Analysis Beveridge - where to from here?

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Dec 21, 2005
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I dont know the inner workings of the club/player goings on and relationships, this year or 20 years ago: who is an irredeemably negative influence and who is not - how could I? How could anyone from outside the club? Im explaining what I think the coach is trying to do given what I can see - pushing certain talented players out who have rumour clouds over their heads - and getting another bunch of players in who are widely considered to be 'good clubmen'. It seems like a fairly concerted campaign.

Whatever the ingredients for the hawks recent premiership were, our coach is in a pretty good position to know, as he was there at the time.
I mean, it's not like the Hawks to push out club champs... :think:
 
Therein lies the problem.

I think the belief that some party boys fractured the group is seriously ill founded.

If Bev wants to address who was most responsible for the loss of cohesion he should go and stand infront of a mirror.

Let me be clear, I don't want Luke gone. I just want him to wake up and recognise it wasn't senior players letting him down that was most responsible for our fall from grace. It was his Football department's mismanagement of the playing group that was most wanting.

Too many poor selection decisions. Too much blaming of players,and being too quick to let players go rather than trying to manage them through tough times. Too much preferential treatment and not enough fairness across the board.

If we want to improve next season, he needs to lift his game more than anyone.[/QUOTE
]


Problem is Proff you are running a narrative based on your opinion on actions our coach needs to takes based on what you beleive has happend and is happening without any substance.

If your thread was headed something like, what direction should our football department be heading, and then discuss there would likely be much better discussion than you are getting where you just appear to be arguing your own narrative.

Besides that I don't buy the party boy, NDH policy. Nothing more than a myth perpetuated mainly on these boards.

No player that has been let go or left were performing at the appropriate level for at least one or in most cases the two years before they were let go. I personally put that 100% on the players lack of professionalism in their careers and blaming the coaches or club is nothing more than a cop out.

When some of those players are creating issues at the club over a period of time and have not changed, get rid of them, this is meant to be their career, where they are well paid and should be doing everything possible to perform in their own right and in the team environment.

As for team selections I agree with you to large extent on the last season, more so early on when we were picking unbalanced teams which seemed to provide no clear narrative with where we were heading.

However, both as a business owner and coach, sometimes there is a middle to longer term narrative than does not appear in the short term, but does in the medium term. When it does appear it is like it just materialised and there was some event that occurred that produced it, when the reality it was built over time with many events happening over time.

I think this is an important year for Bev as he is now getting his team, moulding it together not one he has inherited. It is only his 5th season so I am looking forward to what he does bring and what shape we tale in the upcoming season and beyond
 
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I feel like we weren't the best team in the AFL in 2016 but We were by far the best side in the Finals. And as good ad they were the chances of repeating that success was minimal
We weren't the best team in the home and away season for sure, but we were very unlucky to fall to 7th with an incredibly close top 7 teams, a tough injury run and losing a couple of tight games. It always felt like were closer to a top 4 team than a 7th/8th placed team, we sort of proved that by overachieving in the finals series.
 

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The story about Cooney and Lake was meant to indicate how skewed B&F voting results can impact on a players opinion of their coaches.
If Lake wasn't sure whether he should stay or go before that B&F he would have certainly been convinced afterwards that McCartney was clueless and it was time to leave.

The results from this years B&F were also ridiculous and could have similarly damaged the
standing of the
coaching group with some players.
Lol.

It was a no brainer for Brian to leave. Hawks had narrowly lost a GF and their only weakness was a full back.

We needed draft picks to rebuild, therefore trade was made.

Best and Fairest results would had nothing to do with anything.
 

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Possibly but Lake and Cooney have always been sooks. Talented sooks though.

If a player isn’t getting votes then he isn’t doing the job the coaches want so indirectly the coach perhaps isn’t too upset if they crack the sads and bail out.
Was anyone calling these two blokes sooks while they were playing for us.

I love how this story of them being displeased with the B and F are now taken as fact.
 

Jeff 1975

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2016 was a combination of a few things

We had a good side a slice of luck & a great deal of desire

I can’t understate the desire we had

All 3 have left us

We started losing players the minute the siren sounded & we have been losing players ever since

Who’s at fault?

Firstly - we shouldn’t criticize the players

The players are young adults which should be encouraged & not put down

Don’t bag the players, especially around trade time, makes sense?

Secondly - we shouldn’t criticize the opinions of others that post, been there

Thirdly - criticism should go to where the buck stops

Coach, Recruitment & Selectors
 
Dec 21, 2005
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2016 was a combination of a few things

We had a good side a slice of luck & a great deal of desire

I can’t understate the desire we had

All 3 have left us

We started losing players the minute the siren sounded & we have been losing players ever since

Who’s at fault?

Firstly - we shouldn’t criticize the players

The players are young adults which should be encouraged & not put down

Don’t bag the players, especially around trade time, makes sense?

Secondly - we shouldn’t criticize the opinions of others that post, been there

Thirdly - criticism should go to where the buck stops

Coach, Recruitment & Selectors

Weird. Why do some deserve to be spared criticism and given encouragement but others don't?

I don't think you can tell people they can't criticise players but can criticise the coach. All while telling people not to criticise others opinions.
Makes no sense.
 

Antares

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If we bust for the third year running, should his position be reviewed?

