Shield, is averaging close to 50 this year, with 1 ton and 6 50's

Renshaw
Warner
Smith
S.Marsh
Handscomb
Patterson
Nevill
Starc


Looks pretty good imo. Move Khawaja in for the Ashes and Banga's tour and decide Marsh vs Patterson on form. Finch is another worth considering based on his average in the last 36 months.

#   Player         Sta     Mat Inns NO Runs  HS   Ave    BF    SRATE 100  50  0
1.  AC Voges       WA      19  33   1  1891 249   78.79  3646  51.87   7   9  2
2.  PM Nevill      NSW     17  25   5  1230 235*  61.50  2558  48.08   4   4  1
3.  SE Marsh       WA      18  29   5  1405 164*  58.54  2623  53.34   5   7  2
4.  PSP Handscomb  VIC     25  38   2  1805 215   50.14  3166  57.01   7   9  3
5.  CA Lynn        QLD     10  17   0   807 250   47.47  1170  68.96   2   3  0
6.  GJ Bailey      TAS     17  32   3  1349 148*  46.52  2642  51.06   4   7  3
7.  EJM Cowan      TAS/NSW 23  43   4  1795 212   46.03  3351  53.57   6   6  4
8.  CD Hartley     QLD     26  46  15  1425 142*  45.97  2999  57.52   3   7  7
9.  HWR Cartwright WA      12  20   3   771 139   45.35  1417  54.41   1   5  0
10. M Klinger      WA      27  48   5  1940 202*  45.12  4007  48.42   6   9  3
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
11. AJ Turner      WA      11  17   1   718 110   44.88  1191  60.29   2   2  0
12. TJ Dean        VIC     17  31   3  1256 154*  44.86  2691  46.67   4   6  3
13. MS Wade        VIC     18  23   3   852 152   42.60  1742  48.91   2   5  1
14. JS Lehmann     SA      16  28   2  1102 205   42.38  1634  67.44   4   3  2
15. CJ Ferguson    SA      21  39   4  1483 213   42.37  2940  50.44   6   4  6
16. KR Patterson   NSW     23  41   4  1552 129*  41.95  3364  46.14   4   9  2
17. GJ Maxwell     VIC     11  15   2   545  98   41.92   752  72.47   0   5  1
18. J Weatherald   SA      10  18   1   698 135   41.06  1124  62.10   1   4  1
19. CT Bancroft    WA      27  48   1  1925 211   40.96  4790  40.19   7   4  1
20. MT Renshaw     QLD     12  23   0   942 170   40.96  2197  42.88   3   2  1
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
21. CL White       VIC     16  26   4   898 106   40.82  1675  53.61   2   6  2
22. TM Head        SA      25  44   1  1724 192   40.09  2671  64.55   4  10  5
23. DT Christian   VIC     24  38   8  1183 105*  39.43  1997  59.24   2   6  1
24. MP Stoinis     VIC     25  42   3  1531 110   39.26  2990  51.20   2  13  1
25. NJ Maddinson   NSW     20  32   1  1206 118   38.90  1942  62.10   3   6  4
26. MS Harris      WA/VIC  22  38   3  1324 158*  37.83  2091  63.32   3   7  1
27. JA Burns       QLD     20  37   2  1310 183   37.43  2381  55.02   3   6  2
28. RJ Quiney      VIC     22  37   2  1293 125   36.94  2442  52.95   2   9  2
29. JP Faulkner    TAS     10  18   2   585 100*  36.56  1297  45.10   1   2  0
30. JW Wells       TAS/WA  13  25   3   767 120   34.86  1489  51.51   2   0  0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
31. SD Heazlett    QLD     13  25   1   821 129   34.21  1447  56.74   1   7  2
32. BJ Rohrer      NSW     12  20   4   545 109*  34.06  1057  51.56   1   4  5
33. DP Hughes      NSW     12  23   1   732 124   33.27  1611  45.44   2   4  3
34. MC Henriques   NSW     14  18   1   563 145   33.12  1156  48.70   2   1  1
35. MJ Cosgrove    SA      20  38   0  1251 103   32.92  2241  55.82   1   9  2
36. SO Henry       NSW/QLD 15  24   1   752 142   32.70  1749  43.00   2   4  2
37. M Labuschagne  QLD     18  34   1  1078 112   32.67  2343  46.01   2   7  4
38. TLW Cooper     SA      23  43   2  1324 138   32.29  2384  55.54   3   8  7
39. BR Dunk        TAS     22  43   2  1316 190   32.10  2565  51.31   4   4  4
40. SM Whiteman    WA      25  34   3   993 120   32.03  1860  53.39   2   5  0
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
41. BJ Webster     TAS     18  34   2  1019 122*  31.84  2232  45.65   3   5  5
42. AC Agar        WA      20  26   1   746 106   29.84  1343  55.55   2   3  3
43. SNJ O'Keefe    NSW     17  22   7   447  98   29.80   994  44.97   0   2  0
44. RGL Carters    NSW     21  36   4   951 198   29.72  2574  36.95   1   4  0
45. AI Ross        SA      15  28   2   767  92*  29.50  1308  58.64   0   6  2
46. JR Hopes       QLD     18  30   3   791  98   29.30   959  82.48   0   5  2
47. AJ Doolan      TAS     21  39   1  1083 202*  28.50  2236  48.43   2   5  3
48. CR Hemphrey    QLD     14  26   1   692 118   27.68  1067  43.06   2   2  5
49. JC Silk        TAS     18  35   2   842  97*  25.52  1979  42.55   0   6  3
50. PJ Forrest     QLD     13  22   1   495  93   23.57  1265  39.13   0   4  4
51. KR Smith       SA      13  25   1   562  75   23.42  1120  50.18   0   3  2
52. TD Paine       TAS     12  21   1   273  41   13.65   623  43.82   0   0  0

