Bailey

[melbournemartin]

I know this thread is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction to a meaningless practice match but there were worrying signs with our forward line, or lack of one to be more precise. Yes, we were missing Green and Jurrah but we still had enough senior forwards to hopefully put up more of a contest. Those radio comments about Melbourne being unable to break out of defence were also correct. We don't have a big CHF to bomb the ball to so we have to run it through and we're struggling in that department. We might be able to get a couple of handballs going but at some point someone will **** up a handball (I'm looking at you Nathan Jones).

 

[Crusty Demon]

I know this thread is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction to a meaningless practice match but there were worrying signs with our forward line, or lack of one to be more precise. Yes, we were missing Green and Jurrah but we still had enough senior forwards to hopefully put up more of a contest. Those radio comments about Melbourne being unable to break out of defence were also correct. We don't have a big CHF to bomb the ball to so we have to run it through and we're struggling in that department. We might be able to get a couple of handballs going but at some point someone will **** up a handball (I'm looking at you Nathan Jones).

Agreed. I think we have a problem where half our midfielders are still developing and learning the game, while most of our senior midfielders don't have the footy smarts to carry out Bailey's gameplan!

And this is why i still think we are a few years away from consistent finals footy. Strauss, Tapscott, Trengove, Gysberts, Maric, Blease and Scully are all young guns, and can use the footy. However, they all have only a handful of games experience. These guys have footy smarts, but will take a few years to gel together as a team. Grimes and Davey are the only 2 players out there I feel comfortable with footy in hand coming out of defense into midfield. It's a serious issue we have seeing as we are living in a world of zones and forward pressure...

 

[TRENGOVE2SCULLY]

if we dont make finals this year then bailey needs to go.

just hasn't done enough

 

[dee64]

This thread is crap...give to the Queens bday and if we are not 4/6or 5/5 the pressure should be applied to Dean.the way Todd Vineys goin he wont be able fit fit in the coaches box hes that big.i thought he had swallowed a bean bag or something...very nice bloke though got some nice photos with him and my girls yesty..

And the relevance of Todd Viney's weight to this thread is?

It's strange that someone would call their sisters or girlfriends "my girls", because surely you are not old enough to have kids?

 

[Syrus]

Spoke to him today at the family day for 5 mins. Asked him how we went (i was at Airshow) and he said that they made 4-5 crutial mistakes and that he played a few young guys like Blease, Tapscott. I didn't know if we won or lost, before I spoke to him, but i had worked it out after the above comments.

As for Baileys future with the club, I might leave my comments in regards to him, until after round 6.

 

[jimmyclean]

If you accept we took Bailey as a long term coach, then the argument is that they need to spend years learning the strategy and developing as a team. Only then we are at our absolute best chance to win a premiership.

If we decide that Bailey is no good, and then it turns out next person we hire is no good what do we do then? We've essentially wasted a generation of players jumping coaches.

I think it is a far bigger risk to switch coaches than it is to keep Bailey.

Even switching to someone like Malthouse, who knows how the players will react to the change in styles.

Give the players time to develop, yesterday was a perfect example of this, young players learning how to play our game.

Edit- Remember some of our 'key' players have only been under Dean Bailey for 2 seasons.

 

[bing181]

Forget about game plans or tactics, forget about motivation, here's what Voss had to say about why the Lions won:

"Voss said a lightened training load was behind the improved display."

As someone said on another thread, it's a marathon people, not a sprint. If we make the finals in 2012 we'll be doing well. Anyone who thinks that we should be walk-up finalists this year, with the kids we have, is just kidding themselves. Regardless of the potential, the difference between Black and Power on the one hand and Scully and Trengove on the other is just night and day.

Sheesh.

 

[demonfan9]

Although I have been frustrated at the last two performances, we have to keep in mind that in the big picture, these pre-season games mean absolutely nothing. Nobody looks back in October and discusses the importance of the pre-season matches that took place earlier that year. All that matters is what happens between Round 1 and 22, and hopefully finals after that.

So we need to apply that principle to Dean Bailey when we judge his performance. Look at his most recent season (2010), and judge him on that, not on the result of a couple of practice matches in March. If we look back to last year, I'd say most supporters were pleased with our progress we made during the season. 8.5 wins was about the expectation, we were actually in finals contention with three rounds to go, no massive defeats and an exciting game plan based on attacking run through the centre corridor. It's easy to forget all the positives we took out of last year, for which Bails deserves some credit. First week of the NAB Cup, we go and break a 10 year hoodoo at AAMI Stadium, everyone is up and about, excited for the year ahead. Two weeks later and we're ready to stick the knives into Bailey and the team. We've gotta be a bit more measured than that (hard thing, I know, cos we are all so passionate) but sometimes you have to step back and take a look at the bigger picture before you make judgements.

