Opinion Best 22 for 2022

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Ash24

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Think on 2021 exposed form, Owies gets a gig (well) before Durdin and possibly Fisher too.

Fisher is a mid imo and a different type of mid to most others on our list.

Is Honey picked ahead of Owies or Fisher? Tough one.

Was Cuners at training yesterday?

The knee went mid May - only 6 months back....certainly would be very limited training.

Kennedy? Love the guy, reckon Voss will too.

I think Marchbank (fingers crossed) will be close for Rd 1 but does het get an immediate gong ahead of either Newman or Plowman? (it's a no from me)

When will Doc be able to play??

Young or McGovern? Certainly the fact the young fella is 201cm odd helps his cause....the key forwards aren't getting shorter!

The Guv is versatile too - he's too good to not be in the 22 if fit.

Like others, one Captain. Prefer Weiters.

Those in the wings will press hard too - Carroll, Philp.

Who do we take in the draft?

I'd be talking to LOB/Cotters (has he beefed up or what?) seeing if one would be ok with a SSP spot - then take 2 lives picks in the draft?

A small and a tall.

Unless they have a mature ager in mind in the SSP (KPD type). But that would suggest no faith in OMac, Guv and/or Young....
Pretty hard to not agree with what you've written .

Owies (2nd most improved player for 2021?) > Honey (just) > Fisher (needs to pull his finger out I reckon) > Durdin (not for long)

Marchbank, Doc and Cunners all best 22, but our best hope is to get them all back before the bye.

Kennedy is probably best 22, but is a midfield of Cripps, Hewett and Kennedy too slow?

Gov is not a proper KPD, it's a fight between Young/OMac for the Jones replacement. Hoping McG can battle it out with Kemp for that 3rd tall/intercept role.

I think Voss can get the best out of Cripps and bring him close to 2018-19 form. I say keep him as sole captain for 1 year and then re-assess next year.

Can't wait for Carroll to debut and Philp to get a proper crack at it.

Hoping we take a winger at pick 25 (I'm not fussed who, just think we need some depth) and a mature aged KPD with our available list spot in the pre-season SSP.
 

4flagsin5yrs

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This guy was mentioned by the HUN, who are writing as if we'll take a second draftee....


Cooper Hamilton
Bendigo Pioneers, NAB League / Colbinabbin FC / Caulfield Grammar
State: Victoria Country
Height: 184cm
Weight: 83kg
Date of Birth: 24/09/03

Medium defender/midfielder with elite endurance which enables him to get to multiple contests as well as outnumber the opposition. A very strong contested mark, he also uses the ball effectively by hand and foot. Represented both the Australian under-18s team and Victoria Country this year after being an All-Australian at under-16s level in 2019. He played four matches in the NAB League, averaging 13.2 disposals (7.5 contested) and 4.8 tackles. His time of 5:48 for the 2km time trial at the Victorian Country Draft Combine was the second-fastest ever. His twin brother Hugh is also a draft contender with both dividing their football between Caulfield Grammar and the Pioneers.
 

Accidental genius

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For me Kennedy is best 22 rotating between mid/chf/bench.

Huge fan of owies so he stays in best 22 in meantime but I think durdin may overtake soon. It might come down to who more consistently scores and currently owies is doing well in this aspect.

Durdin is zippy and applied good pressure and looks very dangerous so if he keeps that up and scores as well he will likely overtake owies. Will be sad for owies though because he is such an honest hard working type and he persevered in the reserves for a while before being elevated.
 

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ETET

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Think on 2021 exposed form, Owies gets a gig (well) before Durdin and possibly Fisher too.

Fisher is a mid imo and a different type of mid to most others on our list.

Is Honey picked ahead of Owies or Fisher? Tough one.

Was Cuners at training yesterday?

The knee went mid May - only 6 months back....certainly would be very limited training.

Kennedy? Love the guy, reckon Voss will too.

I think Marchbank (fingers crossed) will be close for Rd 1 but does het get an immediate gong ahead of either Newman or Plowman? (it's a no from me)

When will Doc be able to play??

Young or McGovern? Certainly the fact the young fella is 201cm odd helps his cause....the key forwards aren't getting shorter!

The Guv is versatile too - he's too good to not be in the 22 if fit.