One round of of date but here are the combined shield records of batsmen over the last three shield seasons.

As for Finch his shield record in this time is nothing particularly impressive especially considering the obvious issues with his technique and his declining ODI performances.

We can do much much better than considering him.

 

[mugiwara]

Pizzas, samosas, various rice dishes, popcorn, ice cream. Bottled water is free, small Pepsi is $1, but there was no alcohol yesterday because it was an Election Day.

Just a suggestion if you want to try out local food. If you find a dish called 'vada pav', you can taste it. It's a special dish in Pune. It's available everywhere, but it's good there. It will be spicy though. You can ask the seller to not give mirchy (less spicy).

 

[Bob Neil]

Mitch Marsh is a walk up start for every state.

Mitchell Marsh (WA) - first class batting average 29.5 / first class bowling average 28.5
Marcus Stoinis (VIC) - 35.4 / 49.6
James Faulkner (TAS) - 32.2 / 24.8
Jack Wildermuth (QLD) - 24.1 / 32.1
Moises Henriques (NSW) - 34.5 / 31.1
Simon Milenko (TAS) - 28.3 / 29.8
Hilton Cartwright (WA) - 45.0 / 44.3
Michael Neser (QLD) - 25.3 / 37.2
Trent Copeland (NSW) - 20.0 / 25.6

You might be right - but of the above collection of broadly similar players knocking around state cricket he's by no means a standout.

 

[The_Reaper]

O'Keefe can tour in India whenever the * he wants tbh

 

[Phone]

It's good that this forum has just suffered what I've suffered for 7 years, being absolutely bewildered at SOK's record but coming to an acceptance. Just a shame he didn't get one bowled when a batsman has gone to cut him.

 

[red+black]

What a dream day today was! Might be over tomorrow, but I think India will hold on for Day 4.

 

[Doodlesweaver]

It's good that this forum has just suffered what I've suffered for 7 years, being absolutely bewildered at SOK's record but coming to an acceptance. Just a shame he didn't get one bowled when a batsman has gone to cut him.

