Analysis Best Young Key-Forward in the Competition

[CatToTheFuture]

Really rate Neale. Agree that he’s not at Darcy and Thilthorpe level but interested to see what his ceiling is.

Went to the Easter Monday game at the MCG and remember him taking a monster contested mark in the midfield at a really critical point of the final quarter. Pissed me off at the time but felt like a momentum shifter in a tight high pressure game - any young player capable of that clearly has something going for them.

Yeah that's one thing i really like with him. He doesn't get flustered. High pressure set shot he just falls on his routine and it's like the noise just doesn't get to him

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Mate are you serious? You're trying to pump up his form on the back of the easiest run home draw of all time?

5 goals against GWS without Sam Taylor is the best opposition Shannon Neale kicked a bag against. He is not even remotely close to Darcy and Thilthorpe, and it doesn't just come down to goalkicking output.

Shannon Neale is in the Harry McKay, Mitch Lewis, Joe Daniher tier of key-forwards: a solid big man who can take a mark and kick goals, maybe even snag a Coleman.
Darcy and Thilthorpe are generational footballers with complete skillsets.

Night and day.

I think he's around that group you listed and I agree Darcy and Thilthorpe are petty close to generational players. I'm not making the comparison there. My first comment on this thread, which you can look up if you want, is that he's not in the same class.

I disagree though that what changed is the level of opposition, though it certainly helped. Neale's role changed substantially.

Previously he was a second target, on his bike, creating goals for others. Will have to go back and find the data but to the midpoint of the season he was either in the top couple of kp players for score involvements or the outright leader, forget which.

Of the guys in his age experience bracket for goals kicked by a KP forward this year hes 5th, which I think is fairly reflective.

 

[Bulldog Joe]

Amazing how posters pile in when anything outside the group think is posted.

FWIW I see Shannon Neale as tracking very well and his development cannot be measured against the rates of development of others.

If he is improving (clearly is) why not let the development happen and enjoy what his talent brings to the game.

He does have some advantages over Darcy in his mobility. There won't be many players of his size winning sprints back to the goal square against defenders like Neale is able to do.

As he learns his craft he can be significantly better than his current self. He will almost certainly be difficult for defenders to match up with.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Amazing how posters pile in when anything outside the group think is posted.

FWIW I see Shannon Neale as tracking very well and his development cannot be measured against the rates of development of others.

If he is improving (clearly is) why not let the development happen and enjoy what his talent brings to the game.

He does have some advantages over Darcy in his mobility. There won't be many players of his size winning sprints back to the goal square against defenders like Neale is able to do.

As he learns his craft he can be significantly better than his current self. He will almost certainly be difficult for defenders to match up with.

A sensible take.
Uncommon the last couple pages.

No one is saying he's better than Darcy or Thilthorpe but you can't ask for more thrust in to replace a club great. Sink or swim style.

Elite running capabilities.
Can be used in the ruck.
Elite goal kicking. Brilliant efficient action.

 

[PhatBoy]

Amazing how posters pile in when anything outside the group think is posted.

FWIW I see Shannon Neale as tracking very well and his development cannot be measured against the rates of development of others.

If he is improving (clearly is) why not let the development happen and enjoy what his talent brings to the game.

He does have some advantages over Darcy in his mobility. There won't be many players of his size winning sprints back to the goal square against defenders like Neale is able to do.

As he learns his craft he can be significantly better than his current self. He will almost certainly be difficult for defenders to match up with.

A bit of sensibility. Quality post.

He’s never going to have some of the freak traits of Darcy: few if any players will, or probably have, to tell the truth. And I can’t see him becoming the sort of power-packed player that RT is, who is already becoming a monster in terms of his strength.

As you point out though he can run - he has, for his size, the sort of athletic capability that we have only really had with Mark Blicavs. He was a terrible mark for a specialist forward for his first 20 games. Suddenly he’s started clunking them but he still drops 2-3 a game that he probably should take so if he starts to take those as well it makes him better again. He has room to keep improving. At some stage in his career I don’t really think he is necessarily going to be competing with those other guys for, say, a 70-80 goal Coleman medal or something but there is absolutely no reason he couldn’t be a 60-goal forward at least a couple of times.

 

[The Casey Cat]

Amazing how posters pile in when anything outside the group think is posted.