 

[stretcharmstrong]

Very good post mate.

 

[Ando727]

This thread is crap...give to the Queens bday and if we are not 4/6or 5/5 the pressure should be applied to Dean.the way Todd Vineys goin he wont be able fit fit in the coaches box hes that big.i thought he had swallowed a bean bag or something...very nice bloke though got some nice photos with him and my girls yesty..

You know, it says you support Collingwood under your username. What's the deal with the "we"?

 

[Syrus]

You know, it says you support Collingwood under your username. What's the deal with the "we"?

It is Beton5. He had to post under another user name as he has been carded.

 

[eskimo]

Bit of calm down is needed around these parts.


So what, we lost to Brisbane. We were missing 10 of our best players, 4 of them starters in our backline. Black and Power were the best players for Brisbane.

We tried a slightly different game style, kicking a bit longer out of defense, for most of the game. Sometimes it cam eoff, sometimes it didn't. But what we did achieve was trying a different way to get out of defence than run and carry. When we don't do it every single time, and we mix up between long kicking and run and carry, I think it will work ok.

Also, Jamar spent most of the second half against Brizzy in the forward line, and did very little ruck work. That obviously wont be the case when the real stuff starts.

People are over reacting to a game that meant nothing, with a lot of experiments going on.

As for having no one in the forward line - well that was something a little different also. We effectively pushed all our players up a line on the field. When it worked it worked beautifully, but if anyone actually thinks we will play an entire game/season like that then they are kidding themselves. We were trying some different things, so when plan A fails, we have a plan B. Yesterday we played an entire game using plan B. Things will be mixed up, and that's a good thing. We don't want to be 1 dimensional!

 

[BigSexc]

It is Beton5. He had to post under another user name as he has been carded.

i dunno, i'm skeptical of anyone who posts under a collingwood username to 'troll' them.. dont think its a melbourne supporter

 

[unstable punt]

i dunno, i'm skeptical of anyone who posts under a collingwood username to 'troll' them.. dont think its a melbourne supporter

Yes read all the abuse etc but the bottom line is he is not performing as a coach, they should start chasing Malthouse by mid-year because as I've said Bailey can talk the talk but walk it ............NO

 

[DeesFan]

my comments on Bails

Great in the media, very funny and comes across as very smart (would make a good politician) . My concern is that he is trying a game plan based on the Cats we all know that they have even moved away from it. I am unsure is he can come up with something new or cutting edge. The kids he has recruited are good but they need a leader not a mate I get that feeling that he wants to be a friend rather than a coach.

Bailey would be great in the role as Connely but I have never thought he was a coach, just doesnt have the right make up.

We should go with the likes of Roo's , Malthouse (he would love a good bunch of kids) or even a Leigh Matthews - these type of people dont take crap and demand a high level of commitment.

Hopefully he can lift this year but I expect us to finish lower down then is expected.

The club is going the right way .. no debt etc but we need the quality leader ... just hope they do it if we dont reach expectations.

 

[The Dr]

my comments on Bails

Great in the media, very funny and comes across as very smart (would make a good politician) . My concern is that he is trying a game plan based on the Cats we all know that they have even moved away from it. I am unsure is he can come up with something new or cutting edge. The kids he has recruited are good but they need a leader not a mate I get that feeling that he wants to be a friend rather than a coach.

Bailey would be great in the role as Connely but I have never thought he was a coach, just doesnt have the right make up.

We should go with the likes of Roo's , Malthouse (he would love a good bunch of kids) or even a Leigh Matthews - these type of people dont take crap and demand a high level of commitment.

Hopefully he can lift this year but I expect us to finish lower down then is expected.

The club is going the right way .. no debt etc but we need the quality leader ... just hope they do it if we dont reach expectations.

Mate agree with everything you've said there, especially the bolded bits.

I of course hope Bailey surprises us and we have a belter of a year and beyond....but I'm starting to doubt he's the man that can get the best out of all our players and implement a plan that can deliver in this day and age of zones, presses etc.

 

[Demon 16]

I'm not gonna judge him on preseason form ffs!

I Thought he was decent last year so I'm happy to re-assess at the end of this year.

 

[stabler]

I think Bails is in for the long haul, and i think he'll do well.