Plenty of people here have wanted him given more chances, haven't they? You are hardly on your own.

I gave up on him ages ago as I thought the selectors - seemingly ALL of them - had him on blacklist.

it was such a pleasant surprise that he was chosen for Sri Lanka.

 

[DaRick]

I often find myself surprised that SOK has the FC record that he does. He's always come off as being a steady spinner who doesn't flight or turn the ball that much. Yet he's consistently distinguished himself at that level - and now he has a 6-fer in India. Weird...

 

[Phone]

Plenty of people here have wanted him given more chances, haven't they? You are hardly on your own.

I gave up on him ages ago as I thought the selectors - seemingly ALL of them - had him on blacklist.

it was such a pleasant surprise that he was chosen for Sri Lanka.

Well obviously there's a bit of hyperbole in my post, but plenty of people have been disappointed with what they see when they finally watch him, too. A read of the match day thread before he took his wickets shows that. He is the opposite of the Swepson type selections, where anyone who sees his first class record will push him for higher honours, but anyone who saw him looked elsewhere. (and after about 5 years it was a bit hard to keep on disparaging him)

 

[Doodlesweaver]

Well obviously there's a bit of hyperbole in my post, but plenty of people have been disappointed with what they see when they finally watch him, too. A read of the match day thread before he took his wickets shows that. He is the opposite of the Swepson type selections, where anyone who sees his first class record will push him for higher honours, but anyone who saw him looked elsewhere. (and after about 5 years it was a bit hard to keep on disparaging him)

I remember being surprised when they ignored him for the Ashes 2010/11. Considering how well he'd bowled in the tour games or A games or whatever they were, it was like they saw his performance as a marker for ANY left arm spin bowler kicking around the Shield.

Only not as a marker for him.

 

[red+black]

About to head to the ground now, let's hope for another good day. Make another 100-150 and send them in. Game should be over before tea on Day 4.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Mitchell Marsh (WA) - first class batting average 29.5 / first class bowling average 28.5
Marcus Stoinis (VIC) - 35.4 / 49.6
James Faulkner (TAS) - 32.2 / 24.8
Jack Wildermuth (QLD) - 24.1 / 32.1
Moises Henriques (NSW) - 34.5 / 31.1
Simon Milenko (TAS) - 28.3 / 29.8
Hilton Cartwright (WA) - 45.0 / 44.3
Michael Neser (QLD) - 25.3 / 37.2
Trent Copeland (NSW) - 20.0 / 25.6

You might be right - but of the above collection of broadly similar players knocking around state cricket he's by no means a standout.

And the Redbacks don't play an all rounder.

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

Behrendorff 8/37 at the WACA - our fast bowling stocks are looking good with Cummins & Pattinson coming back into form. Ashes next year should be a beauty.

Even the spinners are looking healthy with Lyon, O'Keefe, Holland, Swepson, Zampa and Agar.

 

[Scotland]

Cummins should be nowhere near the test squad. He hasn't played a Shield game in 6 years.

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

Zampa 6/65 keeping pressure on the spinners in the test squad.

 

[The_Reaper]

Zampa 6/65 keeping pressure on the spinners in the test squad.

Good to see him do well.

 

[Run n Spread]

To spite the seeming unfairness and players discarded harshly (was the same years gone by) there is something about this Australian team. I reckon the selectors have the formula right. They are onto a winner. The systems are working. possibly the Hohn's influence I don't know.

I reckon the Renshaw and Handscomb picks are winners and the horses for courses (to spite I give you the Marsh fascination) which were a hallmark of much conjecture in the late 90s are again working.

Simply up to the players to gel and make it work. But this is a side for its time and I reckon Australian Cricket is onto a winner. The core is stable, the younguns are the bed rock of the future and the role players can slot in and out.

 

[BarneyBent]

******* hell Wade. I know it was a spitting ball but you're keeping wicket in a Test, you need to take those. If that had been an edge...