FWIW I see Shannon Neale as tracking very well and his development cannot be measured against the rates of development of others.

If he is improving (clearly is) why not let the development happen and enjoy what his talent brings to the game.

He does have some advantages over Darcy in his mobility. There won't be many players of his size winning sprints back to the goal square against defenders like Neale is able to do.

As he learns his craft he can be significantly better than his current self. He will almost certainly be difficult for defenders to match up with.

Now here's a good post from someone who's actually paid some attention to him. He isn't yet on the level of the other two. But since he's found his footing at this level he's not as far behind as some might think either. Which is a fair rise from someone I was wondering if would make it as a regular AFL player at all earlier this year. His running capacity is indeed already proving a problem for opposition defense and he's learning how to use it to his advantage more each week and time his leads better.

 

[TheEscapeClub]

Mate are you serious? You're trying to pump up his form on the back of the easiest run home draw of all time?

5 goals against GWS without Sam Taylor is the best opposition Shannon Neale kicked a bag against. He is not even remotely close to Darcy and Thilthorpe, and it doesn't just come down to goalkicking output.

Shannon Neale is in the Harry McKay, Mitch Lewis, Joe Daniher tier of key-forwards: a solid big man who can take a mark and kick goals, maybe even snag a Coleman.
Darcy and Thilthorpe are generational footballers with complete skillsets.

Night and day.

Best set shot out all of them, he has just an easy, smooth action. Kicking them at 70% along with Darcy.

 

[Nunez]

I think any of the aforementioned key forwards would have looked a million bucks in the second half of the season with Geelongs draw.

 

[PhatBoy]

I think any of the aforementioned key forwards would have looked a million bucks in the second half of the season with Geelongs draw.

Ok. So none of his goals count then and we can go back to the trade table.

Add Neale to the growing list of shit players on our list that we allegedly had to cheat to put together because they are all superstars.

It seems to grow daily.

 

[The Casey Cat]

Ok. So none of his goals count then and we can go back to the trade table.

Add Neale to the growing list of shit players on our list that we allegedly had to cheat to put together because they are all superstars.

It seems to grow daily.

And I'm sure neither of Darcy or Til have 'filled their boots' so to speak against ordinary/crap this sides season. Only Geelong have played shite sides this year. Apparently.

 

[Shueygod]

Pissing myself at the Neale to Darcy/Thilthorpe comparisons.

Cmon fellas, he’s in the debate for the top 5.

 

[PhatBoy]

Pissing myself at the Neale to Darcy/Thilthorpe comparisons.

Cmon fellas, he’s in the debate for the top 5.

What are people finding so funny about this? The part where basically everyone is essentially saying ‘he’s not as good as they are and more than likely never will be but he’s improved a lot’?

Geez it doesn’t take much to turn people into dribbling messes

 

[Shueygod]

What are people finding so funny about this? The part where basically everyone is essentially saying ‘he’s not as good as they are and more than likely never will be but he’s improved a lot’?

Geez it doesn’t take much to turn people into dribbling messes

The part where Geelong fans are clearly defending it by comparing the recent form of the three.

If everyone is saying what you say, then there’d be no need for the comparison.

 

[The Casey Cat]

The part where Geelong fans are clearly defending it by comparing the recent form of the three.

If everyone is saying what you say, then there’d be no need for the comparison.

Probably because the recent form is indeed comparable. And I don't think he's quite at the level overall of the best two either. But he's not as far off as some have made out. And wouldn't surprise me if he continues to put up similar stats to the others from now on through all next year now he's found his footing in the league (which admittedly took quite a bit longer). If he doesn't I'll be here to bump/concede I was wrong on the call.

 

[Nunez]

Ok. So none of his goals count then and we can go back to the trade table.

Add Neale to the growing list of shit players on our list that we allegedly had to cheat to put together because they are all superstars.

It seems to grow daily.

Calm down, I like Neale as a ruck/forward, but remove your bias for a moment. Key forwards tend to perform better against weaker opposition and the Cats have had a dream run in that regard. It makes sense that he can perform above his historical output.

 

[Soggy2112]

Kicking about the same amount of goals per game at the moment. I'd have thought that's what forwards are there for.

Thilthorpe has kicked 11 more goals and is ahead in just about every other statistical category though.

