Coach Ben Rutten: Senior Coach

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ant555

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I completely agree. He's not going to win a flag, it's for the cash. Which incidentally helps his family more than our contract.

And I've been guilty of feeling the same way as ghostdog in the past but I've moved past it. Clubs aren't loyal so supporters shouldn't hold players to a different standard. If there was a better option we'd have dumped Saad no questions, can't blame him for doing the same.

Especially when they leave and we get a good result.
I do not know what the role actually is but there is some sort of cultural role / job he will also be filling that could extend past his playing career.
The dollar amounts of the contracts where pretty line ball in the end. It will come out in the end but my mail is there are a couple of players on the list he lost all respect for last year and he was not comfortable being in a club that clearly had a few divisions in the playing list. There is also an amount of truth in his inability to take feed back at times from what I hear as well. Seems a change of club could well be a win for both parties in the long run.

Anyway he has gone and we have moved on and the coach looks like he is heading down the right path to bring the team back to being a united group.
 

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Bombermania

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I do not know what the role actually is but there is some sort of cultural role / job he will also be filling that could extend past his playing career.
The dollar amounts of the contracts where pretty line ball in the end. It will come out in the end but my mail is there are a couple of players on the list he lost all respect for last year and he was not comfortable being in a club that clearly had a few divisions in the playing list. There is also an amount of truth in his inability to take feed back at times from what I hear as well. Seems a change of club could well be a win for both parties in the long run.

Anyway he has gone and we have moved on and the coach looks like he is heading down the right path to bring the team back to being a united group.
Any ideas on who those players were that Saad lost respect for?
 

Bombermania

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The further we get away from it the more I hate Worsfold

So insipid
I don't hate woosha but sitting behind the bench let me watch the players as they came off and from what i saw they didn't acknowledged him sitting there. There were times when I sense a fair bit of indifference among the playing group.
 

fairbump_playon

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I don't hate woosha but sitting behind the bench let me watch the players as they came off and from what i saw they didn't acknowledged him sitting there. There were times when I sense a fair bit of indifference among the playing group.
Yeah I shouldn’t have voiced it the way I did. I don’t hate John Worsfold. I hated having him as coach of Essendon.

If the playing group felt indifference it started with him. It always felt like a wet fish handshake kind of a coaching approach to me, and that feeling just intensifies as I see Rutten do crazy things like ... show enthusiasm and speak directly.
 

ghostdog

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Yeah I shouldn’t have voiced it the way I did. I don’t hate John Worsfold. I hated having him as coach of Essendon.

If the playing group felt indifference it started with him. It always felt like a wet fish handshake kind of a coaching approach to me, and that feeling just intensifies as I see Rutten do crazy things like ... show enthusiasm and speak directly.
Agree. A lot of these guys were still boys. They needed firm boundaries and instruction rather than to be left to their own devices. "Take the game on" just doesn't sound like instructive coaching.
 

fairbump_playon

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Agree. A lot of these guys were still boys. They needed firm boundaries and instruction rather than to be left to their own devices. "Take the game on" just doesn't sound like instructive coaching.
Indeed it does not. I’m sure he believed in the “player led” approach, but it feels like he missed the few sections of the manual about the coach’s role in it all.

Clearer expectations and accountability seem to be what a lot of even senior players were asking for.

You go to work and your boss says “if you want to do a good job, it’s up to you - I’ll be over here if you have any questions”.

A small percentage of people would thrive in that world, but most won’t.

Player leaders that emerge should be emulating the leadership template that a coach provides - not having to invent one. You want a coherent leadership culture. It’s so wack to expect disciplined, energetic player leaders to pop up and hold the whole group to account while the senior coach’s preferred style is to sit back quietly and contemplate learnings.
 

Old Campaigner

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Indeed it does not. I’m sure he believed in the “player led” approach, but it feels like he missed the few sections of the manual about the coach’s role in it all.

Clearer expectations and accountability seem to be what a lot of even senior players were asking for.

You go to work and your boss says “if you want to do a good job, it’s up to you - I’ll be over here if you have any questions”.

A small percentage of people would thrive in that world, but most won’t.

Player leaders that emerge should be emulating the leadership template that a coach provides - not having to invent one. You want a coherent leadership culture. It’s so wack to expect disciplined, energetic player leaders to pop up and hold the whole group to account while the senior coach’s preferred style is to sit back quietly and contemplate learnings.
The player led approach needs strong leadership in the playing group which is something we lacked and probably still lack. It might work if you have an extremely dominant personality like Luke Hodge on the field but I’m not sure any of our guys come close to that sort of leadership and strength of character.
 

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owen87

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The player led approach needs strong leadership in the playing group which is something we lacked and probably still lack. It might work if you have an extremely dominant personality like Luke Hodge on the field but I’m not sure any of our guys come close to that sort of leadership and strength of character.
It seems suitable for a mature, successful playing group. Geelong or Hawthorn in their premiership years for example. It doesn't seem suitable for one that's developing and building toward trying to be successful.

I imagine as much as Hodge is recognised as an outstanding leader, Clarkson would have driven very clear expectations of the players and playing group for most of that time.
 

fairbump_playon

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The player led approach needs strong leadership in the playing group which is something we lacked and probably still lack. It might work if you have an extremely dominant personality like Luke Hodge on the field but I’m not sure any of our guys come close to that sort of leadership and strength of character.
Hodge would help for sure. But the thing is that he was playing under Clarkson who I'm sure set crystal clear boundaries.

