Bluemour Discussion Thread XVI - Facts Not Welcome

[bmaurizio]

Yeah, it's the second time he's used it. Not an off the cuff comment, rather one I suspect has been discussed by the powers that be. I can see the concern caused by the comment however it most likely reflects the reality behind closed doors, similar to his 'lukewarm' support for Bolton when pressed on that issue.
Perhaps it's best he says nothing, even if he's being honest; don't want to upset the masses and have Liddle clean up the mess.

Agree a little surprised Judy was so straightforward on a footy show, surely the our administrators would be briefed and aware of the impact of impromptu and unplanned comments can have on the ferals?

 

[bmaurizio]

I don't like the concept of putting someone in cotton wool for the season - unless there's only 1 or 2 games left. There's 7 weeks left, if he's out 2 more that's 5 games he'll be fit for. That's still nearly a qtr of the season you're just not going to play him for. If he's fit, he's fit.

He’s an important assets will explode into stardom soon a major attraction to the CFC he’s precious so careful planning in needed, Russell has it under control.

 

[Heres Waite]

Daisy basically lost his first couple of seasons to injury, not even the same injury that sidelined him at Collingwood. What we're now seeing is what Daisy is able to offer when fully fit. Just a shame he is now past his prime, but if his form continues to justify selection, why would we not want him in our team? Experience like his can't be drafted.

Hey Biggus. Every time I see you post, I can’t help but think of this clip from Life of Brian and I have a chuckle.

 

[ferrisb]

It's all good & well to be a passionate supporter of the club & speak as if you are only wanting what is best for the club, but if as an ex-player, particularly a multiple premiership player, you have something to offer to the club, it would be best to get down to the club instead of playing along with those in the media who make a sport of hammering our club.

I appreciate your sentiment msr, and I generally believe in 'be part of the solution, not the problem'.

But Maclure works in the media. It's his job to comment on footy. And if we suck, he has the right to call it like it is (or at least as he sees it). He is not obliged to offer us his services/solutions.

 

[Matty411]

Coniglio would be crazy to go to hawthorn.

They are squeezing the end of the toothpaste tube.... Ain't much left.

I agree, Lance. But trying to discuss/argue this fact (what many believe) to a diehard Hawks supporter convinced the dynasty is still alive and they've already got the young talent to re-surge - is like trying to change the mind of an anti-vaxer.

I won't say delusional, because who knows... maybe there's a 0.05% chance he's right. But this is definitely a thing with Hawks fans... hell, maybe all fans and their club. It is rare to be objective and realistic about chances rather than optimistic, which I'm definitely guilty of.

 

[Blue and Blue]

I appreciate your sentiment msr, and I generally believe in 'be part of the solution, not the problem'.

But Maclure works in the media. It's his job to comment on footy. And if we suck, he has the right to call it like it is (or at least as he sees it). He is not obliged to offer us his services/solutions.

Tell me one other in media that hammers their own incessantly.
I mean I love Sellars but geez he sure doesn't miss one sliver of opportunity to rubbish us. And the others all know it and just goad him.
I call it misguided passion. If he started talking us up the whole public perception of Carlton would change. And there is every reason to talk us up.

 

[blue healer]

I appreciate your sentiment msr, and I generally believe in 'be part of the solution, not the problem'.

But Maclure works in the media. It's his job to comment on footy. And if we suck, he has the right to call it like it is (or at least as he sees it). He is not obliged to offer us his services/solutions.

Agree with this. Just because Maclure is Carlton royalty, and he is Carlton royalty who bleeds blue, doesn't mean that he has to endorse everything the club does.

 

[blue healer]

Tell me one other in media that hammers their own incessantly.
I mean I love Sellars but geez he sure doesn't miss one sliver of opportunity to rubbish us. And the others all know it and just goad him.
I call it misguided passion. If he started talking us up the whole public perception of Carlton would change. And there is every reason to talk us up.

You can call it what you like but I'd call it misguided passion if someone was continually talking us up. We haven't given the media very much to talk up in the last few years and I don't even want to see that until we are in a position to warrant it, there's enough of that on here without the media joining in.

I don't necessarily agree with everything Maclure says but it is his job to call it as he sees it and, being a Carlton person, it is only natural that the others seek his opinion.

You don't think they weren't asking, and getting, the same from King before the Scott sacking?

When we start to earn it I'm sure we'll get the praise you seek from Maclure.

Geez I even recall Robbo saying he refused to answer Maclure's calls after we beat Freo.

 

[Curnowhan]

Wouldn’t playing in cotton wool affect Charlie’s marking. Not to mention getting teased by his opponent.

Given that my heart is in my mouth every time I see him make hard contact with the ground, or an opponent, I'd like to suggest he plays in an armoured tank...or at a minimum, perhaps the Popemobile

 

[BIGGUS 64]

Hey Biggus. Every time I see you post, I can’t help but think of this clip from Life of Brian and I have a chuckle.

And so you should!
That is where the nickname originated. My mates started to call me "Biggus" many years ago after an episode involving mixed company in a spa and a pair of budgie smugglers which left nothing to the imagination when I had to get out of the spa to take a phone call. (This was before mobile phones.) I guess I was enjoying the "mixed company". Apparently they were all well impressed.

