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demondavey said:
Soldier in soldier out arrangement? Clarko model?
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Interesting observation -- it hadn't occurred to me!

I suppose that if there's a "secret" to last year's success it was the ability to get A grade performances out of guys that you wouldn't really regard as A grade players. And, yes, I think we do have the ability to cover the loss of a few such players -- there's probably a good dozen guys from the premiership team who have almost like-for-like replacements available.

I think it's the ability the successfully utilize those second tier players well that has really made the difference. Lots of teams can swap soldiers in and out, but it's being able to get them to play a role that is the important thing.
 

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muzhogg said:
Interesting observation -- it hadn't occurred to me!

I suppose that if there's a "secret" to last year's success it was the ability to get A grade performances out of guys that you wouldn't really regard as A grade players. And, yes, I think we do have the ability to cover the loss of a few such players -- there's probably a good dozen guys from the premiership team who have almost like-for-like replacements available.

I think it's the ability the successfully utilize those second tier players well that has really made the difference. Lots of teams can swap soldiers in and out, but it's being able to get them to play a role that is the important thing.
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I mean if you look at someone like Grigg for example, is it a similar case of when Clarkson drafted in Lake to fill a role or even Dew. Do you see similarities with some acquisitions?
 
demondavey said:
I mean if you look at someone like Grigg for example, is it a similar case of when Clarkson drafted in Lake to fill a role or even Dew. Do you see similarities with some acquisitions?
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Certainly. I mean, Nankervis is the obvious one -- I don't have to say anything about why he was drafted. But there's also Caddy, Prestia, Miles, Lloyd, etc. Each of those guys do a slightly different thing, but I'm sure they were drafted with an end in mind.

What really stands out to me, though, is the conversation which occurred between the Richmond drafting and coaching people early last year. The story runs, basically, that the coaching staff sat down with the drafting people and asked the question: "What sort of players have we been chasing and why?"

The answer to that question (runners with elite endurance) played a huge part in determining how the Tigers game-plan was redeveloped in 2017.

From that you can make two observations:

1. Players have certainly been drafted based on particular traits.

2. It was only when the coaching department started levering off those traits that the lesser lights really began to shine.

So I think it's easy to fall into a kind of "cart before the horse" thinking about Richmond in 2017.

The "orthodox" way of thinking about building a team would be (a) set your game plan, and then (b) recruit the players you need to implement it. But it seems to me that for Richmond it kind of worked the other way around: (a) recruit your players, and then (a) set a game-plan that plays to their strengths.

That's a very simplistic take on it, of course, but it does suggest to me that what we've recruited over the last half decade or so is a bunch of players who certainly have their own individual talents but who are still, in many ways, very strong on a few core abilities based around running and endurance.

With a coaching department that seems to have cracked the secret to how to best utilize those individual talents in a whole team performance it means (in my opinion, of course) that it's not quite so necessary to draft guys to play specific roles. Instead, we seem to draft guys who are close to a certain type (runners with good football skills) who are then coached to play the particular role the team needs them to play.

That's how you end up with guys like Caddy, Cotch and Dusty who are equally comfortable playing in the middle or at full-forward. They each do that in different ways, but they all do it quite effectively.

Bottom line: I don't know that we draft guys to play particular roles, instead we seem to me to draft guys with particular traits who are capable of playing different roles depending upon requirements. I think it's an astute combination of versatility in the players, and shrewd coaching to get them to make a strong team contribution.

Edit: just to add. The instance of Lake going to Hawthorn was an interesting one. He certainly was chased to fill a role. I think Richmond are perhaps fortunate that we already have two guys who fill the two hardest to fill roles: Reiwoldt and Rance. Almost every other position on the field can be filled by guys who are B graders, but you do need (I think) a real quality forward and a real quality defender. If you don't have them, you have to chase them. As Richmond already have them, we've been fortunate that we haven't had to draft "role players" as such. Oh, you also need a quality ruck -- so in a sense recruiting Nank is our equivalent of Hawthorn recruiting Lake. Other than ruck, FF and FB I don't know that players need very position specific skills.
 
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OP is a troll. He has been stinking up all summer over our supporters and our premiership. Any time anything related to our flag was discussed, he would quickly try to derail the conversation and hang shit on us. Now he comes onto our board because he all of a sudden wants to hear our thoughts on us going back to back after two JLT games? Lol please. Melbourne supporters are in the tier just below North/Geelong/Collingwood for producing the most salt after our premiership and it was this relentlessly whinging, puffer vest wearing, Jeep Driving, ski pass buying, thermos drinking, Toorak resident that lead their charge.
 
Gosha said:
OP is a troll. He has been stinking up all summer over our supporters and our premiership. Any time anything related to our flag was discussed, he would quickly try to derail the conversation and hang shit on us. Now he comes onto our board because he all of a sudden wants to hear our thoughts on us going back to back after two JLT games? Lol please. Melbourne supporters are in the tier just below North/Geelong/Collingwood for producing the most salt after our premiership and it was this relentlessly whinging, puffer vest wearing, Jeep Driving, ski pass buying, thermos drinking, Toorak resident that lead their charge.
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If I was a troll there is no way I’d come to this board and make an assertion that I believed Richmond could go back to back and probably would. In fact when I’ve criticised your supporters it’s primarily because of your inane and repetitive trumpet blowing which is out of context, and your exceptional ability to find a way to weave Dustin Martin into every conversation there is which ends up becoming mind numbing.

