Autopsy Autopsy vs WBD

[Devil Fish]

The take away message over the last 2 weeks is simply this:

Considering we've had 5 years of top-end picks, the LACK of RAW TALENT on our list is frightening. The media (who we all agree have NFI) and many fans are blindly lead to believe we have "amazing young talent". We don't. Our young players are no more talented than most other clubs.

We have a handful of "talented" footballers on our list - Larkey, Curtis, McKercher, Sheezel, LDU & Zurhaar. And you could then argue Hardeman & O'Sullivan could possibly join them in the future. And keep in mind, all of those mentioned have some serious deficiencies in their games. They are not GUNS of the comp. McKercher is the one who could hopefully become an elite AFL midfielder.

The rest of our list is filled with "handy role players" who when they play AFL look very ordinary, but then when they're in the VFL, we need to get them back in. Rinse. Spin. Repeat.

We tried last night. But we lost by 50 points. It just goes to show how far off the mark we are re actual talent.

25,000 there to celebrate our great clubs history. Don't get me started on that rot. Thanks Sonja & co. Well done for organising a "wonderful" night.

 

[Event Horizon]

Who is the AFL umpire number 35? I had a bit of a search, got some different names come up. He was the absolute worst of the lot. And they were all shit mind you. But this prick had the nerve to deliberately rub it into us, I have little doubt. Every time some contentious 50/50 decision wasn't paid to us, the next minute that prick would pay one to them just to show who the boss is. It may have been his subconscious reaction to the crowd booing, but this doesn't make it any better if so. Absolute scum that bloke is. I would even bother finding his name and address if I could, and would send him a package of dog shit especially prepared and neatly packed just for him to enjoy. I had a gutful of this personally. I turn 50 next year, so not a kid anymore to say the least, yet I felt if some blokes wanted to storm the ground in the middle of the game to give those pricks a few "pads on the back" I would join them.

As for the game, this was the effort required week in week out. The game plan is fine too. Just don't have the engine to go with top teams for four quarters at this point, especially going in after a 5 day break with a few injuries, and a few more midgame. Definitely not the game to be throwing all the toys out of the cot. We will get there. Just a few more holes to plug. But if ever some people thought our midfield was stacked and we just needed some talls to round it off, last night was a reminder that midfield depth is still lacking. Once LDU went down not only did we lack the required drive, we also don't really have anyone in the VFL to come back, other than Parker perhaps, who is in his last couple of years anyway

 

[Horizons_00]

Injuries to Larkey, LDU, Xerri, even Dawson was hobbling.

Plus the atrocious umpiring.

Give us a fit Lmac, Parker, LDU and Larkey and we take it up to them for the whole game.

 

[Event Horizon]

The take away message over the last 2 weeks is simply this:

Considering we've had 5 years of top-end picks, the LACK of RAW TALENT on our list is frightening. The media (who we all agree have NFI) and many fans are blindly lead to believe we have "amazing young talent". We don't. Our young players are no more talented than most other clubs.

We have a handful of "talented" footballers on our list - Larkey, Curtis, McKercher, Sheezel, LDU & Zurhaar. And you could then argue Hardeman & O'Sullivan could possibly join them in the future. And keep in mind, all of those mentioned have some serious deficiencies in their games. They are not GUNS of the comp. McKercher is the one who could hopefully become an elite AFL midfielder.

The rest of our list is filled with "handy role players" who when they play AFL look very ordinary, but then when they're in the VFL, we need to get them back in. Rinse. Spin. Repeat.

We tried last night. But we lost by 50 points. It just goes to show how far off the mark we are re actual talent.

25,000 there to celebrate our great clubs history. Don't get me started on that rot. Thanks Sonja & co. Well done for organising a "wonderful" night.

I am not going to comment on talent because I think it's the emotion talking for you, which is normal after a couple of heavy losses. But when you cool down you will realise that no club has a 23 full of top talent. Role players are absolutely fine, and when our talented players become guns, the same role players will look 10 times better. It's not far away either.

But the crowd number is the bigger concern for mine. On one hand, cold Thursday night against an opponent who doesn't draw huge crowds in away games is not a huge surprise. But on the other hand, a 125th club celebration game in 1994 (I think) vs Collingwood attracted a full MCG basically. We are going backwards as a club in terms of fan base, and given we're the smallest fan base in Melbourne to begin with, any regression on that is near fatal. The club better have some marketing gurus pondering that as we speak

 

[giantroo]

l wonder if it was heard on the tv....

It was heard loud and clear!

 

[HBFlanker]

Pretty happy with the effort.

The dogs are a 50 point better team than us at the moment. I actually think they win the whole thing if they stay healthy.

Injuries really hurt, especially with a winnable one next week.

Must persist with Dawson at all costs.

 

[kool kangas]

Pretty happy with the effort.

The dogs are a 50 point better team than us at the moment. I actually think they win the whole thing if they stay healthy.

Injuries really hurt, especially with a winnable one next week.

Must persist with Dawson at all costs.

