Society/Culture Bourke st incident ( again )

[red+black]

His death is a good thing. It is a shame that Julian Knight, Martin Bryant, James Gargasoulas, etc were not killed at the scene of their crimes.

 

[smokingjacket]

That was some bad policing. That cop is very lucky to not be seriously injured or dead.

I'm surprised to hear you say that Shan. With the available knowledge at the scene for the police, and considering the weapon was lower end threat level (machete or axe different story) I thought the police did a terrific job to hold their nerve and attempt to calm the attacker down and use non-lethal force if possible.

 

[red+black]

Disturbing. We be like London in no time.

dude, I know it's been a bit cold but surely it won't get that cold!

 

[ShanDog]

Why?

He was using the correct techniques they are trained with to disarm men with knifes.

Nobody got hurt from the moment they arrived and they did all they could not to use lethal force.

So many keyboard warriors

What disarm techniques? That's not a thing.

SOP with a knife (a lethal weapon) is to draw weapon. The first cop didn't have one out for whatever reason (maybe he didn't know until it was too close) and the second one didn't draw until old mate had already taken 2-3 swings. Way too slow. There's a '15 foot' rule. If someone with a knife is within 15 feet, they can potentially kill you, even when you have a weapon pointed at them for some of the reasons I posted earlier about 'shooting at the leg'.

 

[ShanDog]

I'm surprised to hear you say that Shan. With the available knowledge at the scene for the police, and considering the weapon was lower end threat level (machete or axe different story) I thought the police did a terrific job to hold their nerve and attempt to calm the attacker down and use non-lethal force if possible.

The short of it is, if a knife-wielding threat is close enough to be swinging at you a few times before anyone has a pistol out - it is bad policing. Altruistic motives or not, it is what it is.

 

[Socrates2]

Remember that black guy in Brighton seige last year that killed the receptionist and ended up getting shot up by police. Wonder if any connection to this incident..

Yes definitely Mary, I can see where you're coming from, one black guy 2 years ago stabs someone and now 2 years another black guy stabs one.You should get a job at the FBI.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

"Man with no experience working with counter-terrorism says 'This looks like a clear case of terrorism', more to come"

Fixed that for ya, Swoony

EDIT: Did not mean to infer that poster _Swoon was categoricaly stating that it was terrorism.

 

[red+black]

I'm surprised to hear you say that Shan. With the available knowledge at the scene for the police, and considering the weapon was lower end threat level (machete or axe different story) I thought the police did a terrific job to hold their nerve and attempt to calm the attacker down and use non-lethal force if possible.

I disagree. Fair enough give him an opportunity but he should have been shot before he had a chance to slash a large knife multiple times.

It wasn't like this all happened in 2-3 seconds, the police had time to draw their weapons and shoot him as soon as he got too close.

It is luck rather than good police work that they were not injured. Maybe the cop was protected from the slashing motion, but was he safe if the guy tried to stab him in the neck? Was there no chance that cop could have been injured with the knife?

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

Fixed that for ya, Swoony

Lmao quote where I said that was terrorism, old boy or apologize and delete your post.

 

[dumb]

Tasers were used or attempted apparently?

 

[maryjames]

Yes definitely Mary, I can see where you're coming from, one black guy 2 years ago stabs someone and now 2 years another black guy stabs one.You should get a job at the FBI.

Let’s see if known to each other. Wouldn’t surprise me.

 

[Thrawn]

Please, tell me more.

The police did everything they could before resorting to a last resort measure without putting anyone in the public in danger. If they had made an earlier decision to shoot, they made sure to have a clear shot. In case you didn't notice, there were bystanders watching. This is not America where police go in full-rambo and ask questions later. They handled it as well as they could have considering the circumstances. Or would you prefer a stray bullet ricocheting and hitting someone because the officer reacted too quickly/panicky?

It's easy to say they did a s**t job behind your keyboard. These are trained professionals, what did you want them to do instead? Are you a trained police officer?

At the end of the day, they subdued a maniac, did not get injured in the process and their actions did not hurt or kill innocent bystanders. That is not "shitty policing". They knew what they were doing.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Why?

He was using the correct techniques they are trained with to disarm men with knifes.

Nobody got hurt from the moment they arrived and they did all they could not to use lethal force.

