Analysis Blow it up - when's the next premiership window and how do we get there?

DangerSloane

Hall of Famer
Jul 13, 2012
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I disagree.
People will talk about the Gibbs deal and that's the one which is the most controversial. However, we paid more than we had to because we were going fro a 28yo who was the 'missing piece' for our mids coming off 2017. If we had a decent 2018 (bloody Burton!) then we'd be looking differently at it.
  • Charlie Cameron (who wanted to leave) for pick 12 - win. It's not Reid's choice who was picked or that he's not been picked to play
  • The Carlton pick swap this year - we will win that one
  • Leaver for 2 firsts and one coming back - win
  • McGovern for pick 13 and McAdam - win
  • JJ deal - probably a loss, but understandable after 2017
  • Betts deal - par. Give him an extra year and now we hope Eddie does this right thing by the club and retires at season's end
  • Signed up ROB recently - win
Let's see what we do with McKay, Douglas, Otten and Sauce at season's end.
:p A grade - none on the list next year
:) B grade - 1 on on the list
:huh: C grade - 2 on the list
:mad: D grade - 3 on the list
:sick: E grade - all 4 on the list - Sack Reid!
You could at least make the options the chooseable emojis!
 

OzSparrow

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Aug 30, 2006
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Our window was wide open in 2017 but look what happened in 2018
Burton and Haas and their fitness regime killed us.
Add to that the CM debacle and the mental fragility of the playing group after the 17 GF choke and 2018 was always a train wreck waiting to happen.
I am amazed we didn't bottom out.
 

OzSparrow

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Aug 30, 2006
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I was listening to a couple of Phil Walsh interviews today and heard him say a couple of times that they like to move the ball fast, however there were times when the opposition wouldn't let you do it. Thus, you needed to have another style you can play.

Seems in stark contrast to Pyke who seems to think just because we want to play a style, we can always play that way regardless of the opposition. This is the Neil Craig approach and totally disrespects the other great teams in the competition.

Who is our opposition analyst?
This guy:

718734
 

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marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
25,202
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Burton and Haas and their fitness regime killed us.
Add to that the CM debacle and the mental fragility of the playing group after the 17 GF choke and 2018 was always a train wreck waiting to happen.
I am amazed we didn't bottom out.

Every club has injures and players out, not buying that west coast wn the flag without their best two players

WE are going to have to bottom out as we were negligent in not replacing the quality we had in 2017, who's fault is that?
 

Thetrader15

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 16, 2015
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Good post. I'm not sure we will win the Carlton pick as I can't see us winning more than 1 of our last 4 which would mean we will finish 10th or 11th. Carlton could potentially finish 15th. That would be a win for them.
Sure, but when he did the deal, it was a 'start the car' moment. Not his fault for our poor on-field performances.
 

Crowbots are dead

Premiership Player
Oct 11, 2012
3,237
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Wow. Massive underrating of Brown and CEY. We have hugely missed CEY and no coincidence that our midfield has been smashed since his injury. Brown is constantly underrated on here. I would say that you are harsh on kelly and Hartigan too. Our defence has actually been our best line this year by far and is still solid but you obviously only notice the flashy
 

Bay62

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 28, 2014
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It’s amazing how little games our kids under 23 have actually played and some can get a consistent run of games as we keep the old firm in

Not all are going to be 200 game players but think some can have an impact at AFL level if played in the right positions and given a long run of opportunities not just two or three games and then dropped.

Some draftees take time and haven’t seen enough of some hardly any of them to make judgement just yet.

Ben Davis came in for 1 game (worst game to debut, Geelong at Geelong). I think Crows supporters are quick to put the “he’s not up to AFL Standard” tag way too quick.
After ROB’s first game this year, when he was average, Rowie said “We’ll we’ve seen what he can do and it’s not enough”. He’d written him off! Since then ROB has been consistently good (with the odd exception)

Players do need time to develop

Then there’s those that have had time and their time has run out

We have the balance between those two groups wrong
 

NavyRedGold

Debutant
Oct 4, 2017
55
132
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The premiership window model is flawed. A lot of risk with what can be no reward.

You need to be competitive year in-year out, it’s the only way to breed success within a club.

You need to recruit and retain talent, make sure you connect with them, get the best out of them and make them want to be there. Then you need to keep the footy dept fresh and ahead of the game.

