Prediction Best 22 for Round One, 2017

[RunningBounce]

we have not seen it for a while now but Jack is very good 1 on 1 so i'd kick it to his advantage (the real problem was the kick wasn't) & back him in. better still kick it so he can lead onto it...

He is as good as most in the competition one on two, as well. His got some tricks when the ball is on the ground.

 

[Komrade_Tiger]

Stig is always watching guys

 

[RememberRoyce]

B: Grimes Rance Short
HB: Houli Astbury Markov
C: McIntosh Prestia B. Ellis
HF: Edwards Griffiths Caddy
F: Rioli Riewoldt Lloyd
R: Nankervis Cotchin Martin
I/C: Stengle Grigg Vlastuin Conca/Elton/Lennon/Hampson

EMG: Lennon Hampson Elton

Depending on if we want to play 2 ruckman, an extra midfielder, and extra medium forward, or an extra tall forward.

Best side I've seen. The only change I'd make is Hampson to starting ruck
and Nankervis to I/C. Hopefully after a few rounds Nankervis takes over from Hampson →vfl.

But for r1 your I/C could be
Nankervis / Conca / Grigg / Vlastuin
(Preseason games is Lennon's test -- Miles would also be a chance- Lloyd or Edwards could come out)

With a good injury run, that team would win more than lose through the first 11 games imo. (Depending on the game plan!!)

 

[TheSmokingGun]

Stig is always watching guys

Story-time everyone. I have a friend who knows Nathan Drummond from high school, and he said Nathan was a psychopath who bullied him relentlessly.

 

[TheSmokingGun]

it's also the game plan

if you are playing loose men in defence to protect a poor sude fron a flogging and your mids and fwds are running back all day you can't move it forward quickly as they are not there.

playing one on one and holding positions all over the ground means you learn how to handle pressure and everyone plays their role, no passengers.

then when you transition quickly you have people down the ground to kick to

that's finals footy, you can play the other way for so long but will get found out eventually.

Would you like to be the coach? (serious question)

 

[Tango67]

Would you like to be coach? (serious question)

not again

 

[Tango67]

Disagree, one on one and holding positions just doesn't happen anymore. The hawks play a 7th defender, and they seem to transition ok, so yes it is about getting this better as opposed to not defending properly. Its about being able to keep possession, and the ability to spread the ground enough to free areas of opposing players. Doing this, means less chance of possession loss, and the hawks do this the best. At least they used to.

disagree you need to watch more footy at the end of the year

 

[DrMike]

We won't see wholesale changes
Expect Prestia and Caddy to play
Nankervis likely but I wouldn't guarantee it
None of the draftees

 

[Tango67]

We won't see wholesale changes
Expect Prestia and Caddy to play
Nankervis likely but I wouldn't guarantee it
None of the draftees

maybe not early but by mid or end of the year book mark it

 

[mopsy]

first off I clearly stated my team was not a round 1 team I said by the end of the year so maybe people didn't read.

in answer to the Drummond comments he was best 22 at round 4 when he debuted otherwise he wouldn't have played as I doubt we were gifting games that early.

the reason he didn't play again is because of a knee reco, the fact that they played him again for 4 games instead of others says something.

like him or not, agree with me or not the coach sees something in him and I believe if he is fit will play by the end of the year

our team make up is pretty simple we have about 6 stars, umpteen vanilla or plodders and a few really exciting kids and not much else

Believe it or not i dont often criticise younger players we have, But i have to say and this is not a critique as such just an opinion on a players actual talent and i can not see Drummond as a long term keeper.On talent alone most of our other juniors are in front of him, but we all know in this caper its not all about talent alone.
I agree it is likely he will get more games this yr and im all for it, only way to find out if he is good enough or not is play him.

 

[Tango67]

Believe it or not i dont often criticise younger players we have, But i have to say and this is not a critique as such just an opinion on a players actual talent and i can not see Drummond as a long term keeper.On talent alone most of our other juniors are in front of him, but we all know in this caper its not all about talent alone.
I agree it is likely he will get more games this yr and im all for it, only way to find out if he is good enough or not is play him.