Like others, one Captain. Prefer Weiters.

Those in the wings will press hard too - Carroll, Philp.

Who do we take in the draft?

I'd be talking to LOB/Cotters (has he beefed up or what?) seeing if one would be ok with a SSP spot - then take 2 lives picks in the draft?

A small and a tall.

Unless they have a mature ager in mind in the SSP (KPD type). But that would suggest no faith in OMac, Guv and/or Young....

ps As others have pointed out, it's Honey and Kennedy taking draft spots as rookie upgrades. The other two are promised rookie spots...so that changes the equation. Or can 1 of Honey/Kennedy stay as a rookie.....if there's a will,.....?
I loved Fish when he first started. Dodging, jinking, side stepping, clever.

Now with the progression of our list I see him as vulnerable and playing in the two's quite a bit.

He is unable to run hard enough for long enough to play mid in my view and too lightly framed to compete.
Honey, Durdin stronger in the contest.
Honey, Durdin look like they have more explosive pace.
Fish has little arial presence.

It will be interesting to see how the coaches view his "cleverness" or creative side vs others that are fundamentally better in the contest.
 

4flagsin5yrs

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I loved Fish when he first started. Dodging, jinking, side stepping, clever.

Now with the progression of our list I see him as vulnerable and playing in the two's quite a bit.

He is unable to run hard enough for long enough to play mid in my view and too lightly framed to compete.
Honey, Durdin stronger in the contest.
Honey, Durdin look like they have more explosive pace.
Fish has little arial presence.

It will be interesting to see how the coaches view his "cleverness" or creative side vs others that are fundamentally better in the contest.
Tend to agree, but reckon Fish needs to be a 1st receiver.

That is Cripps extracts the pill, dishes it straight off to Fish who runs, carries and delivers lace out to a forward....easy!
 

gbatman

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Fisher had an injury effected year this year and last year so it clouds a lot. When he got injured early this season they left him on field when he looked really sore (really poor player mgmt). This year he tackled more than Castagna and Charlie Cameron on overall averages. But he tackled less inside forward 50 Which is important To your point. But go back the year before and his tackles inside forward 50 were way higher when he had a specific forward role. It shows physicality and shows he can play the role if he can outmatch Castagna who is one of the first players to ever play the role.

I think the only accusation that should be levelled against Fisher is that he might be injury prone.

In terms of your statement about Fisher not doing much forward, please don’t forget that for the last 5 years we have had both Cripps and Ed Curnow delivering the ball inside 50. They both can’t complete a weighted kick to advantage. It illustrates why McKay is our best forward because with him, you can put the ball high and straight up in the air. On top of toward delivery, give some allowance to how bad Carlton have been and have been in ball transition.

Think of Fisher at Richmond during their 3 flag years as a small forward. Would have been lauded there by now and easily in front of Castagna on class. Carlton are a basket case club. Eddie left, Waite left, Tuohy left. All had form line success elsewhere.

Lets revisit this year if two things happen. Carlton make the 8 with decent transition strategy and Fisher completes a season. Think you will find he is a popular best 22.

As for Durdin, looking forward to him progressing too. Like what you see.
Bit of a problem with stats is they don't show quality. To me Fisher seems easily intimidated and hesitant when it comes to tackling with aggression and towards the contested ball. Honey and Durdin have out performed Fisher and that is in the same team with Ed Curnow and Cripps delivering the ball. I'm not sure Fisher has that scrappiness about him to fight for and apply real pressure around the ground ball but we are just going to have to wait and see, next season is a new year and a chance for players to step up.

I have the same question when it comes to Fisher as I have towards a lot of our talented underperformers, are they willing to take a hit to win the ball or keep it in dispute, do they slow down or speed up when the opposition's attack on the ball is red hot. This is why SPS didn't make it. This is why Durdin will surpass fisher. This is why Philp will make it. I could go on and on about this but commitment trumps talent in the big league and I still have questions around his commitment.

As I said, Fisher has the talent, x-factor and athleticism to be a top level player however it's this type of commitment that's lacking. The injuries haven't really made a huge difference, just kept him off the park too much.