I have never stated you weren’t a good side, in fact if you look at my posting you’ll find I’ve defended you vehemently against the anti premiership trolls who continually torpedo your credibility.

I’ve come here to make a valid point and raise a discussion with your fans, I couldn’t care what board I am on, if I want to raise a point, I will.

The only person trolling here is you.
 
Gosha said:
OP is a troll. He has been stinking up all summer over our supporters and our premiership. Any time anything related to our flag was discussed, he would quickly try to derail the conversation and hang shit on us. Now he comes onto our board because he all of a sudden wants to hear our thoughts on us going back to back after two JLT games? Lol please. Melbourne supporters are in the tier just below North/Geelong/Collingwood for producing the most salt after our premiership and it was this relentlessly whinging, puffer vest wearing, Jeep Driving, ski pass buying, thermos drinking, Toorak resident that lead their charge.
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You’ve made some really big assumptions about what I am haven’t you? Big generalisation without knowing the facts.

Troll.
 
demondavey said:
If I was a troll there is no way I’d come to this board and make an assertion that I believed Richmond could go back to back and probably would. In fact when I’ve criticised your supporters it’s primarily because of your inane and repetitive trumpet blowing which is out of context, and your exceptional ability to find a way to weave Dustin Martin into every conversation there is which ends up becoming mind numbing.

I have never stated you weren’t a good side, in fact if you look at my posting you’ll find I’ve defended you vehemently against the anti premiership trolls who continually torpedo your credibility.

I’ve come here to make a valid point and raise a discussion with your fans, I couldn’t care what board I am on, if I want to raise a point, I will.

The only person trolling here is you.
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You’ve carried on like a baby all off-season because you couldn’t handle any discussion based around our premiership. There’s no way you’re going to convince me that after a summer of sooking about Richmond related discussion, you’re now all of a sudden interested in listening to Richmond supporters talk up Richmond. It’s completely contradictory to everything you stand for.

Have a listen to yourself FFS. You’re sick of “inane and repetitive trumpet blowing” from Richmond supporters so you go to the Richmond board and start a thread about Richmond going back to back (on the back of two JLT games). That’s a really strange way of trying to escape something you don’t like talking about.
 
Gosha said:
You’ve carried on like a baby all off-season because you couldn’t handle any discussion based around our premiership. There’s no way you’re going to convince me that after a summer of sooking about Richmond related discussion, you’re now all of a sudden interested in listening to Richmond supporters talk up Richmond. It’s completely contradictory to everything you stand for.

Have a listen to yourself FFS. You’re sick of “inane and repetitive trumpet blowing” from Richmond supporters so you go to the Richmond board and start a thread about Richmond going back to back (on the back of two JLT games). That’s a really strange way of trying to escape something you don’t like talking about.
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If you actually look at the responses from your supporters in this thread it’s been anything but trumpet blowing, it’s been logical and rational. If anything you’re in the minority and you’re assuming that your fellow supporters are going to carry on like you just because of the fact you won the flag.

I’ve got involved with your premiership talks, again, backed it up consistently. I’ve called you and a few others out for your <insert Dustin Martin comment here> excessive interjection in any thread to introduce Dustin Martin.

Please, you’re wasting my time, don’t quote or post in here. It isn’t for you.
 

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I don't understand why this got nasty. It was a convo in a civil fashion.
Let's calm the **** down.


Sent from my iPhone using Righteous Man Power.
 
demondavey said:
As I said, I engaged in some meaningful discussion before the inevitable low grade poster crawled out of the primordial slime to give their Neanderthal like logic and opinion.
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He might be Neanderthal, but he’s OUR Neanderthal! Now $&@) off and leave him alone.

The last thing we need is Dees telling us how good we are. Ffs Roos started this in JLT and it’s ruined my footy experience.

You see there’s the Tiger Army, and then there’s everyone else. Tribal, independent and we feed on the hatred of others.
Friends? We’re not ready for them.
 

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TigerImposter said:
Can’t believe people on here are having their genitalia played with by a Melbourne troll.
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They haven’t have they?
IF it was a troll it didn’t work very well.
 
Livonski said:
He might be Neanderthal, but he’s OUR Neanderthal! Now $&@) off and leave him alone.

The last thing we need is Dees telling us how good we are. Ffs Roos started this in JLT and it’s ruined my footy experience.

You see there’s the Tiger Army, and then there’s everyone else. Tribal, independent and we feed on the hatred of others.
Friends? We’re not ready for them.
Click to expand...
God have mercy....
 
Livonski said:
He might be Neanderthal, but he’s OUR Neanderthal! Now $&@) off and leave him alone.

The last thing we need is Dees telling us how good we are. Ffs Roos started this in JLT and it’s ruined my footy experience.

You see there’s the Tiger Army, and then there’s everyone else. Tribal, independent and we feed on the hatred of others.
Friends? We’re not ready for them.
Click to expand...
Friends? **** we are a mile off that! You get savaged on here if you even try to talk sensibly about any other team that doesn’t involve just trashing them or having our tongues up our own arses 24/7 at the moment. It’s making me sick.
 

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