Drummond has elite speed, an outstanding athlete and a strong tackler, sounds an ideal rebounding HBF to me
For a guy that missed being drafted as an 18YO because of injury to then win a b&f at our VFL club, to make a debut in rand 4 of his first season only to do his knee and miss a season, comes back and plays 4 games..... I'd say he has courage and tenacity and some talent and I'm glad the club sees it as well, will surprise people.

 

[Tango67]

We have tremendous young talent at our club and I'm hoping we finally have the coaching talent to see it and take some risks rather than persist with vanilla types and coach favourites that can take you so far, promise a lot but ultimately let you down when it matters

 

[Hoos]

Our team isn't greatly different to the one we were using in our finals years. It's our game plan that needs fixing, the talent is there.

While I agree the game plan needs a complete overhaul, I don't think you can blame that alone. On what we've seen, the talent isn't there. There's too many players that aren't up to it that need to be replaced by some of these kids. If it means we don't play finals, in order to get games into them, then so be it. Too many have been found out in finals and yet they still get picked, every week. Maybe this will change.

 

[matt_y106]

Drummond has elite speed, an outstanding athlete and a strong tackler, sounds an ideal rebounding HBF to me
For a guy that missed being drafted as an 18YO because of injury to then win a b&f at our VFL club, to make a debut in rand 4 of his first season only to do his knee and miss a season, comes back and plays 4 games..... I'd say he has courage and tenacity and some talent and I'm glad the club sees it as well, will surprise people.

He only played 3 games for our VFL club in 2014. He did win the Murray Bushrangers b&f as an over-aged player.

 

[mopsy]

He only played 3 games for our VFL club in 2014. He did win the Murray Bushrangers b&f as an over-aged player.

He was very much an over ager. an example we took Menadue in the same draft and there is a 20 month difference in age,
He tested exceptionally at draft camp top 3 or 5 in about 5 different categories.but you had to temper that down a touch because of his age,
Physically ready and an older draftee not really surprising he got an early game or showed enough to get one.

 

[Tango67]

He only played 3 games for our VFL club in 2014. He did win the Murray Bushrangers b&f as an over-aged player.

correct my bad

 

[RockJobster0312]

B: Short Rance Grimes.
HB: Markov Astbury CEllis.
C: BEllis Prestia McIntosh
HF: Caddy Griff SEdwards
F: Lloyd Riewoldt Rioli
R: Hampson Cotchin Martin
INT: Nankervis Menadue Vlastuin Miles
EMG: Lennon Houli Drummond

It was actually quite challenging for me. I don't necessarily think this will be our round 1 22, and a lot will be predicated on game style. Eg, having only 1 ruck (Hampson / Nankervis) and playing an extra mid and small.

The backline doesn't include Vlastuin, as Ive placed him on the bench. My thoughts here are he can play either back pocket, 7th defender or on the ball.

The two drivers out of defence are Short and Markov. Both great by foot, love to run and be aggressive. I see CEllis as a great foil to those two. Elite by foot and a smart user of the football. Loved his game versus the WCE last year in this spot, and I caught there last quarter versus the Suns were I felt he was on unheralded hero in our come from behind victory.

I put faith in BEllis on the wing. Will always be a player with weaknesses, but in 2015 when we had a top 3 ranked defence, Rance, Chappy and Grimes consistently praised the efforts of BEllis and McIntosh in getting back in defence and essentially creating an 8/9 man defence. I am backing him in to replicate that 2015 role. In saying that, Menadue/ Houli/ Drummond and even Butler could play this role. Insofar as McIntosh, I just have to have him in my side. I share TigerImposter s love for him. Not a smart nor necessarily skillful footballer, but plays the game simply and is very effective in doing so.

Caddy as HF is a no brainer. Edwards or Rioli the for mine as the other HF. All three Id expect to push up into the midfield at times. Especially if we are looking to isolate Martin/ Caddy/ Cotchin (even Rioli) up forward as a foil to the conventional tall forward line up.