Agree...atrocious umpiring, Injuries to LDU, Larkey and Xerri , and a 5 day turn around didnt help...we might not have won but it would have been a lot closer...

 

[HBFlanker]

Agree...atrocious umpiring, Injuries to LDU, Larkey and Xerri , and a 5 day turn around didnt help...we might not have won but it would have been a lot closer...

Ticks for Dawson + Hardeman. Bit more exposure for Cooper as well, who handled himself well.

Need to take the positives.

 

[Roosurgence]

l wonder if it was heard on the tv....

7 would have dulled the mics. Can’t have the AFL’s incompetent gimps being called into question.

 

[kool kangas]

Ticks for Dawson + Hardeman. Bit more exposure for Cooper as well, who handled himself well.

Need to take the positives.

True..l even thought Scott was better last night. Some of our younger players are starting to show signs of improvement. l wouldn't mind seeing both Zac Banch and Brayden George in the side this season at some point maybe at the expense of RHJ and Duursma..We may have to go down the Tigers path of playing a lot more of the kids in the last half of the season.

 

[muttley45]

The Bont, cannot have free kick paid against, not only the blatant non holding the ball, at least twice i saw him "assist" the ball over the boundary, once tapped it over, once walked it over, the double standard umpiring is so consistent for us, and i would love to hear an honest assessment by some of our player's, without fear of retribution.

 

[Hydatina Physis]

Haven't watched a lot of North game this season, how's FOS going? Has he played every game?

 

[William Caresser]

Hoyne from Champion Data said a few weeks back that we are the slowest to dispose of the ball in D-50 and kick it sideways and long, essentially with the most hang time. Only Essendon was close. He and King described what we see every week - the ball moves at snail's pace and the opposition has time to set up and so we can't get it out of our back half.

Last night we lost the inside 50s 43-65 but won the clearances - a regular occurrence this year. As usual, lots of repeat entries from the opposition after lots of slow, sideways ball movement or shallow kicks to a contest from us from D-50. We've seen it all year.

So when in Q1, Dawson immediately and instinctively kicked it 60 metres up the centre from deep in defence (after Stephens' did enough to spoil) it was highly unusual, but we kicked our 5th goal. Later in the game Zurhaar - unusually rebounding back in D-50 - also moved the ball fast through the corridor and we kicked a goal.

We have to start moving the ball immediately and more directly from back there, a lot more often.

 

[Moti]

Hoyne from Champion Data said a few weeks back that we are the slowest to dispose of the ball in D-50 and kick it sideways and long, essentially with the most hang time. Only Essendon was close. He and King described what we see every week - the ball moves at snail's pace and the opposition has time to set up and so we can't get it out of our back half.

Last night we lost the inside 50s 43-65 but won the clearances - a regular occurrence this year. As usual, lots of repeat entries from the opposition after lots of slow, sideways ball movement or shallow kicks to a contest from us from D-50. We've seen it all year. Daniel is not the answer.

So when in Q1, Dawson immediately and instinctively kicked it 60 metres up the centre from deep in defence (after Stephens' did enough to spoil) it was highly unusual, but we kicked our 5th goal. Later in the game Zurhaar - unusually rebounding back in D-50 - also moved the ball fast through the corridor and we kicked a goal.

We have to start moving the ball immediately and more directly from back there, a lot more often.

 

[Devil Fish]

I am not going to comment on talent because I think it's the emotion talking for you, which is normal after a couple of heavy losses. But when you cool down you will realise that no club has a 23 full of top talent. Role players are absolutely fine, and when our talented players become guns, the same role players will look 10 times better. It's not far away either.

But the crowd number is the bigger concern for mine. On one hand, cold Thursday night against an opponent who doesn't draw huge crowds in away games is not a huge surprise. But on the other hand, a 125th club celebration game in 1994 (I think) vs Collingwood attracted a full MCG basically. We are going backwards as a club in terms of fan base, and given we're the smallest fan base in Melbourne to begin with, any regression on that is near fatal. The club better have some marketing gurus pondering that as we speak

Which of our talented players do you think will become “guns”? And by “gun”, I assume you mean a Top 50 AFL player, not someone who is “handy”.

 

[Event Horizon]

Which of our talented players do you think will become “guns”? And by “gun”, I assume you mean a Top 50 AFL player, not someone who is “handy”.

Pretty much most of the ones you mentioned: McKercher, Sheezel, Comben, still believe in Wardlaw as well, X is already in the 3-5 of his position, as is Larkey arguably, Curtis, LDU, Hardeman, Zurhaar and possibly a few others like FOS in the future

 

[the big lebowski]

David King is a shithouse game day commentator.

Stick to stats and making up new terms like ‘leg drivers’ and ‘quarterback’

I loved the larkey praise

“Larkey is such a great target. Very rarely gets outmarked and you know he’ll bring the ball to ground”

Where a recent stat has him as the no 1 kpf to get out marked by the defender

 

[Pres]

Hoyne from Champion Data said a few weeks back that we are the slowest to dispose of the ball in D-50 and kick it sideways and long, essentially with the most hang time. Only Essendon was close. He and King described what we see every week - the ball moves at snail's pace and the opposition has time to set up and so we can't get it out of our back half.