 

[TheBoss]

I'm not gonna judge him on preseason form ffs!

I Thought he was decent last year so I'm happy to re-assess at the end of this year.

Why shouldn't he be held accountable? With the exception of the first week, MFC have been playing terrible football for what is meant to be an up and coming side. I had higher expectations coming into this year, but now I am not sure if MFC is capable of playing in the finals this year.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

Why shouldn't he be held accountable? With the exception of the first week, MFC have been playing terrible football for what is meant to be an up and coming side. I had higher expectations coming into this year, but now I am not sure if MFC is capable of playing in the finals this year.

STFU

finals would be exceeding expectations FFS! we have one year that we finish 13th and then become the youngest list in the afl par the GC and supporters are expecting a finals appearance?

the ****?!?

we are a young inexperienced side, with our most 'talented' players generally not having played more than 20 games of league footy

we are at least a year away from being ready for finals, probably three from serious contention (top 4)

yes we have a lot of talent, all you have to do is look at the premiership winners game stats, average of 120 games or something, collingwood was considered young and they had an average of 100 games

we have around 65!!

some of you are sounding like the panic-mongerers that reside on demonland

 

[TheBoss]

God forbid that some people expect improvement from year to year, instead of accepting mediocrity.

With some of the performances the team had in 2010 against top sides, I honestly believed that Melbourne were capable of scraping into the the top 8 this year. If some of those close games last year fell MFC's way they would have made the finals last year. I thought a finish between 7-10 would be realistic for this year. After the form displayed during this pre-season I think a finish between 9-14 is more realistic.

 

[Ando727]

God forbid that some people expect improvement from year to year, instead of accepting mediocrity.

With some of the performances the team had in 2010 against top sides, I honestly believed that Melbourne were capable of scraping into the the top 8 this year. If some of those close games last year fell MFC's way they would have made the finals last year. I thought a finish between 7-10 would be realistic for this year. After the form displayed during this pre-season I think a finish between 9-14 is more realistic.

Yep, I'm going to call it. If Melbourne isn't at least battling for finals spot this year, we need a change of direction. There is enough talent on the list to be pushing for that. If we are more than a game outside the 8, I'd rather we looked into recruiting a coach with serious credentials ie. a Paul Roos type. I think Melbourne as a club, as well as its supporters, are entirely too patient. Time to get impatient. I'd be very disappointed if the talk within the club wasn't "we need finals this year". Who cares if it isn't realistic according to conventional wisdom. You have to aim high and be intolerant of mediocrity. At the very least, I need t see some real creativity and strategy coming from the coaches box. Much as he is a pleasant bloke. I am yet to see that from Bailey.

 

[THE STING2]

God forbid that some people expect improvement from year to year, instead of accepting mediocrity.

With some of the performances the team had in 2010 against top sides, I honestly believed that Melbourne were capable of scraping into the the top 8 this year. If some of those close games last year fell MFC's way they would have made the finals last year. I thought a finish between 7-10 would be realistic for this year. After the form displayed during this pre-season I think a finish between 9-14 is more realistic.

We can only understand where we are at when we have our best team on the park regularly.

When we played Brisbane in rnd 5 last year they were flying on top of the ladder, now they are one of the favourities to win the spoon so you really can't take early season form let alone pre season form.

For Bailey to keep his job we will have to win more games and more importantly we have to finish the season off well so we know that Bailey is moving us forward and not stagnating, a good start is very important to take the pressure off the club.

If Bailey does fail we have to go for someone at Collingwood. Malthouse is the obvious choice but it will difficult to compete for his signature. Neeld and Watters would be very good candidates as well.

I'm not sure about Viney now, I think he wants to step away a bit from serious coaching now that his son is about to step into the AFL in a couple of years time.

 

[jimmyclean]

Why shouldn't he be held accountable? With the exception of the first week, MFC have been playing terrible football for what is meant to be an up and coming side. I had higher expectations coming into this year, but now I am not sure if MFC is capable of playing in the finals this year.

What would you prefer?

A NAB grand final appearance, coupled with another 5-6 injuries to top 24 players from the games, lets say 1-2 of which are long term.

or

A middling pre-season and the amount of injuries we currently have.

Bailey has smart played list management and short sighted folks like you get pissed.

If we win 10 games or more this year, all your crying is for nothing. You know why? because no one cares about the pre-season.

 

[TheBoss]

I don't care about the results, I care about the effort and execution which have both been lacking this preseason. If you bothered to watch any of the games you will realise that they have taken a few steps backwards.