Ive gone Hampson in the ruck. I love the idea of first hands on the pill out of the centre stoppage to blokes like Cotch, Martin, Prestia and Caddy. I thought his around the ground work improved as last year went on l. Im hoping continued improvement and a full off season further help. But Nankervis is there if that doesn't come to fruition.

Ive gone with Vlastuin and Nanny on the bench as discussed, and included Menadue because I love his aggression and his positional flexibility. I have also included Miles as the next best midfielder. If at the end of pre-season that is Conca, Graham, Townsend (who is my smokey for Most Improved. Call it a hunch), Drummond etc then they get the gig.

The success of our players this year I believe will be based on a more aggressive game style. I also think that despite Prestia and Caddy, even Nankervis, the success of our team in 2017 will be based on the improvement and performance of our young - ex first round selections. Ellisx2, Lennon, Vlastuin, Conca, Rioli.

 

[Hank Heavenly]

B Grimes Rance Short
HB Houli Astbury Markov
C KMac Martin BEllis
HF Rioli Grif/Elton Caddy
F Llyod Riewoldt Lennon
R Nankervis Cotchin Prestia
Int Vlastuin Conca Edwards CEllis

B: Grimes and Rance automatic, Short to take small forwards (not sure who else can TBH)
HB: Astbury only other KPB, Houli can't play anywhere else effectively, Markov showed promise there late
C: Kmac back to favoured position, Dusty automatic, BEllis will train well enough to keep this to start with
HF: Games dumped into Rioli last year means he will start, Caddy swapping with Martin, cant decide on Griff or Elton,
F: Riewoldt Has to play deep, none of this up the ground s**t. Lennon to take Vicks spot as third tall, Llyod will keep it on LY form
R: Cotch & Prestia Automatic, Any sort of around the ground form pushes nank infront of Hampson
I: Vlas to be potential mid rotation, Conca will be given the opp to prove his selection, Edwards moves back to a bit time role, CEllis looks the good IMO


The big thing is the Griff v Elton discussion. Griff has had som many opportunities to cement his role, but he appears to timid, gets injured often and has a massive season high goals of 14. I get the frustration with Elton also, but why should he not be afforded the same opportunity that Griff has had. Personally, I would love Elton to have a run at it, we all know what to expect from Griff, I would like to see if Elton has got it in him, if he doesn't, it signifies the end of his time at Punt Road. Either will have to play that fwd/ruck role to give Nank the chop out.

 

[tunksy]

Drummond has elite speed, an outstanding athlete and a strong tackler, sounds an ideal rebounding HBF to me
For a guy that missed being drafted as an 18YO because of injury to then win a b&f at our VFL club, to make a debut in rand 4 of his first season only to do his knee and miss a season, comes back and plays 4 games..... I'd say he has courage and tenacity and some talent and I'm glad the club sees it as well, will surprise people.

Hes the one who should allow vlastuin to play midfield. Drummond markov and houli of hb should give heaps of run. But Drummond needs to force his way in imo.

 

[theflea]

disagree you need to watch more footy at the end of the year

Nope still do. you don't see it from the tv only at the ground. Its footy half court these days.

 

[Tango67]

3 years ago maybe, sides would have the loose man he would get manned up and then you would either create another loose until the fwd line was congested or allow the other side to have extra mid and continued f50 entries

now it's only teams that try and protect the scoreboard or teams like Nth who are flat track bullies and get beat up at the point end of the season

the modern footy is all about run and carry which is designed to overcome extra men in defence creating overlaps down the ground and having an extra mid

smart teams can work around the extra defender and the dumb teams keep bombing it in

if your team needs mids and loose men to help your defence you are papering over the cracks and robbing your team of forward entries and players down field to kick goals

if you have 8 guys inside 50 it's very easy to pressure them as they don't have options to kick to do they give off 2m gabdbalks or kicks that don't go 15m and that is how RFC came unstuck last year

pick 6 defenders that can hold their own so your mids have more energy running forwards and creating options than backwards