Last night we lost the inside 50s 43-65 but won the clearances - a regular occurrence this year. As usual, lots of repeat entries from the opposition after lots of slow, sideways ball movement or shallow kicks to a contest from us from D-50. We've seen it all year.

So when in Q1, Dawson immediately and instinctively kicked it 60 metres up the centre from deep in defence (after Stephens' did enough to spoil) it was highly unusual, but we kicked our 5th goal. Later in the game Zurhaar - unusually rebounding back in D-50 - also moved the ball fast through the corridor and we kicked a goal.

We have to start moving the ball immediately and more directly from back there, a lot more often.

Great call mate. Was saying this on repeat during the game.

I thought we toughed the game out really well and it did not feel like an upsetting loss. Loved the absolute Shinboner performances of Maley and Dawson. Both did the jumper proud.

The forward line structure looked unbalanced and picking too many of the same type of player did not work. Hopefully Banch debuts next week as we desperately need his type in the team.

FWIW I thought the crowd turnout was good and the celebrations very well done. Denis' speech just sensational.

 

[the big lebowski]

Hoyne from Champion Data said a few weeks back that we are the slowest to dispose of the ball in D-50 and kick it sideways and long, essentially with the most hang time. Only Essendon was close. He and King described what we see every week - the ball moves at snail's pace and the opposition has time to set up and so we can't get it out of our back half.

Last night we lost the inside 50s 43-65 but won the clearances - a regular occurrence this year. As usual, lots of repeat entries from the opposition after lots of slow, sideways ball movement or shallow kicks to a contest from us from D-50. We've seen it all year.

So when in Q1, Dawson immediately and instinctively kicked it 60 metres up the centre from deep in defence (after Stephens' did enough to spoil) it was highly unusual, but we kicked our 5th goal. Later in the game Zurhaar - unusually rebounding back in D-50 - also moved the ball fast through the corridor and we kicked a goal.

We have to start moving the ball immediately and more directly from back there, a lot more often.

So much this.

It absolutely infuriates me.

Hardeman is a perfect example. He’s got speed and a penetrating kick that we haven’t seen for ages. When he moves it quickly and kicks it long, something good usually happens. When he does those dinky little kicks he often turns it over.

What’s the issue with kicking to the advantage of a forward 1 vs 1 or even 2 vs 2? King said last night the Paul Curtis leads the comp when he is kicked to 1 vs 1 with a goal being the outcome. 27% of the time. He is second in the comp for the team scoring a goal when he is kicked to 1 vs 1.

Get it in there long and quick.

Maley is absolutely perfect for this. Even better than JD because he genuinely flies at the ball. Get RHJ, Konstanty, Zuhaar at his feet.

Next, last night dinky over possessing of the footy cost us 6 or so goals.

Lastly, other than against the hawks, we have been close to the best clearance team in the comp. Long kicking equals stoppages. Short kicking does not (just turnovers)

 

[Rollmop]

Does anyone know what happened to Dawson in the last? Watched him hobble off and thought he was done but then he came back on later and looked ok? Was at the game last night and didn’t catch what happened

 

[Passmore]

Does anyone know what happened to Dawson in the last? Watched him hobble off and thought he was done but then he came back on later and looked ok? Was at the game last night and didn’t catch what happened

Corky as per giantroo

 

[giantroo]

 

[Donflicted]

Sorry for the intrusion

Not here for banter or to bait etc

I only watched till half time but man Larky and Curtis have excellent connection and Marly while wasn't rewarded on the stat sheet he seemed to be able to bring the ball to the ground in every marking contest

i was hoping it would go your way honorable loses get annoying and at some point you want it to swing but i certainly do not think you guys disgraced yourselves in anyway either

Hope you guys get some good wins in the latter of the season

 

[Hazey1977]

Hoyne from Champion Data said a few weeks back that we are the slowest to dispose of the ball in D-50 and kick it sideways and long, essentially with the most hang time. Only Essendon was close. He and King described what we see every week - the ball moves at snail's pace and the opposition has time to set up and so we can't get it out of our back half.

Last night we lost the inside 50s 43-65 but won the clearances - a regular occurrence this year. As usual, lots of repeat entries from the opposition after lots of slow, sideways ball movement or shallow kicks to a contest from us from D-50. We've seen it all year.

So when in Q1, Dawson immediately and instinctively kicked it 60 metres up the centre from deep in defence (after Stephens' did enough to spoil) it was highly unusual, but we kicked our 5th goal. Later in the game Zurhaar - unusually rebounding back in D-50 - also moved the ball fast through the corridor and we kicked a goal.

We have to start moving the ball immediately and more directly from back there, a lot more often.

I agree.... But....when we initially tried this under Clarko our skills are so poor we kept turning it over and getting 80-100pt floggings.

Need to get better skills.

 

[Hazey1977]

We looked so much slower than WB across the ground, but particularly on the spread.

Are all our players that much slower or are our fumbles and poor skills making it look like we're slower?