So many keyboard warriors

Getting almost stabbed is not the "correct technique"

 

[FireKrakouer]

That was some bad policing. That cop is very lucky to not be seriously injured or dead.

I'm surprised that you say that. I don't know the first thing about police training, but I do know the extent of the community backlash they receive when they supposedly use "excessive force", lethal or non-lethal. I would've liked to see them shoot earlier, but I've never been in that situation so it's hard for me to attempt to take into account all the factors that would've been driving their decision-making process.

Mainly, I was impressed by their bravery to continue engaging the perp and keeping his focus off civilians. If these were pommy cops they would've turned and ran.

 

[Socrates2]

"Man with no experience working with mental health says 'This looks like a clear case of mental illness', more to come"

I was a nurse for 8 years chummo.Looks the most likely explanation but no one knows anything yet ,like I said.

 

[its free real estate]

For those criticising ASIO, they’ve stopped a lot more of these than have occurred. The only ones that have got through have been very low level attacks. The ones they have stopped would have been Bataclan to September 11 level.

 

[ShanDog]

The police did everything they could before resorting to a last resort measure without putting anyone in the public in danger. If they had made an earlier decision to shoot, they made sure to have a clear shot. In case you didn't notice, there were bystanders watching. This is not America where police go in full-rambo and ask questions later. They handled it as well as they could have considering the circumstances. Or would you prefer a stray bullet ricocheting and hitting someone because the officer reacted too quickly/panicky?

It's easy to say they did a s**t job behind your keyboard. These are trained professionals, what did you want them to do instead? Are you a trained police officer?

At the end of the day, they subdued a maniac, did not get injured in the process and their actions did not hurt or kill innocent bystanders. That is not "shitty policing". They knew what they were doing.

Fifteen years in the military (still serving) with numerous connections and friends in the police and I - quite literally - just got back from the range this evening after instructing trainees on their shooting.

You won't see this as an example used anywhere on how to deal with a knife-wielding attacker. That's my professional opinion. Sorry - 'clueless' opinion. Cheers.

 

[maryjames]

Loved when the cop kneed the dead terrorist in the head.

 

[Thrawn]

Fifteen years in the military (still serving) with numerous connections and friends in the police and I - quite literally - just got back from the range this evening after instructing trainees on their shooting.

You won't see this as an example used anywhere on how to deal with a knife-wielding attacker. That's my professional opinion. Sorry - 'clueless' opinion. Cheers.

Okay, if you're telling the truth and are not exaggerating - what would you have done instead?

Are there any coppers here who can corroborate your professional opinion?

 

[ShanDog]

I'm surprised that you say that. I don't know the first thing about police training, but I do know the extent of the community backlash they receive when they supposedly use "excessive force", lethal or non-lethal. I would've liked to see them shoot earlier, but I've never been in that situation so it's hard for me to attempt to take into account all the factors that would've been driving their decision-making process.

Mainly, I was impressed by their bravery to continue engaging the perp and keeping his focus off civilians. If these were pommy cops they would've turned and ran.

Using a pistol to stop someone with a knife isn't excessive force. It's standard.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Lmao quote where I said that was terrorism, old boy or apologize and delete your post.

I reckon there are a LOT of people stating that it's terrorism, Swoony. Not necessarily you, so I'll ammend the post and I apologise if it seemed I was saying YOU were the one making the statement.

 

[ep2018]

Were you expecting them NOT to think so ?
Or do you mean it's insensitive due to the timeframe ?

I think its insensitive. I doubt it would have much an effect anyway.

 

[Chism]

Confirmed dead by Police gunshot right now in the press conference 30mins after he arrived in hospital.

Also confirmed he was known to Police and ASIO for terrorist links and it is now being treated as a terrorism event.

Press conference live now on the ABC.

 

[Smartest Brain]

I think UK police were quite hampered by lack of access to weapons, but I don't know that 100%. Might not be an appropriate example.

Do you think Australia will never follow what the UK has done with the police? They will probably try to blame legal gun owners before Aussie cops get their guns pulled but this is not far away for us either.

 

[red+black]

The police did everything they could

including needlessly putting themselves in harm's way

These are trained professionals

I would not consider your average cop to be a trained professional. SOG yes, beat cop no.

did not get injured

that was pure luck