Once players have peaked and offer less each year, move them on to greener pastures, they can be an asset at another club for more pay. The one club player should no longer exist (I bet Clarko wishes he moved Hodge and Co on sooner than he did). Need to be prepared to make the hard decisions on and off the field.
I think it's possible to be competitive year-in and year-out, but to be honest I still think the only way to win a premiership by design (rather than by luck, hitting form at the right time) is to build a club that is clearly dominating the rest of the comp. That takes not only good drafting and trades, but also a concentration of your prime talent. You can't do that if your list always has a mix of veterans, prime players and young up-and-comers - you would usually on paper be beaten by the club that has the majority of their list in their prime. That's what we had in 2017.
 

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GreyCrow

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I think it's possible to be competitive year-in and year-out, but to be honest I still think the only way to win a premiership by design (rather than by luck, hitting form at the right time) is to build a club that is clearly dominating the rest of the comp. That takes not only good drafting and trades, but also a concentration of your prime talent. You can't do that if your list always has a mix of veterans, prime players and young up-and-comers - you would usually on paper be beaten by the club that has the majority of their list in their prime. That's what we had in 2017.
Collingwood played in a GF in 2011 and 2018

In that 7 years they turned over a lot of their list (kept some) traded in players but drafted keys.


Its discussed in the podcast , the thing to remember is that 7 years is 130-150 games in to a 'kid' thats the Premiership model there.

The 2018 GF side Pendlebury , Sidebottom. Reid and Blair are on the list in 2019

4 players from 2011 GF.
 

NavyRedGold

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Collingwood played in a GF in 2011 and 2018

In that 7 years they turned over a lot of their list (kept some) traded in players but drafted keys.
And in that 7 years they quickly dropped to 11th, 12th, 12th, 13th i.e. they weren't consistently competitive while rebuilding (although we might simply be agreeing here)
 

GreyCrow

Hall of Famer
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And in that 7 years they quickly dropped to 11th, 12th, 12th, 13th i.e. they weren't consistently competitive while rebuilding (although we might simply be agreeing here)
Yes we are . Remaining competitive is relatively easy. Taking the bigger step to a flag is the difficult part. As you note, building a list means your profile is fairly static ie a large group in that 110-170 game spread rather than a balance of Vets, Mids and Juniors

*though I say we choked 2017 rather than Richmond having a ''perfect list''
 

1991firstgamer

Club Legend
Jun 18, 2018
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And the Apricot Slice brigade hated it then and there were calls to boycott games then.

Even towards the end of the year when it looked like we could miss Blight was criticised.

Lets be very clear if the similar happened today then a large number would be very very unhappy , only now they have a vehicle to vent their anger.
Because they confuse developing a team with their personal entertainment

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Crowboto

All Australian
Jun 11, 2018
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Nahhhh, we like the college boy look in our club. We could have a team full of first rounders and still not get near a flag. The simple reason for this is 3/4 of the players we would pick in the draft would not have the mental fortitude to want to go all the way. But heck they would be great boys from the best private schools with impeccible family backround, who train well, love hanging out with there other interstate opo club mates and best of all dont have those nasty tatts that you see on those bogan players that play in those premiership clubs.
 
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Morning_Fog

Premiership Player
Jun 24, 2018
4,294
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AFL Club
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This Suns vs Lions game is boring as bat shit. This season is gone, so got thinking about next year.

My ideal round 1 side would be

F: McAdam ~ Fogarty ~ McHenry
HF: Sloane ~ Walker ~ Lynch
C: B Crouch ~ Milera ~ Jones
HB: Laird ~ Keath ~ Scholl
FB: Brown ~ Talia ~ Doedee
Ruck: O’Brien ~ M Crouch ~ CEY

Interchange: Gallucci ~ Gibbs ~ #######

Trade: Atkins, Kelly, Greenwood, Jenkins, Knight

Retire: Douglas, MacKay, Jacobs,

###### = Recruit 2 tall mobile defenders. Not Hartigan

Jenkins: Gold Coast. I would offer Jenkins, Knight, pick 16 (see greenwood trade) and our 2020 first round pick for their PP (hopefully pick 2) and Lukosius.

In: Pick 2 and Lukosius
Out: Knight, Jenkins, pick 16 and 2020 first round pick

Atkins: Essendon for pick 32

Greenwood: to Brisbane. Pick 20 and Greenwood for pick 16

Kelly: to Collingwood for pick 34
 

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