2022 is a new season with new people driving the club so we will see.
 

bigblueboy

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Lots of interesting debate topics here ... my views

Think on 2021 exposed form, Owies gets a gig (well) before Durdin and possibly Fisher too. Not before Fisher

Fisher is a mid imo and a different type of mid to most others on our list. Only as a relief rotation

Is Honey picked ahead of Owies or Fisher? Tough one. Honey is a different player to the other two - he should be in our 22 at HF

Was Cuners at training yesterday? Yes

The knee went mid May - only 6 months back....certainly would be very limited training. Yes

Kennedy? Love the guy, reckon Voss will too. Yes - but Hewett might take his midfield minutes

I think Marchbank (fingers crossed) will be close for Rd 1 but does het get an immediate gong ahead of either Newman or Plowman? (it's a no from me) No - all three are borderline

When will Doc be able to play?? Will be conservative. A return to footy in itself would be a win.

Young or McGovern? Certainly the fact the young fella is 201cm odd helps his cause....the key forwards aren't getting shorter! Possibly both - see comment above re: Marchbank/Plowman/Newman

The Guv is versatile too - he's too good to not be in the 22 if fit. Yes

Like others, one Captain. Prefer Weiters. Cripps

Those in the wings will press hard too - Carroll, Philp. Like both - but will need to show form in 2s first

Who do we take in the draft? Who knows - don't believe the early rumours.

I'd be talking to LOB/Cotters (has he beefed up or what?) seeing if one would be ok with a SSP spot - then take 2 lives picks in the draft? As below

A small and a tall. Likely will go one small.

Unless they have a mature ager in mind in the SSP (KPD type). But that would suggest no faith in OMac, Guv and/or Young.... The two are not the same

ps As others have pointed out, it's Honey and Kennedy taking draft spots as rookie upgrades.
The other two are promised rookie spots...so that changes the equation. Or can 1 of Honey/Kennedy stay as a rookie.....if there's a will,.....? Won't happen
 

gbatman

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Competition for spots is going to be a very big thing.

Starting in defence, there is the smaller defensive spots. Williams, Stocker, Williamson, Plowman, Docherty, Newman, Saad, Boyd and maybe McGovern. All have capabilities of playing this role but some are going to miss out. Injuries sorted this out for us last year for most of our games, we pretty much picked who was fit a lot of the time. Now there is a long list of decent defenders capable of playing a smaller role.

Third tall defender is another one. Plowman has been the sole third tall defender on our list and he's not really a third tall defender. It's been years since there has been competition for this crucial spot and it's been a weakness in our team for years. A lot of people naming Plowman as the backline's third tallest player here, if that is the case then things are not going forward for us. This year hopefully sees someone new and capable stepping into this role. A lot of hope for Marchbank and McGovern however Parks is a guy who can't be discounted either. At least one of those three needs to be in our defence if we are to improve. Personally I would like to see Marchbank and McGovern take both back pockets. This would be more in line with the size of most premiership sides the last 10 years. 3 players over 193cm who can genuinely play tall and a couple of quick mobile ones in the high 180s.

CHB is going to be the big question. Jones was ideal there but he's gone. A lot of hope in Young and McDonald here, they will compete for this spot. Both can play so it's a matter of who does it better.

Midfield is much the same, there weren't too many in the reserves last year who we were wanting to come into the team and play there. We changed out the wings a fair bit and never really settled on anyone. O'Brien showed a bit, Newnes was always thereabouts, Cuningham showed a bit before becoming injured. Now we have Philp coming on and and the possibility Cerra may spend time there. Cottrell will keep others honest and I am hoping Kemp and Carroll put their hands up for a wing position. Competition should be solid for the wing but it's probably our greatest unknown. We are desperate for players to really make the wing theirs and there will be a few auditioning for that.

On the ball it was pretty much Cripps, Walsh and a few others like Curnow, Dow and Kennedy who joined them at times. It wasn't a great group. You add Hewett and Cerra and you finally have some competition for spots. Hoping that we have some others like Setterfield, Stocker and Carroll put their hands up and really push for spots. At this stage things look competitive and hopefully injuries don't sort it out for us. I'd like to see more competition for spots here but who is to say that won't happen.

The ruck is another interesting one. Will TDK and Pittonet be competing for the same spot or will we play them both? Could 210cm Mirkov be a surprise packet?