We're all Python fans from way back, so the name stuck.
It's been a running joke ever since, a source of embarrassment for me at first, but eventually I embraced it.

 

[blue healer]

And so you should!
That is where the nickname originated. My mates started to call me "Biggus" many years ago after an episode involving mixed company in a spa and a pair of budgie smugglers which left nothing to the imagination when I had to get out of the spa to take a phone call. (This was before mobile phones.) I guess I was enjoying the "mixed company". Apparently they were all well impressed.

We're all Python fans from way back, so the name stuck.
It's been a running joke ever since, a source of embarrassment for me at first, but eventually I embraced it.

Embrace it?, I'd be stoked.

 

[BIGGUS 64]

Embrace it?, I'd be stoked.

Quietly stoked, fair to say. but they had a way of bringing it up whenever, in front of people I didn't know that well yet, and snicker while I squirmed. But hey, it's cool, I get it. What are mates for? They keep you grounded.

It sure beats the George Costanza scenario. ("Don't they know about shrinkage?!!") Now that would be embarrassing.

 

[blue healer]

Quietly stoked, fair to say. but they had a way of bringing it up whenever, in front of people I didn't know that well yet. But hey, it's cool, I get it. What are mates for?

It sure beats the George Costanza scenario. ("Don't they know about shrinkage?!!") Now that would be embarrassing.

It is. Heard that from a friend.

 

[CJMB]

I agree, Lance. But trying to discuss/argue this fact (what many believe) to a diehard Hawks supporter convinced the dynasty is still alive and they've already got the young talent to re-surge - is like trying to change the mind of an anti-vaxer.

I won't say delusional, because who knows... maybe there's a 0.05% chance he's right. But this is definitely a thing with Hawks fans... hell, maybe all fans and their club. It is rare to be objective and realistic about chances rather than optimistic, which I'm definitely guilty of.

I had a work colleague who was 100% convinced that the hawks had a stockpile of not only the most but the best young talent of all 18 clubs. All the kids they pick are good, they don't haves busts, etc. He also believed that the additions of Wingard & Scully was likely to result in another premiership this year. *cue sad trombone*

 

[Neese]

lol sad trombone, it that the opposite of Biggus Dickus?

 

[Magruder]

I had a work colleague who was 100% convinced that the hawks had a stockpile of not only the most but the best young talent of all 18 clubs. All the kids they pick are good, they don't haves busts, etc. He also believed that the additions of Wingard & Scully was likely to result in another premiership this year. *cue sad trombone*

wait - with the following incredibly reasonable trade hypothetical i've just lifted from the Hawks board - continuing Hawthorn domination is assured:

"GWS get:
Hawks 1st rounder (currently pick 6)

Hawks get:
GWS 1st rounder (currently pick 14)
GWS compo 1st rounder (currently pick 15)
Patton
Coniglio"

I s**t you not -- so not only is Cognilio going to Hawfs as a free agent but pick 6 pays for 14,15 (the compo pick) & Patton.

Trade Thread Page 68ish.

They're all convinced that #6 is too much cos Patton's a salary dump.

Tempted to suggest we should offer Adelaide's first rounder for Mitchell, Bruest and some random they all want delisted but has a contract for next year. Afterall, Mitchell's coming off a serious injury, Bruest's on tghe way down and they won't have tpo pay their salaries anymore.

Heck we could chuck in a 3rd rounder for their 4th.

Completely reasonable.

 

[BlueTang]

wait - with the following incredibly reasonable trade hypothetical i've just lifted from the Hawks board - continuing Hawthorn domination is assured:

"GWS get:
Hawks 1st rounder (currently pick 6)

Hawks get:
GWS 1st rounder (currently pick 14)
GWS compo 1st rounder (currently pick 15)
Patton
Coniglio"

I s**t you not -- so not only is Cognilio going to Hawfs as a free agent but pick 6 pays for 14,15 (the compo pick) & Patton.

After the Scully and Scrimshaw trades last year, that almost sounds like overs

 

[Magruder]

It gets better:


"So we trade back pick 6* with GWS for pick 14-15 & Patton.

Draft pick 14 or trade back to gws with a future first for Whitfield

Pick 15 goes to Freo for B.Hill"

* me...

So GWS are going to say:

Yep give us effectively #6 and next years 1st for Cognilio, Whitfield & Patton.

and while we're at it here's the compo pick we got for Cognilio so that you can get B Hill back from Freo.

Honestly thought some of our stuff was fanciful. This is astonishing.

 

[Luder]

wait - with the following incredibly reasonable trade hypothetical i've just lifted from the Hawks board - continuing Hawthorn domination is assured:

"GWS get:
Hawks 1st rounder (currently pick 6)

Hawks get:
GWS 1st rounder (currently pick 14)
GWS compo 1st rounder (currently pick 15)
Patton
Coniglio"

I s**t you not -- so not only is Cognilio going to Hawfs as a free agent but pick 6 pays for 14,15 (the compo pick) & Patton.