So far his tenure is one of the most bizarre in AFL history. Takes charge of us when we're at our lowest point, takes us to the finals in 2015 when everyone's tipping us for the spoon. Then somehow wins the flag the following year. Then in 2017-2018, the years we would've been expected to challenge when we initially hired him, we start dipping hard. Everything is in reverse.

If we ended up parting ways, I take it Brett Montgomery would be the front runner for the top job by some distance?
 
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The coaching situation should have been reviewed before now, in particular the assistants. Continuing to run with the same group of coaches without any change is just head-in-the-sand stuff from our club.

Richmond and Hardwick received a big boost from the input of some new assistants in 2017.

We should have done the same before the start of 2018. But here we are heading into 2019 with the identical group of coaches just in slightly different assistant roles.
 

Antares

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The coaching situation should have been reviewed before now, in particular the assistants. Continuing to run with the same group of coaches without any change is just head-in-the-sand stuff from our club.

Richmond and Hardwick received a big boost from the input of some new assistants in 2017.

We should have done the same before the start of 2018. But here we are heading into 2019 with the identical group of coaches just in slightly different assistant roles.
Please. Most of our coaches are the same guys who helped us win the flag. As much as people like yourself want to believe what goes on behind the scenes at training, you really don't.

If the team isn't playing well, responsibility falls to the guy at the top, and that's Beveridge.
 

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Please. Most of our coaches are the same guys who helped us win the flag. As much as people like yourself want to believe what goes on behind the scenes at training, you really don't.

If the team isn't playing well, responsibility falls to the guy at the top, and that's Beveridge.
Get off your high horse mate, "people like me"?

**** off and don't put words into my mouth next time.

I didn't give an opinion on Beveridge specifically so don't tell me what I think about him. He should have been reviewed also, but not shown the door. The first step should have been to change up the assistants and find some with the teeth to challenge him with different/new ideas.
 

Antares

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Get off your high horse mate, "people like me"?

**** off and don't put words into my mouth next time.

I didn't give an opinion on Beveridge specifically so don't tell me what I think about him. He should have been reviewed also, but not shown the door. The first step should have been to change up the assistants and find some with the teeth to challenge him with different/new ideas.
See? You're doing it again. You don't know what the current assistants have been saying to him at all. For all anyone here knows, they may have been trying, only for Beveridge to discard them.

Nothing more yawn-inducing than people like you blaming assistants without knowing what's going on.
 
Mar 15, 2012
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See? You're doing it again. You don't know what the current assistants have been saying to him at all. For all anyone here knows, they may have been trying, only for Beveridge to discard them.

Nothing more yawn-inducing than people like you blaming assistants without knowing what's going on.
Any half-decent review would have been able to determine if the assistants were able to challenge the senior coach or were being shut down. That's why I said there should have been a review. For ****'s sake, I'm not claiming to know what happened behind closed doors, despite your insistence that I do.

You're an insolent so-and-so aren't you. Welcome to ignore, you're not worth the time of day.
 

Mattdougie

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Any half-decent review would have been able to determine if the assistants were able to challenge the senior coach or were being shut down. That's why I said there should have been a review. For ****'s sake, I'm not claiming to know what happened behind closed doors, despite your insistence that I do.

You're an insolent so-and-so aren't you. Welcome to ignore, you're not worth the time of day.

Don’t challenge some of these people mate it’s never their fault and they are always right
 

Antares

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Any half-decent review would have been able to determine if the assistants were able to challenge the senior coach or were being shut down. That's why I said there should have been a review. For ****'s sake, I'm not claiming to know what happened behind closed doors, despite your insistence that I do.

You're an insolent so-and-so aren't you. Welcome to ignore, you're not worth the time of day.
You're doing it again now. Everyone holding a position at the club gets reviewed to a degree every year, particularly at seasons end, and you're in no position to assess the quality of those reviews, because once again, you're not informed on the matter.
 
See? You're doing it again. You don't know what the current assistants have been saying to him at all. For all anyone here knows, they may have been trying, only for Beveridge to discard them.

Nothing more yawn-inducing than people like you blaming assistants without knowing what's going on.
Well that escalated quickly ...

Question for you - why bump an old thread with a question if you won't tolerate a response with a divergent opinion? Serious question.

Discussing assistant coaches in the context of Beveridge's coaching performance is entirely relevant. Not being a club insider would disqualify 99% of the people who post here so if having inside knowledge is a requirement we might as well close down the board.
 

Antares

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Well that escalated quickly ...

Question for you - why bump an old thread with a question if you won't tolerate a response with a divergent opinion? Serious question.
Well...
1. I just searched for the Beveridge thread and clicked one.
2. Won't tolerate? Huh?

Discussing assistant coaches in the context of Beveridge's coaching performance is entirely relevant. Not being a club insider would disqualify 99% of the people who post here so if having inside knowledge is a requirement we might as well close down the board.
I still don't think anyone here is in a position to make an assessment on assistant coaches. Their job is to conduct drills that help the players conform to the coach's gameplan. If something wasn't working, they'd have been changed already, and if not, it's not like anyone here would know to begin with. As fans, we can only look at how the team's playing, but if they're playing poorly, it's silly to criticize aspects of the club nobody here actually understands.
 
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