The forward line is finally looking to be competitive for the first time in many years. Betts came and went and gave us an option in a forward line that really didn't have small forwards. We saw Durdin and Honey come in and really give us some much needed spark. Personally I thought they both were great and Owies was really good at times as well. I have a feeling we may be bringing in another small forward in the draft to heighten the competition here. Fisher and Fogarty will put their hands up you would think at times for a forward line spot so the competition for spots won't be zero but will it be strong?

Tall forwards are unquestionably McKay and Curnow. Get used to hearing those two names together. We have light backup for them in McGovern, Young, McDonald and TDK but there is no competition for spots here on the account they are just too good. The medium forward spot brings a bit of debate. Silvagni or McGovern? At this stage our Medium forwards look like being Jack and Jack with McGovern going back.

Definitely one of the most anticipated parts of this coming season is going to be the competition for spots. Go back a few years and most spots lacked competition. Now with all fit, there will be good players missing out. It's going to bring about a lot of great discussion and debate and hopefully it is one of those things that takes the team to the next level. Let's just hope injuries don't make the tough decisions for us.
 

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Blue__Balls

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Well, Motlop seems the type who could well cement a spot very early, and while he may not play 20+ games next year I think we'll look much better in the games he does play. He and Durdin could easily split the spot between them and get 10+ games each.

Plowman, Young, McGovern/Marchbank
Saad, Weitering, Williams
Martin, Walsh, Hewett
TDK, Cripps, Cerra
JSOS, Curnow, Honey
Owies, McKay, Motlop/Durdin
I/C from: Stocker, Fisher, Kennedy, Ed, Cunners, Setters, Newman, Dow, Kemp, LOB, Philp, Carroll
 

Ash24

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Well, Motlop seems the type who could well cement a spot very early, and while he may not play 20+ games next year I think we'll look much better in the games he does play. He and Durdin could easily split the spot between them and get 10+ games each.

Plowman, Young, McGovern/Marchbank
Saad, Weitering, Williams
Martin, Walsh, Hewett
TDK, Cripps, Cerra
JSOS, Curnow, Honey
Owies, McKay, Motlop/Durdin
I/C from: Stocker, Fisher, Kennedy, Ed, Cunners, Setters, Newman, Dow, Kemp, LOB, Philp, Carroll
Pretty hard to not agree with everything you've just said.

My four from the bench are Stocker (will be a gun), Ed (need some experience and leadership in the side, still too good to not be playing senior footy), Newman (underrated in my opinion, also allows Stocker/Williams to rotate through the midfield) and then one of Dow or Kennedy to take that last midfield spot.
 

Arr0w

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He will ahead of Durdin but I don't know why we keep playing him as a small forward, which he clearly is not. I'd pick Honey and Owies over Fisher any day of the week.
Not suggesting he should play small forward, but he won't miss out due to Durdin, Honey, Owies
 

Blue__Balls

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Not suggesting he should play small forward, but he won't miss out due to Durdin, Honey, Owies
Well if he's not playing small forward then Durdin, Honey and/or Owies aren't playing ahead of or behind him, are they...

Like saying Fisher won't miss out due to Plowman.

Fisher, like a number of others, will have an opportunity to reset their position description under a new coaching group. He'll want to be a mid, may need to settle for mid/forward, and could very easily be on the fringe of the 22 or outside of it entirely depending on how the preseason goes.

Bench option for me, and one of many.
 

Arr0w

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Well if he's not playing small forward then Durdin, Honey and/or Owies aren't playing ahead of or behind him, are they...

Like saying Fisher won't miss out due to Plowman.

Fisher, like a number of others, will have an opportunity to reset their position description under a new coaching group. He'll want to be a mid, may need to settle for mid/forward, and could very easily be on the fringe of the 22 or outside of it entirely depending on how the preseason goes.

Bench option for me, and one of many.
If we have a reasonable healthy list, I can't see all of Durdin, Honey or Owies playing in the same side, nor Fisher missing out to these guys being ahead of him
 

ETET

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If we have a reasonable healthy list, I can't see all of Durdin, Honey or Owies playing in the same side, nor Fisher missing out to these guys being ahead of him
It's interesting and a good issue to have.