Trade Thread Page 68ish.

They're all convinced that #6 is too much cos Patton's a salary dump.

Tempted to suggest we should offer Adelaide's first rounder for Mitchell, Bruest and some random they all want delisted but has a contract for next year. Afterall, Mitchell's coming off a serious injury, Bruest's on tghe way down and they won't have tpo pay their salaries anymore.

Heck we could chuck in a 3rd rounder for their 4th.

Completely reasonable.

I challenge you to find a single reasonable trade request coming from a poster on their own club's board. Yesterday, someone on the Saints board suggested they could trade a future 3rd rounder for Toby McLean, for example. To be fair, they were shut down immediately as being an idiot. It's pretty hilarious, and is why I always browse other club's trade boards to find gems like the one you're quoting. Hadn't actually seen that one yet, but gave me a good laugh

The only reasonable trades are the ones people are game enough to post on another club's board

 

[Magruder]

I challenge you to find a single reasonable trade request coming from a poster on their own club's board. Yesterday, someone on the Saints board suggested they could trade a future 3rd rounder for Toby McLean, for example. To be fair, they were shut down immediately as being an idiot. It's pretty hilarious, and is why I always browse other club's trade boards to find gems like the one you're quoting. Hadn't actually seen that one yet, but gave me a good laugh

The only reasonable trades are the ones people are game enough to post on another club's board

yeah, McLean's probably worth a late second...

Seriously, I get your point but I had never come across such a convoluted set of circumstances so obviously skewed to benefit 1 side. And in this circumstance the only objection was that the Hawkies were probs paying too much...

 

[therubbernub]

He’s an important assets will explode into stardom soon a major attraction to the CFC he’s precious so careful planning in needed, Russell has it under control.

FMD he is a football player not a Faberge egg

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Daisy basically lost his first couple of seasons to injury, not even the same injury that sidelined him at Collingwood. What we're now seeing is what Daisy is able to offer when fully fit. Just a shame he is now past his prime, but if his form continues to justify selection, why would we not want him in our team? Experience like his can't be drafted.

No it cant, but it can be traded for or added through free agency.

 

[blue_trinity]

Rubbish. Levi's improvement has come from weight loss and the associated training adherence. He wasn't coming off a major, physically debilitating injury.

Strongly disagree that he has exceeded expectations as a rookie. He is doing this year exactly what he was doing last year.


RE: Teague, if I recall correctly my issue with his efforts in the VFL was the he coached too much for results, and I felt it was coming at the expense of some development. Fraser has often been the polar opposite, and has basically tanked a decent VFL side this season.

There's a whole range of outcomes that can still occur with Goddard, it's just that most of them land on the side of him never making the grade. For that to change, he's got to lose weight, develop confidence and balance in his ankles, legs and achilles, and perhaps change his running style a bit, or at least learn to vary it a bit more so he can move a bit sharper out on the field.

Then, on top of all of that, his body has to substantially recover from those injuries.


Unless something radically changes over the next month, I'd sign Levi for a year and thank Hugh for his services. Let's see how Macreadie responds to this challenge as well.


I'm not dismissing him based on what he does. I am ruling him out of likely being a worthwhile member of an AFL list based on he cannot do, and also what he does not look like doing again due to injury.

Preconceived ideas? I'd seen him play football! Russell has good recovery and training techniques, not fairy dust. Goddard probably needs 6-12 months out of the game to see if he can re-develop his body, not another year in the AFL system. I've seen this dance so many times now that I lose patience with football department staff who pan for gold in this way.

Frankly, if Goddard has done everything asked of him, then we have the wrong set of criteria for assessing performance. This isn't a question of character or mental aptitude and fortitude, it's how well his body holds up (he's lost a yard) and how his skill set translates to this grade of football under those circumstances.

I hope he plays his guts out and surprises me, and then he follows up week after week. The beauty about this kind of situation is that he's already in a position to seize upon any luck that falls his way, I just don't think it will.

Disagree. He has improved (albeit marginally some years) every year he has been on our list.

Firstly, his mobility (starting from an incredibly low base), then his goal kicking accuracy improved markedly, and has now shown flexibility in position and imo his field kicking has improved from what it was this year also.

Every year he manages to add a little bit, not much, maybe only <5% of his game. But a little bit here and there none the less.

Really is admirable, the player he has become.

 

[Gethelred]

Are we talking to Greenwood from the crows ? Big bodied mid a good player. Also the Hawks fan pumping him up as the second coming now that their club has been linked to him. Lels.
Coniglio Greenwood surely they are premiers next year.

27, and averages 17.1 disposals per game with 6.4 tackles.

Need more possessions around the ball, not just tackles. For comparison:

Sam Petrevski-Seton and Hugh Greenwood AFL Stats Comparison

Sam Petrevski-Seton and Hugh Greenwood AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

... and we don't think SPS gets involved enough.

 

[NewDarkNavyBlues]

Looks like Horse is out of the race.

This leaves Clarko or bust in terms of experienced coaches.

The thought of Voss or Scott coaching this great club makes me feel physically ill.