 

[THE_GUN]

Cant believe people dont have Miles & Houli in the round 1 starting 22

Grimes - Rance - Short
Houli - Astbury - Markov
B.Ellis - Cotchin - McIntosh
Martin - Griffiths - Edwards
Rioli - Riewoldt - Lloyd
Hampson - Caddy - Prestia
Vlastuin - Nankervis - Grigg - Conca

C.Ellis & Lennon to come in if anybody has injury before round 1

Tigers to win 88 points

 

[pockets75]

Cant believe people dont have Miles & Houli in the round 1 starting 22

Grimes - Rance - Short
Houli - Astbury - Markov
B.Ellis - Cotchin - McIntosh
Martin - Griffiths - Edwards
Rioli - Riewoldt - Lloyd
Hampson - Caddy - Prestia
Vlastuin - Nankervis - Grigg - Conca

C.Ellis & Lennon to come in if anybody has injury before round 1

Tigers to win 88 points

Missing someone?

 

[RobsJourney]

Cant believe people dont have Miles & Houli in the round 1 starting 22

Grimes - Rance - Short
Houli - Astbury - Markov
B.Ellis - Cotchin - McIntosh
Martin - Griffiths - Edwards
Rioli - Riewoldt - Lloyd
Hampson - Caddy - Prestia
Vlastuin - Nankervis - Grigg - Conca

C.Ellis & Lennon to come in if anybody has injury before round 1

Tigers to win 88 points

Don't mind this side, but I'm not sure I want Short as a walk up to the best 22 yet.

We had a horrible year last year, and whilst he was decent enough for a first year in the senior side, I still don't think he is an absolute AFL standard footballer.

BTW where's Miles? You just said you can't believe sides don't have Miles, and you omitted him hehehe....


I keep changing my mind, but I'd probably want to see this -


B: Grimes, Astbury, Batchelor
HB: Houli, Rance, Markov

Rance and Astbury taking any talls, with Grimes to take a third tall if need be, otherwise take a small. Batchelor has had chances but I feel he was very poorly used in recent years. His best games were playing the role which Vlastuin will be vacating. Houli still the best option as a rebounder, and I reckon he will be partnered greatly by Markov. Expect McIntosh and B. Ellis to provide chop outs, pushing back to help.

C: Cotchin, Vlastuin, McIntosh
R: Nankervis, Martin, Prestia

Cotchin will likely play a little more outside, 2012 style, given we are adding three more decent/quality mids in Vlastuin, Prestia and Caddy (we aren't talking Moore/Townsend here).
I don't want to play two rucks, there's no point, especially given neither Hampson or Nankervis are likely to be any good up forward, and it's already been confirmed we are going smaller up forward this year. I give Nankervis the nod because he is a more competitive beast, but Hampson will still likely play round 1 given the runs on the board.

HF: Caddy, Griffiths, Edwards
F: Rioli, Riewoldt, Lloyd

Caddy will start half-forward, but like Edwards he is a resting midfielder, basically. Looking forward to seeing Rioli push up the ground.
Not to say our quality or depth is that awesome, but, I do also wanna see Bolton get in as well as Lennon, but Lloyd has earned his place for now and it's hard to fit them all. We only need to play two talls, and personally I'm more optimistic about Riewoldt/Griffiths than Riewoldt/Vickery. Now that Ty is gone, Griffiths is the main second forward and I personally think he has more upside, but also appeared to play much better with no Vickery in the side.
Expecting to see plenty of time up forward for Martin and Cotchin too, as they are about as good as resting midfielders get in the whole AFL.

Int: B. Ellis, Miles, Conca, Grigg

These guys still deserve their spots, until the rest can do enough to overtake them.
This bench means our midfield bats pretty deep, with about 11 players running through there.

Our biggest issue is absolute locks, in that I reckon only Rance, Cotchin, Martin, Prestia, Riewoldt and Vlastuin are absolute 100% picked. Too many players still could be replaced, and based on 2016 you look at some of those names and think hmmmmm, not great... But then you look at the same names from 2012/13/14/15 and think, yeah, 2016 must have just been a s**t year, and it really just was.