I don't feel Fisher is a strong enough runner or physically strong enough to play mid or wing.
I feel Durdin* and Honey are better in the contest, better kicks for goal and better in the air. Durdin* yet to prove it over a run of matches though. Throw in Motlop and we have real competition.

The Fisher conundrum, where does he play?
If we are all fit should we have him in the team or does he play in the two's?
Are we better to have him play mid/fwd or v.v. when he's on the edges of both?

Good issue to have with the team...finally.
 

Blue__Balls

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If we have a reasonable healthy list, I can't see all of Durdin, Honey or Owies playing in the same side, nor Fisher missing out to these guys being ahead of him
You're the one who said "Fisher will start ahead of Owies, Durdin and Honey".

If they're playing different roles, it's got nothing to do with him being ahead of any of them. He may well be competing with guys like Dow, Stocker, Kennedy, Cunners, Martin etc. for a role that is more midfield-focused.
 

Arr0w

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It's interesting and a good issue to have.

I don't feel Fisher is a strong enough runner or physically strong enough to play mid or wing.
I feel Durdin* and Honey are better in the contest, better kicks for goal and better in the air. Durdin* yet to prove it over a run of matches though. Throw in Motlop and we have real competition.

The Fisher conundrum, where does he play?
If we are all fit should we have him in the team or does he play in the two's?
Are we better to have him play mid/fwd or v.v. when he's on the edges of both?

Good issue to have with the team...finally.
Have always seen him more as a HHF, that can do some work round the fringes of a stoppage

You're the one who said "Fisher will start ahead of Owies, Durdin and Honey".

If they're playing different roles, it's got nothing to do with him being ahead of any of them. He may well be competing with guys like Dow, Stocker, Kennedy, Cunners, Martin etc. for a role that is more midfield-focused.
I know exactly what I said.

This is how I saw it a few weeks ago


Now

Boyd Weitering Newman
Doc Young Saad

Walsh Cripps Hewett
TDK Williams Cerra

Martin OMac Fisher
Motlop/Durdin/Owies Harry Charlie

Stocker Kemp JSOS, Honey

Stiff - Kennedy, Plow, Ed

Rest: LOB, Dow, Newnes, Philp, Marchbank, Willo, Setters, Fog, Gov, Pitto, Carroll, Cuners, Motlop, Durdin Owies

So in summary, I don't see where all of Durdin/Motlop, Honey, Owies play in the same side, nor do I think Fisher misses out on best 22 due to 3 or 4 of those in bold being in the same side
 

JuddgementDay

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Given the large turn-out yesterday for training, I'm going to assume there's no LTIs and everyone is available for selection.
Let's see who gets squeezed out.


FB: Plowman - Young - Marchbank
HB: Saad - Weitering - Williams
C: Docherty - Cripps - Cerra
HF: Cuningham – C.Curnow - Martin
FF: Fisher - McKay - Honey

R: TDK - Walsh - Hewett
Int: Kemp - JSOS – McGovern - Stocker

The interchange is very versatile, all of these players can play multiple positions
Hopefully, we can see this team a few times in 2022 - finals bound baby!!!
My iffy players are Cuningham and Fisher.

So who got squeezed out?

Unlucky/ Depth
  1. Dow – It was either Dow or Cuningham, I went with Cunners
  2. Newman – I just can’t find a spot for him. He can't be ahead of Plowman. Plowman is very good at his role and very versatile too
  3. Kennedy – Should he play instead of Cuningham?
  4. Philp - He's ready to step up

Now looking at the team, we should definitely get Motlop at the ND.
He can come in and replace Fisher/ Cuningham.
We need a natural/ crafty small forward
Now that we've got Motlop, I'm not too sure who to replace. Fisher or Cuningham?
I think Cuningham offers a bit more.

This looks like a very solid and dangerous team to me.
Let's go - finals bound 2022 :D


FB: Plowman - Young - Marchbank
HB: Saad - Weitering - Williams
C: Docherty - Cripps - Cerra
HF: Cuningham – C.Curnow - Martin
FF: Motlop - McKay - Honey

R: TDK - Walsh - Hewett
Int: Kemp - JSOS – McGovern - Stocker
Sub: Fisher
 

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