Thilthorpe is also the defences first priority most of the time, whereas Neale tends to get a bit longer leash because of Cameron.

Neale is a good player, but there is levels to this.

 

[Shueygod]

Thilthorpe has kicked 11 more goals and is ahead in just about every other statistical category though.

Thilthorpe is also the defences first priority most of the time, whereas Neale tends to get a bit longer leash because of Cameron.

Neale is a good player, but there is levels to this.

As well as being one of the more dominant second rucks in the league, it’s a funny comparison.

 

[The Casey Cat]

Thilthorpe has kicked 11 more goals and is ahead in just about every other statistical category though.

Thilthorpe is also the defences first priority most of the time, whereas Neale tends to get a bit longer leash because of Cameron.

Neale is a good player, but there is levels to this.

Fair call. Haven't said Neale is better, as he isn't. Just that he's suddenly tracking pretty well. Needs another year of this output. Am confident he will give it. We will see how finals go and where we are this time next year. If he fades compared to Til and Darcy i'll be here to say it.

 

[fnerd]

Pissing myself at the Neale to Darcy/Thilthorpe comparisons.

Cmon fellas, he’s in the debate for the top 5.

Says the bloke who reckons Jack Williams is better than Josh Treacy and jye amiss, Elijah Hewitt and Reuben Ginbey better than sheezel and wardlaw, Bo Allen better than Murphy Reid etc…

 

[Nunez]

Says the bloke who reckons Jack Williams is better than Josh Treacy and jye amiss, Elijah Hewitt and Reuben Ginbey better than sheezel and wardlaw, Bo Allen better than Murphy Reid etc…

Rumour has it he also thinks Shuey is some sort of deity too. Absolute nutter.

 

[PhatBoy]

The part where Geelong fans are clearly defending it by comparing the recent form of the three.

If everyone is saying what you say, then there’d be no need for the comparison.

Because it’s the recent form of the three, and the fact that recently Neale has actually held is own in comparison to at least one of them, that gives us reason to think ‘ok he probably won’t keep that ‘matching/close to matching up forever but it’s a good sign that he’s on the right path.’ It’s not like it’s a two week sample size, it’s half a season.

In other words, if he can be a little bit behind one of those guys who I think we can all agree is going to be - if he isn’t already - a superstar, for half a season, why can’t he develop further and be a tier below him as they get older?

 

[fnerd]

Rumour has it he also thinks Shuey is some sort of deity too. Absolute nutter.

there’s actually more but that’s just off the top of my head.

The part im interested in is with west coast having all these players that apparently better than most other clubs , how does he reconcile that in his head when WC have won only one game this year?

 

[PhatBoy]

Calm down, I like Neale as a ruck/forward, but remove your bias for a moment. Key forwards tend to perform better against weaker opposition and the Cats have had a dream run in that regard. It makes sense that he can perform above his historical output.

Of course they do: as I said earlier though they’ve both had their worst games as a broad rule against the best sides, and during Neale’s run of form, his best games have been against the best of what has been a mediocre run of opponents, with the exception of the Lions where he had a quiet game. I think he can be given a mulligan against the Suns where he was off the ground for 3 quarters and it was played in a bog for the 20 minutes he was on the ground.

Thilthorpe 100 per cent has the handicap of the number 1 defender each week. No argument there either. That DOES have to be balanced a little when you compare him to some other forwards though, and yes Neale is one, who play as a second target. Neale has the benefit of the second defender no denying that at all but he also usually gets looked for second.

It absolutely doesn’t make up the difference in ‘handicap’ of always having the number one defender or being double teamed at times but it IS a handicap when it comes to racking up goals.

 

[Shueygod]

Says the bloke who reckons Jack Williams is better than Josh Treacy and jye amiss, Elijah Hewitt and Reuben Ginbey better than sheezel and wardlaw, Bo Allen better than Murphy Reid etc…

I have not said a single one of those things. I have said Williams is statistically having a comparable year to Amiss (fact), I would prefer Hewett and Ginbey to either of Sheezel or Wardlaw and that I don’t regret taking Allan over Reid yet.

You on the other hand aren’t capable of spelling the names of the players you attempt to discuss.

 

[ferball]

Right now Cooper Trembath is winning it* on countback.

*The title of"Best Young Forward in the Comp".