Hard to find the perfect balance, but I expect a lot from Corey Ellis and Lennon and expect them to be in the side early if not immediately.
I'm excited about Graham, Bolton and Garthwaite adding heaps to us.
I'm not as excited about Menadue.
I think Drummond could be solid, and want to see Castagna get a game as a midfielder/forward, I repeat again his game vs the Bulldogs.

Anyway, thoughts?

 

[JR82]

Don't mind this side, but I'm not sure I want Short as a walk up to the best 22 yet.

We had a horrible year last year, and whilst he was decent enough for a first year in the senior side, I still don't think he is an absolute AFL standard footballer.

BTW where's Miles? You just said you can't believe sides don't have Miles, and you omitted him hehehe....


I keep changing my mind, but I'd probably want to see this -


B: Grimes, Astbury, Batchelor
HB: Houli, Rance, Markov

Rance and Astbury taking any talls, with Grimes to take a third tall if need be, otherwise take a small. Batchelor has had chances but I feel he was very poorly used in recent years. His best games were playing the role which Vlastuin will be vacating. Houli still the best option as a rebounder, and I reckon he will be partnered greatly by Markov. Expect McIntosh and B. Ellis to provide chop outs, pushing back to help.

C: Cotchin, Vlastuin, McIntosh
R: Nankervis, Martin, Prestia

Cotchin will likely play a little more outside, 2012 style, given we are adding three more decent/quality mids in Vlastuin, Prestia and Caddy (we aren't talking Moore/Townsend here).
I don't want to play two rucks, there's no point, especially given neither Hampson or Nankervis are likely to be any good up forward, and it's already been confirmed we are going smaller up forward this year. I give Nankervis the nod because he is a more competitive beast, but Hampson will still likely play round 1 given the runs on the board.

HF: Caddy, Griffiths, Edwards
F: Rioli, Riewoldt, Lloyd

Caddy will start half-forward, but like Edwards he is a resting midfielder, basically. Looking forward to seeing Rioli push up the ground.
Not to say our quality or depth is that awesome, but, I do also wanna see Bolton get in as well as Lennon, but Lloyd has earned his place for now and it's hard to fit them all. We only need to play two talls, and personally I'm more optimistic about Riewoldt/Griffiths than Riewoldt/Vickery. Now that Ty is gone, Griffiths is the main second forward and I personally think he has more upside, but also appeared to play much better with no Vickery in the side.
Expecting to see plenty of time up forward for Martin and Cotchin too, as they are about as good as resting midfielders get in the whole AFL.

Int: B. Ellis, Miles, Conca, Grigg

These guys still deserve their spots, until the rest can do enough to overtake them.
This bench means our midfield bats pretty deep, with about 11 players running through there.

Our biggest issue is absolute locks, in that I reckon only Rance, Cotchin, Martin, Prestia, Riewoldt and Vlastuin are absolute 100% picked. Too many players still could be replaced, and based on 2016 you look at some of those names and think hmmmmm, not great... But then you look at the same names from 2012/13/14/15 and think, yeah, 2016 must have just been a s**t year, and it really just was.

Hard to find the perfect balance, but I expect a lot from Corey Ellis and Lennon and expect them to be in the side early if not immediately.
I'm excited about Graham, Bolton and Garthwaite adding heaps to us.
I'm not as excited about Menadue.
I think Drummond could be solid, and want to see Castagna get a game as a midfielder/forward, I repeat again his game vs the Bulldogs.

Anyway, thoughts?

quality post, with the Rucks i wonder if we'll play Hammer or Nank based on Matchup?
playing Hammer on the more athletic types & playing Nank against the Mumford types among the oppo rucks?

it's an interesting year for us given our list, 19 players that are 22 or under & there are spots up for grabs for pretty much any of them that stands up this yr. we pretty much need a few of them to step up in the next few yrs to get to where we want to be.