What would Luke Hodge teams have looked like under John Worsfold? Would Hodge have been the leader that he was if it was mostly about learnings?

Or flip it... Will some of our players be better leaders if their coach models what leadership should really look like? I don't think we have a Hodge but watch our collective complaints about weak on field leadership start to fade away once we have a strong hand on the wheel. Hopefully it's Rutten.
 

Bombermania

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Yeah I shouldn’t have voiced it the way I did. I don’t hate John Worsfold. I hated having him as coach of Essendon.

If the playing group felt indifference it started with him. It always felt like a wet fish handshake kind of a coaching approach to me, and that feeling just intensifies as I see Rutten do crazy things like ... show enthusiasm and speak directly.
I knew that's what you meant which is why I made the comment about the body language on the bench. I thought he started off okay but as others have said there might have been issues building which impacted the team direction because the tone and vibe seemed to change.
 

rumply

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I don’t think it could possibly be any clearer that Worsfold was the man for 2016-17, but for 2018 - 2020 he was a shocker.

You sometimes get that wrong by a year, which happens. But our re-signing of Worsfold in 2018 was an incredible misstep. Idiocy.
Yep but both parties share the blame as Worsfold shouldn't have put his hand up to go around again when clearly he wasn't 100% committed. But who's going to turn down that sort of payday for a couple more years to help set your family up etc, not me that's for sure.
 

The Dustbin

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I’m actually enjoying the players embrace the new coaching regime, especially the younger players. Looks a completely different and galvanised team.

Rutten focus on the club’ history and enhancing that too with the players (training at windy hill, players entrance at Tullamarine) has been unreal to see.

Makes a difference on the culture and the overall workplace environment when you don’t have 4 blokes there who don’t want to be there. Quite excited with this new chapter, and whilst I didn’t approve on the process relating to Rutten’ appointment, he’s a doing a great job thus far.
 

Mootsy

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I’m actually enjoying the players embrace the new coaching regime, especially the younger players. Looks a completely different and galvanised team.

Rutten focus on the club’ history and enhancing that too with the players (training at windy hill, players entrance at Tullamarine) has been unreal to see.

Makes a difference on the culture and the overall workplace environment when you don’t have 4 blokes there who don’t want to be there. Quite excited with this new chapter, and whilst I didn’t approve on the process relating to Rutten’ appointment, he’s a doing a great job thus far.
That latest video is superb!
Training at Windy Hill and jazzing up the history at the hangar seems to be bringing some exciting atmosphere to the place.

Team has all the hallmarks of being as good as Geelong or the Tigers if they want to. They've got the great facilities and resources, people, to do it.

In terms of on field improvements, sorting out the midfield and the forward line is what fans want to see. Playing well as a team and confident performances etc. Just the basic stuff.
 

Old Campaigner

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I’m actually enjoying the players embrace the new coaching regime, especially the younger players. Looks a completely different and galvanised team.

Rutten focus on the club’ history and enhancing that too with the players (training at windy hill, players entrance at Tullamarine) has been unreal to see.

Makes a difference on the culture and the overall workplace environment when you don’t have 4 blokes there who don’t want to be there. Quite excited with this new chapter, and whilst I didn’t approve on the process relating to Rutten’ appointment, he’s a doing a great job thus far.
I thought the focus on the club history was good too, gives the players something to play for and aspire to. I definitely feel like that is something that's been missing since the drugs saga.
 

westking

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To me it seems for some Rutten is already a success based on how Worsfold coached and how ineffective it was over his last few years. I understand that considering the extremely low base the club is going off. Play a few videos, change up some training drills, reminisce of days long, long ago is obviously enough to suck ppl in.

And here I thought he would get judged on games won and lost - and how they lost.

Personally to me it sounds like they might be struggling to sell memberships this year. Remember Rutten has been appointed in the same mysterious process that Worsfolds extension was granted. Thats why I don't have much confidence. I predict 1-7 start. That is bad. Season over a third of the way through.

That is when Rutten should get judged.

But I dearly hope Im wrong and we get to see something that resembles a group heading together in the right direction. Too much 'hope' and too little 'confidence' from me.
 

Lore

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To me it seems for some Rutten is already a success based on how Worsfold coached and how ineffective it was over his last few years. I understand that considering the extremely low base the club is going off. Play a few videos, change up some training drills, reminisce of days long, long ago is obviously enough to suck ppl in.

And here I thought he would get judged on games won and lost - and how they lost.

Personally to me it sounds like they might be struggling to sell memberships this year. Remember Rutten has been appointed in the same mysterious process that Worsfolds extension was granted. Thats why I don't have much confidence. I predict 1-7 start. That is bad. Season over a third of the way through.

That is when Rutten should get judged.

But I dearly hope Im wrong and we get to see something that resembles a group heading together in the right direction. Too much 'hope' and too little 'confidence' from me.
Liking Rutten so far doesn't equate to an expectation of making finals. From what the club has been saying we seem to be trying to emulate Fremantle 2020 – they started the year 2-5, and ended it 7-10, only half a win better than we were. But they showed some cohesion, evidence of a game plan, improved through the year and blooded some exciting young kids, so they ended the year 12th and happy, while we were 13th and mad as a cut snake.
 

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